BravestOfTheLamps posted:Yeah, why would there be any doubt in the righteousness of the Empire I wonder if the dudes who are into the Empire so much like science fiction where aliens are at the most just slightly different looking peaceful humanoids and the protaginist factions are basically massive space marine dickheads with a hard on for expansionism. I wonder how they feel about the Imperium/Imperial Guard from Warhammer 40k?
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May 13, 2016 15:17
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SeanBeansShako posted:I wonder if the dudes who are into the Empire so much like science fiction where aliens are at the most just slightly different looking peaceful humanoids and the protaginist factions are basically massive space marine dickheads with a hard on for expansionism. Thy would get a hard on for the tempestus scions. loving genocidal maniacs with notes cribbed from actual waffen ss training handbooks. One of the worst fluff changes for the imperial guard since calling them the space army (Astra militara)
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May 13, 2016 15:34
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SeanBeansShako posted:I wonder if the dudes who are into the Empire so much like science fiction where aliens are at the most just slightly different looking peaceful humanoids and the protaginist factions are basically massive space marine dickheads with a hard on for expansionism. There is an alternate history book called The Iron Dream by Norman Spinrad (who also wrote the Doomsday Machine episode of Star Trek TOS) where the premise is that after World War I, Hitler moved to the US and became a sci-fi writer, and his most famous book is basically our real-world World War II but in a post-apocalyptic setting where humans = Aryans and mutants = Jews, and the sci-fi conventions of that world are filled with people cosplaying as SS officers and giving each other Nazi salutes.
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May 13, 2016 16:48
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Chairman Capone posted:There is an alternate history book called The Iron Dream by Norman Spinrad (who also wrote the Doomsday Machine episode of Star Trek TOS) where the premise is that after World War I, Hitler moved to the US and became a sci-fi writer, and his most famous book is basically our real-world World War II but in a post-apocalyptic setting where humans = Aryans and mutants = Jews, and the sci-fi conventions of that world are filled with people cosplaying as SS officers and giving each other Nazi salutes. This sounds like some sort of weird nerd hell to me. Also yeah, gently caress the weird changes they did in Warhammer to the IG. You already got fanatical genocidal space warrior monks. loving GW.
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May 13, 2016 16:51
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IG became "Astra Militarum" or whatever bullshit it's actually called because GW lost the lawsuit on the term "Imperial Guard" and they changed it as a result of that. On the cover. After like three pages it's back to Guard this and Guard that. In summary gently caress GW
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May 13, 2016 17:03
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SeanBeansShako posted:cryptonazi Empire fans Do they really exist? The Empire is not that well characterized in the movies. I always thought that the human supremacy was basically just an EU retcon to explain why they're all human. So it's never going to be as impactful as what the movies show. People like stormtroopers because they have cool armour, not because of their ethos and - oh
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May 13, 2016 18:12
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Also, Battlefront 2 is in the works already. This is going to be confusing as hell, seeing as there is already a Battlefront 2. I'm sure it'll be rubbish and let people down again.
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May 13, 2016 19:37
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I often like bad guys, because sometimes it's more fun to play the bad guy. That said, anyone who is sane can tell that the Empire is supposed to be evil. However, I will say that Vader, Palpatine and the Empire are kind of like... cartoonish villains. Especially Palpatine. Sheev is practically Skeletor. He just loves being evil so much that it borders on the comical side. The First Order is a little different in that they hit a little closer to home and feel like actual Nazis for some reason.
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May 13, 2016 19:40
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:Do they really exist? The Empire is not that well characterized in the movies. I always thought that the human supremacy was basically just an EU retcon to explain why they're all human. So it's never going to be as impactful as what the movies show. Long before I read any EU, I always thought that the Empire didn't like aliens given the Death Star guard's comment about Chewbacca in ANH. Then again I also thought that stormtroopers were some kind of cyborg.
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May 13, 2016 19:47
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I like to think Robot Chicken parody Palpatine is very close to the canon character.
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May 13, 2016 19:48
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SeanBeansShako posted:I like to think Robot Chicken parody Palpatine is very close to the canon character. "So I threw the Senate at him! True story!" I agree.
