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romanowski posted:your first statement was pretty dumb but then you just kept following it up with even dumber poo poo, impressive I'm ALSO still trying to understand what they were thinking with that final scene. There's like a full minute of lingering camera angles on Jon Snow's corpse and his wolf stirring. What the gently caress is the point? Like what journey is that supposed to take the audience on? "Oh, I think he's going to come back to life...Okay, he's definitely going to come back to life 'cause why else would the corpse on a table get it's own scene...okay now I'm just bored...aaaaand he's back to life. Yeah."
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May 2, 2016 21:32
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Karstark's niece also marries the new Magnar of Thenn, which further prevents him from carrying out his plans. As for whether Ramsay is in good standing in the North, even D&D say in the Inside the Episode that Roose's caution and pursuit of political alliances is what has kept House Bolton afloat, and that by killing Roose, Ramsay is making House Bolton's position more precarious than it previously was. So we'll see what happens with Dorne, but at the very least with Ramsay the writers don't view this as being a smart move or one that will be supported by the rest of the North. Rickon may be the big factor keeping the other Northern houses from rebelling immediately, if that's what the "gift" entails.
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May 2, 2016 21:33
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Mike N Eich posted:The implication from the books is that if you have had a life extended by magic (like Beric or Melisandre) and try to impart that to someone else, you have to sacrifice your own life. Yeah, the biggest twist from Sunday's episode was that Melisandre didn't die reviving Jon. I thought if they were going to cull anyone from the cast it would be her.
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May 2, 2016 21:33
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In It For The Tank posted:Yeah, the biggest twist from Sunday's episode was that Melisandre didn't die reviving Jon. I thought if they were going to cull anyone from the cast it would be her. I think Hodor not always having been Hodor is the biggest twist. Most of the other stuff happening this season seems to be confirming stuff people have speculated on for years, even before the TV show began, but I really thought Hodor was born that way.
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May 2, 2016 21:36
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In It For The Tank posted:Yeah, the biggest twist from Sunday's episode was that Melisandre didn't die reviving Jon. I thought if they were going to cull anyone from the cast it would be her. 0 out of 2 red priests have suffered in any way from reviving a dead person though... Maybe it's just fatal if you're a scrub that doesn't know R'hllor?
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May 2, 2016 21:36
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Max posted:If you go back and watch the scene where Thoros revives Berric after his fight with the Hound, he legit just prays over his body in the show version, and suddenly Berric is healed. Good to know, ty. It was consistent within the show then and I am no longer salty. It's just been forev and BwB was back when they were kind of mostly faithful and thus I assumed. e: ^ on the show at least. In the books iirc Thoros becomes skinnier and more haggard compared to his fat and jolly self from rezzing Beric so much, then Beric obvs dies when he transfers what little life force he has left to Cat
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May 2, 2016 21:37
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VagueRant posted:Is it an overexaggeration to ask if this is the worst show on TV? Because of the shows I watch, it's making season 3 of The 100 look very good by comparison. Okay I get that you're upset and all, but if you've ever turned a television on in the united states between the hours of noon and 8pm you should know that the answer is hell no. There is so much complete garbage on TV. Even at its worst GOT is still miles more entertaining than over half of the stupid poo poo on TV. Have you ever watched a single episode of something like 'two and a half men' or any of the other the garbage I usually flip past? VagueRant posted:I'm ALSO still trying to understand what they were thinking with that final scene. There's like a full minute of lingering camera angles on Jon Snow's corpse and his wolf stirring. What the gently caress is the point? Like what journey is that supposed to take the audience on? "Oh, I think he's going to come back to life...Okay, he's definitely going to come back to life 'cause why else would the corpse on a table get it's own scene...okay now I'm just bored...aaaaand he's back to life. Yeah." Try watching GOT with some friends so you have people to talk to during those moments.
