BSS Movie Thread (And The Stupenderful Articulation Of Substandard Speculation)

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > BSS: Bisexual Super Son > BSS Movie Thread (And The Stupenderful Articulation Of Substandard Speculation)

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Dexo: Aug 15, 2009; A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.

# ? May 18, 2016 03:45

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# ? May 17, 2024 09:45

Dexo: Aug 15, 2009; A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.

Ditto

# ? May 18, 2016 03:45

NieR Occomata: Jan 18, 2009; Glory to Mankind.

Barry Convex posted:

THR has the scoop: WB is launching a seemingly Marvel Studios-esque DC Films division with Geoff Johns and current WB exec Jon Berg in charge. No prizes for guessing what prompted this.

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/batman-v-superman-fallout-warner-895174

That's hilarious. So much for being creative-first or whatever and thus better than Marvel because mumble mumble.

# ? May 18, 2016 03:58

Aphrodite: Jun 27, 2006

...That's an exceptional leap, even for you.

# ? May 18, 2016 04:00

Scaramouche: Mar 26, 2001; SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

When I think of the kind of stories I want to see DC tell in movies I think Geoff Johns

# ? May 18, 2016 04:18

Ojjeorago: Sep 21, 2008; I had a dream, too. It wasn't pleasant, though ... I dreamt I was a moron...; Gary’s Answer

DC Films: "Me too, but worse"

# ? May 18, 2016 04:24

Shawn: Feb 6, 2003; I yiffed two people at once and all I got was laughed at.

I think Geoff Johns has very specific ideas with regards to characteristics of properties, where Kevin Feige has specific ideas about story structure, tone, and movies in general. If that makes sense. Feige's predilection works a lot better in that position in guiding a shared continuity but still allowing for a lot more freedom.

# ? May 18, 2016 04:27

Codependent Poster: Oct 20, 2003

Ugh, I really don't want Johns running the films.

Like, I really like Bendis, but I wouldn't want him running the Marvel films.

Feige is a fan of the comics, and I think not writing them and just being able to help pick and choose certain beats and character directions works best. He's not biased toward any sort of characters or stories, and that detachment helps since I believe he just wants to put entertaining stories on film with characters that are all the best parts of the ones that have been around for decades.

But I wouldn't trust Johns to have that detachment. Plus he was involved in Green Lantern, and we all know how that went.

# ? May 18, 2016 04:33

X-O: Apr 28, 2002; Long Live The King!

Johns doing the movies means he's writing less of the comics probably. So this is a good thing.

# ? May 18, 2016 04:39

Aphrodite: Jun 27, 2006

Johns was already running the movies.

# ? May 18, 2016 04:41

burnishedfume: Mar 8, 2011; You really are a louse...

X-O posted:

Johns doing the movies means he's writing less of the comics probably. So this is a good thing.

Never underestimate the ability of a bad writer to take on more work by simply spending even less time thinking about what they're writing.

(I don't dislike Johns that much but yeah, a DC film division with him at the head feels like a step sideways for the films.)

# ? May 18, 2016 04:45

SirDan3k: Jan 6, 2001; Trust me, you are taking this a lot more seriously then I am.

How I imagine it.

Geoff: Okay but before the big reveal that both their mom's names are Martha Batman should rip off one of Superman's arms, to show the stakes are high.

# ? May 18, 2016 04:52

Superstring: Jul 22, 2007; I thought I was going insane for a second.

SirDan3k posted:

How I imagine it.

Geoff: Okay but before the big reveal that both their mom's names are Martha Batman should rip off one of Superman's arms, to show the stakes are high.

Geoff: Hal Jordon is the best and here's why

# ? May 18, 2016 05:00

NieR Occomata: Jan 18, 2009; Glory to Mankind.

Geoff: Have you considered maybe if Lex joined the Justice League?

Snyder: Great idea! But what about all the other members?

Geoff: Oh, what if they were all bitchy assholes to each other? Like, really bitchy.

Snyder: Oh man, this poo poo is loving gold. Any other suggestions?

Geoff: Sure! What if Darkseid just like, showed up apropros of nothing and was just generically evil and stuff?

