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mcmagic posted:Mutavault would always be good but it would've been a 1 or 2 of at best in the last standard. It just happened to be in standard where the 2 best decks were not only mono colored but they also had linchpin cards (master of waves and pack rat) that had tremendous natural synergy with Mutavault. Honestly I feel like part of the problem is that One Or Two modern reprints is pretty much exactly the wrong number. Thoughtseize and Mutavault both took over that standard for quite a while, and I feel like a big part of that is that the big deck that standard easily played sets of both. The other deck only played Mutavault but got a lot of use out of it. There wasn't really a saturation of modern-powered cards to make a few deck building decisions around and there weren't similarly powered cards in other colors (UW had enough cards that came close lmao verdict and revelation) so we just ended up looking at the two modern reprints in the format coming across the red zone with whatever decks they enabled backing them up.
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Apr 21, 2016 22:37
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jassi007 posted:I think the thing is though, they've been trying. Mutavault and Thoughtseize showed WOTC that cards of a certain power level are going to mess with standard. TNN and Containment priest showed that powerful cards are going to gently caress up demand and cause issues with getting products to their target markets. The masters sets aren't putting enough copies in circulation to long term affect prices, but they are making more supply without pissing off collectors. I really don't know if they're willing to go much further. I think all these reprint arguments ignore all the things they have tried in the past couple years and the effects of it. The Masters sets would actually do exactly what they're supposed to if the pack price was slightly lowered and the print run was slightly increased. They're erring way too far on the side of not antagonizing collectors with those.
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Apr 21, 2016 22:44
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They're usually fun to draft too and it sucks only being able to draft it once or twice because $$$.
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Apr 21, 2016 22:45
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odiv posted:They're usually fun to draft too and it sucks only being able to draft it once or twice because $$$. I think MM15 is my favorite draft format..
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Apr 21, 2016 22:47
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The professor did get something super right, original inn was one of the best sets ever and it's bonkers thy there wasn't more reprints.
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Apr 21, 2016 22:52
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The "Echoes of old innistrad" idea similar to the expeditions sounded to me like a really good idea. I mean standard players get to have the EV of a box lowered and can turn a nice card in to a chunk of a deck and modern players see more cards come on the market, it's win win. Just don't make them one in every 5 boxes or whatever the hell expeditions were.
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Apr 21, 2016 23:03
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Is there a spot for Topplegeist in some sort of Junk Modern deck? Or am I just too high on it?
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Apr 21, 2016 23:27
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Good news for those who want a higher print run of Eternal Masters: apparently they're going to be selling packs of it at major retailers  and still having the usual low restricted allocation to small shops. My LGS manager has been breathing fire at either Wizards, his distributor, or the store owner today since this double shits on card shops while not doing much about the problem.
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Apr 22, 2016 00:10
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Archenteron posted:Good news for those who want a higher print run of Eternal Masters: apparently they're going to be selling packs of it at major retailers So... how soon do major retailers get them? Like I hop on over to the local Wal Mart on release day, will I find them or do they show up like a few days after? I want to get at least 2 boxes of EM, 1 to possibly resell or open and another to draft 
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Apr 22, 2016 00:18
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Archenteron posted:Good news for those who want a higher print run of Eternal Masters: apparently they're going to be selling packs of it at major retailers This is hilarious and incompetent, so I totally believe WotC did it
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Apr 22, 2016 00:20
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So, interesting information from We The People vs. Wizard$ of the Coa$t from a former Regional Coordinator came to light (and was confirmed by my RC): the Regional Coordinator position - basically a judge management position available to L3+ judges - is a judge position that is actually under contract from WotC. The payment they receive under contract actually equates to less than minimum wage when factoring in all contract expectations - one of which is not revealing said contract exists, especially to other non-RC judges . Also, while I have no professional capacity to verify or dispute any of it, a fellow judge who is also a legal professional commented that - at least as far as he could tell from what's publicly available and what was in the brief - the judge program would be considered a division of WotC (and not a subsidiary company/organization). He wouldn't hazard a guess as to what impact that might have on proceedings, but did comment that whatever the fall-out from this dispute it might push WotC towards turning the program into a non-profit subsidiary, if they don't just try to tighten up the reins on it another way. As someone who is purportedly a professional in this field, I'd be interested in any feedback/speculation. Legal matters aside, though, there's once again another wave of judges that are contemplating their involvement in the program pending WotC's (likely self-destructive) attitude towards judges and the program moving forward.