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May 2, 2016 21:41
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GoGoGadgetChris posted:0 out of 2 red priests have suffered in any way from reviving a dead person though... The assumption being that Melisandre would expend the magic keeping her alive like Beric did when he revived Catelyn. That she survived does raise questions about what the point of the revelation that she's secretly old as balls was. If she'd turned to ash when the ritual completed, it would have been a bit more understandable. As it is, and to be fair maybe something will come of it (lol or not), the end of 6x01 basically just reiterated that Melisandre can do magic which you would think would be unnecessary since she can spawn shadow demons out of her hoo-ha. (Also 0 out of 2 Red Priests? Thoros and....? Or do you think Moqorro revived Victarion as well as giving him a bad rear end volcano hand?)
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May 2, 2016 21:42
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In It For The Tank posted:The assumption being that Melisandre would expend the magic keeping her alive like Beric did when he revived Catelyn. That she survived does raise questions about what the point of the revelation that she's secretly old as balls was. If she'd turned to ash when the ritual completed, it would have been a bit more understandable. As it is, and to be fair maybe something will come of it (lol or not), the end of 6x01 basically just reiterated that Melisandre can do magic which you would think would be unnecessary since she can spawn shadow demons out of her hoo-ha. Yeah I really thought they'd have her necklace drained of power and she'd be stuck as old from here on out, if not fully die, but oh well. Van Houten is really hot (and seems more open to nude scenes than Emilia Clarke) so they couldn't completely get rid of her.
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May 2, 2016 21:43
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I assumed that Thoros got skinny because he is no longer sitting and around drinking all the time, and instead living on the run as a fugitive? I don't recall it being about his resurrections, although maybe I just missed it. In addition to being a Red Priestess, Melisandre is also a Shadowbinder, so she has multiple levels of crazy magic going on that might allow her to manage more than we've seen before.
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May 2, 2016 21:46
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In It For The Tank posted:The assumption being that Melisandre would expend the magic keeping her alive like Beric did when he revived Catelyn. That she survived does raise questions about what the point of the revelation that she's secretly old as balls was. If she'd turned to ash when the ritual completed, it would have been a bit more understandable. As it is, and to be fair maybe something will come of it (lol or not), the end of 6x01 basically just reiterated that Melisandre can do magic which you would think would be unnecessary since she can spawn shadow demons out of her hoo-ha. Beric is not a Red Priest but a dude who was revived by a Red Priest (Thoros of Myr), who showed some signs of strain from reviving Beric several times, but nothing major. Basically, if you are a Red Priest in good standing you can revive dudes, but if you are a revived person you can only transfer the magic, which means if you want to revive someone, you will have to sacrifice yourself. The result is that Mel can revive Jon just fine, but if Jon wanted to revive someone else in the future, he could do so only by giving up his own life.
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May 2, 2016 21:47
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esperterra posted:e: ^ on the show at least. In the books iirc Thoros becomes skinnier and more haggard compared to his fat and jolly self from rezzing Beric so much, then Beric obvs dies when he transfers what little life force he has left to Cat
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May 2, 2016 21:47
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In It For The Tank posted:Yeah, the biggest twist from Sunday's episode was that Melisandre didn't die reviving Jon. I thought if they were going to cull anyone from the cast it would be her. We kind of assumed here watching the first episode that showing Mel as an old woman, meant that she was sacrificing her life/magic whatever to her god to bring back Jon. Apparently we were wrong, but I have to admit, we thought for sure here that she was going to just end up giving her life to her god to bring back Jon's.....a life for a life type of thing. Glad she isn't dead...I like her.
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May 2, 2016 21:51
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Changing the subject a bit, I suppose now Jaqen will just return Arya's vision and she will get on with her training, with no cat warging or anything? That's was pretty boring if that was really all her blind training, getting beaten up twice by the girl
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May 2, 2016 21:51
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Maybe that which sustains Melisandre isn't exactly the same as what kept/is keeping Beric and Stoneheart alive. Maybe she never actually died and has just been kept alive for several centuries. You'd think there'd be a difference in keeping someone alive and making a zombie. Or maybe in the books she will die if/when she revives him and the show kept her alive because it never established the precedent with Lady Stoneheart of Beric sacrificing his fire to revive Catelyn. Speaking of the Brotherhood Without Banners, I wonder how Brienne, Sansa, and Podrick are going to end up in the Riverlands if they're headed in the opposite direction right now. That's assuming Sansa even goes to the Riverlands at all, it's possible someone else will kill the Freys.
