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Jim Barris posted:If you hide in a hallway and wait for Ralph to spawn and take a couple shots at him he'll gently caress off and won't come back on that floor (I think). I'm not 100% on this but it seemed to be true from my observational experience. cumshitter posted:I tried to do a 180 casings/4 keys run to fix the third floor elevator. On the first run I managed to pick up four keys from drops, but only 175 casings total for the three floors. Then on the next I only had one key drop and not a single store had a key for sale during the first or second run. I ended up destroying about 25 chests and only one dropped a single half-heart, one exploded, and the rest were trash. Didn't see a single trash eater in the merchants. Of course, that won't help you if the shop is locked...
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Apr 23, 2016 22:33
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I wasn't using any keys for my run, which I'm doing on PS4. If you have even one key then it doesn't appear that the shop is guaranteed to have them for sale, even if one doesn't drop on that specific level. I think if you discover the merchant on the map while holding a key, even without entering the room, then it deactivates the guaranteed key. I've had a few runs where I made the icon appear on the map and then backtracked to use my starter key before entering the shop. I didn't see keys for sale a few times. If you're not going for the sewer then it's probably best to use your starter key as soon as you can since keys are pretty affordable in chamber 1.
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Apr 23, 2016 22:50
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Ah, if you're playing on PS4 it might be different, because on PC they changed it so you're guaranteed to find a key in the store if you haven't picked one up on that floor before you reach it. Guess PS4 might be a patch or two behind. Broken Cog fucked around with this message at 23:18 on Apr 23, 2016 |
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Apr 23, 2016 23:05
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FactsAreUseless posted:Also bosses should drop ammo. I've complained endlessly about the RNG problems in this game mainly for ammo, and if there's one easy band-aid fix they could do to improve the game until they can come up with something better, it would be to make every boss drop an ammo box, and probably 2 boxes starting on floor 3. I still cannot believe there is literally no guaranteed source of ammo boxes in the game. That's a ridiculous thing to just leave entirely in the hands of the RNG.
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Apr 23, 2016 23:05
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Digirat posted:I've complained endlessly about the RNG problems in this game mainly for ammo, and if there's one easy band-aid fix they could do to improve the game until they can come up with something better, it would be to make every boss drop an ammo box, and probably 2 boxes starting on floor 3.
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Apr 23, 2016 23:07
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Speaking of random rear end rewards, the run that got me the 7 leaf clover earlier also randomly dropped a gold casing in a simple room which gave me a whopping 50 or 100 casings at once I think.
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Apr 23, 2016 23:26
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The theory is that using more ammo increases the chance of ammo dropping. Some runs it seems like that's the case but some runs end in the fourth floor with like five empty guns except for the lowercase r. I've taken to just always using a non-starter gun after the first boss unless you get some crazy damage ups and just accepting it if the RNG decides to kill my run. Most runs peter out but also most runs are fun (except the ones where you get nothing but garbage guns).
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Apr 23, 2016 23:28
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Sometimes literally, with the trashcannon.
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Apr 23, 2016 23:30
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cumshitter posted:I tried to do a 180 casings/4 keys run to fix the third floor elevator. On the first run I managed to pick up four keys from drops, but only 175 casings total for the three floors. Then on the next I only had one key drop and not a single store had a key for sale during the first or second run. I ended up destroying about 25 chests and only one dropped a single half-heart, one exploded, and the rest were trash. Didn't see a single trash eater in the merchants. Yeah I really wish the shortcut unlock things worked differently. Instead of demanding a fixed amount of money or keys he should just ask for everything that's spawned so far, so you're 100% guaranteed to get it if you get there without spending money/keys. Broken Cog posted:Ah, if you're playing on PS4 it might be different, because on PC they changed it so you're guaranteed to find a key in the store if you haven't picked one up on that floor before you reach it. I'm like 80% sure that this is only for the first floor. you'll always be able to have two keys by the end of level 1, but no guarantees after that. Jibo posted:The theory is that using more ammo increases the chance of ammo dropping. Some runs it seems like that's the case but some runs end in the fourth floor with like five empty guns except for the lowercase r. Someone actually asked the devs this one (at the end of that thing). It's just a random chance after every room. It could definitely stand to be a little more consistent and less swingy. RPATDO_LAMD fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Apr 23, 2016 |
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Apr 23, 2016 23:37
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Who lives in the gungeon? Pretty sure it's just fire. Very weird run. I got 4 guon stones which made things rather safe since they block bullets. I also got a renewed appreciation of the flare gun since it one shots a lot of stuff if you let it burn off. Sloober fucked around with this message at 00:04 on Apr 24, 2016 |
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Apr 24, 2016 00:00
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16 hours played and I've only got to floor 4 once. Is this what it's like to be old? Oh well, back to Rocket League. Let me know if they patch the game to give you enough keys and ammo.
