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Empress Theonora posted:hmmm this artist posted in the bad webcomics thread because she's uncomfortable with the way they discuss her work, better breathlessly bring word to the other webcomics thread so they can all talk about it too Yeah better not talk about webcomics, even slightly in a negative way, lest some interesting discussion break out. Oh wait sorry, I'll post better. woah poppy.
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Jun 15, 2016 07:14
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All I'm getting from this (aside from some useful e/n introspection which I'll say thank you for but not bug anybody with) is labels are poo poo and cause more trouble than they're worth.
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Jun 15, 2016 07:52
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Renaissance Robot posted:All I'm getting from this (aside from some useful e/n introspection which I'll say thank you for but not bug anybody with) is labels are poo poo and cause more trouble than they're worth. As a counterpoint, I think labels are a fine thing as long as you don't think of them as absolutes. It's incredibly comforting to have a name to call yourself to know that you're not the only one out there experiencing that and from that foundation you can reach out and explore the true you rather than just drowning in a sea of possibilities.
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Jun 15, 2016 08:07
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I know people here are super paranoid about not resembling the byob thread but it's seriously okay to be critical about comics sometimes and have arguments about things. It certainly makes the thread more readable than the fifty billionth page in a row about "poppy/monster pulse updated and it was good" I think GTH's main crime is just being mediocre, poorly paced, and derivative. I get the complaints of pandering, not in the sense that there's some sort of cynical attempt to appeal to a demographic, but in the sense that it feels like the author looked at a bunch of things that were already popular and then made a pastiche of them without any real depth/appeal beyond looking to similar to Cucumber Quest etc. Also caring about what a bunch of nerds in a secluded thread of a pay-to-view forum think of your comic, and buying an account to tell them to stop discussing it is not a good look imo e: re: labels, I get why some people like using them and coining new ones, but I feel like obsessively labeling and categorizing people into increasingly specific boxes usually just turns into a bunch of anal hair-splitting and otherization. I feel like having super-specific labels for everything misrepresents issues of identity as a series of boxes/requirements you can check instead of a fluid, complex, ambiguous thing that's different for everybody. It is in fact okay to just have normal conversations about your feelings without having to put yourself through a sorting machine. HorseRenoir fucked around with this message at 08:26 on Jun 15, 2016 |
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Jun 15, 2016 08:12
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I kinda feel about GTH like I feel about QC: it's boring, nothing ever happens, or when it happens it's offscreen because the author doesn't feel confident enough in their skills to attempt to illustrate it. And just like QC, the boringness results in passionate goon debates.
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Jun 15, 2016 08:21
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djw175 posted:As a counterpoint, I think labels are a fine thing as long as you don't think of them as absolutes. It's incredibly comforting to have a name to call yourself to know that you're not the only one out there experiencing that and from that foundation you can reach out and explore the true you rather than just drowning in a sea of possibilities. Absolutely, I'll concede that (with the caveat that forming groups like that, while comforting, is also itself potentially a lot of trouble as it can and does slide into tribalism very easily) HorseRenoir posted:I think GTH's main crime is just being mediocre, poorly paced, and derivative. Isn't the author literally a teenager Renaissance Robot fucked around with this message at 08:41 on Jun 15, 2016 |
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Jun 15, 2016 08:37
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She's 22.
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Jun 15, 2016 08:44
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Yeah thats still literally a baby 
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Jun 15, 2016 08:55
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SynthOrange posted:Yeah thats still literally a baby congrats on the big 3 0
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Jun 15, 2016 09:55
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Thats also still literally a baby
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Jun 15, 2016 09:57
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Registering on a pay forum just to (poorly) respond to criticism on byob isn't the wisest choice But at least they're not shilling for Star Citizen
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Jun 15, 2016 10:07
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T.G. Xarbala posted:Registering on a pay forum just to (poorly) respond to criticism on byob isn't the wisest choice I think that would have made that one and only post much better, actually.
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Jun 15, 2016 10:14
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Cat Mattress posted:I kinda feel about GTH like I feel about QC: it's boring, nothing ever happens, or when it happens it's offscreen because the author doesn't feel confident enough in their skills to attempt to illustrate it. And just like QC, the boringness results in passionate goon debates. This is kind of my take. I tried to get into it but between A) the over reliance on EXPOSITION DUMPS to deliver what plot it does have and B) the way it rushes past what seem like important character defining moments because gently caress man we can't let plot and characterization delay us from getting to the snuggling and interpersonal drama, it's just really boring.