Snyder: God loving drat it man you're three for loving three over here.

# ? May 18, 2016 05:06

BrianWilly: Apr 24, 2007; There is no homosexual terrorist Johnny Silverhand

The article does mention that the WB still wants to remain filmmaker-driven, so my guess is that Johns will mostly just be there to make broad yes-or-no suggestions about what fits or doesn't fit for these characters. "Should Batman shoot down mooks with a gun?" "No, that's a bit extreme." "Would he rip off their arms instead?" "OH HELL YEA"

Still, I dunno how qualified Johns will be at basically running a film division. And I don't know who this Berg guy is at all.

For what it's worth, I do think Johns will have a better creative vision than Snyder, whose creative vision just wasn't resonating with fans or broader moviegoing audiences or -- for some reason -- my Communist kinsmen in China.

# ? May 18, 2016 05:19

X-O: Apr 28, 2002; Long Live The King!

"Should Batman sit down?"

"Hell no. Unless it's a chair that can tell him Joker's real name."

# ? May 18, 2016 05:22

CharlestheHammer: Jun 26, 2011; YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

X-O posted:

"Should Batman sit down?"

"Hell no. Unless it's a chair that can tell him Joker's real name."

He then must never stand up while this chair exists.

# ? May 18, 2016 06:24

BravestOfTheLamps: Oct 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless; Lipstick Apathy

Iron Man 1 is a movie about a billionaire celebrity weapons developer who is kidnapped by terrorists in Afghanistan and escapes with his technical know-how. He then reforms and starts developing a new, incredibly powerful weapons system, just in time to stop a particularly violent corporate takeover.

There is a short sequence where he flies back to Afghanistan to crush some Muslim insurgents. This amounts to all the superhero action in the movie.

It�s not a very good movie. For one thing, it�s morally completely vacuous. There is only one moment of satire to justify that: when Tony Stark battles a traitorous corporate subordinate, the media mistakes this for a superhero battle involving an �Iron Man�. Tony Stark then decides to adopt this moniker to the acclamation of the press. This is the only real insight the movie has on heroism, namely that Tony Stark/Iron Man is definitely not a superhero. He's a corporate celebrity. Tony Stark and his antics are the actual draw of the movie, and any real heroism is secondary to that. It�s both fitting and ironic, since Stan Lee�s intent with Iron Man was to make audiences root for a character that they should despise. He�s only ever been interesting in his failures, but the movies still want you to root for him as a wish-fulfillment figure. They're extremely ironic, except in their interest in Tony Stark. Iron Man 1 came out the same year as Dark Knight, a movie that�s increasingly lukewarm but more relevant. In Dark Knight, the billionaire crime-fighter is 1) actually occupied mostly with fighting crime as a superhero, 2) his billionaire playboy persona really is just a persona, and 3) has the decency to subvert the noxious ideology it seems to promote (in this case the War on Terror). The conclusion of Dark Knight is that Batman is a failure. Iron Man 1 is not so honest. It�s not a good movie about celebrity culture, techno-fetishism, or about being a bad superhero.

BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 10:06 on May 18, 2016

# ? May 18, 2016 07:06

FilthyImp: Sep 30, 2002; Anime Deviant

IM1 is just "If I Were Rich I Would Be Awesome" the movie.

His two stumbles (the crisis of conscience he experiences and his captivity) serve to make him more awesome.

# ? May 18, 2016 07:11

CharlestheHammer: Jun 26, 2011; YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Iron Man is fun for the origin then it just drags itself to the finish line, wheezing the whole way.

# ? May 18, 2016 07:43

Shit Fuckasaurus: Oct 14, 2005; i think right angles might be an abomination against nature you guys; Lipstick Apathy

So I watched Fant4stic tonight. I had heard some criticisms but mostly avoided them, and I rather like the First Family so I thought I'd give it a shot before Fant4stic 2 got officially greenlit, given that article that got posted a couple pages ago.

Holy poo poo this movie.

