|
punk rebel ecks posted:It sounds like Civ5 is a dumbed down version of the previous games. It is definitely simplified in many respects, but many systems that were mainstays in the first four games (like choosing different government types, or the relatively limited application of culture) have been completely replaced in Civ5. Personally I still think that Civ4 is the best game thus far, but I can absolutely appreciate the need to shake things up. Civ5 is more approachable for newcomers and is a better basis for future games than Civ4 would have been.
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 18:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 17:29 |
|
|
How the gently caress is that even possible
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 18:36
|
|
|
punk rebel ecks posted:It sounds like Civ5 is a dumbed down version of the previous games. I wouldn't go that far, I think it's a simpler game, but it's not really a version of the previous ones. I also think there are a lot of ways that Civ V adds nuance. The execution of some these can be argued, but trade routes, religion and combat are all examples of things that are much better fleshed out in 5 than 4 imo. Diplomatic and cultural victories are also much more interesting designs, even if they're still not all that interesting in practice.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 18:43
|
|
|
I tried to get into Civ4 but getting juggernaut'd by doomstacks all the goddamn time really killed the fun.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 18:46
|
|
|
Byzantine posted:I tried to get into Civ4 but getting juggernaut'd by doomstacks all the goddamn time really killed the fun. Civ4's difficulty levels are harder than Civ5's -- I stay on King in 4 but play on Emperor in 5. Otherwise, this is mostly about having a rough feel for how much of your production needs to go towards armies, and having scouts posted so you know when a doomstack is coming before it gets to your cities. If you don't have an army ready to repel invaders, well, then that's why there's a doomstack on your borders! The AI figured out you were weak and ripe for the picking. If you do have an army and see a stack anyway, you should muster the garrisons at all nearby cities and send them to the one that's going to be attacked, then start rushing more units everywhere you can that can help. It's not remotely unheard-of to scramble a defense in a city and wear away the enemy's doomstack to the point that even if they do take the city, you take it right back a few turns later. City defense units are really loving strong in Civ4, too, especially if the enemy stack doesn't have much collateral damage units (catapults, etc.). A single archer in a city can hold off several axemen, for example.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 18:54
|
|
|
MMM Whatchya Say posted:I wouldn't go that far, I think it's a simpler game, but it's not really a version of the previous ones. I also think there are a lot of ways that Civ V adds nuance. The execution of some these can be argued, but trade routes, religion and combat are all examples of things that are much better fleshed out in 5 than 4 imo. Diplomatic and cultural victories are also much more interesting designs, even if they're still not all that interesting in practice. Also combat with 1-stack per tile has a "tactical" aspect that none other ever had, its way more complex to do combat effectively in 5 But 4 is probably the most complex one really. I had skipped it and recently, after years of 5, tried to play it. And I got owned everytime and I dont understand half of whats going on
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 18:56
|
|
|
Elias_Maluco posted:What? I dont think I ever used an internal trade route. To me they were always essential to having a lot of gold to keep a large military and buy buildings to speed up new cities Internal trade routes make your capitol grow nice and big, and that gets you more gold thanks to one of tradition's policies, and possibly tithes. It also makes your capitol a more attractive target for other civs to send their trade routes to, and you get money from that. It more than balances out in the end.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 20:42
|
|
|
I'd say Civ 4 is the best game, but Civ 5 is a fuckload more accessible and friendly. Every game needs a big button that says, "You gotta do this before you end your turn, dummy!" that you mash on.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 21:12
|
|
|
Gort posted:I'd say Civ 4 is the best game, but Civ 5 is a fuckload more accessible and friendly. Every game needs a big button that says, "You gotta do this before you end your turn, dummy!" that you mash on. Yeah having basically a notification feed for in-game events and places where you need to take action was one of the best parts of Civ5
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 22:08
|
|
|
Civ 5 kind of made war a joke though. The AI is so terrible at combat (ESPECIALLY with anything that involves water/navies). That was one advantage of doomstacks: The AI could actually leverage its (cheating) advantages into producing more units than you. You had to use better army composition and/or split your units and flank around their frontline to try and break up their doomstack. I remember in Civ 4 constantly checking the relative military strength of my neighbours because I didn't want to get blindsided by giant stack of troops on my doorstep. I rarely do this in Civ 5.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2016 23:28