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Apr 22, 2016 00:24
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Well wotc only needs to make the program barely attractive enough to just get the number of judges they need. Which IMO they're doing admirably. Judges grumble, get paid in cards (and not even product, at least from wotc. This costs them NOTHING), yet there's still plenty of them. Doing just enough and not too little is a tough bar to hit: See the WER issues at the GP last week.
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Apr 22, 2016 00:36
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I've long held theories on this, and my hypothesis is the culture factor. Namely, the 'casual' nature of American culture. I know that Japanese players take the game very seriously, and also consider the collecting part a major part of the allure. To many of them, the playing and collecting go hand in hand. As such, while frequenting 2ch and talking to my Japanese buddies, I've never heard anyone complain about the reserve list. The idea is that, if you can't afford something e.g. Vintage, then you shouldn't play it. It makes sense to them, if you can't afford an Aston Martin, you don't get to drive it.
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Apr 22, 2016 00:44
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WOTC-freude is the most delicious freude of all.
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Apr 22, 2016 01:47
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mcmagic, I threw together the UW Skies deck, it seems fun but susceptible. Can you explain the SB choices? With all the Coco going around is there room for Hallowed Moonlight
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Apr 22, 2016 01:49
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Sickening posted:You know what is important to this game? You're posting ironically now but if you want to see this thread have a heated speculative discussion on the motives of all the marquee Planeswalkers in the current set, wait a few minutes.
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Apr 22, 2016 02:09
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Mark Rosewater finally told about the "forbidden" mechanic they tried but couldn't make work in the original Innistrad block, and it sounds about as dumb and terrible as you'd expect: http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/143113997698/i-saw-someone-refer-to-something-as-the-forbidden
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Apr 22, 2016 02:27
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Entropic posted:Mark Rosewater finally told about the "forbidden" mechanic they tried but couldn't make work in the original Innistrad block, and it sounds about as dumb and terrible as you'd expect: That's because Sam Stoddard told a panel what it was a year or so ago.
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Apr 22, 2016 02:27
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Entropic posted:Mark Rosewater finally told about the "forbidden" mechanic they tried but couldn't make work in the original Innistrad block, and it sounds about as dumb and terrible as you'd expect: That's a cute gimmick for one card or a cycle, maybe. But it would be the worst thing to draft, and requires wish effects at the same time when we haven't had one since Spawnsire of Ulamog. And if it isn't an instant or sorcery then no one will play it ever.
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Apr 22, 2016 02:45
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:That's a cute gimmick for one card or a cycle, maybe. But it would be the worst thing to draft, and requires wish effects at the same time when we haven't had one since Spawnsire of Ulamog. It would probably have to be absurdly powerful as well, or no one would bother with it. At that point then it would probably just go in to a desk that already plays wishes and be broken.
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Apr 22, 2016 02:57
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Shaman Ooglaboogla posted:It would probably have to be absurdly powerful as well, or no one would bother with it. And that's the point when you go back to the drawing board with a mechanic. Which, to be fair to them, is exactly what they did.
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Apr 22, 2016 03:22
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Shaman Ooglaboogla posted:It would probably have to be absurdly powerful as well, or no one would bother with it. At that point then it would probably just go in to a desk that already plays wishes and be broken. The sample card was Forbidden Bolt R Instant Forbidden Bolt deals 5 damage to target creature or player. So yeah, the power was there. The enablers would be cards like Forbidden Bear 1G Creature - Bear When Forbidden Bear enters the battlefield, reveal a card you own with Forbidden from outside the game and shuffle it into your deck.
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Apr 22, 2016 04:28
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I can't be the only one who thinks all of this talk of a secret Pro Tour strategy is bullshit. They're just going to all play Bant Company. It's the direct successor to Rally and it leans heavily on the exact same rear end in a top hat overpowered cards Rally did because Collected Company is a format-ruining card they didn't test enough because they just operated under the assumption that putting creatures in your deck was a super-high deckbuilding cost. Angry Grimace fucked around with this message at 06:52 on Apr 22, 2016 |
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Apr 22, 2016 06:47
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There are always going to be a few staples that standard warps around and CoCo itself isn't that bad.
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Apr 22, 2016 06:56
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Having to build a deck entirely out of 3 drops is a real deckbuilding cost. You basically get your playset of CoCo and then like 4-5 other spells and everything else is 3 drops and lands. The latest Bant Company builds have been getting greedy just adding in pairs of Avacyns on top of that. Let's remember that prior to Rally existing there basically weren't Company decks in Standard because why would you run a midrange deck in green that couldn't slam Siege Rhino? More importantly, it's been like a month that Bant Company has been a dominant contender and not some secondary option overshadowed by Rally and Abzan, and there are plenty of matchups it struggles with, so give the meta some time to adjust before declaring the end of the world.