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May 13, 2016 19:49
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Chairman Capone posted:There is an alternate history book called The Iron Dream by Norman Spinrad I am reading this right now! I was never able to find a copy for the longest time but it looks like there's a new reprint and I got a copy through Interlibrary Loan. It's not particularly well-written, which I guess is part of the point (and also maybe not a huge turn-off for people willing to read EU novels!). But as an illustration of the weird fascist tendencies underlying a tremendous amount of epic fantasy, it's pretty effective. Since no one else has posted it yet, here's an old (classic?) conservative defense of the Empire.
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May 13, 2016 20:16
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Megachile posted:I am reading this right now! I was never able to find a copy for the longest time but it looks like there's a new reprint and I got a copy through Interlibrary Loan. It's not particularly well-written, which I guess is part of the point (and also maybe not a huge turn-off for people willing to read EU novels!). But as an illustration of the weird fascist tendencies underlying a tremendous amount of epic fantasy, it's pretty effective. Yeah, I think it was intentional - I haven't read anything else from Spinrad, but the section at the end of the book which is ostensibly a "nonfiction" essay by a literary scholar on Hitler's career as an author is much different. If you're interested in this sort of look at the authoritarianism of fantasy, Michael Moorcock wrote two essays that look at this, Epic Pooh for high fantasy and Starship Stormtroopers for space opera.
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May 13, 2016 21:18
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Gammatron 64 posted:However, I will say that Vader, Palpatine and the Empire are kind of like... cartoonish villains. Especially Palpatine. Sheev is practically Skeletor. He just loves being evil so much that it borders on the comical side. As we've all agreed before, Ian McDiarmid hamming it up as Sheev "The Senate" Palpatine is one of the highlights of Revenge of the Sith - he is just having so much fun. Actually, Frank Langella as Skeletor in Masters of the Universe might be a good comparison. quote:The First Order is a little different in that they hit a little closer to home and feel like actual Nazis for some reason. Well, they're based on the concept of high-ranking Nazis fleeing the Third Reich and setting up shop in South America to keep the war going. Obviously Hux's big speech is basically a Nuremburg rally. It's because the First Order is staffed by variations on Arnold Judas Rimmer.  Anyway, I feel as though the droves of people emerging to insist that the Empire would've beaten the Yuuzhan Vong handily was one of the most tedious outcomes of the NJO. Wheat Loaf fucked around with this message at 21:52 on May 13, 2016 |
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May 13, 2016 21:45
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Chairman Capone posted:Yeah, I think it was intentional - I haven't read anything else from Spinrad, but the section at the end of the book which is ostensibly a "nonfiction" essay by a literary scholar on Hitler's career as an author is much different. I would argue that, even though Epic Pooh toys with calling Tolkien et al. fascist, it's really attacking epic fantasy for not being fascist enough. Moorcock is essentially saying that we should prefer protagonists like Conan the Barbarian to protagonists like Frodo and Sam. Ick. Silver2195 fucked around with this message at 01:27 on May 14, 2016 |
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May 14, 2016 01:24
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I've not actually read any of the books that have anything about the Yuuzhon but I get the impression that they were this big threat! I also remember reading a wookiepedia article that said they were the reason Palpatine built his Empire. I can easily see that being an actual stated reason, and I can already think of about a dozen things Palpatine did that prove that to be bullshit.
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May 14, 2016 01:33
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Wheat Loaf posted:Anyway, I feel as though the droves of people emerging to insist that the Empire would've beaten the Yuuzhan Vong handily was one of the most tedious outcomes of the NJO. That attitude was called out, literally in the NJO. Han Solo posted:"What the Empire would have done was build a super-colossal Yuuzhan Vong–killing battle machine. They would have called it the Nova Colossus or the Galaxy Destructor or the Nostril of Palpatine or something equally grandiose. They would have spent billions of credits, employed thousands of contractors and subcontractors, and equipped it with the latest in death-dealing technology. And you know what would have happened? It wouldn't have worked. They'd forget to bolt down a metal plate over an access hatch leading to the main reactors, or some other mistake, and a hotshot enemy pilot would drop a bomb down there and blow the whole thing up. Now that's what the Empire would have done."
