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D1E
Nov 25, 2001


drat that Sandi sure is an ugly old broad.

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boviscopophobic
Feb 5, 2016

Somebody's really fat. I'm not going to name names.

Sunswipe
Feb 5, 2016

by Fluffdaddy
Is this some kind of reverse psychology trick to aquire fat jokes?

Lovely Joe Stalin
Jun 12, 2007

Our Lovely Wang
This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs? The client is what, 20, 30 gigs per user per patch? Obviously this is in addition to being a way to obfuscate the complete lack of actual work they'll be doing on it if SC really has been unofficially cancelled. Tell the backers that they'll have to wait for the current closed test to bear fruit before they get an update, meanwhile the closed testers are under NDA and can't tell anyone that they're not testing anything.

Sperglord
Feb 6, 2016
One thing to keep remembering about Star Citizen: CIG is still raising money on a totally broken game, a game whose actually state is completely hidden from backers.

This is moral fraud and, when CIG collapses, I hope the FTC finds this as legal fraud.

The company should die tonight, but it won't. Each day that it doesn't die is another day when more money disappears in some cocaine fueled dream of Roberts.

As for the employees, from what we've heard, CIG abuses it's workforce. Atxsperg said that some former employees have near PTSD and alcoholism. CIG is not a good company and it has bad management.

Ok, enough about realizing how awful this whole thing is.

Did I hear correctly that CIG has one of the top five gaming budgets of all time?

A Neurotic Jew
Feb 17, 2012

by exmarx

Gapey Joe Stalin posted:

This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs?

yes.

Mirificus
Oct 29, 2004

Kings need not raise their voices to be heard
Concept sale Q&A before sales?


https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/comment/6544663/#Comment_6544663


https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/comment/6552214/#Comment_6552214

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.
Hey I'm on a mobile. Somebody make an animated gif of this crap.

http://youtu.be/_aN-3bD0fX8

Chris promised us Ender's Game. But looks like we were getting Blitzball, only less fun.

Sperglord
Feb 6, 2016

Gapey Joe Stalin posted:

This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs? The client is what, 20, 30 gigs per user per patch? Obviously this is in addition to being a way to obfuscate the complete lack of actual work they'll be doing on it if SC really has been unofficially cancelled. Tell the backers that they'll have to wait for the current closed test to bear fruit before they get an update, meanwhile the closed testers are under NDA and can't tell anyone that they're not testing anything.

Great point. The majority of players must download the each PU build, tool about for an hour, then forget it. Those people carry as much server cost as the one commando that plays the PU, our very own :pgabz:.

By going to NDA system, cut down on number of server costs and hide the true state of the game.

I could see the new build system as a way of allowing for approximating a stable build.

Tank Boy Ken
Aug 24, 2012
J4G for life
Fallen Rib

G0RF posted:

Hey I'm on a mobile. Somebody make an animated gif of this crap.

http://youtu.be/_aN-3bD0fX8

Chris promised us Ender's Game. But looks like we were getting Blitzball, only less fun.

You're wrong. We're not getting a working game. They might release a badly bugged tech demo to try to complete stretchgoals. This is not intended as a serious post. Please don't hate me. Or perhaps, just go easy on the hate. Two weeks. The End. They're hosed. ELO!

Beet Wagon
Oct 19, 2015





Gapey Joe Stalin posted:

This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs? The client is what, 20, 30 gigs per user per patch? Obviously this is in addition to being a way to obfuscate the complete lack of actual work they'll be doing on it if SC really has been unofficially cancelled. Tell the backers that they'll have to wait for the current closed test to bear fruit before they get an update, meanwhile the closed testers are under NDA and can't tell anyone that they're not testing anything.

And, assuming they had any internal testers to begin with (they must have had at least a few), now they can safely fire them, secure in the knowledge that they conned a bunch of autists into doing it for free!

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Sperglord posted:

Did I hear correctly that CIG has one of the top five gaming budgets of all time?
4th largest development budget in history. Might overtake GTA V by year end if this year resembled last year.

But I don't think it does. Not one bit.

AP
Jul 12, 2004

One Ring to fool them all
One Ring to find them
One Ring to milk them all
and pockets fully line them
Grimey Drawer

Gapey Joe Stalin posted:

This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs?
Yes, but also if you don't have much to show inviting the most active testers into a NDA rewards them and makes the others jealous, those without access will assume there's lots happening people can't talk about. It could even make the live game more active as people hopefully file bug reports to try and get selected.

It might be useful for testing but they know their audience, the NDA signers will see themselves as a select group and be more faithful, they'll also hint on the forums about amazing stuff just over the horizon. It buys CIG time, they always want more time.