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Jun 15, 2016 11:04
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Girl Genius has thrown a pretty major curveball into the mix. (Err... starting a week ago, but still.)
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Jun 15, 2016 13:23
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Starting to suspect every mysterious disappearance in the story is going to be down to time travel shenanigans. Not being able to remember half of them sounds like a good excuse for a re-read.
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Jun 15, 2016 13:35
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Girl Genius seems like a story I could really get in to if it weren't for the art.
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Jun 15, 2016 14:40
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I've never really understood that complaint, but then I also enjoy Josh Lesnick's almost caricaturish scribbles so 
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Jun 15, 2016 14:59
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Renaissance Robot posted:I've never really understood that complaint, but then I also enjoy Josh Lesnick's almost caricaturish scribbles so Lesnick's art is messy but it's a cartoonish messiness, you can tell he's got a good grasp of anatomy and action lines. GG's characters look like something you'd see through the glass of a lava lamp, it's a bit off-putting. I think the comic's better than a lot of people give it credit for - all pacing complaints are totally on the mark but it's still got some great lines, especially when it plays up the radio-hall Weird Science angle - but the Foglios don't draw folks good.
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Jun 15, 2016 15:12
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Stabbey_the_Clown posted:Girl Genius has thrown a pretty major curveball into the mix. (Err... starting a week ago, but still.) That's the weird thing about taking a graphic novel and showing one page every two days, a brief moment of confusion lasts a week. In fact, that's part of why everybody grew to resent the comic during the Battle of Mechanicsburg, the Foglios chose to spend more pages on short moments to show the sheer scale of the entirety of the Baron's grab-bag of forces, which felt like it was wasting the reader's time on a day-to-day basis. That and the fact that the comic up until that point had moved through locales quickly, the heroes never spending more than a couple days in a place in their time, but when they got to Mechanicsburg, Agatha's final destination for most of the comic, they spent at least a couple weeks there. Renaissance Robot posted:Starting to suspect every mysterious disappearance in the story is going to be down to time travel shenanigans. Not being able to remember half of them sounds like a good excuse for a re-read. They really led up to the old Storm King, from Van Rjin's notebook to the muse of time, to Van Rjin's corpse, it sorta follows that the Storm King would follow where Van Rjin is. Hopefully that won't mean that everybody from the Heterodyne boys to Zeetha's village are lost somewhere in the timestream. One thing's for certain, the Master of Paris is going to be pissed.
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Jun 15, 2016 15:53
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I like the background/scene art in Girl Genius. I guess the very simplistic/cartoony art using for people's face clashes badly with the detailed art of the background? The Foglios love to use extremely exaggerated expressions, which couldn't work with a more realistic art style. (They're also, I must admit, pretty bad at anatomy.)
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Jun 15, 2016 16:03
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Renaissance Robot posted:I've never really understood that complaint, but then I also enjoy Josh Lesnick's almost caricaturish scribbles so I think Lesnick's another example of what you said a couple days ago: Renaissance Robot posted:even though the visual aspect of ONE's art is unquestionably loving awful, his panel layout and scene construction etc. are top notch and yeah the art's scribbly but it's scribbly with intent and skill, and it's things like as Oxxidation says "[his] good grasp of anatomy and action lines" which make the comic.
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Jun 15, 2016 16:14
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Also I saw Foglio at a con a few years ago and, so god help me, my only thought was "oh, that explains his characters' faces."
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Jun 15, 2016 16:15
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fritz posted:I think Lesnick's another example of what you said a couple days ago: tbh most of the Lesnick pages I've seen were ugly indecipherable messes. Yeah, the technical skill behind them is evident and I'd bet he could do fabulous things in animation but I don't think his art works very well in a comic format.
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Jun 15, 2016 16:28
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fritz posted:Also I saw Foglio at a con a few years ago and, so god help me, my only thought was "oh, that explains his characters' faces." He looks like Benny Hill.
