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DreamShipWrecked posted:Scrub control question: what is the best way to order groups to attack when they are in formation? I believe the guide that Kim posted recommended just walking them forward and letting them attack whoever they run into, but I don't get charge bonus that way. Do I need to break ranks and have them double click attack to charge, or is there another way? Does the charge bonus require that a unit be targeted? You can hit 'r' to toggle between run / walk mode after issuing an order. I was under the impression that a unit running into combat counted as charging.
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May 28, 2016 20:22
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John Charity Spring posted:Hold alt when you have a group selected, and when you right-click it'll automatically make each unit pick a sensible target instead of all converging on one. That changed my world and I've been playing Total War games since Rome 1. Should have been in the feature list if it is new here.
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May 28, 2016 20:26
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Rakthar posted:Does the charge bonus require that a unit be targeted? You can hit 'r' to toggle between run / walk mode after issuing an order. I was under the impression that a unit running into combat counted as charging. It might be in practice, but it doesn't show "charging" in the tool tip like a normal one-unit charge order would so I assumed not. Plus it sometimes takes the unit a bit to catch on that they are supposed to be killing the guy that they bumped into so they don't have the momentum either
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May 28, 2016 20:26
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Rakthar posted:Does the charge bonus require that a unit be targeted? You can hit 'r' to toggle between run / walk mode after issuing an order. I was under the impression that a unit running into combat counted as charging. Nah, you have to issue an attack order to get them charging, always been like that. I would suggest making a one or more groups out of your army and moving them at a run towards the enemy when you are starting to close in, then quickly clicking through the units and manually order attack orders on the enemy units most directly in front of them, since they are already running they should keep formation pretty well, if you outnumber the enemy or have a wide formation, the units on the flanks should probably keep moving if possible in order to end up at the enemy's flanks and rear before charging in to join the rest.
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May 28, 2016 20:27
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DreamShipWrecked posted:It might be in practice, but it doesn't show "charging" in the tool tip like a normal one-unit charge order would so I assumed not. Plus it sometimes takes the unit a bit to catch on that they are supposed to be killing the guy that they bumped into so they don't have the momentum either Yep that sure seems to be the case. You gotta click em a few seconds before they hit for the charge to happen. Something to keep in mind if you are using the movement tricks posted earlier.
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May 28, 2016 20:33
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Is there a mod to restrict the movement somewhat of AI generals? I just had a dwarf army sack a settlement and move just barely in range of my army - I attacked him, he ran, then sacked another city, then ran away from my army again. They can burn your loving cities down AND outrun your armies, it's absolute bullshit and turns the late game into whack a mole
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May 28, 2016 20:37
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Is there a way for me to fight with my WAAAG army? Like on the same battlefield?
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May 28, 2016 20:44
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Lame Devil posted:Is there a way for me to fight with my WAAAG army? Like on the same battlefield? Park your army next to their army/city and set the WAAAGH! target to that enemy. Since your WAAAGH! moves right after you, as long as it is in range it will move and engage the enemy, which should draw you in as reinforcements. If you are sieging a settlement the ally should just park its army right next to yours anyways.
