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Marvel choosing to not use their female superheroes is not a good excuse for not having them.
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May 9, 2016 21:05
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MacheteZombie posted:Marvel choosing to not use their female superheroes is not a good excuse for not having them. I'm saying most of those specific characters don't warrant use because they're either superfluous to each or other heroes. You're really going to count female spider hero as three separate entries? One of which even people that read comics would be hard pressed to recognize? Also Moondragon, Tigra, and Squirrel Girl are serious options? Nobody at all cares about the first two and the last one is literally a joke. The only real contenders on that list are Valkyrie, The three Inhumans, Jessica Drew and a very outside shot on Kate. Misty Knight is already taken, Enchantress is a villain, and Firestar is a mutant. X-O fucked around with this message at 21:11 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 21:09
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X-O posted:I'm saying most of those specific characters don't warrant use because they're either superfluous to each or other heroes. You're really going to count female spider hero as three separate entries? One of which even people that read comics would be hard pressed to recognize? Also Moondragon, Tigra, and Squirrel Girl are serious options? Nobody at all cares about the first two and the last one is literally a joke. I've seen many people describe Iron Man as a C-List/D-List character prior to the MCU and they made that work. Maybe Marvel could at least try? Squirrel Girl could easily work with a tone similar to GotG, hell it justifiably could get away with an even sillier tone.
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May 9, 2016 21:13
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DC is also already using their own Enchantress in Suicide Squad and they probably would prefer not to overlap.
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May 9, 2016 21:15
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Squirrel Girl could work as a cartoon, something akin to a Pixar movie. It would never work in the MCU.
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May 9, 2016 21:15
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MacheteZombie posted:I've seen many people describe Iron Man as a C-List/D-List character prior to the MCU and they made that work. Maybe Marvel could at least try? Yeah. If you showed people a list of the male Marvel heroes in 2007 and said "guess which ones will get their own movies or feature in movies in the next ten years", everyone would have been wrong.
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May 9, 2016 21:15
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X-O posted:Squirrel Girl could work as a cartoon, something akin to a Pixar movie. It would never work in the MCU. But the talking raccoon, that's okay.
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May 9, 2016 21:16
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Rurea posted:Yeah. If you showed people a list of the male Marvel heroes in 2007 and said "guess which ones will get their own movies or feature in movies in the next ten years", everyone would have been wrong. Really? I can't think of any who would be on that list and didn't get one.
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May 9, 2016 21:16
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X-O, I would say at a minimum She-Hulk and Spider-Woman (Jessica Drew) are doable. Especially they come packaged with a built-in fanbase due to being associated with another brand due to their name. And further from that I'd say that the MCU could take concepts for heroes or heroes that exist as part of a Corps, like Nova and Quasar, and make them into female heroes. Especially Nova, which already has a reason to exist and is built upon a movie that did quite well for Marvel.
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May 9, 2016 21:16
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X-O posted:Squirrel Girl could work as a cartoon, something akin to a Pixar movie. It would never work in the MCU. A guy who communicates with Ants and changes his size was an extremely popular live-action motion picture in this decade, but talking to squirrels and being silly is a bridge too far? ImpAtom posted:Really? I can't think of any who would be on that list and didn't get one.
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May 9, 2016 21:16
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Like She-Hulk should've, honestly, gotten her own movie by now and its kinda crazy that Captain Marvel ends up the first female supe to get her own movie.
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May 9, 2016 21:18
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MacheteZombie posted:A guy who communicates with Ants and changes his size was an extremely popular live-action motion picture in this decade, but talking to squirrels and being silly is a bridge too far? Squirrel Girl would absolutely, positively not work as a Marvel movie anchor. X-O's totally right there. You're looking at a Netflix series, a half-hour sitcom starring Kristen Schaal.
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May 9, 2016 21:19
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redbackground posted:But the talking raccoon, that's okay. Yes, that character as it exists is not one big ongoing joke. Squirrel Girl's whole thing is that she has the lamest powers ever conceived and that she can beat anyone with them. That's a joke premise and would not work in an actual movie. She-Hulk would be great, but she's also a derivative character and her rights likely are the same as Hulk's in that they can't do a solo movie with her without jumping through hoops.
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May 9, 2016 21:19
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Toxxupation posted:Squirrel Girl would absolutely, positively not work as a Marvel movie anchor. X-O's totally right there. You're looking at a Netflix series, a half-hour sitcom starring Kristen Schaal. We can't know, because Marvel won't even try.
