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Countblanc posted:don't bm, merely of a timely "Stopwatch." after every game. god bless. This is the only correct answer. Please listen to countblanc he knows what he is talking about
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Jun 3, 2016 20:13
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Eonwe posted:you should probably relax a little bit and not do weirdo callouts in this, the overwatch video games thread Oh no  please do not be upset, I only mean to share the peace and the love between siblings of the human raceguts and bolts posted:i feel like Genji's skill floor is high, actually - like, to be even moderately effective you have to be sort of good at Overwatch and good at him as a character, and if you just pick him up and play you'll get wrecked over and over again until you switch, quit, or get good If your personal skill is arbitrarily 50, and a character's skill floor is 25, then your actual effectiveness while playing is 50. If your personal skill is 10 and the skill floor is 25, then the actual effectiveness while playing is 25. You get this with McCree and Winston, where practically anyone can toss a flashbang and then fan, or leap, drop bubble, and zap dudes. Of course, knowing when, how, and who to target makes you more effective at doing that, but that's part of becoming More Skilled. We can further extrapolate this: If your personal skill is again arbitrarily 75 and the skill ceiling is 50, then your actual effectiveness is 50 while playing that character. No matter how much better you get you aren't going to see improvements in your impact on the match because of that character's limitations. Genji has the lowest skill floor in the entire game, and McCree/Winston are among the highest. Genji's skill ceiling is up in the stratosphere, McCree's ceiling is very high, and Winston has one of the lowest skill ceilings on the roster. There's a certain threshold with Genji in particular where you suddenly jump from useless to strong contributor. That's my take on it though. There's another common interpretation where skill floor means you need this much skill to start performing well. That's a valid way of interpreting the terms, I guess, but it doesn't really match with what skill ceiling means and implies. Minimum and maximum impact, or minimum requirement and maximum impact? ~Terminology~
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Jun 3, 2016 20:20
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hmm, i feel like that was sarcasm
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Jun 3, 2016 20:22
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i want to be good at genji but i do not want to take the time being bad at genji to become good at genji
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Jun 3, 2016 20:24
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you should play genji, he's fun
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Jun 3, 2016 20:24
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My first match today was Offense on a Payload map that started off with our team having Widow, Hanzo, and Torb. We won handily. 
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Jun 3, 2016 20:25
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Jun 3, 2016 20:28
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Snazzy Frocks posted:Everything from Were all soldiers now and on seems fun
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Jun 3, 2016 20:28
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mormonpartyboat posted:i want to be good at genji Assuming you're going into Genji cold it takes only like 4 to 8 matches? (depending on your Personal Skill) for things to start clicking and you to start being more than dead weight, and after that you just get better and better every match
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Jun 3, 2016 20:28
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I finally got a 144hz monitor so I can be the overwatch pro I was always meant to be.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:29
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limited posted:gently caress, just make MOBA-Watch a baseline mode. Please. God. The team that gets widow and mccree wins Oh wait i misunderstood. Still, bad idea
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Jun 3, 2016 20:29
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heres some hot tips for Genji, he has throwing stars that are cool as gently caress and accurate, his shift does like 50 damage in a line as you dash and resets when you get a kill or whatever and he can deflect projectiles he also has a sword that you can use sometimes when you build your ult, and its pretty cool oh and he can double jump and climb walls happy hunting 
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Jun 3, 2016 20:30
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limited posted:gently caress, just make MOBA-Watch a baseline mode. Please. God. i dont think this would be fun at all
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Jun 3, 2016 20:30
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The hero brawl this week is pretty okay at learning how to move and shoot as Genji but the timings are probably going to gently caress you up
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Jun 3, 2016 20:30
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Brannock posted:~Terminology~ i've just always personally interpreted the "skill floor" to be like "you must be this tall to ride this ride" - the bare minimum "personal skill" required to play a hero and not be abject trash with that hero; whereas "skill ceiling" i've always used coloquially to suggest the point at which personal skill no longer matters, because you can only get so good at a hero/character/whatever before you plateau off it ties in with my general idea of difficulty when talking about competitive games. characters that have easy-to-learn movesets, kits, or abilities are among the easiest to immediately pick up and find moderate success with, so people call these characters "easy," when the reality is that once everyone stops being a shitter, their limited capabilities start to actively hurt them, making them harder to play effectively instead of easier this is a crazy tangent but it's cool to talk about so whatever like, in my personal estimation, Genji seems to be the hardest character to pick up and play in the game, and he's challenging even once you've "gotten the hang" of him, whereas Tracer is somewhat hard to pick up and play relative to characters like Soldier: 76 and Reaper and McCree but once she clicks with you and you "get it," you can sorta just become a terror i'm trying now to think of who i think might be harder to pick up than Genji and I've got nothing, and what makes pub Genjis/Tracers such a coinflip is the difference in "how cool this character's aesthetic is" or "how much of the mascot this character is" and "how difficult is this character to play" reaper intersects neatly with "easy to play and attracts people out of the gates who will gravitate toward that heavy-offense role" so if you're like 12 y/o me you can just pick him and be okay genji is a literal robot ninja samurai and tracer is the mascot, so a lot of people (my friends included) were like "oh, i'll just pick the main guy/cool guy" and they got repeatedly annihilated for doing so it's my secret theory as to why Ryu is usually the easiest character to pick up in Street Fighter, because he's on the loving cover art
