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Toxxupation posted:There's no other (reasonable) explanation. China loves American blockbusters, even America-centric films (I mean Captain America killed over there), and loves them some superhero films. But BvS totally underperformed across the Pacific and nobody really knows why. Maybe word of mouth is not a thing that asian markets are completely exempt from? They don't have to pay attention to american reviews if the chinese people who go to the movie are telling their chinese friends that it's bad.
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May 23, 2016 02:14
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I remember heart breaking news about the Avengers getting terribly translated subtitles ruining the movie and making some people in the audience cry I would be one of those people if I lived in China
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May 23, 2016 02:35
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mycot posted:That doesn't make any sense, China doesn't give a poo poo about critic reviews. The Chinese love Titanic, Celine Dion, and the Backstreet Boys more than anything else in the world. They don't just have bad taste, they've perfected bad taste.
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May 23, 2016 04:56
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Chickenwalker posted:The Chinese love Titanic, Celine Dion, and the Backstreet Boys more than anything else in the world. They don't just have bad taste, they've perfected bad taste. uhh but I've heard they love white people?
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May 23, 2016 05:14
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Toxxupation posted:There's no other (reasonable) explanation. China loves American blockbusters, even America-centric films (I mean Captain America killed over there), and loves them some superhero films. But BvS totally underperformed across the Pacific and nobody really knows why. I don't know about China but here in Korea no one gives a poo poo about any of the DC properties. Anytime superheroes come up it's Cap, Iron Man, Hulk, Spidey, or Taekwon V.
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May 23, 2016 06:43
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Whizbang posted:I don't know about China but here in Korea no one gives a poo poo about any of the DC properties. Anytime superheroes come up it's Cap, Iron Man, Hulk, Spidey, or Taekwon V. It may not be in Taiwan (though that would be surprising) but Batman is by a significant degree one of the most valuable superhero properties worldwide and has proven a strong demographic seller in every market. Other DC heroes ain't as popular but as long as they have Batman you can't really say nobody cares.
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May 23, 2016 08:05
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Ignite Memories posted:Maybe word of mouth is not a thing that asian markets are completely exempt from? That's my point. The reviews affected word of mouth and as a result box office sales.
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May 23, 2016 16:27
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ImpAtom posted:It may not be in Taiwan (though that would be surprising) but Batman is by a significant degree one of the most valuable superhero properties worldwide and has proven a strong demographic seller in every market. Other DC heroes ain't as popular but as long as they have Batman you can't really say nobody cares. This is basically DC movies the world over. I think if WW is the first really successful non-Batman movie for WB and DC, it's going to send the execs into panic because the idea of a woman lead action movie being a huge hit, that defies all logic!
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May 23, 2016 19:55
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twistedmentat posted:This is basically DC movies the world over. I think if WW is the first really successful non-Batman movie for WB and DC, it's going to send the execs into panic because the idea of a woman lead action movie being a huge hit, that defies all logic! I can already hear parts of their conference call "But Catwoman failed!!! How did this succeed?!?!?! Quick copy everything about it" *copies all the superficial stuff*
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May 23, 2016 19:58
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twistedmentat posted:This is basically DC movies the world over. I think if WW is the first really successful non-Batman movie for WB and DC, it's going to send the execs into panic because the idea of a woman lead action movie being a huge hit, that defies all logic! Wonder Woman is pretty unlikely to be more successful than MoS or BvS. It'd be amazing if it was but it's just extremely unlikely. It doing very well for what it is is entirely possible and if it does as well as BvS then that'll be mindblowing. It's worth remembering that BvS was by no means a failure, just nowhere as big a success as they clearly hoped. Civil War doing better however is probably the cause of the Geoff Johnsing of the film department. An era where "Iron Man vs Captain America" is a much, much, much larger seller than "Batman vs Superman" would have been completely unthinkable even a few years ago.