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May 9, 2016 21:19
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ImpAtom posted:Really? I can't think of any who would be on that list and didn't get one. Antman and Guardians of the Galaxy are the ones nobody expected would actually come out. I think Antman is what originally kicked off the whole "nobody will watch a movie about [whatever]"
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May 9, 2016 21:21
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X-O posted:Yes, that character as it exists is not one big ongoing joke. Squirrel Girl's whole thing is that she has the lamest powers ever conceived and that she can beat anyone with them. That's a joke premise and would not work in an actual movie. I dunno. I think her current series is showing that she beats people not with her powers, but because she tries out things other than punching. Like talking to them. And with Ewing integrating her into New Avengers, she's much less of a joke character now and could very well be adapted.
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May 9, 2016 21:23
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MacheteZombie posted:We can't know, because Marvel won't even try. The whole point of the character is that she breaks the power curve. That's not sustainable in the same universe without reining in her power (negating her character) AND making her serious (negating her character). She's also a lovely example of a female superhero to start with. Thirty years down the line when Captain Marvel and Spider-Woman and She-Hulk and Ms. Marvel and the Inhumans are running around? Sure, maybe then. But Squirrel Girl was conceived as a joke that only works if you "get" how powerful the extended Marvel Universe is, and how funny it is that she's insanely overpowered. You're talking about a unvierse that hasn't even introduced Thanos and you want a character that beat him in a straight-up fight to get a starring movie? C'mon. That's stupid.
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May 9, 2016 21:24
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Valkyrie is confirmed for Thor 3.
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May 9, 2016 21:24
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That said, Howard the Duck made it into a post-credits sequence. Anything is possible in a post-credits sequence.
qntm fucked around with this message at 21:28 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 21:25
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Toxxupation posted:The whole point of the character is that she breaks the power curve. That's not sustainable in the same universe without reining in her power (negating her character) AND making her serious (negating her character). Or instead of focusing on her power level you focus on her being chipper, optimistic and slightly over the top despite her silly power set? Nor does she need to be serious. Frigging Deadpool is one of the most profitable superhero films ever.
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May 9, 2016 21:26
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Toxxupation posted:Winter Soldier did really good numbers, the Captain America brand has been built up to the point I would say Chris Evans is a solid (but very far behind, like everybody else) number two to RDJ in terms of being or tied with the superhero that he plays. How would you compare either of them with Jackman as Wolverine?
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May 9, 2016 21:27
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Toxxupation posted:The whole point of the character is that she breaks the power curve. That's not sustainable in the same universe without reining in her power (negating her character) AND making her serious (negating her character). So you haven't been reading the current series and are only going off of knowing Squirrel Girl from when she was a joke character.
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May 9, 2016 21:28
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ImpAtom posted:Or instead of focusing on her power level you focus on her being chipper, optimistic and slightly over the top despite her silly power set? Nor does she need to be serious. Frigging Deadpool is one of the most profitable superhero films ever. redbackground fucked around with this message at 21:32 on May 9, 2016 |
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May 9, 2016 21:29
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Codependent Poster posted:I dunno. I think her current series is showing that she beats people not with her powers, but because she tries out things other than punching. Like talking to them. And with Ewing integrating her into New Avengers, she's much less of a joke character now and could very well be adapted. No way man, she talks to squirrels and says silly things which would not fit into the MCU at all. Marvel audiences aren't ready for silly jokes and lighthearted storytelling. Toxxupation posted:The whole point of the character is that she breaks the power curve. That's not sustainable in the same universe without reining in her power (negating her character) AND making her serious (negating her character). She beats him in a one-off Christmas special. Vision and Scarlett Witch have power curve breaking abilities but no one's complaining about them being included. Also, I'm not hitching my wagon to specifically Squirrel-Girl, any of the women on that original list could be made into a live-action MCU counterpart, but Marvel doesn't seem interested in trying.
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May 9, 2016 21:29
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She's a joke character that only works as a subversion of and reaction to established concepts of Marvel canon. She's awesome, she's amazing, but if you were to make a list of the best female Marvel superheroes currently in use she wouldn't even crack the top five. You can't subvert expectations as you're establishing them. Deadpool's an exception because he's a comic book character who's literally aware he's a comic book character.
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May 9, 2016 21:29
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The guy mentioned Cloak and Dagger. That casts a wide net. EDIT - as for Firestar, she's never actually had a notable run as an X-Man, so there's a case for her falling into the same category as Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver.
