Auspol April - Long Live the Glorious State of North Queensland

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Auspol April - Long Live the Glorious State of North Queensland

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bowmore: Oct 6, 2008; Lipstick Apathy

LibertyCat posted:

Greens plan to raise refugee intake to 50,000

This certainly won't hurt jobs and encourage people smugglers, resulting in more deaths at sea. How many terrorists will this bring into the country?

gently caress you, you are a piece of poo poo.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 08:48

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# ? May 23, 2024 08:37

bowmore: Oct 6, 2008; Lipstick Apathy

I have no problems saying that to you because you clearly lost your humanity some time ago.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 08:49

Negligent: Aug 20, 2013; Its just lovely here this time of year.

lol, you know shorten is a tory piece of poo poo right? his mother in law is dame quentin bryce. loving lol if you think he is any less neoliberal than turnbull.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 08:57

TheIllestVillain: Dec 27, 2011; Sal, Wyoming's not a country

LibertyCat posted:

I am not kidding when I say I was more moved during the events of the Mass Effect series than I ever was by the works of Beethoven or Leonardo da Vinci.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 09:17

Skellybones: May 31, 2011; Fun Shoe

Anidav posted:

Economic Inequality Complaints Are Just A Cover For Anti-Rich Prejudice
It�s not fair to blame individuals for other people�s wrongdoing. Yet we let envy-peddlers get away with it when unfairly attacking rich people.
APRIL 14, 2016 By Don Watkins
In the wake of the endless controversies surrounding Donald Trump�s campaign, it�s easy to forget that most of us rightfully pride ourselves on our opposition to racism, sexism, anti-Semitism, and other forms of unjust discrimination. But we rarely even discuss another prevalent form of prejudice: the demonization and dehumanization of the successful. This prejudice is central to today�s chief economic concern: the campaign against economic inequality.

Not everyone worried about our economic challenges is bigoted, of course. There are real problems we all should be concerned about, whether it�s declining opportunity (especially for those starting at the bottom), slowing economic progress, the pitiful state of education, or the political favors bestowed on some businesses.

In our new book on inequality, �Equal Is Unfair: America�s Misguided Fight Against Income Inequality,� my co-author Yaron Brook and I address those problems and many others. But whatever one�s view of our challenges, nothing can justify the way many�including presidential hopeful Bernie Sanders�are treating those who have achieved economic success.

The Double Standards for Rich People
Consider just a few of the behaviors that inequality critics apparently consider acceptable when dealing with wealthy Americans.

Collective Judgments. Virtually everyone agrees we should judge people by their actions and the content of their character, not by the (real or manufactured) sins or shortcomings of other members of whatever group they happen to belong to.

Replace �the rich� with �Hispanics� or �women� or �Jews� in that sentence, and ask yourself: isn�t this precisely the sort of prejudice we object to when it is targeted at other groups?
Regarding businessmen, for example, we should condemn those who lie, cheat, and steal. But we should condemn them as individuals for their dishonest and predatory actions. By the same token, we should praise individuals who earn their wealth through ingenuity and effort�not make them pay for other people�s sins.

Yet what we hear from today�s inequality critics is across-the-board denunciations of successful businessmen. Sanders contends �the business model of Wall Street��which employees hundreds of thousands of productive Americans��is fraud.� A headline for a Sean McElwee article in Salon tells us �Rich white people are ruining the planet.� Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett write in their popular book �The Spirit Level� that �Rather than adopting an attitude of gratitude toward the rich, we need to recognize what a damaging effect they have on the social fabric.� Replace �the rich� with �Hispanics� or �women� or �Jews� in that sentence, and ask yourself: isn�t this precisely the sort of prejudice we object to when it is targeted at other groups?

Dehumanization. Prejudice encourages dehumanization�it encourages demonizing �the other� so they are seen as less than human and therefore unworthy of respect. This is precisely what inequality critics are trying to do to �the 1 percent.�

To take just one example, Nobel Prize-winning economist Paul Krugman has claimed that rich Americans are �less likely to exhibit empathy, less likely to respect norms and even laws, more likely to cheat, than those occupying lower rungs on the economic ladder��they are, in short, �spoiled egomaniacs.� Well, if so, what concern should we have for their rights and their dignity?

The Wealthy Are People, Too
A common myth is that you cannot be a victim of injustice unless you are powerless or disadvantaged, or that an injustice is okay if it�s aimed at someone who isn�t powerless or disadvantaged. But those are nothing more than crude rationalizations for injustice.