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May 23, 2016 20:02
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ImpAtom posted:Wonder Woman is pretty unlikely to be more successful than MoS or BvS. It'd be amazing if it was but it's just extremely unlikely. It doing very well for what it is is entirely possible and if it does as well as BvS then that'll be mindblowing. I can see them putting characters in War settings as a reaction: Coming in 2019, Power Girl & Batwoman in
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May 23, 2016 20:13
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FilthyImp posted:WW being the best of the Justice League prelude flicks is pretty much a given. Unless maybe they can push out a Battfleck joint in the next 2 years. Suicide Squad has potential in that it's got some big names in it (Will Smith for one), and is effectively a Batman spinoff featuring The Joker, Harley Quinn and a cameo from Batman. I'm not saying it's a sure thing but I could see Suicide Squad doing well if it hits the right tone and atmosphere.
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May 23, 2016 20:17
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ImpAtom posted:Suicide Squad has potential in that it's got some big names in it It's like their weird little Incredible Hulk flick. They'll no doubt scramble to integrate them into JL if it does gangbusters. If it underperforms then it'll be in its own little bubble.
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May 23, 2016 20:20
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I really hope it does good (although I'm not gonna support it because jared Leto is a gross garbage person), but I'm already kinda nervous due to the fact that the movie desperately went into reshoots when the trailer got such a positive reaction that we're gonna end up with some shambling atonal mess of a film that feels less than the sum of its parts in exactly the same way BvS was.
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May 23, 2016 23:00
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No it didn't.
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May 23, 2016 23:28
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Toxxupation posted:I really hope it does good (although I'm not gonna support it because jared Leto is a gross garbage person), but I'm already kinda nervous due to the fact that the movie desperately went into reshoots when the trailer got such a positive reaction that we're gonna end up with some shambling atonal mess of a film that feels less than the sum of its parts in exactly the same way BvS was. According to one of the actors, all the reshoots were for more action scenes, which actually sounds way worse than if they were just trying to make the movie funnier. :/
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May 23, 2016 23:49
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ImpAtom posted:Wonder Woman is pretty unlikely to be more successful than MoS or BvS. It'd be amazing if it was but it's just extremely unlikely. It doing very well for what it is is entirely possible and if it does as well as BvS then that'll be mindblowing. It's worth remembering that BvS was by no means a failure, just nowhere as big a success as they clearly hoped. It doesn't have to make more money necessarily, but if it becomes a fan and critically successful movie, but then Deadpool was all 3. Anyways, I just want the old timey thinking execs at WB to realize that the world isn't as separated as it once was between boys stuff and girls stuff. Actually, isn't that also Pearlmutters problem? He used to be the president of Toybiz or something and still things that there are boy toys and girl toys, and that thinking infects everything he over sees? I know some people who worked on SS and they told me they had to send copies of all their reference materials for the sets that the finale and some other key action sequences took place in, so I gathered from that they needed some big impressive stuff to add in.
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May 23, 2016 23:58
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Jamesman posted:According to one of the actors, all the reshoots were for more action scenes, which actually sounds way worse than if they were just trying to make the movie funnier. :/ From what I read it was stuff they had planned in advance because of timing issues with some of the actors, and the studio let Ayer do some stuff that he had wanted but he wasn't originally able to do. Movie set rumors though, so 
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May 24, 2016 15:22
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Toxxupation posted:There's no other (reasonable) explanation. China loves American blockbusters, even America-centric films (I mean Captain America killed over there), and loves them some superhero films. But BvS totally underperformed across the Pacific and nobody really knows why. This is, uh, pretty solid casual racism. It's very possible that the Chinese audience also didn't find the movie very compelling, seeing as they are people who are capable of having opinions about things?
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May 24, 2016 15:36
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theflyingorc posted:seeing as they are people who are capable of having opinions about things? Who's having opinions? Give me their name.
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May 24, 2016 15:41
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I don't think Wonder Woman is going to do well, BvS was a flaming meteor of anti-hype and one of those movies that despite making money is still going to go down as a flop. It has primed the public against the DCCU on two fronts people think it's either going to be more of the same which means they are going to skip it or that BvS flopping and the shift in executives will trigger a reboot and the movie won't matter so they'll skip it. Normally all this studio stuff flies under the general audience's radar but BvS flopping has made it actual news, news that'll pop back up when Wonder Woman gets close to release. Suicide Squad might hit but it'll be riding Deadpool's coattails to any success.