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May 9, 2016 21:30
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MacheteZombie posted:We can't know, because Marvel won't even try. If you believe the actors and producers, a lot of that blame rests with Perlmutter who now is no longer involved - he was apparently the guy who said there shouldn't be Black Widow merchandise because girls don't watch superhero movies, and Evans said the guy was a big reason why he was leery about continuing with Marvel. Wasp is co-headlining Ant-Man 2, which apparently wouldn't have been possible with Perlmutter in the picture according to Marvel's folks, and they also say he was the biggest voice opposing a full on Black Widow movie.
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May 9, 2016 21:31
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Toxxupation posted:She's a joke character that only works as a subversion of and reaction to established concepts of Marvel canon. She's awesome, she's amazing, but if you were to make a list of the best female Marvel superheroes currently in use she wouldn't even crack the top five. You can't subvert expectations as you're establishing them. Deadpool's an exception because he's a comic book character who's literally aware he's a comic book character. If they actually made a Squirrel Girl movie it wouldn't be slated for release until 2020 or beyond. Marvel needs to build expectations beyond that time frame? How long do they need before they can be subverted?
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May 9, 2016 21:32
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Squirrel Girl pre-film short cartoons. And maybe a serial newsreel about Captain America during the war.
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May 9, 2016 21:32
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TFRazorsaw posted:Angela He said big name
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May 9, 2016 21:33
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Codependent Poster posted:So you haven't been reading the current series and are only going off of knowing Squirrel Girl from when she was a joke character. I'm going literally off the current series. She ends up making friends with Galactus to beat him, and that joke only works if you know how insane it is for a mortal being to make friends with him. Or how inherently impossible it is for that to even happen. It's great, it's amazing, but it only works if you're like "Galactus is being interpreted in this goofy counterintuitive way to how he's always been portrayed, and that's awesome, but it removes or subverts all pre-established stakes about the character". It's just like how insane it is that Howard the Duck ends up a herald of Galactus in his ongoing. Because Howard would be, usually, the absolute worst candidate ever for the Power Cosmic. That discrepancy is what makes him work.
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May 9, 2016 21:33
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The problem is that most of Marvel's great current great female characters are either tied up with other studios (X-Men, Sue Storm, She-Hulk, Spider-Women), on TV (Jessica Jones, Hellcat, Misty Knight, Elektra, Mockingbird), derivative (Rescue, Thor, Spider-Women, She-Hulk, Ms Marvel), or they already have plans going forward (Black Widow, Captain Marvel, Wasp, Valkyrie). Hell I'd love a Spectrum or Elsa Bloodstone movie just as much as the next guy because those characters are great. But is that feasible? I don't think so.
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May 9, 2016 21:33
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Tigra has a better chance of showing up on SHIELD, where people are all about messing around with genetics and a lady with cat powers is a definite step up from a regular guy with gun, than in a movie, where she could maybe go toe to toe with Black Widow or Hawkeye until they got tired of fighting her or ran out of cat puns and just put her down already. Still shouldn't happen, though.
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May 9, 2016 21:34
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Ignite Memories posted:He said big name again, the guy I replied to mentioned Cloak and Dagger. None of these characters have to appear in FILM, either. Or as main characters.
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May 9, 2016 21:34
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The MCU is coming up on 10 years of length and more than a dozen films. It is one of the largest and most prolific film franchises ever. Saying they 'need to wait' is insane because they're going to be releasing their 14th film this year.. *14.* The only comparable franchise is like James Bond.
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May 9, 2016 21:36
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Like just imagine a Doreen Green being an intern at Stark Industries, who is super hyper and keeps trying to talk to Tony. She begs him to let her be his sidekick, says what her powers are, and he blows her off. Then in a stinger you have her shown having beaten some supervillain or having talked them into doing something better with their lives. You could toss her into a Spider-Man movie as Peter's classmate, or Young Avengers.
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May 9, 2016 21:37
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I could actually see them doing the Blade movie with the teenage female Blade like that the comic that disappeared into the ether was going to do.
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May 9, 2016 21:37
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Nobody would see Squirrel Girl. I would make sure of it.
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May 9, 2016 21:37
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Marvel Studios has Hulk rights, just not distribution rights.
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May 9, 2016 21:37
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X-O posted:I could actually see them doing the Blade movie with the teenage female Blade like that the comic that disappeared into the ether was going to do. I thought that was rumored to be the basis for a Netflix series.
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May 9, 2016 21:38
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