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May 14, 2016 01:45
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cptn_dr posted:That attitude was called out, literally in the NJO. To be fair Han Solo was murdered by his own son so what does he know
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May 14, 2016 01:46
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Also, it's a little weird how in the actual movies, Darth Vader and the Empire are like, legitimately scary evil nazi guys, but after decades of merchandising and Vader toys and stuffed plushies and stuff he's kind of lost his bite. I guess it's the Dracula effect where after a period of time, Dracula is no longer scary and is now the friendly grandpa of the Munsters.
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May 14, 2016 02:09
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Gammatron 64 posted:Also, it's a little weird how in the actual movies, Darth Vader and the Empire are like, legitimately scary evil nazi guys, but after decades of merchandising and Vader toys and stuffed plushies and stuff he's kind of lost his bite. I guess it's the Dracula effect where after a period of time, Dracula is no longer scary and is now the friendly grandpa of the Munsters. It's hard for Darth Vader to be scary when you've seen him as an adorable 10 year old
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May 14, 2016 02:18
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Silver2195 posted:I would argue that, even though Epic Pooh toys with calling Tolkien et al. fascist, it's really attacking epic fantasy for not being fascist enough. Moorcock is essentially saying that we should prefer protagonists like Conan the Barbarian to protagonists like Frodo and Sam. Ick. Errr no? He's criticising the popularity of Conservative middle class fantasy for being reactionary and what he feels is bad writing catching on, at the expense of better writers and the dumbing down of children's literature. Nowhere in that does he indicate support for Conan the Barbarian or protagonists like him. He doesn't really bring up protagonists except for a few cheap digs at Aslan and the Hobbits. None of the books or authors he explicitly praises or recommends like Ursula le Guin are like Conan or Robert E. Howard.
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May 14, 2016 02:45
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Baka-nin posted:Errr no? He's criticising the popularity of Conservative middle class fantasy for being reactionary and what he feels is bad writing catching on, at the expense of better writers and the dumbing down of children's literature. Nowhere in that does he indicate support for Conan the Barbarian or protagonists like him. He doesn't really bring up protagonists except for a few cheap digs at Aslan and the Hobbits. None of the books or authors he explicitly praises or recommends like Ursula le Guin are like Conan or Robert E. Howard. I'm being a bit hyperbolic, but not by much. Michael Moorcock posted:If the bulk of American sf could be said to be written by robots, about robots, for robots, then the bulk of English fantasy seems to be written by rabbits, about rabbits and for rabbits. "About rabbits" seems like a complaint about protagonists to me. quote:The little hills and woods of that Surrey of the mind, the Shire, are "safe", but the wild landscapes everywhere beyond the Shire are "dangerous"...This is not to deny that courageous characters are found in The Lord of the Rings, or a willingness to fight Evil (never really defined), but somehow those courageous characters take on the aspect of retired colonels at last driven to write a letter to The Times The implication is that protagonists who, all things being equal, would prefer to stay home are therefore "conservative" and thus inferior to protagonists who seek adventure for its own sake. quote:Amongst the writers to be found in the volume are C. S. Lewis, John Buchan, Frank R. Stockton and Lloyd Alexander, not one of whom can match the literary talents of, say, Fritz Leiber, whose work has primarily been published in commercial magazines and genre paperback series...Those who use more vigorous American models are regarded as less literary! This isn't in praise of Robert E. Howard specifically, but comes close.
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May 14, 2016 03:09
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Silver2195 posted:I'm being a bit hyperbolic, but not by much. It is quite obviously a complaint as was the crack about Robots, but that can mean many different things, and I don't see why you'd automatically draw the conclusions you do draw. Especially since he goes onto praise writers whose stories and styles are in opposition to these trends he's arguing against don't tally with your conclusions. quote:The implication is that protagonists who, all things being equal, would prefer to stay home are therefore "conservative" and thus inferior to protagonists who seek adventure for its own sake. No, he's criticising Conservative attitudes in Tolkien protagonists. That isn't a contentious issue the Hobbits are explicitly the little Englander ideal. Later on in the essay he compares such attitudes to xenophobia an odd complaint for a supporter of Robert E. Howard style works. He also makes a similar complaint against Heinlein and company for using their stories and characters as platforms for their own politics and they're pretty different from Tolkien and Howard. quote:This isn't in praise of Robert E. Howard specifically, but comes close. How on earth can a passage praising Fritz Leiber a Pacifist riddled with guilt over his German heritage and writers like him be read as an endorsement of Howard or anyone like him? I mean Lovecraft maybe but Howard? Sorry but your reading a lot that isn't there, this would only be remotely true if Fantasy was a binary decision between The Lord of the Rings and Conan the Barbarian.