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Jun 15, 2016 17:05
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Renaissance Robot posted:I've never really understood that complaint, but then I also enjoy Josh Lesnick's almost caricaturish scribbles so I do too. My chief problem with GG is that nothing seems to... fit? I'm sure there's a better word but let me explain, all the GG characters have these melty faced heads which is weird, but hey I could get past that, I've certainly read and enjoyed comics with weird/bad art before, it's just when you put those on everyone's weirdly giant bodies with their huge hair that poo poo starts to look jarring. His faces and body types don't mesh at all. Lesnick, to use your example, has very nice characters because even though they're cartoonish or have exaggerated features, they seem to have a consistency to them that Foglio lacks. TwoPair fucked around with this message at 17:19 on Jun 15, 2016 |
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Jun 15, 2016 17:16
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Yeah, the Foglios' weird warping and distorting the human form works for expressiveness, but it also makes for absolutely garbage anatomy. That's why Buck Godot is one of their best works. The bulk of the cast is nonhuman and unconstrained by human anatomy, and even the main character is some weird subspecies of human that makes an excuse for his weird anatomy. And of course, the thing I linked was a page from the internet archive because another thing the Foglios are poo poo at is web design and their website is full of dead links.
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Jun 15, 2016 17:51
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I don't want to apologise for bad art, but honestly the badness in the specific context of this particular comic is what I like. I feel it really complements the lurid penny dreadful/pulp fiction aesthetic of the setting and story, which is good to me because getting a fix of that experience is pretty much why I read it.
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Jun 15, 2016 18:44
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Gutter Owl posted:...that had literally nothing to do with my post. How did you miss the point this hard? lol
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Jun 15, 2016 20:13
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 webcomic artists are like gladiators
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Jun 15, 2016 20:14
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It may surprise you, but President Roosevelt was telling a funny story type lie which we call a metaphor.
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Jun 15, 2016 20:16
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TwoPair posted:Yeah better not talk about webcomics, even slightly in a negative way, lest some interesting discussion break out. woah indeed Android Blues posted:It may surprise you, but President Roosevelt was telling a funny story type lie which we call a metaphor. what? really?
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Jun 15, 2016 20:20
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I never really saw the formless faces in Girl Genius as that objectionable, I mean they're not good looking but I've never had any problem telling who's who or what they're doing which puts it in the top quintile of webcomic art. what's really objectionable is doing the exact same five SCIENCE!!!!! gags in a five-page rotation for, what, a decade
A Wizard of Goatse fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Jun 16, 2016 |
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Jun 16, 2016 02:36
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fritz posted:Also I saw Foglio at a con a few years ago and, so god help me, my only thought was "oh, that explains his characters' faces." Are you saying that he draws using a mirror?
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Jun 16, 2016 16:46
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:I never really saw the formless faces in Girl Genius as that objectionable, I mean they're not good looking but I've never had any problem telling who's who or what they're doing which puts it in the top quintile of webcomic art. what's really objectionable is doing the exact same five SCIENCE!!!!! gags in a five-page rotation for, what, a decade someone said that it was a good comic so i tried to read it, but the face art was so bad that i couldn't
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Jun 16, 2016 17:28
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Hogge Wild posted:what? really? Like gladiators, webcomic artists exist to amuse us and to die for us.
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Jun 16, 2016 18:27
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Hogge Wild posted:someone said that it was a good comic so i tried to read it, but the face art was so bad that i couldn't It was a good comic to start years ago, when well drawn comics weren't that plentiful. Now it coasts by on inertia and a need to see how the plot resolves.
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Jun 16, 2016 18:52
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nimby posted:It was a good comic to start years ago, when well drawn comics weren't that plentiful. Now it coasts by on inertia and a need to see how the plot resolves. Sounds like a metaphor for my life eh 
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Jun 16, 2016 18:54
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For some reason I still like Girl genius. Mainly due to the characters
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Jun 16, 2016 19:49
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Twibbit posted:For some reason I still like Girl genius. Mainly due to the characters I just binged the last 30 months of it due to thread talk and I was pleasantly surprised. The pacing has improved immeasurably and while the faces are very not good they've at least reined in some of the worst excesses. the holy poopacy fucked around with this message at 04:45 on Jun 17, 2016 |
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Jun 17, 2016 04:42
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I want to point out that I think everyone should read Buck Godot, it's miles ahead of anything the Foglios have done. Like, why the hell are they doing GG when they could do more Buck Godot?
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Jun 17, 2016 05:23
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