UKRIPMT June 2016: #Boxit

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKRIPMT June 2016: #Boxit

How will you be voting in the UKEU Referendum? This poll is closed.
Remain - Keep Britane Strong!	328	15.40%
Leave - Take Are Sovreignity Back!	115	5.40%
Remain - But only because Brexit are crazy	506	23.76%
Leave - But only because the EU is terrible	157	7.37%
Spoiled Ballot - This whole thing is an awful idea	61	2.86%
I'm not going to vote	19	0.89%
I'm not allowed to vote	411	19.30%
Pissflaps	533	25.02%
Total:	2130 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

Nitrousoxide: May 30, 2011; do not buy a oneplus phone

Spangly A posted:

I'm not recognising your name so please tell me if you're trolling or thick? you're describing the BBC but there are very, very easy ways to stop the government interfering with the BBC.

The BBC has engaged in censorship to toe the government line. Here's one particularly widespread and egregious example.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988%E2%80%9394_British_broadcasting_voice_restrictions

There are plenty of other examples as well, though they tend to less blatent.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:12

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 7, 2024 19:13

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

Spangly A posted:

I can't argue this point any further because this is something I feel I genuinely don't have evidence to go for. However, if his callout to the crisis team had been judged to require an inpatient stay, he would not have shot an MP.

e; that is to say, this may or may not be a relevant factor, and we won't know until we hear what the callout was for. "Hey can I have some valium the OCD is playing up" is different to "Hey I think I'm going to kill someone" as far as a medical response is concerned.

The lady who was working at the desk when he went in didn't seem to think it required immediate treatment. He apparently came in looking for alternate therapies for depression, not really a trigger for immediate sectioning.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:13

radmonger: Jun 6, 2011

Pochoclo posted:

Not a good idea either until we stop being so easily corrupted as a species. A huge state-funded media apparatus will just funnel out funds to perpetuate those in power, and cover up their sacking of state coffers (old USSR, Argentina, Brazil, Venezuela, etc). This always happens.

Similarly, judges being paid a government salary to judge cases is always a terrible idea. Things were much fairer in the good old Game of Thrones days when the local landowners were judge, jury and executioner.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:13

Tesseraction: Apr 5, 2009

JFairfax posted:

The tattoos should make it easy right?

Which is interesting - the pictures of the man being arrested seemed to show a pudgier guy with no tattoos. I wonder if those picture were of a different person.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:14

Spangly A: May 14, 2009; God help you if ever you're caught on these shores

A man's ambition must indeed be small
To write his name upon a shithouse wall

Nitrousoxide posted:

The BBC has engaged in censorship to toe the government line. Here's one particularly widespread and egregious example.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988%E2%80%9394_British_broadcasting_voice_restrictions

There are plenty of other examples as well, though they tend to less blatent.

seriously you aren't even responding to what I posted

it's very easy to stop the government interfering with the BBC. You simply need a constitution that says that their funding isn't up for government review. State run news services aren't all propaganda; the BBC certainly suffers strong pro-imperialist bias through it's history, but is widely regarded as one of the Least poo poo outlets. Al-jazera is state run by the loving qataris and presents excellent foreign affairs discussions provided it's outside of their immediate influence.

Pochoclo posted:

Not a good idea either until we stop being so easily corrupted as a species. A huge state-funded media apparatus will just funnel out funds to perpetuate those in power, and cover up their sacking of state coffers (old USSR, Argentina, Brazil, Venezuela, etc). This always happens.