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Jun 3, 2016 20:31
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i've been trying this out a bit with mumble friends and I'm starting to think that one of the best strats for pubs right now is "don't show respect until the opponents earn it." not like, bming or picking gimmick 5 mei/1 lucio comps, but basically ask yourself "do i assume my opponents are playing well/'correctly' right now?" and if the answer is yes even though you haven't actually seen proof of that you need to go a bit more ham. a great example of this is offense on first point Hanamura, with the one chokepoint gate. the "proper" play would be to spam down the opposing reinhardt's shield, get some sort of pick with a widow/roadhog/etc., then push in with a support ult, or some variation thereof. what've i've found though is that people seem to just take this for granted and will stall at that chokepoint and not accomplish anything. instead try speedboosting with lucio after that second corner and plowing into them with a zarya and mccree or something - you'll probably end up just walking right over them in my experience because people respect you too much and don't expect you to just violate the unwritten rules of overwatch chokepoints like that. even if you don't wipe them you'll probably trade and the walk back is definitely shorter for offense than defense there. it's not a perfect strat (in fact it relies on being kinda gimmicky and bad) but i've gotten a lot of mileage out of it if i let my team know that's what's going on. i've found it often doesn't work as hot against turret classes for whatever reason, probably because you have to split your attention, but give it a shot and see how it works out for you!
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Jun 3, 2016 20:31
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Countblanc posted:i've been trying this out a bit with mumble friends and I'm starting to think that one of the best strats for pubs right now is "don't show respect until the opponents earn it." not like, bming or picking gimmick 5 mei/1 lucio comps, but basically ask yourself "do i assume my opponents are playing well/'correctly' right now?" and if the answer is yes even though you haven't actually seen proof of that you need to go a bit more ham. people in this game are bizarrely stuck on the idea that you defend X chokepoint and you can punish them really hard on Numbani and Temple of Anubis especially with this, but on Hanamura as well
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Jun 3, 2016 20:34
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genji is precision japanese engineering treat him as such namaste
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Jun 3, 2016 20:34
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Also I don't know how much this was talked about in beta but like Tracer's ultimate is totally fine from a gameplay standpoint but thematically I have no clue what throwing a grenade with the weakest arm in the world has to do with The Girl Who Lept Through Time.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:35
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You want your tracer bomb to stick to the opponent, it's funny to freak em out. Which is why if a good Zarya gets stuck with a tracer bomb, all she has to do is pop her barrier and never dies~
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Jun 3, 2016 20:36
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My main goal for this game right now is to get the Elvis/Daredevil outfit for 76.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:37
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Lady Naga posted:Also I don't know how much this was talked about in beta but like Tracer's ultimate is totally fine from a gameplay standpoint but thematically I have no clue what throwing a grenade with the weakest arm in the world has to do with The Girl Who Lept Through Time. It only works thematically if you make the stick. Teleport, plant C4, reverse time to get away from the explosion.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:37
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Aphrodite posted:I don't say anything after a win because they know they just got beat easily, and that they're not worth my time to type.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:37
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Soothing Vapors posted:i refuse to believe you win games Technically I didn't say that.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:38
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Lastgirl posted:genji is precision japanese engineering mercy gave him the suit i thought wouldn't it make it swiss engineering
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Jun 3, 2016 20:38
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General Morden posted:mercy gave him the suit i thought ooh so genji is a walking swiss knife this makes sense
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Jun 3, 2016 20:38
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guts and bolts posted:it ties in with my general idea of difficulty when talking about competitive games. characters that have easy-to-learn movesets, kits, or abilities are among the easiest to immediately pick up and find moderate success with, so people call these characters "easy," when the reality is that once every stops being a shitter, their limited capabilities start to actively hurt them, making them harder to play effectively instead of easier there's definitely certain tools a character can have that makes them easier to stomp people with at lower skill levels. a fighting game character with lots of super armor is going to ruin bad people's days a lot more than a pixie who needs to drill combos to be even moderately effective. that said there can also be characters whose toolkits offer growth even when their entry point is strong. TF2's Soldier is a terror in newbie vs newbie games, and he's also one of the strongest competitive classes because of how his mechanics let you grow as a player. there's also something of a trap where a character being difficult to learn doesn't necessarily translate into them being super good. the Spy is an example of this, where you need a lot more map knowledge, game sense, and honestly fundamental fps skills than a Heavy to have similar results, but you still probably aren't gonna get to main Spy in a non-highlander competitive format no matter how many hours you put into the character. similarly a character with "easy" tools may just do well in higher level play because having easy tools means you have reliable tools - mccree's fan the hammer is a good example. Ryu is consistently good in street fighter even though his kit is one of the easiest to understand because his tools are so universally strong. genji may somewhat fall into the latter category depending on how the meta shakes out. he'll never be BAD in the hands of someone who knows how to use him, but that same player may win more games with a simpler character who gives you more freedom to not be on your AAA-game 100% of the time.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:39