Kakarot
Jul 20, 2013

by zen death robot
Buglord

Gapey Joe Stalin posted:

This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs? The client is what, 20, 30 gigs per user per patch? Obviously this is in addition to being a way to obfuscate the complete lack of actual work they'll be doing on it if SC really has been unofficially cancelled. Tell the backers that they'll have to wait for the current closed test to bear fruit before they get an update, meanwhile the closed testers are under NDA and can't tell anyone that they're not testing anything.

Yes, our bot army that tooterfish set up to continuously download the game might have finally made them change how they handle updates etc. They have spent A LOT on bandwidth

Sperglord
Feb 6, 2016

G0RF posted:

4th largest development budget in history. Might overtake GTA V by year end if this year resembled last year.

But I don't think it does. Not one bit.

Is the list corrected for inflation?


In either case, a top level gaming budget and it has released as much tangible progress as a CryEngine mod. CIG hasn't put out enough for a tech-demo, just a failed game mod. A $111 million game mod.

Nomenclature
Jul 20, 2006

You can outrun the IRS, but you can't outrun your sister's love.

Gapey Joe Stalin posted:

This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs? The client is what, 20, 30 gigs per user per patch?...
Honestly, it is a smart thing for CIG to do money-wise, regardless of how much they have left.

One server instance runs on two cores, and the servers run on 16-core machines in the cloud. If each instance handles 24 players, they need 24x8=192 testers to test server performance every time they make a change. It's a lot cheaper to push 20GB patches to a few hundred testers than to hire 192 QA testers.

Gradis
Feb 27, 2016

GAPE APE
jesus Sandi is so loving fat and ben is a loving ugly stick insect.

Trundel
Mar 13, 2005

:10bux: + :awesomelon: = :roboluv:
- a sound investment!
I'm pouring one out for Karl. I miss that terrible bastard.

Io_
Oct 15, 2012

woo woo

Pillbug

Beet Wagon posted:

And, assuming they had any internal testers to begin with (they must have had at least a few), now they can safely fire them, secure in the knowledge that they conned a bunch of autists into doing it for free!

I assume NDA as in Non-Disclosure Agreement? Then it also gives them a stick to control the outflow of funny gifs showing how much of steaming hot mess it is.

Kakarot
Jul 20, 2013

by zen death robot
Buglord
Did you guys really run out Sarsapariller?

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Sperglord posted:

Is the list corrected for inflation?
Yes.

Variable 5
Apr 17, 2007
We do these things not because they are easy, but because we thought they would be easy.
Grimey Drawer

Booourns posted:

Are you so desperate to call Ben fat that you're willing to completely ignore that they were talking about a pic of the ED guys' office?

I got an experiment for the thread, I wanna see if you guys can go even one single day without making a Ben is fat/Sandi is ugly comment. Just one day !

Yes, whatever we do, we mustn't comment on the appearance of two horrible, soulless scam artists that are going to be directly responsible for more than one suicide when it's all said and done.

hakimashou
Jul 15, 2002
Upset Trowel

Booourns posted:

Are you so desperate to call Ben fat that you're willing to completely ignore that they were talking about a pic of the ED guys' office?

I got an experiment for the thread, I wanna see if you guys can go even one single day without making a Ben is fat/Sandi is ugly comment. Just one day !

lol ben is so fat

also sandi thinks she can be an actress but just look at her lol not gonna happen

Mendrian
Jan 6, 2013

Booourns posted:

Are you so desperate to call Ben fat that you're willing to completely ignore that they were talking about a pic of the ED guys' office?

I got an experiment for the thread, I wanna see if you guys can go even one single day without making a Ben is fat/Sandi is ugly comment. Just one day !

I'm in.

Does making fun of Sandi for being evil or smug count?

Mirificus
Oct 29, 2004

Kings need not raise their voices to be heard

https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/325891/who-else-makes-purchasing-decisions-based-on-what-squadron-42-will-lack

Amarcarts
Feb 21, 2007

This looks a lot like suffering.


I skipped them all :D

boviscopophobic
Feb 5, 2016

Kakarot posted:

Did you guys really run out Sarsapariller?

He showed himself out after admitting to buying back in to 2.0. He also changed his YouTube account name (which used to be Sarsapariller Sunrise).

boviscopophobic fucked around with this message at 02:03 on Apr 10, 2016

hakimashou
Jul 15, 2002
Upset Trowel

boviscopophobic posted:

He showed himself out after admitting to buying back in to 2.0. He also changed his Youtube account name.

ya sasparillar did, or claimed to have done, spend2500 dollars -again- on star citizen after already having gotten a refund on his original idiot purchase.

and was complaining he couldnt get another refund

Io_
Oct 15, 2012

woo woo

Pillbug
That is a whole other level of stupid. And that's saying something considering the poo poo that's been posted in this thread.