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Apr 22, 2016 06:58
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Hallowed Moonlight Negate Dispel Duress Transgress the Mind There's probably more but WUB at least has sufficient and flexible sideboard hate to deal with a CoCo deck. Your options with Siege Rhino were...Infinite Obliteration? Disdainful Stroke? You were able to Thoughtseize your opponent's Rhino and then...play your own Rhino.
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Apr 22, 2016 07:04
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Voyager I posted:Having to build a deck entirely out of 3 drops is a real deckbuilding cost. You basically get your playset of CoCo and then like 4-5 other spells and everything else is 3 drops and lands. The latest Bant Company builds have been getting greedy just adding in pairs of Avacyns on top of that. Let's remember that prior to Rally existing there basically weren't Company decks in Standard because why would you run a midrange deck in green that couldn't slam Siege Rhino? The problem is that they clearly assumed it was a high enough deckbuilding cost to keep the card in check, except its not a particularly high deckbuilding cost when Reflector Mage, Tireless Tracker and Bounding Krasis are all being printed. It's also just a generally annoying deck to play against because "6 mana of dudes at instant speed who tap and bounce all of your guys" is a loving stupid thing to be able to do for 4 mana. The worst part of it is that it legitimately pushes out pretty much every control strategy because Tireless Tracker and Duskwatch Recruiter allow it to never loving run out of guys. I've played games against the deck where I 2, 3 or 4 for one'd it with Radiant Flames or Languish and still lost because you still can't outvalue it. ThePeavstenator posted:Hallowed Moonlight And every single removal spell and creature that can block it. It's a good card, but its an exaggeration to suggest Siege Rhino pushed out every other strategy because it isn't like the card operated on a weird axis: you can just kill it. I would not be even vaguely surprised if Bant Company turns into Faeries. There are simply not enough answers to Collected Company itself because they intentionally made hating on either graveyards or creatures you didn't pay for bad to enable wholly imaginary graveyard strategies in SOI block. Angry Grimace fucked around with this message at 07:25 on Apr 22, 2016 |
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Apr 22, 2016 07:09
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End of Life Guy posted:Lets crowdfund a GP trip for mcmagic and also crowdfund his deck full of Chamale's brews. I'm selling out of MTGO but I'm going to keep SearchTheCity.dek to play in Modern
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Apr 22, 2016 07:54
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I'm not arguing that it's a bad deck, because it obviously isn't, but I am arguing that it's too soon to start screaming about how it's oppressing the meta when it's been at the top for like 1 1/2 events after the two decks that dominated standard above it rotated it out. Like, up until SoI, the three mana requirement was tight enough to keep pure CoCo decks from running away with the show compared to better options, and right now it's mostly just a good deck from before rotation that had more cards get printed than rotate out. It's not really surprising that it's still a good deck when nobody knows WTF Standard is at the moment.
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Apr 22, 2016 07:59
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As someone who played Sligh, RDW, Atarka Red and RW Midrange during like all of THS/KTK standard, I always have a chuckle to myself when people complain about Rhino. It was one of the few things keeping the decks I was playing in check, with the exception of RW which just ate Abzan for breakfast.