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May 14, 2016 04:39
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Baka-nin posted:It is quite obviously a complaint as was the crack about Robots, but that can mean many different things, and I don't see why you'd automatically draw the conclusions you do draw. Especially since he goes onto praise writers whose stories and styles are in opposition to these trends he's arguing against don't tally with your conclusions. You raise some fair points. I still disagree with Moorcock about the merits of a "vigorous" style and protagonists who aren't "rabbits."
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May 14, 2016 21:09
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whats the deal with jedi books/shelves ? are these just glowing tablets they pull out and read or do they plug them into something or what?
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May 16, 2016 03:13
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I assumed they were like blade servers and you'd just download what you needed.
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May 16, 2016 03:49
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Canemacar posted:I assumed they were like blade servers and you'd just download what you needed. Well, they DO have rackmount servers. The Jedi Beacon sure appears to be in a datacenter, at least. 
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May 16, 2016 04:19
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I never realized how bad that looks until now.
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May 16, 2016 05:24
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Hey, are there any articles or essays describing the creative process or what went wrong in the Bantam era EU? I seem to recall there was one posted here but I can't find it.
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May 16, 2016 05:49
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Lack of oversight and some crazy ideas, but I'd rather take that than Star Wars 40K that we got with Del Rey.
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May 16, 2016 05:50
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For any Lost Stars fans: https://twitter.com/starwars/status/733050849363103744 Nice that they're starting to build out and do more with the new characters they're introducing.
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May 19, 2016 17:07
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Teek posted:For any Lost Stars fans: That's a cool pic. yo I know Im a broken record but why no TIE Interceptors in TFA? WTF JJ Worst movie 0/10
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May 19, 2016 19:31
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Turns out battlefront was supposed to have a singleplayer campaign but they cut it to release with force awakens. But don't worry they're promising they will do better with battlefront 2!
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May 19, 2016 20:21
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Arcsquad12 posted:Turns out battlefront was supposed to have a singleplayer campaign but they cut it to release with force awakens. But don't worry they're promising they will do better with battlefront 2! Granted, this was absolutely the right decision from a business sense. So long as Battlefront was not literally a pile of scrap metal in a box, it was going to be printing money with its release being that close to TFA. Assuming BF2 releases with Episode 8, that's two years between games. The first game being stripped down, weird, and unwieldy was basically a given, thanks to the time frame and the business mentality of maximum return on investment. Battlefront 2 will be where any actual effort will show through. This is the same studio that couldn't get Battlefield 4, I believe it was, patched to the point of being passable in like six months or something, though, so Battlefront 2 might just be a picture of Slave Bikini Leia holding a laser rifle on a disc. Which will still sell great to a certain section of the fanbase, of course.
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May 20, 2016 07:15
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I'm kinda irked that they're announcing Battlefront 2 after I just bought the season pass and they're not going to continue to add content to the barebones game I stupidly bought
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May 20, 2016 13:59
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They're adding content through next spring. Battlefront is fine, it just didn't meet the internet's stratospheric expectations.
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May 20, 2016 16:03
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To be fair, I think some of those expectations involved the game not having fewer features than the previous installment that came out a decade ago.
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May 20, 2016 16:11
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Also to be fair, Battlefront is probably the best looking and most graphically detailed game I have ever seen, even though the game itself is a bit shallow. Video games are really hard to make these days and the economics and logistics just hasn't been able to keep pace with the technology.
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May 20, 2016 16:45
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Battlefront honestly wasn't very good. It visually looked great but its gameplay was shallower and more poorly designed than both modern Battlefield games and earlier Battlefront games. It being a modern game doesn't make it excusible because there are plenty of modern games that can do better. It was rushed to meet TFA's release date and it shows in every way. This has nothing to do with too-high expectations. It failed to live up to either games in the same franchise or other games in the same genre.
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May 20, 2016 16:56
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Big Mean Jerk posted:They're adding content through next spring. Battlefront is fine, it just didn't meet the internet's stratospheric expectations. My expectation was that I would be able to find a game on any mode within 30 minutes on PC. My bad.
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May 20, 2016 17:42
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