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LonsomeSon posted:I mean, making this point does imply that one believes buttcoins or laffchains might have an increase in utility over current worldwide financial systems similar to the difference between mass scale horse-drawn and internal-combustion-powered transportation. Blockchains are just a lovely implementation of distributed database. They do have their place. Butts are a tech demo with some limitations, and there are interesting cases where you use a different balance of trust and distribution. This inkling of interesting potential is largely silenced by the stupidity of true believers and consultants name-dropping blockchain as a buzzword to write huge bills for circlejerking around Powerpoint presentations.
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Jun 21, 2016 18:34
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univbee posted:In Canada they're still the norm for rent and many private medical practices (e.g. dentists, therapists). Probably because, like the US, they are the only non-cash method of transferring money which doesn't incur a fee.
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Jun 21, 2016 19:58
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klafbang posted:Hey guys, why would anybody ever switch to stupid exploding "automobiles?" Horse carriages work much better and nobody has had to walk for decades! Transport is a solved "problem." This analogy might work if you didn't actually use a functional upgrade in it. Instead of "automobiles" go with a gigantic rube goldberg machine that weighs 400 pounds and the end result is it dangles a carrot in front of the horse, or stabs the horse in the eye with the carrot (guess which one it does more often)
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Jun 21, 2016 20:13
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Smdh I just wanna buy drugs online but with bitcoin going all crazy I'd have to buy at a loss
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Jun 21, 2016 20:30
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Fat Shat Sings posted:This analogy might work if you didn't actually use a functional upgrade in it. Glad you agree my analogy is brilliant 
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Jun 21, 2016 20:31
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There's an offshoot called Etherium that allowed "smart contracts" to be processed with their fake money, ie little programs that could be executed by the system to do more complex things in some fashion. It's all moot cause the main thing they had dumped their money into got robbed by someone who noticed a recursive function within that contract looped in a way that it would keep pulling money out into his account as fast as the network would process it and there's no way to fix this outside of forking their chain like it never happened.
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Jun 21, 2016 20:40
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I think we can all agree that a tamper-proof distributed ledger shared only among a select few trusted actors is a pretty good way for those parties to maintain a shared set of records, yes? See, all you have to do to make the blockchain usable is strip it of everything that makes it the blockchain and use it for a completely different purpose than intended. BITCOIN TO THE MOON WHEEEEEEEEEEE
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Jun 21, 2016 23:54
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waitwhatno posted:1.) I have never seen a single check in my entire life, nobody in the developed world uses that poo poo anymore. My freaking parents haven't seen a check in their lifetime. It's a solved "problem". bullshit your parents have never seen a check
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Jun 22, 2016 00:30
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mrwuss posted:bullshit your parents have never seen a check Hey, maybe his parents are unbanked migrant workers or convicted felons who work for cash under the table.
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Jun 22, 2016 00:40
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an AOL chatroom posted:I heard about what Imogen Heap was doing, but didn't know it had become a *thing*. She's sold about $100 worth of download codes for "Tiny Human". Nobody ever mentions the actual sales figure (though it's even in Wikipedia). But OH MY GOODNESS the CONFERENCE TALKS. If I hated myself more I'd track down recordings of the conferences and track the inane blather. The sooner the record industry is stabbed in the loving face the better. [I've thought this since about 1982.] CapnAndy posted:I think we can all agree that a tamper-proof distributed ledger shared only among a select few trusted actors is a pretty good way for those parties to maintain a shared set of records, yes? You literally get this just putting the transactions into a Git repository. I think the few of these semimythical finance "blockchains" that exist are Git underneath.
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Jun 22, 2016 01:15
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Roylicious posted:Alright found the link, looks like they did a typo and didn't get $1b but they did get $81m. Solved problem indeed. you're a moron what was exploited was someone got inside the bank and then used the bank's systems to authorize the bank to use SWIFT to send themselves money you know what happens with ~the blockchain~ replacing SWIFT? the exact same thing, except probably worse since there's no human going "hmm seems wrong" when they ask for 1b
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Jun 22, 2016 01:19
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evilweasel posted:you're a moron Though the funny part of this story is that no one did the last bit in this story either. What got it caught was the thieves misspelled one of the banks' names and someone from the other bank called them to let them know.
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Jun 22, 2016 01:34
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A Man With A Plan posted:Though the funny part of this story is that no one did the last bit in this story either. What got it caught was the thieves misspelled one of the banks' names and someone from the other bank called them to let them know. With superior blockchain technology, the same mistake could lead to the money being irreversibly sent to an unrecoverable black hole!