Justin Tyme
Feb 22, 2011


Gapey Joe Stalin posted:

This is probably a dumb idea, I am a dumb, but if they're really running low on funds could this NDA testing be a way of cutting off their data costs? The client is what, 20, 30 gigs per user per patch? Obviously this is in addition to being a way to obfuscate the complete lack of actual work they'll be doing on it if SC really has been unofficially cancelled. Tell the backers that they'll have to wait for the current closed test to bear fruit before they get an update, meanwhile the closed testers are under NDA and can't tell anyone that they're not testing anything.

Could also be indicative of them laying off their QA staff/QA being the mythical leavers.

Also does anyone actually have the Sarspariller quote about him buying back in for $2500? Because I swear that's just a thread rumor, I know he got another package but I think the $2500 number was made up because I never remember him actually putting that number out.

to0terfish
Apr 4, 2015

Pork Pro
I applaud this individual for a finely executed gag, whichever one of you it is. Bravo. :golfclap:



https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/326113/getting-ready-for-star-citizen

Kakarot
Jul 20, 2013

by zen death robot
Buglord
Star Citizen is the best

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpTOMNzIvmc

Mirificus
Oct 29, 2004

Kings need not raise their voices to be heard

Justin Tyme posted:

Could also be indicative of them laying off their QA staff/QA being the mythical leavers.

Also does anyone actually have the Sarspariller quote about him buying back in for $2500? Because I swear that's just a thread rumor, I know he got another package but I think the $2500 number was made up because I never remember him actually putting that number out.

The $2500 figure was in the draft of their letter to customer service. It wasn't something they advertised so much as confessed once it was pointed out.

Good Dumplings
Mar 30, 2011

Excuse my worthless shitposting because all I can ever hope to accomplish in life is to rot away the braincells of strangers on the internet with my irredeemable brainworms.

Justin Tyme posted:

Could also be indicative of them laying off their QA staff/QA being the mythical leavers.

Also does anyone actually have the Sarspariller quote about him buying back in for $2500? Because I swear that's just a thread rumor, I know he got another package but I think the $2500 number was made up because I never remember him actually putting that number out.

Sarsapariller posted:

For funsies, here is the angry email I sent to CIG when they told me that a chargeback in this case would be fraudulent. I am going to edit this into a much more professional and complete version before I fire it off to the bank, but it's the basis for my argument:

email posted:

I appreciate that you are taking the time to make a personal response. I also appreciate that you have given these requests consideration in the past- that consideration and the fact that you followed up shortly afterwards with a your Alpha release is what prompted me to put money back in. Unfortunately the company has failed to live up to that standard in the months since, releasing virtually no further improvements and refusing to speak to release dates. The latest indication by Chris Roberts that he no longer intends to produce a significant portion of the product despite having sold it as being nearly out the door for the entirety of the last year is my final straw (http://www.informationredux.com/ind...ally-cancelled/). There is nothing fraudulent about filing a chargeback claim in this case. Shall we go over the reasons?


Valid chargeback reasons:
Non-receipt of information.
Fraud.
Authorization error.
Processing error.
Canceled / returned merchandise.
Non-receipt of goods or services.

1) Services not provided or merchandise not received
1a) The pack that I am pledged for, the Armada pack, includes a copy of Squadron 42 for digital download and a copy of the Star Citizen persistent universe. Squadron 42's initial release date was somewhere in 2014. Citations:
i) Interview with CEO: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYFCfRK4e6Y&t=1187s
ii) Article from a separate interview with CEO: http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/...is-Roberts.html

1b) Somehow that release date has slipped and slipped again. In 2014, you said 2016. Citations:
i) Producer Eric Peterson and Phil Meller discussing the release date on your channel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fllp5o5Qkq0&t=23m58s
ii) Erin Roberts in an interview: http://www.twitch.tv/geekdomo/b/519001941?t=11m13s