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but what im saying is think like a ninja with genji and itll never fail
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Jun 3, 2016 20:39
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Lastgirl posted:You want your tracer bomb to stick to the opponent, it's funny to freak em out. - Aphrodite posted:It only works thematically if you make the stick. I guess but it legitimately seems like a placeholder ability, especially when everyone else gets weird or fancy or flashy ults and you get...a grenade. Like imagine if you're playing Street Fighter as Ken and you get your max super gauge and when you activate it he just pulls out a gun and shoots his opponent.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:40
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General Morden posted:mercy gave him the suit i thought I think his mom and dad gave him dat rear end, so I'd say the japanese engineered him pretty well
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Jun 3, 2016 20:40
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Lastgirl posted:ooh so genji is a walking swiss knife this makes sense tracer has gorilla engineering
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Jun 3, 2016 20:40
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Lady Naga posted:Also I don't know how much this was talked about in beta but like Tracer's ultimate is totally fine from a gameplay standpoint but thematically I have no clue what throwing a grenade with the weakest arm in the world has to do with The Girl Who Lept Through Time. It would be super annoying/disruptive but it'd be neat if she could freeze time for like 3 seconds and do as much damage as she can before everyone unfreezes
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Jun 3, 2016 20:41
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Lady Naga posted:Also I don't know how much this was talked about in beta but like Tracer's ultimate is totally fine from a gameplay standpoint but thematically I have no clue what throwing a grenade with the weakest arm in the world has to do with The Girl Who Lept Through Time. Tracer is Y.T. from Snow Crash with time travel Special delivery!
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Jun 3, 2016 20:42
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Help Im Alive posted:It would be super annoying/disruptive but it'd be neat if she could freeze time for like 3 seconds and do as much damage as she can before everyone unfreezes 
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Jun 3, 2016 20:42
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Pumpy Dumper posted:A summary of getting butt hurt at someone saying you're bad at this game: i just wanted to say that tyler the creator is also my role model and i look up to him and worship the gorund he walks on and this makes me a badass at not caring too and justifies lovely behavior because im awesome like that haha  Lady Naga posted:I guess but it legitimately seems like a placeholder ability, especially when everyone else gets weird or fancy or flashy ults and you get...a grenade. Like imagine if you're playing Street Fighter as Ken and you get your max super gauge and when you activate it he just pulls out a gun and shoots his opponent. It's kind of situational but... if used in conjunction with another ult like Graviton Surge or people hugging a Reinhardht, Tracer's bomb can blow up 3-4 people when done right. It's also very good for Bastions and displacements and AoD.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:42
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Lady Naga posted:- please do not mention Ken Masters in this most sacred of threads
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Jun 3, 2016 20:43
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Brannock posted:Assuming you're going into Genji cold it takes only like 4 to 8 matches? (depending on your Personal Skill) for things to start clicking and you to start being more than dead weight, and after that you just get better and better every match i just know my situation awareness tends to go to poo poo in big melee scrums which is where genji really shines, so i tend to play people like pharah or roadhog and be extremely aggressive about harassment/picks. but yeah, won't know till i try! Countblanc posted:a great example of this is offense on first point Hanamura, with the one chokepoint gate. the "proper" play would be to spam down the opposing reinhardt's shield, get some sort of pick with a widow/roadhog/etc., then push in with a support ult, or some variation thereof. i like wall running through the upper window as lucio and then dooting people off the edge when they try to catch you
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Jun 3, 2016 20:43
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limited posted:gently caress, just make MOBA-Watch a baseline mode. Please. God. "I picked Winston. Either I'm going to be awesome or they picked Reaper and I will be better off hiding in spawn hoping my team can win a 5v6 rather than feeding them ult" This game mode seems rad.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:44
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Lady Naga posted:I guess but it legitimately seems like a placeholder ability, especially when everyone else gets weird or fancy or flashy ults and you get...a grenade. Like imagine if you're playing Street Fighter as Ken and you get your max super gauge and when you activate it he just pulls out a gun and shoots his opponent.
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Jun 3, 2016 20:44
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Brannock posted:Tracer is Y.T. from Snow Crash with time travel I like you now.  for snow crashGeneral Morden posted:tracer has gorilla engineering tracer's blinks are powered by bananarium and peanut butterom, and when that baby's flux capacitor hits 88 mph, watch out
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Jun 3, 2016 20:44
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