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Jun 22, 2016 02:01
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The funniest part of this recent conversation is the whole bit about banks. Banks don't spend money on anything that they aren't forced to, and that includes technology. If you've worked for a bank (I have), this is straight out obvious. They spend when they're forced to spend, and you better have a bigger gun and an itchier trigger finger than they do to make them do it. Any talk about banks and blockchains is an attempt to pull in some outside money to fund it. They're not going to spend their own profit on fiddling around with that poo poo. Why do you think they still use the ACH? Because it works, it's cheap, and they have the infrastructure to attach to it. Ta-loving-Dah. That money has been spent and won't get spent again until they are forced to by a) competition, or b) something costs more to keep running than it costs to buy new stuff to run their old code.
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Jun 22, 2016 03:13
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Hey guys, I downloaded Dropbox and now have it on my phone, work PC and home PC. I'm using the blockchain!
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Jun 22, 2016 05:13
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an AOL chatroom posted:Right now, in the US at least, a lot of the established banks and financial institutions are afraid of being disrupted by emerging disruptors in the fin-tech world. Stuff like Venmo, Facebook/Google payments, and just about anything that takes a piece of the action away from them is seen as a huge threat. quote:So a lot of them are "experimenting" with blockchain right now, though I haven't seen anyone really *do* much of anything with it. It's mostly a "let's throw some resources at this for a couple of quarters so we can at least say we tried" type of exercise. It's a relatively low-cost way to grab some headlines and pump up some powerpoint slides, but those proposing that blockchain has a place in supporting the daily workings of a bank has no idea the transactional throughput of a bank nor the inability of a blockchain to handle anything even remotely approaching that scale. The real travesty here is that there doesn't seem to be a blockchain equivalent to cloud-to-butt.
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Jun 22, 2016 07:37
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The_Franz posted:Probably because, like the US, they are the only non-cash method of transferring money which doesn't incur a fee. It does, though, since getting cheques isn't free, although you can get it down to like 40ish cents a cheque in Canada which is lower than anything else.
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Jun 22, 2016 17:36
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A lot of checking accounts come with free checks. I just had to order more checks because it's still the cheapest way for me to pay for my water bill. Because they charge like $3 to make an online payment using a credit or debit card, it costs gas and time to go drive there in person, they have a fee to pay over the phone, but when I pay by check it just costs me a stamp. gently caress you, Contra Costa Water District, gently caress you. More seriously though, checks still exist in the US because of the Baby Boomers. Old people have most of the money in this country and they still want to write checks the old fashioned way. Countries without a disprpoportionately large elderly population whose conception of the ideal world is still firmly anchored in the 1950s don't have that problem.
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Jun 22, 2016 17:42
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they exist because of boomers and because of fees you're lucky your water bill has only a $3 fee to pay online last place i lived charged $7.50 for an online payment
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Jun 22, 2016 18:05
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You also need checks to get your routing and account number off of so that you can do direct deposit and automatic payment like a real person. I have Superman on mine
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Jun 22, 2016 18:11
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CapnAndy posted:You also need checks to get your routing and account number off of so that you can do direct deposit and automatic payment like a real person. I just log into my bank account and it has my account and routing numbers right there.
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Jun 22, 2016 18:27
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Tuxedo Gin posted:they exist because of boomers and because of fees I don't understand why businesses do this - charge a fee for an electronic transaction that costs less, is immediately verifiable (no insufficient funds returns), doesn't require imaging/storing paper, and likely has a lot of other manual processes associated with it. My mortgage company does this.
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Jun 22, 2016 18:27
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I can kind of understand some Americans being enticed by Bitcoin because the banking system does suck so badly here. Waitwhatno is probably only exaggerating in the bit about his parents never using a check, but back home I touched a single personal check in the last 15 years but dealt with about 5 here in 3 months. In the UK if you want to send money to someone you can just do it for free on you phones banking app, do it via text message, or send them to an ATM with a one off code and it'll spit out cash to them in emergencies. The UK is dumb for having £1 coins and the existence of 2p pieces, but the lack of a million tiny banks that can't communicate to eachother was a real good idea.
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Jun 22, 2016 18:29
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Because grandma doesn't know about any of that. She sees the computer box can just send her money and that sounds like magic so of course you have to pay a fee to do it, there's all sorts of technology behind the scenes that costs a lot to run.
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Jun 22, 2016 18:30
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EL BROMANCE posted:I can kind of understand some Americans being enticed by Bitcoin because the banking system does suck so badly here. Waitwhatno is probably only exaggerating in the bit about his parents never using a check, but back home I touched a single personal check in the last 15 years but dealt with about 5 here in 3 months. In the UK if you want to send money to someone you can just do it for free on you phones banking app, do it via text message, or send them to an ATM with a one off code and it'll spit out cash to them in emergencies. Yeah our system is a massive piece of poo poo of that there is no doubt. I have no idea why we're so behind the curve adopting certain things from Europe. You guys had smartphones with touchscreens back when the Motorola Razr was the top of the line over here, ditto the SIM cards.