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May 2, 2016 21:53
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Disco Salmon posted:We kind of assumed here watching the first episode that showing Mel as an old woman, meant that she was sacrificing her life/magic whatever to her god to bring back Jon. I had guessed this might happen in the other thread, at which point I said "then why bother showing she's old? D&D just really wanted to make everybody look at some old granny tits I guess  "Somebody else replied "the point was to show she's old" which okay yeah sure whatever. They really could have skipped that scene if she wasn't going to sacrifice herself, but I guess it was just supposed to hammer home her loss of faith. But...now that she's successfully brought somebody back from the dead, somebody she thought might be azor ahai and who she had lost faith for, she's probably going to be a lot more confident in her abilities, right? Meaning that her loss of faith was pretty temporary. Odd thing to waste so much time on if that's so.
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May 2, 2016 21:56
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The impression I got wrt the "cost" of resurrection is that the cost is borne more by the recipient than anyone else. Berric gives it up to revive Cat because he wants to die; he talks about how he's not himself any more, how every time he comes back something else of him - memory, personality, feelings - goes. This is way more clear in the books where Berric is originally introduced/described as being a jovial, handsome, rough-hewn young knight (Sansa's friend Jeyne, another cut character, wants to marry him) in comparison to the haggard, prematurely old, quiet, desperate man we meet in the Brotherhood. Similarly some combination of grief, the horror of the Red Wedding, the length of time she was dead, and that human cost of resurrection makes Cat a real Pet Sematary kind of miracle, a creepy, rasping, cruel banshee of the woods who hangs anyone who crosses the Brotherhood's path that she doesn't like the look of without debate or discussion. In the show, Melisandre even tells Davos "if you want to help him, leave him be". If there's a horrific sacrifice to be paid for the resurrection spell, Jon is going to be the one paying it, not Melisandre. And if a sacrifice must be paid to enable it, I think Shireen's burning is more than enough (and may very well be the catalyst for Jon's resurrection in the books). The purpose of that sacrifice was to break the weather and help Stannis win the battle of Winterfell, but weather breaks on its own and nothing goes right for Stannis from the moment he agrees to it. Perhaps it's humility which R'hllor wants anyway, not sacrifice. Thoros was humbled by Berric's death, begging the Lord to save him. Melisandre is humbled by Stannis's defeat and confronts the reality of her age, fragility, and decay. And then she's able to work a miracle.
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May 2, 2016 22:00
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Zaphod42 posted:I had guessed this might happen in the other thread, at which point I said "then why bother showing she's old? D&D just really wanted to make everybody look at some old granny tits I guess Well, tbh, we didn't think she was as old as what people said...the 400 years thing. We just figured she did the whole "power for youth" thing. I'm rather curious now to see how they play the rest of this out...maybe it was a message to her from her god (not reviving Jon right away) that she isn't as powerful as she thought, and that maybe she needed a little humbling? Lots of ways to look at it. Looking forward to next week!
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May 2, 2016 22:01
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Elias_Maluco posted:Changing the subject a bit, I suppose now Jaqen will just return Arya's vision and she will get on with her training, with no cat warging or anything? That's was pretty boring if that was really all her blind training, getting beaten up twice by the girl I don't think so, she's still going to have to learn to "sense" danger and anticipate her opponent's moves, it's just now her training is going to be kicked up a notch.