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May 28, 2016 20:53
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I got a Night Goblin Shaman from an event early on and I just realised he has a bloody monocle  
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May 28, 2016 21:05
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ZearothK posted:That changed my world and I've been playing Total War games since Rome 1. Should have been in the feature list if it is new here. It was possible to do something similar in Rome 1 - if you created an AI-assisted control group and ordered it to attack, it would also target nearby units
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May 28, 2016 21:12
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The Orc campaign has taught me the power of friendship, the bloody spears holding the north and raiding the empire constantly, the savage orcs to my south dealing with rebellions and marching out against chaos, gives time to devote the majority of my army to just cleaning out the last dwarf holdouts on the far mountains and leaving the border princes up as my personal punching bag on the way out of my territory. I did end up using the no enemy aggressive action mod for the campaign though, by turn 40 the AI already had 4+ agents per faction swarming over and Grimgor would of just been constantly assassinated until he got better just to get assassinated again. I also started with Azhag but he is pretty meh, turn 60 and I still haven't had a chance to get the gobbo boss over to the chaos wastes, lore of death is a great spell line but it takes ages to reach, the only benefit of starting him has been the extra 10% sacking income and the fact Grimgor shows up after only 10 battles with captives. Grimgor got a late start, but he already has over 800 weapon strength which is crazy and a bunch of items backing up his defense like potion of toughness and items that make everyone around him hit for less. Ra Ra Rasputin fucked around with this message at 21:21 on May 28, 2016 |
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May 28, 2016 21:14
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Sweet jesus I finally (30000000000000 reloads later) finished a Warriors of Chaos campaign on Normal difficulty. I wish I had some tips for people, but honestly much of it was down to luck. By the time I'd cleaned up Norsca and defeated the LoC and vassals who betrayed me I thought I could sneak through the middle of the map and join up with the Orcs to get a good sack/raze going, hopefully resulting in the Orcs heading up into the Empire. Turns out the Empire was already beaten to hell by the Vampire Counts, so I essentially sack/razed all the way through their undefended lands until I met up with the vamps, at which point we turned around and finished off Altdorf. I never even got to fight Karl Franz in person :/ So with all five campaigns done, I'd say pretty much all of them had their positives. As a TW vet, I think Vampire Counts and Empire were the easiest to get to grips with in battle since they had a good mix of melee and cav/monster cav and could be played fairly similar to historical factions in the previous games. That's not to say they don't have cool poo poo like zombie dragons, steam tanks and so on, but their basic roster works well with traditional TW strategies. Greenskins were somewhat frustrating in the early game as I had serious trouble working out a good counter to the Dwarfs in 1-on-1 battles, but once I'd wiped them out and started fighting through the human lands it clicked for me. High point for me was leading four stacks and tag-a-long Waaaghs straight into the full strength of the Chaos Invasion and wiping them out in the biggest battle I've seen so far. Vampire Counts was great in the early stage due to the small number of provinces to micromanage and looking for a chance to expand towards Reikland without going to war was interesting. Middle stage dragged a bit, especially when Dwarfs started tryingto backstab me whilst I held off Chaos, but the final battles were worth it. I never really settled in to the Dwarf campaign. I felt like i was being pushed to be rather un-dwarf-ily aggressive in the early stages in order to take out the greenskins, and this only got worse when I had to try and secure all the neutral Karaks. Not my favourite campaign, that's for sure. Chaos Warriors was too difficult to really be fun. I stopped manually playing battles within an hour because I knew I'd probably have to reload the next turn if something went wrong on the campaign map. Being a single turn or two away from total failure felt alienating. It definitely felt like it had been tuned towards hardcore players or whatever. Still got some good battles out of it in the final stages, like the *spoiler* battle and final siege of Altdorf. Anyway, this has definitely been my favourite TW in a long, long time. Probably the best 50hrs I've spent since Medieval 2. It's a huge shame the campaign AI does the same dumb poo poo as previous titles though. I also found that stuff like Quest Battles and some higher-tier units were considerably more trouble than they were really worth. Still, I do appreciate that you can't just float through the whole campaign with starting units - unlike in Attila you can't just set up a shock rear charge and watch pretty much anything melt away in seconds. In the entire time I've played, I haven't encountered a single CTD or serious glitch besides the launch day issues that froze up some battles. Really looking forward to the DLC. Hopefully we'll get a Bretonnia campaign soon. Would recommend the game to anyone, though people might understandably balk at max price for 5 factions. I'm a Warhammer nut who's going to splurge on all the DLC, so probably not the best person to determine value. dd209 fucked around with this message at 23:10 on May 28, 2016 |
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May 28, 2016 21:21
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I absolutely cannot wrap my head around playing as Chaos. Want to make a new army? Great, sit here for 8-10 turns making marauders 2 units at a time so you can actually attack a settlement. Be careful though, they'll be knocked over by a stiff breeze and the Nordling factions can field full stacks starting around turn 8. Want to babysit an army so it can start getting growth? Great, swapping units between armies gimps the primary one and now you're both taking attrition damage. Oh, you're going to sit your armies just outside of attrition range? Well one army has just been attacked and when you retreated it actually ran AWAY from your supporting army. Want to head South and start laying waste to the Empire? Great, now manually fight every single battle so you can desperately try to manage your casualties since encampment outside of allied territory takes 6-8 turns to replenish even minor losses to a unit. Have fun going back North every time you want your army to have actual loving soldiers in it. It's gonna be a long campaign pal. Chaos is a badass faction completely overshadowed by have completely and utterly poo poo their loving campaign mechanics are. What a joke. Or, more likely, I'm just mad because I've started and lost 5 Chaos campaigns in a row now.