Are you Brazillian? you're incredibly sceptical of what in europe is a normal thing. State media services outside of places that have begun to trend far right are miles better than the free press, with the exception of I guess Germany and SDZ

Spangly A fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jun 18, 2016

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:14

Tesseraction: Apr 5, 2009

Brown Moses posted:

Doesn't look like it is him

https://twitter.com/omicRocker/status/744259131272372224
https://twitter.com/hackneyglyn/status/744241740987633664

I see I should have added 'efb' to my post

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:15

Nothingtoseehere: Nov 11, 2010

Spangly A posted:

seriously you aren't even responding to what I posted

it's very easy to stop the government interfering with the BBC. You simply need a constitution that says that their funding isn't up for government review. State run news services aren't all propaganda; the BBC certainly suffers strong pro-imperialist bias through it's history, but is widely regarded as one of the Least poo poo outlets. Al-jazera is state run by the loving qataris and presents excellent foreign affairs discussions provided it's outside of their immediate influence.

Are you Brazillian? you're incredibly sceptical of what in europe is a normal thing. State media services outside of places that have begun to trend far right are miles better than the free press, with the exception of I guess Germany and SDZ

He's Argentinian

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:19

Angepain: Jul 13, 2012; what keeps happening to my clothes

TinTower posted:

MoS are backing Remain.

Is this as surprising as I think it is? My impression was anyone connected to the Daily Mail was all too eager to stop those blasted Eurocrats getting their tentables in Our Bretane.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:20

Nitrousoxide: May 30, 2011; do not buy a oneplus phone

Spangly A posted:

seriously you aren't even responding to what I posted

it's very easy to stop the government interfering with the BBC. You simply need a constitution that says that their funding isn't up for government review. State run news services aren't all propaganda; the BBC certainly suffers strong pro-imperialist bias through it's history, but is widely regarded as one of the Least poo poo outlets. Al-jazera is state run by the loving qataris and presents excellent foreign affairs discussions provided it's outside of their immediate influence.

Laws or constitutions only prevent people as far as leaders are willing to abide by them. Not only are they subject to change (most often for the"public's safety") but can be undermined by exploiting unforeseen situation's by the draftors.

Plus when you have only one news source who is there to report if the news source is compromised?

Multiple independent news outlets are the only way to combat censorship since they have a vested interest in exposing censorship of their competitors.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:21

Spangly A: May 14, 2009; God help you if ever you're caught on these shores

A man's ambition must indeed be small
To write his name upon a shithouse wall

Nitrousoxide posted:

Multiple independent news outlets are the only way to combat censorship since they have a vested interest in exposing censorship of their competitors.

yeah on the other hand phone hacking

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:22

TinTower: Apr 21, 2010; You don't have to 8e a good person to 8e a hero.

Nitrousoxide posted:

Multiple independent news outlets are the only way to combat censorship since they have a vested interest in exposing censorship of their competitors.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:24

communism bitch: Apr 24, 2009

Set up a guillotine in fleet street imo.

Yes I know hardly any of the papers are based in fleet street anymore you despicable pedant

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:28

Ms Adequate: Oct 30, 2011; Baby even when I'm dead and gone
You will always be my only one, my only one
When the night is calling
No matter who I become
You will always be my only one, my only one, my only one
When the night is calling

Oberleutnant posted:

Set up a guillotine in fleet street imo.

Very few of the papers are actually based in Fleet Street anymore.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:32

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

Nitrousoxide posted:

Laws or constitutions only prevent people as far as leaders are willing to abide by them. Not only are they subject to change (most often for the"public's safety") but can be undermined by exploiting unforeseen situation's by the draftors.

Plus when you have only one news source who is there to report if the news source is compromised?

Multiple independent news outlets are the only way to combat censorship since they have a vested interest in exposing censorship of their competitors.

You have a weird amount of trust in the ability or inclination of the free market to act in the interest of humanity.

Especially in the face of the actual current reality of it completely and spectacularly having failed to do so for the past age.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:42

Tesseraction: Apr 5, 2009

Mister Adequate posted:

Very few of the papers are actually based in Fleet Street anymore.

yeah it's now Wapping in Surrey

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:43

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

Spangly A posted:

This is a good post. I'm fully rowing back on my no opinions, and your phrasing of opinions relating to facts is both achievable and provides a wider room for public benefit.