|
|
|
I got blindsided by an AI invasion in a game of Civ5 once. I frantically upgraded 3 units into gatling guns and rushed them into position along my border. The enemy army, a massive carpet of easily 15+ units from the medieval era (tons of knights, trebuchets, pikes, etc.), could trivially have overwhelmed my puny defending force and then run rampant through my empire. Instead it kind of just shuffled units back and forth for a dozen turns, at which point my newly-built-and-emplaced defenders started chewing it up. By the time the AI called the war off, I'd killed all but 5 of its units (counting new units it had built and sent to the front lines!) and it had literally never once attacked me.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 00:36
|
|
|
Away all Goats posted:Civ 5 kind of made war a joke though. The AI is so terrible at combat (ESPECIALLY with anything that involves water/navies). They really dropped the ball with Civ 5s difficulty levels. They made a system that emphasises quality units over quantity, then gave the AIs huge numbers of units which then mill around getting in each others way while the human player uses ranged units to grind up to the ludicrously overpowered "shoot twice a turn" promotion. They should have given high-difficulty AIs free promotions on their units, or just a flat combat bonus instead.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 01:07
|
|
|
Combat in civ is way better designed, it's just that the AI sucks at it. Which is a big problem, but not inherent to the design. I think those two sentences sum up Civ V basically.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 03:06
|
|
|
This was talked about a lot when the game came out, but ultimately Civ 4 has a much worse combat system than 5, but because it is much simpler and equates to hammers=army, the AI fared much better at warfare.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 03:32
|
|
|
Civ V is basically designed for multiplayer, but the multiplayer sucks so
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 03:34
|
|
|
Civ 6 had better have functioning pitboss MP at release, I swear to christ.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 05:27
|
|
|
Gort posted:They really dropped the ball with Civ 5s difficulty levels. They made a system that emphasises quality units over quantity, then gave the AIs huge numbers of units which then mill around getting in each others way while the human player uses ranged units to grind up to the ludicrously overpowered "shoot twice a turn" promotion. I've seen a few AI mods that do this with promotions, it also gives the AI less opportunity to trip over itself as we all are used to seeing. It's actually good at making the AI combat effective.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 05:42
|
|
|
Chronojam posted:I've seen a few AI mods that do this with promotions, it also gives the AI less opportunity to trip over itself as we all are used to seeing. It's actually good at making the AI combat effective. Yeah, here's mine. CBPs better though.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 13:56
|
|
|
Random events in civ4 are cool and good because one time I was Rome and got iron working from a hut and then an event spawned an iron mine and road in my cap.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 14:16
|
|
|
Random events would be better if they were tied to a minor story or quest ie an expedition is proposed that you chose to fund. Make a few decisions and they bring back the plague or a technology. Basically Castles II style if anyone remembers that game. Hand Row fucked around with this message at 14:28 on Jun 11, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 14:25
|
|
|
Sometimes reading this thread makes me feel like the title should be "Civilization VI: My Opinions On How Civilization Should Be More Like a Paradox Game"
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 14:33
|
|
|
Civilization VI: Complain about Civ V, Civ IV
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 14:44
|
|
|
E: doublepost
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 14:45
|
|
|
I dint liked the random events in Civ 4, so I just turned then off in the options. Its very convenient. Speaking about it, Im again trying to get into Civ 4 because you guys keep telling how it is the best, but I just suck so much at it. Any tips you can give, or guides you can direct me to? EDIT: I got the "complete" edition, it comes with the original, warlords, and beyond the sword. Im just playing with beyond cause I figured it has anything and everything the other two has? What's the difference? EDIT 2: by the way: Im playing it on linux using wine and it runs flawlessly Elias_Maluco fucked around with this message at 15:49 on Jun 11, 2016 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 15:37
|
|
|
Elias_Maluco posted:I dint liked the random events in Civ 4, so I just turned then off in the options. Its very convenient. I did Civ 4 last year and my recommendation would be to start with vanilla before working your way through the expansions. Also some of the scenarios may be a good way to familiarise with some mechanics, provided the scenario hasn't been modded beyond recognition. I had a lot of fun with the Warring States China scenario.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 15:45