# ? May 18, 2016 08:16

SonicRulez: Aug 6, 2013; GOTTA GO FIST

I know Geoff Johns has written good things, but he has a very narrow view of how characters should do stuff and my experience with him is that he'll bin anyone or anything that doesn't fit with that. In a movie universe where they're likely to use Barry Allen and Hal Jordan anyway I'm not sure I see any harm. Now if we had already had a Wally West movie in the books then I'd be worried.

Plastik posted:

So I watched Fant4stic tonight. I had heard some criticisms but mostly avoided them, and I rather like the First Family so I thought I'd give it a shot before Fant4stic 2 got officially greenlit, given that article that got posted a couple pages ago.

Holy poo poo this movie.

In your opinion, what went wrong? Feed me negativity.

# ? May 18, 2016 09:29

purple death ray: Jul 28, 2007; me omw 2 steal ur girl

SonicRulez posted:

I know Geoff Johns has written good things

I keep hearing people say this and I've never seen it personally. It's like seeing the Loch Ness Monster, some people swear up and down that it exists but we keep looking with advanced sonar and coming up empty.

# ? May 18, 2016 13:10

BrianWilly: Apr 24, 2007; There is no homosexual terrorist Johnny Silverhand

Flash, Teen Titans, Superman, JSA.

# ? May 18, 2016 13:15

Starsnostars: Jan 17, 2009; The Master of Magnetism

Wasn't Johns involved in the Green Lantern movie? I'm surprised they would put him back near the movie department after that.

# ? May 18, 2016 13:22

Wheat Loaf: Feb 13, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

BrianWilly posted:

Flash, Teen Titans, Superman, JSA.

Stars and S.T.R.I.P.E.

# ? May 18, 2016 13:25

team overhead smash: Sep 2, 2006; Team-Forest-Tree-Dog:
Smashing your way into our hearts one skylight at a time

Starsnostars posted:

Wasn't Johns involved in the Green Lantern movie? I'm surprised they would put him back near the movie department after that.

He was a co-producer, which I think means he was involved in the script but in a comparatively minor way and without overall control.

# ? May 18, 2016 13:29

BrianWilly: Apr 24, 2007; There is no homosexual terrorist Johnny Silverhand

Starsnostars posted:

Wasn't Johns involved in the Green Lantern movie? I'm surprised they would put him back near the movie department after that.

I thought I heard that too, but his name doesn't appear on the credits for that film at all (edit: or I guess Wikipedia just didn't list him for some reason) so I guess it must have been some sort of minor advisory role.

To put things in perspective, Kevin Feige also produced Blade Trinity, X3, and Fantastic Four 2.

# ? May 18, 2016 13:30

Aphrodite: Jun 27, 2006

Also the 3 or 4 MCU movies that just aren't good.

# ? May 18, 2016 13:42

muscles like this!: Jan 17, 2005

The thing about the industry is that they give out producer credits like candy. So it can mean anything from "very hands on, in charge of pretty much everything" to "sat in on a meeting once 5 years ago but has enough pull that their name will get more attention."

# ? May 18, 2016 14:19

Shit Fuckasaurus: Oct 14, 2005; i think right angles might be an abomination against nature you guys; Lipstick Apathy

SonicRulez posted:

In your opinion, what went wrong? Feed me negativity.

I'm coming at it from two sides, really. It's both not about the Fantastic Four and also a terrible movie. I'll address them separately because I know NOT MY arguments are frowned upon by some people here.

No spoiler tags because it's been nearly a year, and if I spoil this movie and make you not want to watch it we should both consider that a public service.

Sue Storm is, for some reason, psuedo-autistic. She's "good with patterns"? It's a weird facet to the character more than anything offensive, but it still stands as weird and the resolution is ultimately unsatisfying.
Reed Richards is working with the government at the end, and he's okay with that. Also he's pretty dumb for the Smartest Man in the Marvelverse. And his loyalty to the Four is so strong that he abandons them for an entire year.
Ben Grimm and Johnny Storm are undercharacterized, but nothing stands out as wrong. Maybe Ben doesn't hate being The Thing enough, but they never really say since they skip a year of post-powers exposition.
Victor Von Doom is apparently a man made of metal, lives on Planet Zero now, might be dead, and has really, really insane powers. He can remotely pop heads and raise mountains and harness the teleporter to, uhhh, consume the Earth? What the gently caress are Doom's powers here?
Why are they given Central City? Did Reed really threaten the government with Ben Grimm until they gave him a rocket base? And why aren't they in the Baxter Building?