I'm all about the blue sky research. The ridiculous link between crohn's disease and a cattle culling disease may improve my quality of life by an unthinkable amount, and if it doesn't, it's a better use of my time to sit in clean rooms and get tested and shot up with stuff than do piss all.

Nature and Science's problems go back a long way. Shulgin actually writes about the impact of growing editorial changes and an obsession with space and DNA research in one of the *IKHALS.

I completely agree that the tabloid press is shite, though!

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:44

Metrication: Dec 12, 2010; Raskin had one problem: Jobs regarded him as an insufferable theorist or, to use Jobs's own more precise terminology, "a shithead who sucks".

Tesseraction posted:

yeah it's now Wapping in Surrey

wapping... in surrey ?

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:46

Nothingtoseehere: Nov 11, 2010

Multiple independent outlets owned by rich members of the establishment will promote ideas rich members of the establishment approve of: And as they have the money to have a wide reach, these will be the views spread to society.

Sure, there will also be left-wing journalists pointing out that they are being lovely and corrupt (see: how The Telegraph has fallen in the last few years) But if they arn't getting their stories printed in the big national newspapers and out in the public consciousness, it doesn't matter how right they are when most people don't hear them unless they go looking.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:47

Nenonen: Oct 22, 2009; Mulla on aina kolkyt donaa taskussa

Mister Adequate posted:

Mair sounds an awful lot like a Scottish surname to me, I think we need to talk about tightening up security north of the border to stop this insidious menace.

Why hasn't anyone thought of building a wall???

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:48

Tesseraction: Apr 5, 2009

Metrication posted:

wapping... in surrey ?

sorry I meant some other pointless part of greater london

I kinda hate the south as much as I ignore the north

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:48

Kurtofan: Feb 16, 2011; hon hon hon

Make Rome Great Again

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:50

tooterfish: Jul 13, 2013

Nenonen posted:

Why hasn't anyone thought of building a wall???

That idea's been stolen by Trump, and George RR Martin.

And Israel.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:51

TinTower: Apr 21, 2010; You don't have to 8e a good person to 8e a hero.

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/744285195881299974

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:52

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

If you're proposing rebuilding hadrian's wall that would relegate a disressing amount of Northumbria to the mercy of being overrun by Britain First members.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:52

Saint Isaias Boner: Jan 17, 2007; hi how are you ♥

TinTower posted:

https://twitter.com/britainelects/status/744285195881299974

who are those 6%

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:53

Nitrousoxide: May 30, 2011; do not buy a oneplus phone

OwlFancier posted:

You have a weird amount of trust in the ability or inclination of the free market to act in the interest of humanity.

Especially in the face of the actual current reality of it completely and spectacularly having failed to do so for the past age.

We've never had more access to alternate sources for news than we do today.

It takes a couple of hundred pounds to setup a channel on YouTube with acceptable production values and no money to start a Twitter or tumbler blog. And just access to a smartphone to start a podcast.

People acting like tabloids are this unstoppable juggernaut that needs to be stopped with legislation is really puzzling. Especially given the downward trend of revenues for them and newspapers.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:53

Maoist Pussy: Feb 12, 2014; by Lowtax

If your leaders are not putting Britain first, who are they putting first?

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:54

Julio Cruz: May 19, 2006

Angepain posted:

Is this as surprising as I think it is? My impression was anyone connected to the Daily Mail was all too eager to stop those blasted Eurocrats getting their tentables in Our Bretane.

Yep, I was trying to think of other things that "MoS" could be, having immediately discounted Mail on Sunday.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:54

Kurtofan: Feb 16, 2011; hon hon hon

Saint Isaias Boner posted:

who are those 6%

Pissflaps

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:54

Ms Adequate: Oct 30, 2011; Baby even when I'm dead and gone
You will always be my only one, my only one
When the night is calling
No matter who I become
You will always be my only one, my only one, my only one
When the night is calling

Sod Hadrian, herd the degenerate jocks up out of the Lowlands and rebuild the Antonine Wall.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:54

Kurtofan: Feb 16, 2011; hon hon hon

we can't be the stupid empire anymore

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:55

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

Nitrousoxide posted:

We've never had more access to alternate sources for news than we do today.