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May 24, 2016 19:19
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theflyingorc posted:This is, uh, pretty solid casual racism. The Chinese have evolved a love of superheroes to combat their native predators, the Mongols. Where did you even get your degree?
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May 24, 2016 19:27
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SirDan3k posted:I don't think Wonder Woman is going to do well, BvS was a flaming meteor of anti-hype and one of those movies that despite making money is still going to go down as a flop. It has primed the public against the DCCU on two fronts people think it's either going to be more of the same which means they are going to skip it or that BvS flopping and the shift in executives will trigger a reboot and the movie won't matter so they'll skip it. Normally all this studio stuff flies under the general audience's radar but BvS flopping has made it actual news, news that'll pop back up when Wonder Woman gets close to release. Even people who hated the movie had a lot of great things to say about Wonder Woman though. I think she's got pretty good buzz going at the moment.
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May 24, 2016 19:32
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People look at reviews, they don't just assume it's going to be the same.
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May 24, 2016 19:33
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Aphrodite posted:People look at reviews, they don't just assume it's going to be the same. This and the two things I've heard, pretty much unanimously except on SA, is that everyone's excited for WW and Batfleck. Even people I know that complained about WW being forced into BvS said her combat stuff was dope and would go see her movie. e: I'm a BvS fan, I'm excited for the current DCCU and talking with non-comic book fans or internet posters, my general excitement might influence their responses though.
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May 24, 2016 19:37
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I can easily imagine there is a lot of interest in WW, considering there isn't really anything like an action fronted super heroine movie out there. Sort of how retroactively you can see how badly people were looking for a satirical R rated romp before Deadpool.
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May 24, 2016 20:32
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SirDan3k posted:I don't think Wonder Woman is going to do well, BvS was a flaming meteor of anti-hype and one of those movies that despite making money is still going to go down as a flop. It has primed the public against the DCCU on two fronts people think it's either going to be more of the same which means they are going to skip it or that BvS flopping and the shift in executives will trigger a reboot and the movie won't matter so they'll skip it. Normally all this studio stuff flies under the general audience's radar but BvS flopping has made it actual news, news that'll pop back up when Wonder Woman gets close to release. And the negative news about BvS really, really overstated its case. The movie wasn't what the studio hoped, but I've seen worse movies. CharlestheHammer posted:Where did you even get your degree? edit: If Suicide Squad sucks I think that will actually make people start to notice "DCCU BAD", but I think they'd need a run of 4 bad ones or so to tank the entire effort.
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May 24, 2016 21:10
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It seems like comic book movies are much more dependant on word of mouth than any other movie (well, other than indies). Children movies are basically critic proof.
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May 24, 2016 21:20
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Shageletic posted:Children movies are basically critic proof.
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May 24, 2016 21:27
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theflyingorc posted:If it's good they'll see it. Guardians of the Galaxy wouldn't have had anyone see it if it had been terrible, but strong buzz made it do well. Suicide Squad would make three in a row, which would also be 100% of the films in the shared universe.
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May 24, 2016 21:38
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Travis343 posted:Suicide Squad would make three in a row, which would also be 100% of the films in the shared universe. There was such a long gap between Man of Steel and BvS that I don't think people will really count it. And though a lot of people hate it, it's reputation wasn't "A BAD MOVIE EVERYONE HATES" like BvS has.
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May 24, 2016 21:40
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theflyingorc posted:And though a lot of people hate it, it's reputation wasn't "A BAD MOVIE EVERYONE HATES" like BvS has. I don't even think BvS has that reputation among average viewers.
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May 24, 2016 21:41
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MacheteZombie posted:I don't even think BvS has that reputation among average viewers. It's negative reception was really, really well publicized, but it is definitely difficult to tell how things are viewed outside the nerd bubble. My favorite example of this is that we all KNOW that everyone agrees that Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull was a complete garbage movie that everyone hated, right? 77% on Rotten Tomatoes, average score 6.9
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May 24, 2016 21:46
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MacheteZombie posted:I don't even think BvS has that reputation among average viewers. It absolutely does. It's hated as a piece of poo poo amongst literally everyone besides diehard DC fans, because everyone else considers it a dark depressing ugly boring overlong mess. I mean, to be fair, it's a dark depressing ugly boring overlong mess, but even beyond that guess what - the average, moviewatching audience member goes to a superhero movie to watch good guys win and bad guys get punched, not whatever the gently caress BvS ended up being.