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May 28, 2016 21:22
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Is there a repository of all the tips, tricks, and formations? Every time I read this thread I learn something that improves my fight. Edit: I manually fight almost all of my battles. Is the opposite true for most? Lame Devil fucked around with this message at 21:36 on May 28, 2016 |
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May 28, 2016 21:24
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Does anyone know if there's any other set battle maps other than Black Fire Pass? I just discovered that if you do a battle there in the campaign it uses the map from the quest battle, which is a really drat cool detail.
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May 28, 2016 21:35
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Of all things I think that Greenskins have given me the hardest time in early game (aside from Chaos). Taking down orc encampments is fine, but taking on any Dwarf settlement without a Waaagh to back you up is bad, and taking on Dwarf stacks is rough because you have the highest armor group in the game being attacked by a group with almost no armor piercing capability. Diplomacy is more necessary for the Orcs than it is for Dwarves which is weird from a lore sense
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May 28, 2016 21:40
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DreamShipWrecked posted:Of all things I think that Greenskins have given me the hardest time in early game (aside from Chaos). Taking down orc encampments is fine, but taking on any Dwarf settlement without a Waaagh to back you up is bad, and taking on Dwarf stacks is rough because you have the highest armor group in the game being attacked by a group with almost no armor piercing capability. Diplomacy is more necessary for the Orcs than it is for Dwarves which is weird from a lore sense Embrace Mork.
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May 28, 2016 21:46
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Fresh Shesh Besh posted:I absolutely cannot wrap my head around playing as Chaos. I don't know, they don't seem that hard to me. Raze a few settlements early on to get horde growth, grab the skills that increase horde growth, you'll be replacing those marauders in no time and be well on your way towards getting more advanced units. Keep moving, raid if you want, you get a whole lot of money for sacking southern settlements, so that allows you to build up structures and units. I'm up to recruiting something like 4 or 5 units per turn, it's faster to simply merge and replace units rather than waiting for them to replenish (sack settlements for cash). So, I dunno, seemed pretty straight forward to me.
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May 28, 2016 21:54
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Randarkman posted:I don't know, they don't seem that hard to me. Raze a few settlements early on to get horde growth, grab the skills that increase horde growth, you'll be replacing those marauders in no time and be well on your way towards getting more advanced units. Keep moving, raid if you want, you get a whole lot of money for sacking southern settlements, so that allows you to build up structures and units. I'm up to recruiting something like 4 or 5 units per turn, it's faster to simply merge and replace units rather than waiting for them to replenish (sack settlements for cash). I have no issues getting a single high tier army. One army doesn't win you the game however, and by the time you're suited to have multiple armies they get crushed immediately by full stacks of enemies while you're stuck making 2 units of marauders per turn. It's almost designed to waste your time.
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May 28, 2016 21:59
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So Kholek got assassinated leading my third army. Will he auto-switch back to be the stack general when he stops being wounded or do I have to pay 6 pop and start him from scratch again? If he ain't coming back automatically then gently caress me I think I'll just rage quit this garbage campaign and go back to one thats less frustrating. Trying to field an army of exalted lords and sorcerers as a merry band of (evil) adventurers didn't go so well. I mean, in battle they loving rock but prepare to lose your whole army over a few turns to constant critical success assassinations.
