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foutre posted:Yeah, I ward more than 98% of players because I play Zyra support, and all the tank supports count as tanks that includes the top lane pool. With the new champ select, can't they just check directly what position you were? Yeah people swap roles in champ select occasionally, and you'll still get a few outliers like Lee Sin players naturally dropping more wards than most other junglers, but that's still better data than telling even great tops that their warding is merely mediocre because it's directly comparing them to supports.
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Jun 21, 2016 19:47
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RYang posted:With the new champ select, can't they just check directly what position you were? Yeah people swap roles in champ select occasionally, and you'll still get a few outliers like Lee Sin players naturally dropping more wards than most other junglers, but that's still better data than telling even great tops that their warding is merely mediocre because it's directly comparing them to supports. Yeah they can, but that site doesn't, it just ranks you by Champion Type which is just the thing in the client if you go to champions you own you can sort them by type.
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Jun 21, 2016 19:53
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Methanar posted:AS reds, arpen quints, armor yellows, scaling mr i think you mean 12 18 0 my friend
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Jun 21, 2016 20:56
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There's champ mastery in ARAM now but I've got no fukcing clue what the criteria are.
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Jun 21, 2016 21:02
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Pots are the S+ of wards probably
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Jun 21, 2016 21:34
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RYang posted:With the new champ select, can't they just check directly what position you were? Yeah people swap roles in champ select occasionally, and you'll still get a few outliers like Lee Sin players naturally dropping more wards than most other junglers, but that's still better data than telling even great tops that their warding is merely mediocre because it's directly comparing them to supports. Riot automatically guesses your lane and position based on your actual in game coordinates sampled periodically (along with a bunch of other stuff), the queued position is not saved in public match history
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Jun 21, 2016 22:40
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Methanar posted:AS reds, arpen quints, armor yellows, scaling mr Any particular reason for not doing MS quints? Don't think the 4.5% is worth it versus the arpen?
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Jun 21, 2016 23:46
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If you are going to do ArPen and AS I'm pretty sure mathematically you are better going ArPen Reds and AS Quints
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Jun 21, 2016 23:49
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Wisdom
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Jun 21, 2016 23:51
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I have an AD/Armor/Mr/Mspeed runepage and an Ad/Lifesteal/Mr runepage and I can't be hosed to spend IP on more or rearrange runes every match; enemy laner's just gonna have to deal with a slightly more annoying Veigar Poke. I won't change the lifesteal one because that's reserved for TT Graves and Xin play and I will not give that up 
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Jun 22, 2016 00:05
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Libertine posted:If you are going to do ArPen and AS I'm pretty sure mathematically you are better going ArPen Reds and AS Quints I mean I've got an old as hell runepage that uses a little bit of ArPen red and AS reds and the MS quints because of all characters, Hecarim seems like the champion that MS quints would benefit the most. e: Most winning-est runepage is arpen/armor/flat CDR/MS, and 0/18/12. Servaetes fucked around with this message at 00:12 on Jun 22, 2016 |
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Jun 22, 2016 00:10
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Sorry I was talking specifically about the combination he was running. I'd always run MS on Hecarim because it's Hecarim and he needs to horse at top speed at all times. But if you are running ArPen/AS you get more mileage out of the Pen on Reds Speed on Quints. A lot of pros ran that on Kindred I think.
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Jun 22, 2016 00:26
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Why would Deep Sea Nami have normal eyes BTW like, that's half the neat part of the deep seas, that everything is blind as poo poo and weird looking because of the lack of sunlight
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Jun 22, 2016 00:27
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Servaetes posted:I mean I've got an old as hell runepage that uses a little bit of ArPen red and AS reds and the MS quints because of all characters, Hecarim seems like the champion that MS quints would benefit the most. Hecarim slams into the diminishing returns limit for MS with just trinity and charge, let along things like the phage kill, move-fast mastery or ghost, further MS is just wasted. 4.5% MS is probably like 3 ad too, haven't done the math on it though. I was trying arp reds and quints but it made your clear way too risky so I substituted the reds for AS. I did a bit of math and found doing reds for AS to be the better bang for your buck than vice versa. CDR runes are unnecessary too, trinity is 20% now, warrior is 10%, blue is 10% (take every blue gently caress your team and constantly invade because you win). I really think the kicker for what breaks hecarim and starts the run away train of one shots is getting rift.
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Jun 22, 2016 00:36
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Methanar posted:Hecarim slams into the diminishing returns limit for MS with just trinity and charge, let along things like the phage kill, move-fast mastery or ghost, further MS is just wasted. 4.5% MS is probably like 3 ad too, haven't done the math on it though. How is the like 100 extra damage from Herald buff starting that kind of snowballing?