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Jun 22, 2016 18:31
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I mailed a check to my landlord every month for nearly 13 years. Last week she told me she finally accepts direct deposit, so I can send it from my bank account to hers starting next month. I have no idea what I'm going to do with all these stamps I have left.
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Jun 22, 2016 18:31
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evilweasel posted:you're a moron And my point here was that the wire transfer system is not perfect and thus banks are always seeking to improve, not that BTC is our savior. Thus the argument of 'look even banks are looking into blockchain!' is dumb. So we agree. And you're wrong anyway, the most recent method is to simply spoof SWIFT messages and send them to banks hoping they won't double check and approve the wire transfer. Yes, this requires malware infection on the bank systems but no that doesn't mean they need to physically be in there doing the theft. Roylicious fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Jun 22, 2016 |
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Jun 22, 2016 18:38
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CapnAndy posted:You also need checks to get your routing and account number off of so that you can do direct deposit and automatic payment like a real person. Which is a massive security hole! Hooray! http://fusion.net/story/309392/stop-using-paper-checks/
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Jun 22, 2016 19:11
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You can just google the bank routing number and get the account number from your account online though? Don't need a paper check. But yeah that is a huge security hole. All you need is those 2 numbers to sign up for all kinds of stuff. My brother found a check (he says found I say he prolly stole it but anyway) and it was blank but he used the numbers to sign up for free trials on premium porn sites back in the day when porn was not as freely available.
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Jun 22, 2016 19:13
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I've seriously never been able to find my routing/account numbers online, so I just have paper checks that never leave my room that I can look at. Superman is on them to make me happy. And yeah the whole system's massively insecure, wheeeeee
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Jun 22, 2016 19:24
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The account number should be on your statement if nothing else, and the routing is regional so you gotta look for like 'Wells Fargo Los Angeles routing number' on google and it should just pop up. Google says Wells Fargo's routing for CA is 121042882 for example. The system is insecure but banks are really good about catching fraud and getting your money back at least. Like yeah someone might try to jack you but 99% of the time you won't be liable for anything. Roylicious fucked around with this message at 19:28 on Jun 22, 2016 |
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Jun 22, 2016 19:26
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Roylicious posted:The system is insecure but banks are really good about catching fraud and getting your money back at least. Like yeah someone might try to jack you but 99% of the time you won't be liable for anything.
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Jun 22, 2016 20:10
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CapnAndy posted:Yeah, they're amazingly on top of things. I can go on vacation and start dropping serious money in a city I'm never in and it all goes through, but somebody got my credit card number and tried to buy themselves lunch and that poo poo got detected, shut down, and I had a new card by overnight mail. my experience has been the opposite if i step foot outside my county they shut all my poo poo down immediately. some dude in the midwest goes on a spree, poo poo goes through.
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Jun 22, 2016 20:13
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I tried to pay to get a new battery installed in my car and USAA was all "Uh, no, gently caress off." Then several minutes later, after I had paid with a different card, they finally texted me and asked if it was authorized. Then someone buys a plane ticket from some shady website in Las Vegas and that goes through just fine.
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Jun 22, 2016 20:34
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what does any of this bullshit have to do with laughing at bitcoiners' misfortunes?
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Jun 22, 2016 21:00
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Checks are bad therefore blockchain.
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Jun 22, 2016 21:09
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temple posted:Checks are bad therefore blockchain. Try jumping.
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Jun 22, 2016 21:21
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Prettz posted:what does any of this bullshit have to do with laughing at bitcoiners' misfortunes? American banking system is so hilariously outdated that even bitcoin seems like an improvement to some people.
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Jun 22, 2016 21:27
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Seriously, having to pay fees for paying your bills and still routinely using checks and not having instantaneous (and free) account-to-account transfers across banks, holy hell are you living in the 1970s or something because my dear mom used to work in a bank for 30 years and even she just won't believe a Western country could function properly with poo poo like that going on still, 40 years later. Get your poo poo together america
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Jun 22, 2016 22:18
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Naxuz posted:Seriously, having to pay fees for paying your bills and still routinely using checks and not having instantaneous (and free) account-to-account transfers across banks, holy hell are you living in the 1970s or something because my dear mom used to work in a bank for 30 years and even she just won't believe a Western country could function properly with poo poo like that going on still, 40 years later. Get your poo poo together america 
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Jun 22, 2016 22:21
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