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May 28, 2016 22:00
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hreple posted:My orc trolls break at the first sign of combat. Are they just bad or am I doing something wrong? Not sure about all the factions but: God Tier: Both types of demigryphs, consistently smash anything except chosen halberds in a head on charge including all other monsters. Good units: Hexwraiths, terror and damage reduction makes them possibly the best undead infantry but like most VC infantry they lack killng power. Swordmans, best bang for your buck infantry, slightly outclassed by some but never outnumbered. Quarellers, cheap and deadly, best missile infantry in the game by some way although outstripped by thunderers against armour but can fire over friendlies. Blasting charge miners, deal horrendous damage to infantry with their ranged attack and can infiltrate
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May 28, 2016 22:00
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Fresh Shesh Besh posted:I have no issues getting a single high tier army. One army doesn't win you the game however, and by the time you're suited to have multiple armies they get crushed immediately by full stacks of enemies while you're stuck making 2 units of marauders per turn. It's almost designed to waste your time. Don't use marauders in the new army then. Just transfer over 10+ warriors to the new army then move on. If you have a high level horde you can recruit like 6 units of warriors/chosen in a turn. It shouldn't be that big of a deal to get the first army back up to full strength.
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May 28, 2016 22:03
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nopantsjack posted:Not sure about all the factions but: One correction to this: while halberd-wielding demigryphs will slaughter Hexwraiths, the wraiths will take out a unit of sword-demis. That said, the halberd variant is so much better that I doubt you'll see many of the sword types once word gets around. Oddly enough, the real VC counter to demigryphs of either type appears to be Crypt Horrors. Throwing two units of CHs at a demigryph unit will win that fight handily, albeit at some length.
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May 28, 2016 22:13
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hreple posted:My orc trolls break at the first sign of combat. Are they just bad or am I doing something wrong? On the other end of the scale, I've been pretty disappointed by all the melee chariots. Yeah, they do have a powerful charge, but they're finicky to extract afterwards and also pretty rear end in a prolonged fight. Just regular heavy cavalry is usually almost as good on a charge, while also being able to stick around and finish the job on their own afterwards.
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May 28, 2016 22:23
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Here are some pics of the state of the world at the end of my campaigns. Empire pic is from winning a Long Victory, the rest are Short Victories.    
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May 28, 2016 22:32
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I haven't tried chariots yet but I'm pretty sure the idea isn't to let them get into melee at all. Pick a unit that's been stretched thin and bowl through 'em, and wait for your unit to reform behind enemy lines. Chariots that get the charge off do about as much damage as an artillery strike.
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May 28, 2016 22:32
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Ostland and Ostermark are ded 'ard.
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May 28, 2016 22:35
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Is there any benefit/penalty to public order besides rebellions? Does high public order give any kind of bonus?
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May 28, 2016 22:36
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Ironbreakers: heavily armored and shielded, with a decent attack, they make an unbreakable line so you can flank with hammerers and slayers. All that, and each ironbreaker unit gets two volleys of explosive charges to soften up an enemy before contact with your line. Basically, like Roman javelins from Rome 2, but explosive, so extra dwarfy.
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May 28, 2016 22:47
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Flavahbeast posted:Is there any benefit/penalty to public order besides rebellions? Does high public order give any kind of bonus? According to the manual, having high public order gives a boost to growth in a province.
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May 28, 2016 22:52
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dd209 posted:Chaos Warriors was too difficult to really be fun. I stopped autoresolving battles within an hour because I knew I'd probably have to reload the next turn if something went wrong on the campaign map. Being a single turn or two away from total failure felt alienating. It definitely felt like it had been tuned towards hardcore players or whatever. Still got some good battles out of it in the final stages. I've finished a long campaign as them and would disagree. I really think subduing the whole north was your first mistake. It really doesn't help you anymore than just having the default Norscans there and it gives the southerners time to build up strength. I just started off razing all the dwarf holds and it worked out great. Albeit I was Kolek and running around with a full stack of dragon ogres fairly quickly.