|
|
|
I say jump straight into BTS, and also have a read of the Civ4 strategy guide: http://www.civfanatics.com/civ4/strategy/sisiutil.php
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 15:57
|
|
|
Chucat posted:
So... turn them off?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 16:15
|
|
|
Hand Row posted:Random events would be better if they were tied to a minor story or quest ie an expedition is proposed that you chose to fund. Make a few decisions and they bring back the plague or a technology. I remember it, and I think that if more games were inspired by castles 2 this world would be a better place.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2016 16:17
|
|
|
New gameplay video from e3
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 02:22
|
|
|
Those wonder animations look great, although I'm sad that I know I'll be ignoring all of those unit animations when it comes to combat. The civic cards kinda look eh, though. I'm worried that there's going to be an optimal set to work towards, but we'll see I guess.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 02:47
|
|
|
E3 today was pretty lackluster. Some good minor details like pillaging certain districts gives you bonuses depending on what you pillaged, and that you can nuke wonders. I liked everything I saw, but what I really want though is to see some specs on the uniques of some civilizations. I want to see the limit to which they are willing to change influence the game with special abilities.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 02:54
|
|
|
I've decided that I don't like the leader art at all, if the two leaders we've seen are anything to go by
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:16
|
|
|
I like how expressive/cartoony they are but yeah that is not a good Cleopatra design at all
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:21
|
|
|
MMM Whatchya Say posted:I've decided that I don't like the leader art at all, if the two leaders we've seen are anything to go by It's pretty bad, but whatever. It's just there to be there. I only look at the menus in the leaders screen. I don't give a poo poo what is going on in the animation.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:22
|
|
|
It's disappointing, because I actually like the art on the rest of game, and I really liked the leader screens on civ v, so I'm surprised it went where it did.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:30
|
|
|
Hate Cleopatra all you want but the background art was beautiful. (also why not Hatsheput)
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:32
|
|
|
Teddy looks like he's got some serious chipmunk cheek inflammation going on, but that aside I'll be the dissenter and say the two leader screen models we've seen look just fine. I don't really get why people would get down on them, cheeks aside. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:33
|
|
|
majormonotone posted:I like how expressive/cartoony they are but yeah that is not a good Cleopatra design at all A little... neotenic? Not quite the word I mean but it is kinda weird design. Also weren't 6/7 of the ancient wonders caved in before nukes got invented? You should be able to use concentrated effort to pillage one and permanently wreck it in exchange for some huge boost, like a good amount of gold and xp for all your nearby units. I'm thinking you would have to pillage it multiple times, and the last time breaks it for real. Once it's actually broke you get something that would be less good than actually having it on your city, but something that helps you out right this second. Maybe it can leave a cool, semi unique archeology site. So breaking it could ensure you win the war, or be a huge gently caress you to your opponent, with the trade off that it's loving destroyed and can never be rebuilt.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:42
|
|
|
Yeah the cartoon look will definitely take some getting used to, no doubt about it. But lets think about it guys, Civ 5 came out when, in 2010? Literally 6 years off of one game. I think its alright to see a different direction. It does look like they are using the Civ4 font as well. My fear after watching that video was that it was going to be too simple. Almost everything they clicked outside the civic system was just a one or two button press. Didn't seem to have a lot of options there. Still pumped, and the key will really be the diplomacy and AI.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:49
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 17:29 |
|
|
I officially love how cartoony it is. Cleopatra hamming it up is hilarious. Jastiger posted:My fear after watching that video was that it was going to be too simple. Almost everything they clicked outside the civic system was just a one or two button press. Didn't seem to have a lot of options there. Yeah, the designer was going on about how complex it is but we haven't really seen evidence of that yet, only of how accessible it is. The complexities will hopefully emerge once we see actual gameplay turn-by-turn instead of the sped-up footage in the video. Also officially hyped for policymaking 
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2016 03:52
|
|