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May 2, 2016 22:03
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Zombies' Downfall posted:In the show, Melisandre even tells Davos "if you want to help him, leave him be". If there's a horrific sacrifice to be paid for the resurrection spell, Jon is going to be the one paying it, not Melisandre. And if a sacrifice must be paid to enable it, I think Shireen's burning is more than enough (and may very well be the catalyst for Jon's resurrection in the books). The purpose of that sacrifice was to break the weather and help Stannis win the battle of Winterfell, but weather breaks on its own and nothing goes right for Stannis from the moment he agrees to it. Yeah I think the books are probably going to have Shireen burn to bring back Jon, and the show decided they didn't want to link those so directly because that's kinda icky. Same with having Jojen die fighting skeletons instead of being possibly fed to Bran as breakfast. They like the red wedding shockers but they don't want to go too far. Evil people like Ramsay can kill babies but good guys like Jon or Bran can't be even remotely involved. Which kinda misses the point...
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May 2, 2016 22:06
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Linguica posted:Haha I didn't really register that Brienne neglects to tell Sansa that she saw Arya with Sandor loving Clegane and instead just sort of mumbles that she saw him with "a man." (Not to mention the part where Brienne, you know, mortally wounded Sandor thereby leaving Arya all alone.) I really hope theyre not doing that terrible lazy pointlessly-withheld-information thing where a few episodes from now Brienne casually mentions Sandor and Sansa is like "wait wtf why didnt you say that before now" oh who am I kidding that's probably exactly what will happen. This is from a while back, but there is an actual point to witholding information since Brienne wouldn't want Sansa to worry about Arya's safety. Telling her that Arya was with the Hound would do nothing but make Sansa more concerned. Might not be the best move on her part, but there's definitely logic to it.
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May 2, 2016 22:09
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Apoplexy posted:What is dead may never die. What is dead may never die.
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May 2, 2016 22:12
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VagueRant posted:Sorry, Dave. are you this retarded on purpose
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May 2, 2016 22:13
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VagueRant posted:Sorry, Dave. You're just kind of looking for poo poo to be mad about with the show aren't you?
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May 2, 2016 22:15
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Why did they change the response to What Is Dead May Never Die to... What Is Dead May Never Die? It's these for-no-reason changes that always confuse me the most. I get why they couldn't do the Reek reveal or the Whitebeard reveal on TV the way it worked in the books, but this just seems odd. I get that they had to rename the Seastone Chair. Show watchers won't understand that it's a throne if they use the word "chair", and Seastone Throne rhymes and sounds stupid, soooo... Salt Throne it is, baby!
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May 2, 2016 22:21
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May 2, 2016 22:26
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drat dude low blow
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May 2, 2016 22:29
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Zaphod42 posted:I had guessed this might happen in the other thread, at which point I said "then why bother showing she's old? D&D just really wanted to make everybody look at some old granny tits I guess It's characterization, which is good in my humble opinion. Also that scene was like 30 seconds
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May 2, 2016 22:31
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No dogless man may sit the Seastone Chair.
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May 2, 2016 22:35
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Amish Ninja posted:You're just kind of looking for poo poo to be mad about with the show aren't you? Yeah TBH ever since the later parts of S4 this thread has been consistently populated with turdlords who confuse critical thinking with "being as negative as possible". Critical thinking is stuff like pointing out how the Sand Snakes are suddenly aboard Trystane's ship or how pointless it is to give yet another demonstration of Ramsay's psychopathic tendencies, which have been established now for like three seasons. Just wanting to be mad and being thought of as critical and smart by nitpicking about dumb stuff like "curved wounds on Jon's body" or scoffing at how Tyrion deals with the dragons is just annoying. The thing is I'm sure that if Jon's body showed simple stab wounds, those same salty nerds would moan about the wounds not being round enough and if Tyrion would have gotten Quentyn'ed, they'd have whined about what a dumb decision he'd made. I mean, guess what, nearly every movie or tv series ever made has inconsistencies, plotholes and things that don't make 100% sense. Because that poo poo ultimately doesn't matter the most. For instance, in the Iliad, it would be the most logical choice for Achilles to not enter the fray after his friend/gay lover Patroclus is killed in combat because he knows there's a prophecy hanging over him. Just like Hector spelling out Andromache's fate word for word is what not should make him go and fight. But the Iliad's narrative wouldn't be interesting at all if Achilles and Hector made rational, sane choices. Kind of like real life, you know? Kind of like how stories are constructed to be inherently artificial.