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Apr 24, 2016 00:38
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cumshitter posted:I tried to do a 180 casings/4 keys run to fix the third floor elevator. On the first run I managed to pick up four keys from drops, but only 175 casings total for the three floors. Then on the next I only had one key drop and not a single store had a key for sale during the first or second run. I ended up destroying about 25 chests and only one dropped a single half-heart, one exploded, and the rest were trash. Didn't see a single trash eater in the merchants. It's not going to help for the floor 3 elevator, but there is an easy method for doing this for the floor 4 and 5 elevators. Buy and pick up every key you possibly can until you hit the requirement for the minimum amount of keys, and only spend keys if you have over the minimum required. Once you reach floor four, find one of these enemies and kill every other enemy in the room:  Make sure to leave it alive so it can keep summoning the giant jammed zombies. The jammed zombies drop shells every time they die (most likely as a side effect of being summoned as jammed), so it is an infinite money engine for as long as you need to grind it to meet the elevator requirements. This is pretty useless to do in a real playthrough unless you are desperate and bored, but should make the shortcuts much easier.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:05
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Jim Barris posted:Yesterday I got a room that had one of the big red Chests with a fuse coming off it so naturally I rushed over there to open it and it turned out it was a mimic. Thanks a lot, game, way to be a loving rear end in a top hat. Literally always switch to the starting gun and shoot all chests once, it takes a second and prevents this. The red mimic is a fucker to fight period, though.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:07
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Jim Barris posted:Yesterday I got a room that had one of the big red Chests with a fuse coming off it so naturally I rushed over there to open it and it turned out it was a mimic. Thanks a lot, game, way to be a loving rear end in a top hat. I have never seen a mimic on the red/black chests so I assumed it wasn't even a thing. I guess I have to tap the red/black chests too now, just to be safe 
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Apr 24, 2016 01:19
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Red mimics are some serious poo poo. Also if you ever get a jammed mimic you may as well just leave the room and move on unless you want to spend the next 10 minutes on it.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:21
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Snazzy Frocks posted:I have never seen a mimic on the red/black chests so I assumed it wasn't even a thing. I guess I have to tap the red/black chests too now, just to be safe Every chest but Rainbow and Glitch can be a mimic, it seems.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:21
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I pick this up after finishing DS3, finally get around to dousing the fireplace to get to the Oubliette switch...and the hatch to the Oubliette needs 2 keys. Does anyone have a way to get infinite keys in this game, because I'm not going to bother with it unless I can subvert some of its bullshit design choices.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:41
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There were some folks in this thread posting about using cheat engine for that earlier. You're always guaranteed to get two keys by the end of level 1 now, at least. But if you want to do the secret level you have to pass up on the chests and probably kill the first boss with your starter gun.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:46
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I just always play with the pilot now and if a lockpick opens one of the secret level locks i go in there if not gently caress it.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:52
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lazorexplosion posted:Install cheat engine.
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Apr 24, 2016 01:55
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That's grand, thanks.
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Apr 24, 2016 02:00
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I modified one of the Cheat Engine scripts to just give me a drop, any kind of drop, after each room clear, even if it's just an additional bullet casing drop, and man is the game now a lot more fun And even then i've gone entire runs where i haven't seen a single ammo drop until the fourth floor
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Apr 24, 2016 02:05
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Man, I'm not sure what to think about the secret level. It's tedious to get into, and it nearly-always means you'll be starved for keys in the next map, but it's effectively an entire extra level added to your run, meaning more chances at gathering shells and items. Right now its kind of a requirement for me to save those 2 keys an laboriously-roll a barrel around so I can get that leg-up in the game, whereas skipping the area feels like I've kneecapped myself for the rest of the run. Not sure if I like that.