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Jun 22, 2016 01:28
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Mikujin posted:How is the like 100 extra damage from Herald buff starting that kind of snowballing? The damage scales on level between 15-270, and Hecarim does plenty of roaming which lets him get stacks up, on top of having a very all-in burst style that benefits from what is essentially a free Hextech Revolver. The 5% damage reduction is a nice added bonus, as well.
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Jun 22, 2016 01:36
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Libertine posted:Sorry I was talking specifically about the combination he was running. I'd always run MS on Hecarim because it's Hecarim and he needs to horse at top speed at all times. But if you are running ArPen/AS you get more mileage out of the Pen on Reds Speed on Quints. A lot of pros ran that on Kindred I think. This is correct. AS quints/Arpen reds gives you 1.8% less AS but 3.84 armor pen. Basically you are trading one extra AS red for 3 extra arpen reds. The additional MS only gives you 2.5 AD at level 1, though.
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Jun 22, 2016 02:29
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I think aspd is probably better than movespeed because you get to clear the jungle with more health early and that could completely swing some games
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Jun 22, 2016 04:54
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That profiler says I ward like garbage while my friends are at literally 100% warding, whereas I'm really high on the action score and they're passive as hell. That explains a lot about our trouble playing together.
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Jun 22, 2016 05:05
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Neurolimal posted:The damage scales on level between 15-270, and Hecarim does plenty of roaming which lets him get stacks up, on top of having a very all-in burst style that benefits from what is essentially a free Hextech Revolver. The 5% damage reduction is a nice added bonus, as well. It does 15 damage per level, builds up over time and not from moving around (that's Shiv/RFC), and the 5% damage reduction only applies while solo (no allies in ~650 range). Assuming you get it around level 8 it's only 100 extra damage, which doesn't seem like it would be the make-it-or-break-it point where Hecarim just suddenly starts ripping people 100 -> 0.
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Jun 22, 2016 06:24
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Yeah I actually checked beforehand to see if it worked like Shiv. My point was more that by roaming he has plenty of times where he's alone and generating stacks. On paper it's not a lot of damage (just like Revolver) but in practice it helps push your damage over the kill threshold quite a few times.
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Jun 22, 2016 06:31
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Mikujin posted:It does 15 damage per level, builds up over time and not from moving around (that's Shiv/RFC), and the 5% damage reduction only applies while solo (no allies in ~650 range). Assuming you get it around level 8 it's only 100 extra damage, which doesn't seem like it would be the make-it-or-break-it point where Hecarim just suddenly starts ripping people 100 -> 0. 100 damage is a fuckload what are you on about
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Jun 22, 2016 06:54
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what is irelia meant to do vs pantheon other than ping for assistance and be sad under her turret when no one comes
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Jun 22, 2016 08:38
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Luna Was Here posted:what is irelia meant to do vs pantheon other than ping for assistance and be sad under her turret when no one comes nobody in the history of league has ever had fun laning vs pantheon
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Jun 22, 2016 09:20
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Luna Was Here posted:what is irelia meant to do vs pantheon other than ping for assistance and be sad under her turret when no one comes i dont think irelia can fight him at all barring big mistakes until level 6 but after that if she's not too far behind she can crawl back and eventually is much stronger. have patience, farm, and maybe start dshield so it's a little harder to shove you out completely.
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Jun 22, 2016 13:16
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Lovechop posted:nobody in the history of league has ever had fun laning vs pantheon
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Jun 22, 2016 13:41
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Treat him like Yorick after he gets a tear: accept that you aren't gonna win any trades, focus on last hitting at low enough margins that he pushes the lane closer to your tower. Bring many potions.
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Jun 22, 2016 14:20
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Luna Was Here posted:what is irelia meant to do vs pantheon other than ping for assistance and be sad under her turret when no one comes If you're that far behind there isn't much you can do, but with parts of a triforce she can and will beat him in duels, especially post six because she's an auto attacker and he does really poorly against them. Just don't tilt out of your mind during early laning phase because he kills you, just farm up the best you can and try to fight him back when you feel like you can do it, especially post 6 because you get a pretty meaningful powerspike and he doesn't.