Okay, so mechanical problems in the movie.

Characters have okay to good scenes where they establish personal motives or at least some sort of undercurrent to the character and then the movie abandons it entirely. The standouts here are Ben watching footage of himself with CONFIRMED KILLCOUNT splashed across the bottom of the screen, which then goes nowhere, and Sue being really, really opposed to government intervention, and then in the next scene helping the government find Reed with seemingly no qualms.
Related to the above, people's motivations are really unclear. Doom want to stop the Government from "killing his planet", but they don't seem to really want to do that? Ben fights the military's battles because ???. I'm confident that a close reading of the film (I'm not prepared to watch it again so it'll have to be Not Me that does it) will reveal that most characters in most scenes do the things they do To Move The Plot Forward, and for no other reason.
The government is, for whatever reason, incapable of replicating Reed's work in spite of having the remains of his lab and most likely the schematics of his previous successful attempt, but they *are* able to fully rebuild the facility required. Reed fixes this in ten minutes.
Everything involving computers in this film was written by someone who hates computers.
Victor is only obsessed with Sue insofar as it advances the plot. Sue is only interested in Reed insofar as it angers Victor.
Victor, Reed, and Johnny get drunk together in a multimillion dollar lab for seemingly no reason. Obviously Drunk Reed Richards then lets his friend Ben who nobody knows into the lab, and nobody questions it. They proceed to fire up the teleporter at which point Sue and only Sue notices.
Reed Richards goes to MYSTERIOUS SOUTH AMERICA for a year, learns to reconfigure his face on the fly, and somehow learns how to use his ability to fight off six armed men. This is never explained. Also when said six armed men come for him, at no point does he just reconfigure his face.
Sue finds Reed in minutes knowing only that he likes 20,000 Leagues Under The Sea, which is apparently the fulcrum upon which his life revolves.
What the actual gently caress is up with the transformation scene? Their treatment of The Thing is something I'd expect straight out of a parody, where a seemingly endless stream of rocks fly into his pod while he screams. Johnny bursts into flame for no reason. If you're going to try to make these changes rational, you'll have to do a better job than that.
What is Planet Zero? Where is Planet Zero? How can you get back to Earth from Planet Zero by just going up?
The final fight is so bad. Doom absolutely owns each of the Four in turn, but then the Power Of Friendship gets him punched in the jaw. During this fight, Reed mostly lies on the floor, feeling sorry for himself. Victor has apparently forgotten that ten minutes ago he was able to burst human heads from twenty feet away, so the Four live without having to confront this explicitly lethal power.
Seriously what the gently caress are Doom's powers?

Ultimately I got all the way to Sue's "Patterns" line before I saw any significant cracks. It was really looking like an interesting characterization of a younger Fantastic Four, but it peaked at the "Patterns" line, kepe getting worse from there, then when One Year Later splashed across the scene it just picked up speed and never looked back.

Also the visual effects of the teleport were just sort of... vomited on top of an obviously static set. Every time. It was disappointing. And The Thing looks like literal poo poo a lot of the time.

You'll have to excuse me if any of these complaints are super-common or maybe inaccurate, I've only just opened the 13 page Fant4stic thread from CD to see if I can further unpack my mind over this movie, and all I did between posting that comment and now is sleep and go to work.

Shit Fuckasaurus fucked around with this message at 14:48 on May 18, 2016

# ? May 18, 2016 14:45

Metalshark: Feb 4, 2013; The seagull is essential.

http://www.comicbookresources.com/article/x-men-apocalypse-cast-rocks-80s-with-parody-album-covers

# ? May 18, 2016 15:36

AnonSpore: Jan 19, 2012; "I didn't see the part where he develops as a character so I guess he never developed as a character"

Plastik posted:

I'm coming at it from two sides, really. It's both not about the Fantastic Four and also a terrible movie. I'll address them separately because I know NOT MY arguments are frowned upon by some people here.

