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MacheteZombie posted:The script and editing are the biggest issues with the movie, both things not entirely in Snyder's control. It's true that a movie this big has a lot of cooks in the kitchen, but I'm skeptical he's really helping outside of some good images. A lot of stuff like the overlong name and the forced Justice League stuff do feel like more of a corporate problem. The single biggest issue the movie has is still that if you've seen the trailers, you've seen the movie. Doomsday would have been much better received if he had been, y'know, a surprise. And I suspect that decision came from on high. Which isn't to say Doomsday was great, but they did themselves no favors. quote:The double-edged sword of DC is that their legacy is so steadfast and their big two are so iconic that it offends people, like makes them angry, when they're portrayed "wrong". People are really invested in Superman and Batman, and a movie like BvS that reduces Superman to a whiny loser and Batman to TDKR version of him gets people angry, because that's not anything like the Superman they "know".
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May 24, 2016 21:57
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golden bubble posted:The director may not be the ultimate authority on all things editing, but there's a reason "Director's cut" is a thing. I am aware of directors cuts. And Snyder has had two of his movies largely improved by directors cuts, so I say give him more editorial control. WB had to know far in advance that Snyder was making a rated R BvS, they only waited until after editing began to say "hey tone it down to pg13" and forced deeper cuts into the movie than intended. theflyingorc posted:It's true that a movie this big has a lot of cooks in the kitchen, but I'm skeptical he's really helping outside of some good images. A lot of stuff like the overlong name and the forced Justice League stuff do feel like more of a corporate problem. As someone who doesn't care about spoilers, at all, I agree with you on the save Doomsday thing. I know a lot of people who's hype derailed when that trailer came out, the "is she with you" joke didn't help either.
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May 24, 2016 21:58
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MacheteZombie posted:The script and editing are the biggest issues with the movie, both things not entirely in Snyder's control. Unless your argument is that the studio did a hidden complete overhaul of the film from under his nose or overruled his creative direction, Snyder's the number one person to blame for the success or failure of BvS as shown. Especially when WB's crowed constantly about being creative-driven and allowing creators to interpret the brands the way they see fit. Also Goyer's been with DC for almost a decade now and especially in movies he's a glorified hired gun. Sure his input is heard but Snyder has the ultimate approval of what goes in the script and what of the script is filmed. The blame lies on Snyder, unless you want to put forth the argument that WB snatched control out from him to make the movie they wanted - even though looking at both it and MoS they are of the same tonal and creative piece.
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May 24, 2016 22:01
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I've not really seen much outright hate for the movie at all. Mostly just people really disappointed that it wasn't good. That's how I felt. It was a big mess with glimmers of a good movie interspersed enough that it made you even more disappointed that a good movie didn't materialize out of it. Anyone that says they've only seen hatred for it is probably swimming in circles where it was to be hated anyway regardless.
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May 24, 2016 22:01
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Toxxupation posted:Unless your argument is that the studio did a hidden complete overhaul of the film from under his nose or overruled his creative direction, Snyder's the number one person to blame for the success or failure of BvS as shown. Especially when WB's crowed constantly about being creative-driven and allowing creators to interpret the brands the way they see fit. I think my post accurately describes my argument. No need to force your interpretation into my statement. Editing and the script are not entirely in Snyder's control, those tasks where given to other people who worked with Snyder but certainly had to make decisions without him. e: and the studio completely did stick itself into the creative process when they said "cut 30 minutes get it under an r rating"
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May 24, 2016 22:03
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theflyingorc posted:
These are non-nerds. That's my point. Nerds are well aware that "dark" Superman and "grim n' gritty" Batman have been around for ten and thirty years, respectively. Ask the average moviegoer or non-nerd what Superman is, they'll think of Christopher Reeve.
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May 24, 2016 22:04
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Toxxupation posted:These are non-nerds. That's my point. Nerds are well aware that "dark" Superman and "grim n' gritty" Batman have been around for ten and thirty years, respectively. Ask the average moviegoer or non-nerd what Superman is, they'll think of Christopher Reeve. My mother-in-law thinks MoS is the best Superman and has never read a comic in her life, so ymmv.
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May 24, 2016 22:06
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MacheteZombie posted:
If you think the main problem with the movie was that it needed to be longer...