It takes a couple of hundred pounds to setup a channel on YouTube with acceptable production values and no money to start a Twitter or tumbler blog. And just access to a smartphone to start a podcast.

People acting like tabloids are this unstoppable juggernaut that needs to be stopped with legislation is really puzzling. Especially given the downward trend of revenues for them and newspapers.

And yet we continue to accelerate towards idiocy and lies comprising an overwhelming proportion of the public discourse.

"Just let the free market sort it out" has never been a good solution historically, what makes you think it will be any better here?

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:55

Nothingtoseehere: Nov 11, 2010

Nitrousoxide posted:

We've never had more access to alternate sources for news than we do today.

It takes a couple of hundred pounds to setup a channel on YouTube with acceptable production values and no money to start a Twitter or tumbler blog. And just access to a smartphone to start a podcast.

People acting like tabloids are this unstoppable juggernaut that needs to be stopped with legislation is really puzzling. Especially given the downward trend of revenues for them and newspapers.

Sure: But you still need money to make people listen or care. The ability to create content or point out flaws means nothing when the big outlets can ignore, brush over, or hide on page 24 in small font any uncomfortable news.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 22:59

Hoops: Aug 19, 2005; A Black Mark For Retarded Posting

Nitrousoxide posted:

The BBC has engaged in censorship to toe the government line. Here's one particularly widespread and egregious example.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1988%E2%80%9394_British_broadcasting_voice_restrictions

There are plenty of other examples as well, though they tend to less blatent.

Isn't this an example of them specifically not toeing the government line? The government tired to implement censorship by making it illegal to broadcast their voices, so the media (including the BBC) used a loophole to defy the government's aim. Unless your point is that they should have ignored a legal, state-wide ban and got themselves sanctioned, this seems like a completely contradictory example to use.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 23:01

Dr. Cool Aids: Jul 6, 2009

Julio Cruz posted:

Yep, I was trying to think of other things that "MoS" could be, having immediately discounted Mail on Sunday.

My mind immediately went to Ministry of Sound who surely love Europe

# ? Jun 18, 2016 23:01

Hoops: Aug 19, 2005; A Black Mark For Retarded Posting

We used to get five different newspapers on a Sunday and read them as a family, and the Mail on Sunday had the best magazine.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 23:03

TinTower: Apr 21, 2010; You don't have to 8e a good person to 8e a hero.

Well, the owner of the Ministry of Sound was he's a long-term Lib Dem donor.

Paging Phoon:

Gisela Stuart posted:

I will remember Jo Cox as an extraordinarily gutsy politician. Our paths first crossed when we attended meetings with Syrian opposition groups.

Many of us were focusing on the political and military practicalities of ending the war and what to do about Bashar al-Assad. But Jo always made sure we kept the needs of the Syrian people themselves at the front of our minds.

She had only just arrived in Parliament, but she was prepared to advocate strong action to protect those under attack even if that meant defying the official party line. Her views commanded respect because they were grounded so firmly in her experience as a humanitarian worker.

There was another side to Jo which does not often go with that kind of single-mindedness--a genuine openness to the views of others.

When the referendum was called and, unlike on Syria, we found ourselves on opposite sides, she wanted to know why this was so. She engaged, thought about my arguments and made up her own mind. That�s the sign of a strong person.

For such a promising politician, a loving mother and wife, to be killed the way she was is hideous.

She died doing her job as a democratically elected politician. Her advice surgery was the place where those she represented came with their concerns. She listened, she advised and she gave people practical help to resolve their problems.