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Apr 24, 2016 02:08
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cumshitter posted:I tried to do a 180 casings/4 keys run to fix the third floor elevator. On the first run I managed to pick up four keys from drops, but only 175 casings total for the three floors. Then on the next I only had one key drop and not a single store had a key for sale during the first or second run. I ended up destroying about 25 chests and only one dropped a single half-heart, one exploded, and the rest were trash. Didn't see a single trash eater in the merchants. Dunno if you're doing this already, but it's insanely easier if you play on a cleared character who can pray at the beginning altar. The large number of jammed enemies means you'll rack up a boatload of money. I had over 200 just finishing the 2nd floor and buying 1-2 keys.
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Apr 24, 2016 03:32
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I think the key balance is pretty good right now. I can't remember the last time I had to skip a green chest or better. As long as you buy all the keys in the shops and don't waste keys on brown chests, you should be fine. If you're at 1 key then don't open any chests unless it has a fuze on it or you've completed the floor. You don't want to waste your last key on a blue chest and then find a red or black on the same floor. If you're having a lot of issues then play hunter or pilot. As for ammo you are pretty much guaranteed to run out if you stop using your starter weapons the moment you pick up a new gun. If you're trying to play optimally, you should be using your starter weapons for at least the 1st and 2nd floors. You should use the starter pistol for as much of the 3rd floor as possible as well. At the very least you should be switching to it to finish off the last few enemies in a wave. Using ammo for any of the bosses is fine and generally worth it unless you think you can get a flawless without it. It makes the earlier floors kinda tedious/boring, but it's better than losing a run at the very end because you ran out of ammo. I don't think a flat ammo drop rate increase is the answer. The game is at a pretty good spot difficulty wise, they just need to do something to make the earlier floors less boring. Something that would help is having the unused ammo from the boxes spill over to your other weapons. It doesn't really make any sense that the only way to make good use of the boxes is to use one gun at a time until it's empty. If you use an ammo box on a gun that has 30% of its ammo left, that should only use up 70% of the ammo box. The remaining 30% should be divided up and given to your other guns. ChickenHeart posted:Man, I'm not sure what to think about the secret level. It's tedious to get into, and it nearly-always means you'll be starved for keys in the next map, but it's effectively an entire extra level added to your run, meaning more chances at gathering shells and items. Right now its kind of a requirement for me to save those 2 keys an laboriously-roll a barrel around so I can get that leg-up in the game, whereas skipping the area feels like I've kneecapped myself for the rest of the run. Not sure if I like that. I used to always go to the secret level but now I don't think it's worth it anymore. It just takes too long. I'd say you would probably have more successful runs if you just used all that time you would normally waste going to the oubliette on doing extra runs instead. I've been having more fun/success since I stopped going to the oubliette.
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Apr 24, 2016 03:33
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TheRevolution1 posted:As for ammo you are pretty much guaranteed to run out if you stop using your starter weapons the moment you pick up a new gun. If you're trying to play optimally, you should be using your starter weapons for at least the 1st and 2nd floors. You should use the starter pistol for as much of the 3rd floor as possible as well. Boring. Not interested.
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Apr 24, 2016 03:41
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What's the motivation for introducing keys as a random factor, anyway? If you want to limit how much stuff a person can get per floor, just limit the number and type of chests appropriately. This introduction basically ties the amount of stuff a person gets to RNG. Given that what you get out of the chest is already RNG, you're just stacking RNG on top of RNG at this point, and that rarely favors anyone, nor is it particularly fun. You're not demanding players make difficult decisions, either, since they have no way of knowing what will be in a particular chest. Additionally, it also incentivizes backtracking after one has discovered all chests and possible keys, which people continually argue is something the game tries to discourage. All in all, the system really doesn't make much sense, no matter how you present it.
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Apr 24, 2016 03:44
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Oxxidation posted:Boring. Not interested. Seriously it's by far the worst thing about this game and the reason since I've bought it I started playing nuclear throne instead. I'm not good enought o get to floor 3 using my guns most of the time, but why bother if I'm probably gonna get ammo hosed.
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Apr 24, 2016 03:53
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Everybody knows using your starting weapon for as long as possible and then only using 1 gun at a time without ever switching is how you lower the chances of running out of ammo, they just don't want to do it because it's boring as gently caress and nobody wants to spend 25-50% of their time using the most boring weapon in the game when there are over 100 alternatives in the game you should be allowed to use instead, and because switching out weapons is fun.