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May 2, 2016 22:52
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Beeez posted:I think Hodor not always having been Hodor is the biggest twist. Obvious setup for Jon's parents turning out to be... Lyanna and Hodor.
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May 2, 2016 23:19
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I just want to point out that season 4 was the pinnacle of the series, i did not expect it to get better, merely to keep up with the clever writing and incredible drama. I think people pointing out how lazy the writing is justified. Ramsey killing Roose with nearly no buildup or twist or even something crazy, like maybe he kills the child but spares Walda? Nothing, nada, nothing clever or unforseen this season at all. If they had balls why wouldn't they wait one more episode to ressurect Jon, maybe in the funeral Pyre as others have said? Why have Ramsey kill Roose so easily? Why not have a failed attempt by Roose while Ramsey clearly knows he always wears chainmail? Just lazy writing, and still i'm enjoying the season. Thanks god we still had Tyrion to save it so far.
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May 2, 2016 23:26
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I saw a much better theory that Shireen isn't going to be burned for Jon, likely based on what we've seen Mel can revive Jon probably without having to. Shireen is much more likely to be burned to revive the Winterfell dragon.
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May 2, 2016 23:31
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Actually season 1 was the pinnacle.
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May 2, 2016 23:31
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This season will pick up once Mace Tyrell leads the assault to bust his daughter and son out of prison.
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May 2, 2016 23:32
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a cop posted:Yeah it's that one specific prayer that he even tells Mel. I was wondering if it was something funny like Mel speaking the wrong language, lol. I think it was the fact she was going through the motions at first. Doing what you're supposed to do. She tries a few times and seems to be getting more desperate. When she finally gives up and begs 'please' is when it finally takes hold. If I remember right, Thoros was equally distraught and just begged please the first time he brought back Beric. edit: actually doesn't this mean Beric is still kicking around if no stone heart?
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May 2, 2016 23:34
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chilihead posted:I just want to point out that season 4 was the pinnacle of the series, i did not expect it to get better, merely to keep up with the clever writing and incredible drama. The show's writing in S6 has been poo poo, but dragging out Jon's ressurection wouldn't have helped at ALL. Every single show fan knew he was coming back a year ago; the sooner they get that over with the better. Dragging that out would have been the worst. TK-42-1 posted:I think it was the fact she was going through the motions at first. Doing what you're supposed to do. She tries a few times and seems to be getting more desperate. When she finally gives up and begs 'please' is when it finally takes hold. Yes we have so far no reason to believe Berric is gone. I think the show will do the Stoneheart plot this season though.
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May 2, 2016 23:36
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I just had a non-reader absolutely lose her mind at me when I brought up R + L = J because I'm "spoiling from the books." They've telegraphed in how honorable Ned is and how mysterious the Tower of Joy demise of Lyanna was since S1 like how do you miss these signals 
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May 2, 2016 23:46
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The people I was watching with last night are still under the impression that Yara is some sort of awesome badass pirate woman. I guess we can still operate under that assumption if we also assume that the men in the Dreadfort that night with Ramsay were the Twenty Goodmen but that may be pushing it. Those dogs though
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May 2, 2016 23:56
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I'm looking forward to the Riverlands plot, whether they do Stoneheart or not. The show is at its strongest when it builds a world, and Arya/Hound's trip through the war ravaged Riverlands was pretty entertaining even if it was trivial. Compare that to Dorne where the only scenes are some coastline and the palace, and you get an idea of where it all started to go wrong. 13Pandora13 posted:I just had a non-reader absolutely lose her mind at me when I brought up R + L = J because I'm "spoiling from the books." They've telegraphed in how honorable Ned is and how mysterious the Tower of Joy demise of Lyanna was since S1 like how do you miss these signals To be fair it's not like they do the same ridiculous amount of hinting as the books. It's like some namedrops of Lyanna in S1, "We'll talk about your mother someday" and a few other things. iSqueezeCats fucked around with this message at 00:00 on May 3, 2016 |
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May 2, 2016 23:57
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