No spoiler tags because it's been nearly a year, and if I spoil this movie and make you not want to watch it we should both consider that a public service.

Sue Storm is, for some reason, psuedo-autistic. She's "good with patterns"? It's a weird facet to the character more than anything offensive, but it still stands as weird and the resolution is ultimately unsatisfying.

Reed Richards is working with the government at the end, and he's okay with that. Also he's pretty dumb for the Smartest Man in the Marvelverse. And his loyalty to the Four is so strong that he abandons them for an entire year.

Ben Grimm and Johnny Storm are undercharacterized, but nothing stands out as wrong. Maybe Ben doesn't hate being The Thing enough, but they never really say since they skip a year of post-powers exposition.

Victor Von Doom is apparently a man made of metal, lives on Planet Zero now, might be dead, and has really, really insane powers. He can remotely pop heads and raise mountains and harness the teleporter to, uhhh, consume the Earth? What the gently caress are Doom's powers here?

Why are they given Central City? Did Reed really threaten the government with Ben Grimm until they gave him a rocket base? And why aren't they in the Baxter Building?

Okay, so mechanical problems in the movie.

Characters have okay to good scenes where they establish personal motives or at least some sort of undercurrent to the character and then the movie abandons it entirely. The standouts here are Ben watching footage of himself with CONFIRMED KILLCOUNT splashed across the bottom of the screen, which then goes nowhere, and Sue being really, really opposed to government intervention, and then in the next scene helping the government find Reed with seemingly no qualms.

Related to the above, people's motivations are really unclear. Doom want to stop the Government from "killing his planet", but they don't seem to really want to do that? Ben fights the military's battles because ???. I'm confident that a close reading of the film (I'm not prepared to watch it again so it'll have to be Not Me that does it) will reveal that most characters in most scenes do the things they do To Move The Plot Forward, and for no other reason.

The government is, for whatever reason, incapable of replicating Reed's work in spite of having the remains of his lab and most likely the schematics of his previous successful attempt, but they *are* able to fully rebuild the facility required. Reed fixes this in ten minutes.

Everything involving computers in this film was written by someone who hates computers.

Victor is only obsessed with Sue insofar as it advances the plot. Sue is only interested in Reed insofar as it angers Victor.

Victor, Reed, and Johnny get drunk together in a multimillion dollar lab for seemingly no reason. Obviously Drunk Reed Richards then lets his friend Ben who nobody knows into the lab, and nobody questions it. They proceed to fire up the teleporter at which point Sue and only Sue notices.

Reed Richards goes to MYSTERIOUS SOUTH AMERICA for a year, learns to reconfigure his face on the fly, and somehow learns how to use his ability to fight off six armed men. This is never explained. Also when said six armed men come for him, at no point does he just reconfigure his face.

Sue finds Reed in minutes knowing only that he likes 20,000 Leagues Under The Sea, which is apparently the fulcrum upon which his life revolves.

What the actual gently caress is up with the transformation scene? Their treatment of The Thing is something I'd expect straight out of a parody, where a seemingly endless stream of rocks fly into his pod while he screams. Johnny bursts into flame for no reason. If you're going to try to make these changes rational, you'll have to do a better job than that.

What is Planet Zero? Where is Planet Zero? How can you get back to Earth from Planet Zero by just going up?

The final fight is so bad. Doom absolutely owns each of the Four in turn, but then the Power Of Friendship gets him punched in the jaw. During this fight, Reed mostly lies on the floor, feeling sorry for himself. Victor has apparently forgotten that ten minutes ago he was able to burst human heads from twenty feet away, so the Four live without having to confront this explicitly lethal power.

Seriously what the gently caress are Doom's powers?

Ultimately I got all the way to Sue's "Patterns" line before I saw any significant cracks. It was really looking like an interesting characterization of a younger Fantastic Four, but it peaked at the "Patterns" line, kepe getting worse from there, then when One Year Later splashed across the scene it just picked up speed and never looked back.