1c) Now you will not even give release dates. Judging by what you have done with the Star Marine section of the game, where your CEO extremely dishonestly insisted that it was not cancelled (Citation i), and multiple representatives of your company maintained that party line (Citation ii), until a few days ago when it was announced that what has been released in your alpha test build was the intended product all along- based on this, it is incredibly difficult to believe that you have any intention of delivering the other products that you sold to me.
i) "In January (2014), Roberts said that Star Marine would be arriving in the spring. The module was delayed and is now slated to arrive some time in the next few weeks. At the time of the delay, earlier this year, Roberts had no new release date and several outlets, including Polygon, reported it as being "delayed indefinitely," something at which the studio bristled." http://www.polygon.com/features/201...th-star-citizen
ii) The saga of Star Marine: http://www.justagamemode.com/

1d) I cannot link you the sales description of the Armada Pack because you have actually removed it from your website(Citation i). However, according to the version attached to my account, it should come with the following ships in-game: Gladius, Super Hornet, Starfarer Gemini, Vanguard, Idris-P Frigate, Retaliator, Constellation, Freelancer MIS. Not only are two of those ships, whose individual values total well over $1000, still in production after three years, but the ships that you have provided are non-functional in almost every way. I would not bring this up except you are citing the current state of the game as grounds for refusing refunds, so I am assuming you expect that you have satisfied the terms of your sale. The turrets do not work (Citation ii), the stations do not work (Citation iii), and the game itself is practically non-functional in its current state (Citations iv, v, vi). Since you announce no dates and have issued no significant improvements since the launch of the game last year I can only assume that the current unacceptable state is your intended release. The merchandise you have delivered is in unacceptable condition and is not remotely what you promised during sale.
i) Armada Pack 404s- https://robertsspaceindustries.com/...bos/Armada-Pack
ii) Current gameplay in Retaliator and Constellation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONW_ciiHym8
iii) Current gameplay: ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIqrn49mZ5c)
iv) Current gameplay- (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJfh3r7nq9o)
v) Current gameplay- (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Go1oFvxUoeI)
vi) Current gameplay- (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55HXtqdiqsA)


I also find it interesting that not even 5 months ago you were publicly giving full refunds (http://www.polygon.com/2015/8/20/91...heir-money-back) but now feel that you delivered sufficient content to warrant their denial, per your letter above, which appears to be boilerplate: (https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitize.../refund_denied/)


In any case- thank you for your time. I will now pursue a chargeback.


The Armada pack is the important part here, originally listed in store as $2500.

MeLKoR
Dec 23, 2004

by FactsAreUseless

Loxbourne posted:

There may be very very good legal reasons for not giving us encrypted hints. If there genuinely is an investigation by law enforcement agencies - whatever their provenance or origin - and Derek knows about it, then potentially even hinting about any such investigation could be a criminal offence. In the UK this is called "tipping off", and it would be a bitch to defend since it's very hard to prove that someone (say, at CIG) didn't crack Derek's encryption early and alter data or evidence ahead of time.

Worse, the existence of a secret taunting website could be held in court to taint the prosecution. That includes cunning games with URLs, lockbin files, the works. If the ELE exists and is the kind that might include dawn raids and asset freezes and eventual trials, then we as a thread aren't worth the risk.

Yes, this does come across as containing just as wishful thinking as those we mock. That's the game you play when you start making fun of large troubled companies on the internet.

This strikes me as an exercise in whaleism. Chris Roberts makes a few "sure we'll think of a way to include it" and they create all these "what if I hide in a crate to hijack their ship" scenarios. Derek makes a few vague statements about impending doom and you're creating these raid at dawn scenarios. Let's be clear here no one has actually made any such claims.

orcinus
Feb 25, 2016

Fun Shoe

Clearly you don't know anything about gas development.

runsamok
Jan 12, 2011


The Armada pack is the important part here, originally listed in store as $2500.
[/quote]

Doing the parp's work here.

Justin Tyme
Feb 22, 2011


I guess my question is is did he have an Armada pack before or after the fact. He's still an idiot for having that much in it in the first place but I just wanna know if he is truly a double-idiot.

Mendrian
Jan 6, 2013

I still say the best revenge against all shitizens would be if SC came out, exactly as promised, with all planned features. Because it would never live up to their dreams and they would feel grief.

It's kind of like all the people who talked about their highly in-character hopes and dreams for games like The Old Republic or gently caress even Everquest. Giant videogames never accurately translate into a virtual second life and it's hilarious when they don't. Games get mined for the most important gameable bits. They get dissected and are played like games, not enormous RP chatrooms. I mean, sure you can find little pockets of people in LotRO or WoW who insist on only typing IC but for the most part it's just an environment to grind poo poo in. SC - even feature complete - would be little different.

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Sperglord
Feb 6, 2016

CIG is going to be a historic failure. 4th largest gaming budget of all time. Nothing to show for it which couldn't be replicated by a good team in a month or two.

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