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Jun 22, 2016 15:25
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Endorph posted:gangplank fucks him because he can basically auto him without actually autoing him and you can just orange his all-in i don't believe you
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Jun 22, 2016 15:51
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Pantheon is easy to manage once you've progressed past the "gotta get dat early kill" mentality, and understand how Pantheon operates. He wants to hardcore bully you for fast early kills, then at 6 nope out of lane to tilt the rest of your team. So long as you don't try to contest him he won't have as much of an advantage when it comes time to mandrop, and you'll be healthy enough to punish him after you get your ultimate. He's a lot like Darius where the skill check is "how patient are you in letting him push the lane and get ganked", except in this case it's just "how competent are you at just CSing and not trying to kill him pre-6". If you need further incentive not to duel him, remember that he can outright block an attack including onhit effects, and refreshes it with his stun.
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Jun 22, 2016 16:05
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That assumes Pantheon is a robot and will automatically jump @ 6 to another lane versus dropping dead on top of the loving dolt toplane shoving the lane because they don't see him on the map. I've gotten many a kill on a stupid rear end in a top hat toplaner that thinks that just because I backed at six I plan on jumping somewhere else rather than the guy that has two waves on my tower and is next to it autoing it. You can definitely duel him pre six, you're wrong here. Depends on how much you've let yourself eat spears @ 1 and 3 and if he's gassed himself throwing too many. Luna, as Irelia early on if you can keep yourself up around like 75% and he's busted his stun already, you can land a stun on him and wail on him and he won't really respond too well to it. Gangplank can land barrel combos on him pre six and outsustain. And if he's taken Ignite (which I and most folks on champion.gg) take you can minimize the damage he's gotten from his kill by coming right back after him. Irelia used to be the most loving annoying lane matchup in the game because she took flask+3 pots and I could never get her low enough to all in to get the snowball started and eventually she got a phage/sheen and could outduel and kill me. I can't stress it enough how badly auto-attackers beat the poo poo out of him. Smart ones can duel him pre six and crush him post six. Supertanks too--Sion/Malphite quickly becomes way too difficult for him to burst. If he can't do it @ 1-3 he's in deep poo poo and will lose the lane very, very, very badly. Servaetes fucked around with this message at 16:58 on Jun 22, 2016 |
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Jun 22, 2016 16:54
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Pantheon is a cheeser pick! Cheeser dog! I will teach you respect!
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Jun 22, 2016 17:04
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Settle down, Beavis.
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Jun 22, 2016 17:06
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I mean sure, you could just stay top and fake him out if he isn't using his free wards and whatnots. I just prefer shutting down Mid and Bot, since those two are more likely to carry a game (and Dragon is a pretty big deal now).
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Jun 22, 2016 17:37
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I've mostly been playing ADC lately and was just looking through champion.gg to see if my item builds are still ok. I was kind of surprised not to qss/mercurial in almost any of the most common/highest win builds. I tend to build it 3rd or 4th item almost every game because there's always some horrible cc ability I want to be able to get out of. Am I putting too much value into the active?
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Jun 22, 2016 21:29
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Freaksaus posted:I've mostly been playing ADC lately and was just looking through champion.gg to see if my item builds are still ok. I was kind of surprised not to qss/mercurial in almost any of the most common/highest win builds. I tend to build it 3rd or 4th item almost every game because there's always some horrible cc ability I want to be able to get out of. Am I putting too much value into the active? No you are right. It's probably the strongest defensive/life steal item in an ADC build in my opinion. It's definitely something worthwhile to have by 3rd or 4th item depending on threat. If there's any game-ending hard CC (there should be at least one on the enemy team unless they are dumb) you want to have it. I think it's very under-built relative to it's value in solo queue. You see it a ton with a lot more priority in professional play. You shouldn't doubt your own thoughts on that matter in this one.
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Jun 22, 2016 21:48
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It's also absolutely critical in One for all vs Morgana/Lux (and others). I had a team MF vs Morg and I was the only one who built one, and I have to say I died a lot less than everyone else.
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Jun 22, 2016 22:48
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Is safe farm > murderbrawl 7-9 the general recipe for anything that Irelia can't bully pre-6? And what matchups does that not do well in? Supertanks?
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Jun 22, 2016 22:52
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Irelia is a mid-game champion and has bad matchups vs. lane bullies like Renekton/Darius/Pantheon and against stuff like Jax who has a similar power spike but scales better
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Jun 22, 2016 23:01
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Freaksaus posted:I've mostly been playing ADC lately and was just looking through champion.gg to see if my item builds are still ok. I was kind of surprised not to qss/mercurial in almost any of the most common/highest win builds. I tend to build it 3rd or 4th item almost every game because there's always some horrible cc ability I want to be able to get out of. Am I putting too much value into the active? It doesn't do damage so adcs don't buy it. You're correct.
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Jun 22, 2016 23:08
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