Also the visual effects of the teleport were just sort of... vomited on top of an obviously static set. Every time. It was disappointing. And The Thing looks like literal poo poo a lot of the time.

You'll have to excuse me if any of these complaints are super-common or maybe inaccurate, I've only just opened the 13 page Fant4stic thread from CD to see if I can further unpack my mind over this movie, and all I did between posting that comment and now is sleep and go to work.

This was probably more interesting and entertaining than the actual movie was

# ? May 18, 2016 15:40

Ignite Memories: Feb 27, 2005

Cyclops' glasses don't look great but at least they cover the sides of his eyes now. It's such an irritating thing when there's this huge gap that just gets ignored.

# ? May 18, 2016 15:43

Aphrodite: Jun 27, 2006

Except for somehow turning rocks into a power generator, everything else Doom does is telekinesis.

# ? May 18, 2016 15:45

Shit Fuckasaurus: Oct 14, 2005; i think right angles might be an abomination against nature you guys; Lipstick Apathy

Aphrodite posted:

Except for somehow turning rocks into a power generator, everything else Doom does is telekinesis.

Fair. But exploding heads, turning off lights as he walks near them and blocking bullets are all kind of strange, high-powered takes on telekinesis.

# ? May 18, 2016 16:21

Shageletic: Jul 25, 2007

Toxxupation posted:

Geoff: Have you considered maybe if Lex joined the Justice League?

Snyder: Great idea! But what about all the other members?

Geoff: Oh, what if they were all bitchy assholes to each other? Like, really bitchy.

Snyder: Oh man, this poo poo is loving gold. Any other suggestions?

Geoff: Sure! What if Darkseid just like, showed up apropros of nothing and was just generically evil and stuff?

Snyder: God loving drat it man you're three for loving three over here.

Had to check if it was that bad and guess what it is

quote:

And even when a force managed to dent the terraformer, Darkseid declared the fight was already won before two Kryptonians broke into Apokolips' court to confront the Dark God head-on,[17] but were no match for the tyrant who singlehandedly defeated the defenders of Earth, leaving the Green Lantern alone against him.[18] He initially proved to be stronger than the Green Avatar, defeating him and then killing countless human survivors to nourish Apokolips, but he returned with the power of the Multiversal Green that strengthened him enough to repel Darkseid from the survivors and save them from his wrath.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Uxas_(Prime_Earth)

Hal to the rescue!

# ? May 18, 2016 16:38

BravestOfTheLamps: Oct 12, 2012; by FactsAreUseless; Lipstick Apathy

Geoff Johns's comics have always felt somehow off to me. Like that there something fundamentally broken about the world he writes. His comic about a family collection of superheroes has super-villains (including a man called Captain Nazi) slaughter picnicing families for kicks. With something like Man of Steel you have a broken world but the story is about trying to overcome that. With Johns there's just something deeply unpleasant.

# ? May 18, 2016 17:07

ImpAtom: May 24, 2007

BravestOfTheLamps posted:

Geoff Johns's comics have always felt somehow off to me. Like that there something fundamentally broken about the world he writes. His comic about a family collection of superheroes has super-villains (including a man called Captain Nazi) slaughter picnicing families for kicks. With something like Man of Steel you have a broken world but the story is about trying to overcome that. With Johns there's just something deeply unpleasant.

Geoff Johns is a guy who unironically writes comics based off what he remembers vaugly from childhood, combined with an unironic but poorly considered desire to make the things he remembered from childhood more mature where mature equal violence.

He is, by and large, a dude whose view of characters for the past decade comes across as someone who is a combination of reading a wiki and remembering stuff he read when he was 12 and his comics all feel like that.

# ? May 18, 2016 17:13

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# ? May 17, 2024 09:45

mycot: Oct 23, 2014; "It's okay. There are other Terminators! Just give us this one!"; Hell Gem

I feel this kinda strange pity for Johns because he wouldn't be bad if he was still like any other writer, it just that he inexplicably keeps getting more and more power which aggravates all of his John-isms.

# ? May 18, 2016 17:18

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > BSS: Bisexual Super Son > BSS Movie Thread (And The Stupenderful Articulation Of Substandard Speculation)

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