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May 24, 2016 21:48
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MacheteZombie posted:I don't even think BvS has that reputation among average viewers. BvS's cinemascore and general reception is a lot poorer than MoS. However I don't think it's hatred. I think, more damningly, it's apathy. People didn't hate BvS because hatred tends to involve a lot more investment. The actual outcome seems to be that it was a night out that people had and quickly forgot about. It's not even the butt of jokes or ongoing conversations about how wrong everyone was the was MoS was. People couldn't shut up about Superman destroying buildings but Batman gunning people down has pretty quickly faded. Some people really hated MoS but in the long run that's better. Hatred makes people want to know why you hate it. "Eh, it was okay I guess?" doesn't.
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May 24, 2016 21:49
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theflyingorc posted:It's negative reception was really, really well publicized, but it is definitely difficult to tell how things are viewed outside the nerd bubble. Anecdote ain't data, but every non comic book familiar person I've talked to has either said "it was alright" or "a bit darker than other superhero movies but wasn't the worst thing i saw" type stuff. I agree on it being hard to gauge though. Toxxupation posted:It absolutely does. It's hated as a piece of poo poo amongst literally everyone besides diehard DC fans, because everyone else considers it a dark depressing ugly boring mess. I mean, to be fair, it's a dark depressing ugly boring mess, but guess what - the average, non-hardcore comic book fan goes to a superhero movie to watch good guys win and bad guys get punched, not whatever the gently caress BvS ended up being. lol okay dude e: ImpAtom posted:BvS's cinemascore and general reception is a lot poorer than MoS. However I don't think it's hatred. I think, more damningly, it's apathy. People didn't hate BvS because hatred tends to involve a lot more investment. The actual outcome seems to be that it was a night out that people had and quickly forgot about. It's not even the butt of jokes or ongoing conversations about how wrong everyone was the was MoS was. People couldn't shut up about Superman destroying buildings but Batman gunning people down has pretty quickly faded. That's a totally fair assessment.
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May 24, 2016 21:49
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Toxxupation posted:It absolutely does. It's hated as a piece of poo poo amongst literally everyone besides diehard DC fans, because everyone else considers it a dark depressing ugly boring mess. I mean, to be fair, it's a dark depressing ugly boring mess, but guess what - the average, non-hardcore comic book fan goes to a superhero movie to watch good guys win and bad guys get punched, not whatever the gently caress BvS ended up being. I actually kinda liked it, but it did a lot of stuff very poorly, and I would like control to be taken from Snyder.
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May 24, 2016 21:50
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theflyingorc posted:I actually kinda liked it, but it did a lot of stuff very poorly, and I would like control to be taken from Snyder. The script and editing are the biggest issues with the movie, both things not entirely in Snyder's control.
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May 24, 2016 21:51
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ImpAtom posted:BvS's cinemascore and general reception is a lot poorer than MoS. However I don't think it's hatred. I think, more damningly, it's apathy. People didn't hate BvS because hatred tends to involve a lot more investment. The actual outcome seems to be that it was a night out that people had and quickly forgot about. It's not even the butt of jokes or ongoing conversations about how wrong everyone was the was MoS was. People couldn't shut up about Superman destroying buildings but Batman gunning people down has pretty quickly faded. Everything I've seen has been genuine antipathy, especially in direct comparison to CW (where there's people to "root for"), general consensus isn't aware that this has been DC's shtick for over a decade now and doesn't get why Batman and Superman are such miserable petty assholes. The double-edged sword of DC is that their legacy is so steadfast and their big two are so iconic that it offends people, like makes them angry, when they're portrayed "wrong". People are really invested in Superman and Batman, and a movie like BvS that reduces Superman to a whiny loser and Batman to TDKR version of him gets people angry, because that's not anything like the Superman they "know".
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May 24, 2016 21:55
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MacheteZombie posted:The script and editing are the biggest issues with the movie, both things not entirely in Snyder's control. The director may not be the ultimate authority on all things editing, but there's a reason "Director's cut" is a thing.
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