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May 24, 2016 22:07
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Toxxupation posted:If you think the main problem with the movie was that it needed to be longer... I've already stated by personal bias as a fan of the movie, so yes 30 more minutes would be excellent. Sick burn though.
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May 24, 2016 22:08
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Does anybody know what's wrong with Toxxupation?
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May 24, 2016 22:09
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X-O posted:I've not really seen much outright hate for the movie at all. Mostly just people really disappointed that it wasn't good. That's how I felt. It was a big mess with glimmers of a good movie interspersed enough that it made you even more disappointed that a good movie didn't materialize out of it. Anyone that says they've only seen hatred for it is probably swimming in circles where it was to be hated anyway regardless. I really think BvS will be a movie people will rewatch on tv or netflix or w/e in a year or two and realize it wasn't really that bad and that they actually like it. A bit hopeful, I must admit, but I've talked to people online and offline that had that experience with MoS, among many other movies.
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May 24, 2016 22:12
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MacheteZombie posted:I really think BvS will be a movie people will rewatch on tv or netflix or w/e in a year or two and realize it wasn't really that bad and that they actually like it. A bit hopeful, I must admit, but I've talked to people online and offline that had that experience with MoS, among many other movies. The movie doesn't lend itself to rewatching because the majority of it is boring. The big Batman vs. Superman fight is bad and lasts only like 5 minutes. The only part worth rewatching is Batman vs. Luthor's thugs at the end of the film because even the Doomsday fight is a big CGI clusterfuck with only a couple of good moments with Wonder Woman.
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May 24, 2016 22:38
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I enjoyed Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. It has one really, really, really bad scene that I think lets it down a lot (the atomic fridge scene at the start) but it's a fun movie other than that, with an enjoyable cast. I think it's fun as an homage to the 1950s science-fiction films which functioned as Red Scare allegories, in much the same way as the original Indy movies worked as homages to old pulp adventures and film serials (and to a certain extent Donald Duck comics).
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May 24, 2016 22:40
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MacheteZombie posted:I really think BvS will be a movie people will rewatch on tv or netflix or w/e in a year or two and realize it wasn't really that bad and that they actually like it. A bit hopeful, I must admit, but I've talked to people online and offline that had that experience with MoS, among many other movies. I think it may be that way if the Director's Cut is stronger. It's easy to see how BvS could be a well-liked movie with better editing and pacing. I could easily see it being one of those 'the theatrical cut sucks but the director's cut is GREAT" films.
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May 24, 2016 22:41
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I threw the "catch it on tv" bit into my post because I can totally see someone catching it on TV 20 minutes into the movie and decide to keep watching it. It's how a lot of people I know end up rewatching something. Obviously it colors their perception of the movie if they miss 20 minutes, but I don't think it's unheard of. ImpAtom, I completely agree, and Snyder actually has a track record of this holding true for his movies.
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May 24, 2016 22:46
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Eh, I don't think 30 extra minutes is going to give the film the Kingdom of Heaven treatment where it goes from a disappointing mess to an amazing film.
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May 24, 2016 22:51
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X-O posted:Eh, I don't think 30 extra minutes is going to give the film the Kingdom of Heaven treatment where it goes from a disappointing mess to an amazing film. The few bits they've mentioned adding back in for the DC cut are a lot of stuff I heard complaints about, so we will see.
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May 24, 2016 22:53
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An extra 5 minutes devoted to showing Lex peeing in the jar.
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May 24, 2016 22:58
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If you make a Superman movie and it gets rated R you should be arrested
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May 24, 2016 23:20
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I can see myself watching BvS if I see it on TV. That's something I could never say for MoS. I can't imagine my opinion of it will change much though. It was a painfully average movie. That being said, everyone I know felt that Wonder Woman and Batfleck were the best parts, so I think their movies are bound to have a lot of positive buzz. If anyone is sunk after BvS, it's the S part. He's 0-2 on good movies.
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May 24, 2016 23:33
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I think a lot of it will depend on the tone and presentation of the spoilers. If the WW trailer comes out and it evokes the same laborious over-serious feel of BvS then it's gonna get the negative buzz going again. If it can avoid that and promote a more asskicking warriors-versus-Nazis tone then I think it can build up some pretty enthusiastic hype. e: Oh wait, not Nazis. Other bad guys, I guess.