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May 28, 2016 22:53
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nopantsjack posted:Good units: The infantry is cairn wraiths. Hexwraiths are the cavalry version. Both are good, especially against enemy cavalry. And their killing power is "your dudes just routed because terror and are now taking scythes in the rear end for free." Varghulfs, Vargheists, and Terrorgheists are all amazing units - once you're fully engaged and your enemy's heavy infantry are tarpitted fighting trash-tier skeletons and zombies, charge a couple varghulfs through the lines and start wrecking poo poo. Sic terrorgheists and vargheists on enemy monsters or cavalry, or on ranged units to break them instantly. SOP for me is to land vargheists on any artillery I see. Crypt horrors are also pretty good.
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May 28, 2016 22:56
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When occupying other race's settlements, is there any reason not sack them first then immediately attack again to occupy them? It doesn't seem to hurt public order and it's not like I can use the buildings I'm damaging
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May 28, 2016 22:59
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Spend entire battle casting searing doom with Balthasar Gelt : 0 kills. Does this freaking spell do anything?
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May 28, 2016 23:00
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Terrible Opinions posted:I've finished a long campaign as them and would disagree. I really think subduing the whole north was your first mistake. It really doesn't help you anymore than just having the default Norscans there and it gives the southerners time to build up strength. I just started off razing all the dwarf holds and it worked out great. Albeit I was Kolek and running around with a full stack of dragon ogres fairly quickly. Honestly I just followed the pre-release videos CA released where they basically said "don't bother going south until you've taken Norsca". Most of the quests and abilities are centered around that area too. Plus from a lore standpoint all Chaos Invasions involved uniting the tribes before invading. I think you're absolutely right though - the process of taking over Norsca boils down to spending 50%+ of the campaign length trying to form an alliance aginst the south...by destroying two powerful Norscan factions who already want to go to war with the south.  edit: In fact I just noticed from the screenshot that at the end of the campaign there are now...two Norscan factions, except with fewer territories than the original two factions. 
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May 28, 2016 23:02
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malhavok posted:Spend entire battle casting searing doom with Balthasar Gelt : 0 kills. Does this freaking spell do anything? I've noticed a lot of the small bombardment spells don't seem to do anythin'. I wonder if they're bugged.
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May 28, 2016 23:13
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Grondoth posted:I've noticed a lot of the small bombardment spells don't seem to do anythin'. I wonder if they're bugged. I keep hearing people say that the spells aren't scaling to the unit size settings. Not sure if that's true. The single-target spells seemed reasonably powerful against individual targets without being OP, but maybe I'm wrong.
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May 28, 2016 23:20
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Spell balance is a little weird in that the unavoidable lore of death click and die spells will melt a unit from full to dead in a few seconds if they are within range of the spell caster, meanwhile the giant expensive spells that have randomly roam the battlefield and can backfire do tickle damage.
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May 28, 2016 23:32
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dd209 posted:I keep hearing people say that the spells aren't scaling to the unit size settings. Not sure if that's true. The single-target spells seemed reasonably powerful against individual targets without being OP, but maybe I'm wrong. I did some actual testing on this today and it's totally true, kick your unit size settings down to medium or small and suddenly vortex spells rip through units doing 2-3rds of their total HP bar and killing bunches of dudes instead of just tickling them like they do on Ultra. Single target spells are even easier to test, they do a flat amount of damage regardless of unit size so you're hitting 2000 HP lords for 2000 HP on small or 5,000 HP lords for 2,000 HP (placeholder numbers, obviously) on Ultra. Also Lore of Death is especially weird because you've got two click-and-cast nukes that do massive, reliable damage, and then Black Sun that does loving nothing except knock units down briefly. Pretty sure Searing Doom does nothing on any unit size though. madmac fucked around with this message at 23:42 on May 28, 2016 |
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May 28, 2016 23:40
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Death is the only lore I can really get working as far as damage spells. When playing Chaos I just go 100% death mages. Their debuff and damage spells are insane compared to fire. Every fire spell I've tried outside of fireball has been really dissapointing. Metal has a few nice buffs/debuffs but I like death better. I haven't tried celestial yet at all though so maybe its good.
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May 28, 2016 23:42
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