Isn�t it an indictment of our society when good people are treated like villains?
We need to ask ourselves: Do we really think of rich individuals as human beings? Or do we view them as cartoon villains�one-dimensional stereotypes not dissimilar to the caricatures propagated by racists, misogynists, and Jew-haters?

When I discuss unfair treatment of successful businessmen, I almost always hear comments like, �Oh, boohoo. What do the rich have to complain about? Look at everything they have!� This reflects a crass materialism, which amounts to the notion that money solves everything, and that no one can be hurt by or object to mistreatment unless he�s poor.

But have we ever stopped to ask ourselves: What if a rich individual�s dreams mean as much to him as my dreams do to me? What if he wants to be respected for his achievements the way I want to be respected for mine? What if he has made himself into a moral human being�doesn�t he deserve respect and admiration, and isn�t it an indictment of our society when good people are treated like villains?

A Cynical Justification for Government-Sponsored Injustice
Exploitation. When prejudice gets injected into the political system, it leads to the government inflicting tremendous injustices on the victims.

All of it is aimed at erasing the knowledge that economically successful individuals are human beings and that exploiting other human beings is wrong.
More and more, our political system treats economically successful Americans as resources for �society�s� desires rather than as sovereign individuals with an inalienable right to their own pursuit of happiness. Witness, for example, the plans Democratic candidates have for this country. Free health care�paid for by �the rich.� Free college�paid for by �the rich.� Larger Social Security payments�paid for by �the rich.�

Of course, these demands are supported by the claim that �the rich� aren�t paying their �fair share.� Set aside the fact that affluent Americans bear the vast, vast majority of the tax burden. Do we ever so much as ask: Did they honestly earn their money? Did they gain it by dealing voluntarily with other people, through an incalculable number of win-win trades? Don�t they have a right to use their wealth to pursue their own hopes and dreams�the same way we each have the right to use our wealth to pursue our hopes and dreams?

No, we don�t ask those questions. Preventing us from asking those questions is the goal of the demonization and dehumanization of �the rich.� Whether it�s President Obama dismissing individual achievement when he declares �you didn�t build that,� or Sanders claiming it is immoral for some people to prosper while others are struggling, or Barbara Ehrenreich arguing that �To the extent that any demonization is going on, one can�t help thinking that the rich have been, perhaps inadvertently, asking for it��all of it is aimed at erasing the knowledge that economically successful individuals are human beings and that exploiting other human beings is wrong.

Stripping the Rewards of Virtue
This is prejudice, plain and simple. What�s worse, it is not directed toward traits that have no bearing on a person�s character, it is directed at something that is in fact a moral achievement.

Business success�that is, making a profit through productive achievement, not special favors from Washington�is something that deserves our respect and admiration. As we argue in �Equal Is Unfair,� this kind of success is enormously difficult, and it is profoundly virtuous.

We live in an advanced technological society, and enjoy a level of wealth, health, comfort, and opportunity that our ancestors could not have dreamed of. What made it possible? The effort of producers, on every level of ability, but with the most credit going to the men and women of extraordinary ability: the inventors, entrepreneurs, and investors who drive progress�and earn a fortune in the process.

It�s time we stopped saying �screw you� and started saying �thank you.�

Holy moly

# ? Apr 16, 2016 09:19

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

Die Rich Scum.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 09:21

tithin: Nov 14, 2003; [Grandmaster Tactician]

Yes, all this anti-rich propaganda is just the same thing as the persecution of minorities who face persecution for no other reason than the colour of their skin, their nationality, their religion or their sexual orientation, all things that are not under their control

hating rich people is exactly the same because...

# ? Apr 16, 2016 09:29

Starshark: Dec 22, 2005; Doctor Rope

tithin posted:

Yes, all this anti-rich propaganda is just the same thing as the persecution of minorities who face persecution for no other reason than the colour of their skin, their nationality, their religion or their sexual orientation, all things that are not under their control

hating rich people is exactly the same because...

Well in a lot of cases, they were born that way. They can't help what they are. And part of their DNA is just naturally slashing wages, making working conditions worse, loving the environment irreparably, etc, etc.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 09:44

Nibbles!: Jun 26, 2008; TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP

make australia great again as well please

tithin posted:

Yes, all this anti-rich propaganda is just the same thing as the persecution of minorities who face persecution for no other reason than the colour of their skin, their nationality, their religion or their sexual orientation, all things that are not under their control

hating rich people is exactly the same because...

We'll, people are born rich....

# ? Apr 16, 2016 09:45

LibertyCat: Mar 5, 2016; by WE B Bourgeois

In a way it's actually worse.