Rimusutera fucked around with this message at 08:09 on Apr 22, 2016 |
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Apr 22, 2016 08:07
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Errant Gin Monks posted:OH is someone actually playing a list? I just Brewer it up to be an idiot. List? I just threw a bunch of stuff into a deck and was fairly pleased by it's performance. Like it gets crushed by all the value decks out there, but the deck will still be a thing after rotation. Note that I tried to use predominately Shadows Cards. Kolaghan's command is probably strictly better than say Avacyn's Judgement, i just wanted more payoff cards for madness. Between Insolent Neonate, Heir of Falkenrath, Olivia, Ravenous Bloodseeker, Elusive Tormentor, and Lava Axe you have all the madness enablers ever. However the biggest problem is that there is there no good payoff cards for Madness in Shadows, and it's very unlikely we will see more madness cards in Eldritch Moon. Your best payoff cards if Fiery Temper, Avacyn's Judgement is cute, but your rarely in a position late game where you have both a madness enabler and Avacyn's Judgement ready go to with plenty of mana, so it's just a slightly less useful Kolaghan's Command quite a bit. Asylum Visitor is a 3/1 for 2 mana, I never once got her ability to get going. Kalitas and Elusive Tormentor will get Trangressed Away quite a bit. All that said it's an aggro deck, and has plenty of fliers. You will take games simply off the fact that your opponent will keep a hand that is reasonable for a mid range value grindy game, and then you will just rush them to death. When this deck stumbles it stumbles pretty hard. But Avacyn's Judgement and Fiery Temper managed to close out a few games for me. Exquisite Firecraft is something worth considering for the deck. I have no idea what a reasonable sideboard would look like. Self Inflicted Wounds, Duresses, Trangress the Minds would for sure be in there. Creatures: 29 4 Insolent Neonate 4 Falkenrath Gorger 4 Heir of Falkenrath 2 Ravenous Bloodseeker 2 Asylum Visitor 3 Drana 3 Olivia 3 Kalitas 1 Elusive Tormentor 3 Incorrigible Youths Spells: 11 4 Fiery Temper 4 Lava Axe 3 Avacyn's Judgement Lands: 20 4 Smoldering Marsh 4 Foreboding Ruins 8 Mountains 6 Swamps
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Apr 22, 2016 09:00
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anglachel posted:List? I just threw a bunch of stuff into a deck and was fairly pleased by it's performance. Like it gets crushed by all the value decks out there, but the deck will still be a thing after rotation. Note that I tried to use predominately Shadows Cards. Kolaghan's command is probably strictly better than say Avacyn's Judgement, i just wanted more payoff cards for madness. Between Insolent Neonate, Heir of Falkenrath, Olivia, Ravenous Bloodseeker, Elusive Tormentor, and Lava Axe you have all the madness enablers ever. However the biggest problem is that there is there no good payoff cards for Madness in Shadows, and it's very unlikely we will see more madness cards in Eldritch Moon. Your best payoff cards if Fiery Temper, Avacyn's Judgement is cute, but your rarely in a position late game where you have both a madness enabler and Avacyn's Judgement ready go to with plenty of mana, so it's just a slightly less useful Kolaghan's Command quite a bit. Asylum Visitor is a 3/1 for 2 mana, I never once got her ability to get going. Kalitas and Elusive Tormentor will get Trangressed Away quite a bit. Looks like it would be a good match against Boss Humans too, which is what I assume my meta is going to be full of given trading chat over the last few days.
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Apr 22, 2016 09:17
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Is UB control a thing in standard? I have a couple Jaces, 4x Languish, a bunch of dual lands... Thing in the Ice? I guess I could look at esper instead. Painful Truths in 3 colours would be nice, I suppose.
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Apr 22, 2016 09:24
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AceClown posted:Looks like it would be a good match against Boss Humans too, which is what I assume my meta is going to be full of given trading chat over the last few days. Problem vs humans, is that they can trade you 1 for 1 and use investigate to get back in the game once your both in top deck mode. And they have Declaration to efficiently kill your big flying threats. And can ambush you with a Avacyn. And if they get Always Watching up all their creatures are way stronger than yours, and red/black has zero enchantment removal for stasis snare and what have you. Basically humans will just 1 for 1 you early game, then gets back in the game faster than you. Asylum Visitor just doesnt do any work. The few times you actually have a zero hand, it will just get shot with removal.
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Apr 22, 2016 09:40
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odiv posted:Is UB control a thing in standard? I have a couple Jaces, 4x Languish, a bunch of dual lands... Thing in the Ice? As someone who owns literally 4 standard legal cards: Look into UB Pact. You get to play Languish for all of the aggro matches. You win with Pact value, bouncing it, and Crush of Tentacles.
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Apr 22, 2016 10:41
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:The sample card was That's not as bad as I was thinking. I was figuring they would basically be win the game cards that did something like a planeswalkers ultimate but undercosted.
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Apr 22, 2016 10:44
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LSV and Kibler starting 3-0 Edit: and Brad Nelson Alaan fucked around with this message at 12:55 on Apr 22, 2016 |
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Apr 22, 2016 12:34
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LSV on BG Aristocrats with Loam Dryad and Cryptolith Rite
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Apr 22, 2016 13:01
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Boco_T posted:LSV on BG Aristocrats with Loam Dryad and Cryptolith Rite ?!?! I'm at work, please tell me more!
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Apr 22, 2016 13:05
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Also someone on RG Goggles w/Worldbreakers and Chandra. E: and Kozilek's return. Alaan fucked around with this message at 13:22 on Apr 22, 2016 |
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Apr 22, 2016 13:16
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