Owl Inspector fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Apr 24, 2016 |
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Apr 24, 2016 03:57
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I still think the best solution to ammo would be to just make ammo boxes give full ammo to every weapon. They don't even have to change the drop rates or the prices on buying it from a shop or anything, the current rarity/cost is good enough for that effect! As a side note, it's a real shame that you can't do Bullet Hell on Gun Game mode. I've done the song and dance of playing through the normal game again the way the devs intended to give it a fair shot, and it is incredibly boring to reserve all my weapons for floors 4+ and still be struggling with ammo by the time I find the Lich's room, even with the key balance being better (it is still a dumb system, but not as overly bad as before). I think, now that I've got the elevator unlocks and Robot/Bullet done fairly, I'm just going to turn on unlimited ammo in Cheat Engine and be done with it.
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Apr 24, 2016 04:11
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ChickenHeart posted:Man, I'm not sure what to think about the secret level. It's tedious to get into, and it nearly-always means you'll be starved for keys in the next map, but it's effectively an entire extra level added to your run, meaning more chances at gathering shells and items. Right now its kind of a requirement for me to save those 2 keys an laboriously-roll a barrel around so I can get that leg-up in the game, whereas skipping the area feels like I've kneecapped myself for the rest of the run. Not sure if I like that. After clearing the first floor except the boss, I'll open the better of the two chests, and after that decide whether to do the secret level if I get a gun that's either good all-around (Scrambler, Glacier) or shreds bosses (Golden Gun, Comm4ndo, Stinger) from the better one and have two keys drop/can buy a key. I'm not going to pass up a red/black chest to do it, but a brown/blue one is whatever. So far this has only backfired when the "good enough" gun was a composite gun, which burns ammo way too fast and isn't even that accurate.
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Apr 24, 2016 04:11
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Digirat posted:Everybody knows using your starting weapon for as long as possible and then only using 1 gun at a time without ever switching is how you lower the chances of running out of ammo, they just don't want to do it because it's boring as gently caress and nobody wants to spend 25-50% of their time using the most boring weapon in the game when there are over 100 alternatives in the game you should be allowed to use instead, and because switching out weapons is fun. I swear I get more ammo drops after changing to using real guns more often. The most likely explanation is that the developer is wrong about his own game.
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Apr 24, 2016 04:16
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FactsAreUseless posted:I don't think they fully thought through all their random mechanics - like the aforementioned disconnect between room difficulty and reward. More enemies mean more money, no? Also it might just be confirmation bias but I'm pretty sure the "harder" guys (like the Knights on floor 1 that aren't actually that hard but can take a lot of hits) seem to drop more cash, too. If you're talking about the room clear health/ammo/key rewards though, I agree, that would be a nice way to pad the RNG element out a little bit.
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Apr 24, 2016 05:02
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I haven't played this (or any other non-handheld game) once since DS3 came out to be honest but I mostly enjoyed it a lot for that first week. I look forward to revisiting it in the future and it seems like a lot of the games flaws could be solved by just tweaking some numbers here and there so I'm hoping they make some good decisions when it comes to patching in changes because the core game is really, really fun
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Apr 24, 2016 05:04
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can I just cheat engine infinite ammo for anything and enjoy myself a lot more by being a cheaty cheat?
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Apr 24, 2016 05:05
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yes, and no reload, also infinite keys.
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Apr 24, 2016 05:37
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I would agree to both of those but I'm still trying to learn the game. I've had the Convict die about 17 times so far, not sure when to use the sawed-off.
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Apr 24, 2016 06:06
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Jim Barris posted:If you hide in a hallway and wait for Ralph to spawn and take a couple shots at him he'll gently caress off and won't come back on that floor (I think). I'm not 100% on this but it seemed to be true from my observational experience. He'll steal the poo poo as soon as you teleport, doesn't matter if you scared him off or not.
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Apr 24, 2016 09:13
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 Beat the past for this guy on my first dragun fight with him. Got completely carried by Dragunfire, angry bullets and bouncy bullets. Made the run insanely easy, including flawlessing 4 bosses. The dragun fight is still something I've been able to do like three times so I haven't gotten any patterns down well
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Apr 24, 2016 10:04
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Yes game, I love locked doors for no reason.
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Apr 24, 2016 10:35
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