You can't help being asian, female etc. Discrimination against those groups is bad but it can't stop them being asian or female.

Some people have worked their backsides off and ended up rich - which is a good thing. We want people to work hard, take risks, and end up well off. Discrimination against those people is worse because it discourages them from trying to end up rich in the first place.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:00

pray for my aunt: Feb 13, 2012; 14980c8b8a96fd9e279796a61cf82c9c

LibertyCat posted:

In a way it's actually worse.

You can't help being asian, female etc. Discrimination against those groups is bad but it can't stop them being asian or female.

Some people have worked their backsides off and ended up rich - which is a good thing. We want people to work hard, take risks, and end up well off. Discrimination against those people is worse because it discourages them from trying to end up rich in the first place.

you are a caricature

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:06

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

Everyone pray for Bronwyn Bishop plz.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:09

Anidav: Feb 25, 2010; ahhh fuck its the rats again

LibertyCat posted:

In a way it's actually worse.

You can't help being asian, female etc. Discrimination against those groups is bad but it can't stop them being asian or female.

Some people have worked their backsides off and ended up rich - which is a good thing. We want people to work hard, take risks, and end up well off. Discrimination against those people is worse because it discourages them from trying to end up rich in the first place.

Lol this confirms you are a troll.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:12

Skellybones: May 31, 2011; Fun Shoe

Some rich people, I assume, are good people. I mean they can't ALL be cartoonish villains, right? :shrug:

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:13

Anidav: Feb 25, 2010; ahhh fuck its the rats again

1%ers who give back to society are just as rare as 1%ers themselves.

Tax havens exist because the ultra rich don't want to contribute to our society. They want to contribute to theirs.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:20

Cleretic: Feb 3, 2010; Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Skellybones posted:

Some rich people, I assume, are good people. I mean they can't ALL be cartoonish villains, right?

Of course there's good rich people. Warren Buffett's pretty good from what I know, there's not much bad you can say about Dick Smith these days, everything I've ever heard about the recently-deceased head of Nintendo paints him as exactly what you would hope the head of Nintendo would be like.

But their existence doesn't negate the influence of people like Rhinehart.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:26

Nibbles!: Jun 26, 2008; TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP

make australia great again as well please

Even after you increase taxes on rich people, they're still rich :shrug:

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:41

WhiskeyWhiskers: Oct 14, 2013; "هذا ليس عادلاً."
"هذا ليس عادلاً على الإطلاق."
"كان هناك وقت الآن."
(السياق الخفي: للقراءة)

Good thing this only applies to liberals and not Marxists who recognise that it is not wealth in itself that is the problem, but the exploitative ways in which capital is employed that is the problem.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:44

iajanus: Aug 17, 2004; NUMBER 1 QUEENSLAND SUPPORTER
MAROONS 2023 STATE OF ORIGIN CHAMPIONS FOR LIFE

LibertyCat posted:

In a way it's actually worse.

You can't help being asian, female etc. Discrimination against those groups is bad but it can't stop them being asian or female.

Some people have worked their backsides off and ended up rich - which is a good thing. We want people to work hard, take risks, and end up well off. Discrimination against those people is worse because it discourages them from trying to end up rich in the first place.

That's some quality trolling right there :golfclap:

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:47

Skellybones: May 31, 2011; Fun Shoe

"I wanted to apply for a job but the interviewer saw on my resume that I was a former CEO of IBM and just laughed in my face, saying they didn't employ rich people."

"I was walking down the street and people kept crossing to avoid me. I know it's because I'm rich."

"The police keep harassing me. Every minor charge they can get away with making up, they lay it on me, just because I'm rich. Next time I see the Police Commissioner at the golf course I'll have a word with him."

"I keep hearing rude jokes about rich people being stupid or greedy or evil. Whatever happened to making fun of the negros and orientals?"

"It's subtle, but I feel like I'm treated differently when I go out with my family. Waiters will ignore me when I try to order, security guards keep a close eye on me, people stare at me and whisper. It's because I'm rich."

# ? Apr 16, 2016 10:57

Futuresight: Oct 11, 2012; IT'S ALL TURNED TO SHIT!

Don Watkins posted:

Economic Inequality Complaints Are Just A Cover For Anti-Rich Prejudice

Importing from the Israel/Palestine play book is pretty funny.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 11:23

Pale Ale: Sep 10, 2001; Yeah I know that but do you honestly expect England to even slightly challenge Australia in the finals? They will be demolished.

Jumpingmanjim posted:

Everyone pray for Bronwyn Bishop plz.