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May 24, 2016 23:43
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SonicRulez posted:That being said, everyone I know felt that Wonder Woman and Batfleck were the best parts, so I think their movies are bound to have a lot of positive buzz. If anyone is sunk after BvS, it's the S part. He's 0-2 on good movies. Even if people are bogged down by BvS, they'll remember how loving awesome it was when WW jumped into the fight at the end.
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May 24, 2016 23:43
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golden bubble posted:The director may not be the ultimate authority on all things editing, but there's a reason "Director's cut" is a thing. The majority of my dislike at BvS is the editing.
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May 25, 2016 01:55
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I can't remember if this was officially official or not, but Hulk is in Ragnarok Ruffalo's also billing it as a Buddy Movie
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May 25, 2016 02:10
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That was official a long time ago.
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May 25, 2016 02:14
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My favorite part in the Poetic Edda is when Hulk gets mad.
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May 25, 2016 05:34
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Wheat Loaf posted:I enjoyed Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. It has one really, really, really bad scene that I think lets it down a lot (the atomic fridge scene at the start) but it's a fun movie other than that, with an enjoyable cast. I think it's fun as an homage to the 1950s science-fiction films which functioned as Red Scare allegories, in much the same way as the original Indy movies worked as homages to old pulp adventures and film serials (and to a certain extent Donald Duck comics). I still don't see why everyone shits on that movie for the fridge scene when the far more ridiculous scene of LeBeouf swinging on vines exists.
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May 25, 2016 08:56
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Light Gun Man posted:I still don't see why everyone shits on that movie for the fridge scene when the far more ridiculous scene of LeBeouf swinging on vines exists. Desensitization.
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May 25, 2016 09:38
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I think BvS also suffers a lot from coming in between Deadpool, which is an original and fun comic book movie, and Civil War which executes the kind of conflict BvS uses much better than BvS itself does.
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May 25, 2016 13:52
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Travis343 posted:If you make a Superman movie and it gets rated R you should be arrested That seems excessive and insane to me.
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May 25, 2016 14:01
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Dan Didio posted:That seems excessive and insane to me. Officers... take this diseased maniac away. *Eagle lands on arm, flags descend from ceiling*
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May 25, 2016 14:09
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Dan Didio posted:That seems excessive and insane to me. You sound like a guy who made an R rated superman movie...
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May 25, 2016 15:43
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Dan Didio posted:That seems excessive and insane to me. If you're the president of the company that owns Superman and you let a person make an R rated movie about Superman you should also be arrested
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May 25, 2016 16:22
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What about an X-rated Superman movie? Do the creators of "Justice League: A Porn Parody" deserve jailtime? And man the day porn parodies stopped even trying to have funny names, a part of the world died.
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May 25, 2016 16:24
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That it isn't named "Just-rear end League," is a crime so bewildering that I can't even comprehend it.
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May 25, 2016 16:31
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Bust Nut League?
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May 25, 2016 16:33
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just saw x-men apocalypse. some pretty fun scenes but takes a while to get going. apocalypse looks and sounds pretty dopey imo there is an after credit scene but i dont think you should wait to watch it a man goes to the weapon x facility and takes some blood samples from wolverine and a couple other. his suitcase says "Essex"
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May 25, 2016 16:51
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Cythereal posted:I think BvS also suffers a lot from coming in between Deadpool, which is an original and fun comic book movie, and Civil War which executes the kind of conflict BvS uses much better than BvS itself does. BvS has an advantage that it has a discernible conflict. CW can't stay on one conflict and make it meaningful. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 17:26 on May 25, 2016 |
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May 25, 2016 17:23
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:BvS has an advantage that it has a discernible conflict. CW can't stay on one conflict. Eh, not really. The conflict is all over the place and the only part of it that really gets addressed is Batman's Bat-Racism which conveniently sidesteps all the other issues brought up, not to mention the entire conflict ends up being a false flag on every level and eventually anything else is put aside so they can fight Doomsday.
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May 25, 2016 17:27
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:BvS has an advantage that it has a discernible conflict. CW can't stay on one conflict and make it meaningful. Hahahahahahahahahaha
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May 25, 2016 17:28
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