In my Birmingham constituency, I have held the best part of 1,000 surgeries. It is an exceptionally diverse part of the country and those sessions open me up to an extraordinarily varied range of people, cultures and views.

Of course, I don�t always agree with them. But democracy celebrates our differences and stops them turning into hatred.

My mother was a refugee, and I grew up with stories of the consequences of extremism and the need to fight it in all its forms.

But I am even more familiar with the results of tolerance, and for me personally that means the open-mindedness of this country. I am an immigrant who moved to Britain from Germany in 1974. Britain welcomed me and the Labour Party gave me the opportunity to be elected as a Member of Parliament and become a government minister.

Being an MP is a privilege. It is also a tough job, subject to the closest scrutiny and the fiercest criticism. At the same time, it is vital for the health of our democracy that MPs� doors remain open to their constituents.

Once the referendum is over we must look closely at the right level of protection for MPs. Sadly, Jo�s death is not the first act of violence. In 2000, Andrew Pennington, an MP�s assistant, was murdered at work. Ten years later, Stephen Timms, my Labour colleague, was stabbed and wounded at his constituency surgery.

I, and my staff, have on occasions felt threatened and sadly these occurrences are far too common, with MPs and their employees experiencing stalking, death threats and intimidation of them and their families.

My Conservative colleague at Vote Leave, Priti Patel, has been subjected to sexist and racist abuse.

This aggression is an extreme symptom of the rancid language that now infects so much political discussion. Is it really right that many people seem to think it ok to start a conversation with a politician they have never met before with a string of insults?

If we are to marginalise and eliminate extremism, we have to be scrupulous about how we treat each other. Politicians and voters must reflect on the hate-filled language that too often scars our debates and passes for discussion on social media. Short of this bile, we must take care before assuming that anger turned up to maximum volume should be the default way to hold a political discussion.

It is a difficult balance to strike and we must be wary of retreating to the blandness and consensus that serve only to blur the outlines of the issues we have to resolve.

For some time now voters have felt that there is little to choose between the parties. Since 1997, politicians have been tussling over the centre ground with often only nuances and shades to tell us apart. As someone put it to me. �there�s little change in the menu, they�re just arguing over who will be the cook�.

This referendum could not be more different.

We have a straight choice: do we leave or remain in the European Union?

For me, the underlying question is clear: Are the people able to choose the governments that make their laws and to throw them out when they fail?

I believe leaving the EU is the way to safeguard this precious right. At the same time, I respect those who take an opposing view on what is the best path to a democratic future.

I will not be the only person thinking of Jo Cox on referendum day. She paid with her life, working for her constituents. Whatever the result on Thursday, we will have had the privilege of exercising a hard-fought-for right. Democracy will always triumph.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 23:05

jabby: Oct 27, 2010

Maoist Pussy posted:

If your leaders are not putting Britain first, who are they putting first?

Themselves? Is that in any doubt?

# ? Jun 18, 2016 23:06

Puntification: Nov 4, 2009; Black Orthodontromancy
The most British Magic; Fun Shoe

Nitrousoxide posted:

We've never had more access to alternate sources for news than we do today.

It takes a couple of hundred pounds to setup a channel on YouTube with acceptable production values and no money to start a Twitter or tumbler blog. And just access to a smartphone to start a podcast.

People acting like tabloids are this unstoppable juggernaut that needs to be stopped with legislation is really puzzling. Especially given the downward trend of revenues for them and newspapers.

Even with their falling circulations tabloids still have a combined readership in the millions, I can't see an independent UK news youtube/twitter/tumlber/podcast reading those numbers.

Also journalism isn't cheap you're vastly underestimating the cost of decent well-researched news production.

Jesus that new thread title is a bit loving dark.

# ? Jun 18, 2016 23:14

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Jun 7, 2024 19:13

Kurtofan: Feb 16, 2011; hon hon hon

it's darkest before the dawn

# ? Jun 18, 2016 23:24

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKRIPMT June 2016: #Boxit

«‹›563 »