Didn't work she's dumped

# ? Apr 16, 2016 11:41

Chadzok: Apr 25, 2002

Anidav posted:

Economic Inequality Complaints Are Just A Cover For Anti-Rich Prejudice
It�s not fair to blame individuals for other people�s wrongdoing. Yet we let envy-peddlers get away with it when unfairly attacking rich people.
APRIL 14, 2016 By Don Watkins
In the wake of ... [a whole lot of bullshit ..]
It�s time we stopped saying �screw you� and started saying �thank you.�

Wikipedia posted:

Don Watkins is an American author, columnist and professional speaker, who currently serves as a fellow at the Ayn Rand Institute, a non-profit organization in Irvine, California, that ..

Ah, good. This person's opinion doesn't actually matter.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 11:44

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

Maybe Bronnie can get a shoe on sky news now.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 11:47

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

Today marks the end of a long and undistinguished career.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 11:50

Anidav: Feb 25, 2010; ahhh fuck its the rats again

Where is the news coverage of Bishop coming from?

# ? Apr 16, 2016 11:55

Synthbuttrange: May 6, 2007

It's coming from INSIDE THE PARTY

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:10

The Lord Bude: May 23, 2007; ASK ME ABOUT MY SHITTY, BOUGIE INTERIOR DECORATING ADVICE

http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/bronwyn-bishops-career-over-after-her-party-dumps-her-20160416-go8180.html

In a way I'm disappointed because now we won't get to see her crash and burn against Dick Smith.

What would be the greater humiliation, losing preselection or running and then losing the seat to an independent? Discuss.

The Lord Bude fucked around with this message at 12:18 on Apr 16, 2016

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:15

asio: Nov 29, 2008; "Also Sprach Arnold Jacobs: A Developmental Guide for Brass Wind Musicians" refers to the mullet as an important tool for professional cornet playing and box smashing black and blood

It wasn't until I had children of my own that I developed empathy for other people, this is how a healthy human being thinks, vote liberal

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:19

Bifauxnen: Aug 12, 2010; Curses! Foiled again!

Lol I could try to make enough money to buy a house just how I want it and never have to worry about finding lovely rentals again, or dealing with landlords again, and make enough that I could retire and never worry about job searching again, or financial stability again, and travel around doing whatever the gently caress I wanted, buying whatever I wanted... but... I don't know man, I just feel so discouraged cause people hate rich people so much!

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:21

Other: Jul 10, 2007; Post it easy!

Anidav posted:

Economic Inequality Complaints Are Just A Cover For Anti-Rich Prejudice

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:37

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

Bronwyn will run on the Liberal Democrat ticket and win.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:45

Zenithe: Feb 25, 2013; _{Ask not to whom the Anidavatar belongs; it belongs to thee.}

quote:

But with a lot of the 1%ers, it's not their fault they're in the 1%. They were just born there, they've done literally nothing to get there. Picking on them is literally the same as racism

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:50

DAAS Kapitalist: Nov 9, 2005; Jackass: The Mad Monk

Don't try this at home.

Anidav posted:

Lol this confirms you are a troll.

How thick do you have to be to not have worked that out six weeks ago?

# ? Apr 16, 2016 12:56

dr_rat: Jun 4, 2001

Jumpingmanjim posted:

Bronwyn will run on the Liberal Democrat ticket and win.

More likely Bronwyn will form and run under the 'Bow to me you plebs' party and lose horribly.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 13:28

Recoome: Nov 9, 2013; Matter of fact, I'm salty now.

LibertyCat posted:

In a way it's actually worse.

You can't help being asian, female etc. Discrimination against those groups is bad but it can't stop them being asian or female.

Some people have worked their backsides off and ended up rich - which is a good thing. We want people to work hard, take risks, and end up well off. Discrimination against those people is worse because it discourages them from trying to end up rich in the first place.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 13:33

Futuresight: Oct 11, 2012; IT'S ALL TURNED TO SHIT!

There are many cures for wealth.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 13:36

Anidav: Feb 25, 2010; ahhh fuck its the rats again

DAAS Kapitalist posted:

How thick do you have to be to not have worked that out six weeks ago?

Well look, you read this thread for a few years and figure there's the occasional new face whose entitled to their views but the Dollar Cat has been reaching lately.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 13:42

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

The guillotine won't discriminate against the rich, don't worry.

# ? Apr 16, 2016 14:13

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# ? May 23, 2024 08:37

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

# ? Apr 16, 2016 14:14

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Auspol April - Long Live the Glorious State of North Queensland

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