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Thisuck posted:Winter orb will be a great main board card with this Thalia. The problem with Winter Orb is that it doesn't beat in for damage. Hatebears strategies work by putting your opponent in a bind. They use tax effects and other forms of disruption to prevent the opponent from enacting their gameplan while simultaneously beating down with creatures. In order to reach the critical mass of both disruption and pressure, the disruption has to come attached to a beater of some type. If winter orb was also a 2/2 for 2 mana than it might see play. Hokori, Dust Drinker is 2 mana off from possibly being a playable card.
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Jun 23, 2016 20:59
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Irony Be My Shield posted:We have not seen a single black or red card from this set. We have the legendary werewolf. He's red. Calling it now, red sucks black sucks.
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Jun 23, 2016 21:04
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wow this is just a real bad emote
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Jun 23, 2016 21:12
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Irony Be My Shield posted:We have not seen a single black or red card from this set. Judgm'rakul
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Jun 23, 2016 21:20
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Captain Capitalism posted:We have the legendary werewolf. He's red. The whole set is bad and unplayable Let's just skip right into Kaladesh Thop Till Ya' Drop!
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Jun 23, 2016 21:35
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Irony Be My Shield posted:We have not seen a single black or red card from this set. Current magic design paradigm is that Green and White are the best colors, because they want the game to revolve around creature combat. Green and White aren't going to stop having the best creatures anytime soon. Black might get some decent cards, because Leliana might be good. But black isn't allowed to have creatures that are good cause color pie, and odds seem poor that they are going to give black a card advantage engine as good as Duskwatcher Recruiter or Tireless Tracker. Odds are also poor that Black will get better removal than what White has access too. Hell I doubt Blue will get a better card selection tool than Oath of Nissa either. I fully expect the current archetypes to get further solidified upon release of Eldritch Moon. Black White control might be competitive maybe. I just don't see a deck being viable in standard that doesnt play white or green for awhile.
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Jun 23, 2016 21:43
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People were lamenting the death of green not so long ago because omg no more Elvish Mystic. It's almost like this current favorable metagame for GW does not actually reflect current design principles in any way.
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Jun 23, 2016 21:56
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Irony Be My Shield posted:People were lamenting the death of green not so long ago because omg no more Elvish Mystic. It's almost like this current favorable metagame for GW does not actually reflect current design principles in any way. I don't know anybody saying Green would be dead cause of Elvish Mystic going away. It seemed more of a lament that a staple of magic was going away forever (as long as the current head designers are around). I mean we exist in a world where Shock is too powerful for standard.
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Jun 23, 2016 22:01
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anglachel posted:I don't know anybody saying Green would be dead cause of Elvish Mystic going away. It seemed more of a lament that a staple of magic was going away forever (as long as the current head designers are around). I mean we exist in a world where Shock is too powerful for standard. Did they actually say Shock was too powerful
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Jun 23, 2016 22:03
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Skyl3lazer posted:wow this is just a real bad emote 
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Jun 23, 2016 22:03
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Mono black and abzan, which was usually more GBw, were pretty recent decks that were kinda okay too.
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Jun 23, 2016 22:07
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White was also bad outside of a few pushed mythics before like OGW?
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Jun 23, 2016 22:22
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Irony Be My Shield posted:White was also bad outside of a few pushed mythics before like OGW? WINGMATE ROC N ROLL
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Jun 23, 2016 22:31
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They did screw the pooch a bit with current standard, though.
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Jun 23, 2016 22:37
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Captain Capitalism posted:We have the legendary werewolf. He's red. WotC will never let control be good in standard Long live GW
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Jun 23, 2016 22:52
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Irony Be My Shield posted:White was also bad outside of a few pushed mythics before like OGW? Heroic was far more playable than decks these days that don't have green or white. It was dirt cheap too.
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Jun 23, 2016 23:20
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Irony Be My Shield posted:White was also bad outside of a few pushed mythics before like OGW? 
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Jun 23, 2016 23:24
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also I'm pretty sure red has lived in the mediocre to dogshit range since theros block and its cheap playable burn spells that can hit players rotated out, but that's only a period of a year or so and every color had had longer periods than that of being bad, it's just a thing that happens
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Jun 23, 2016 23:32
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People love to conflate red not having good burn now to red will never again have good burn. We are coming off a long run of red being really solid with lots of powerful face and creature hitting burn.
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Jun 23, 2016 23:40
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TheKingofSprings posted:Did they actually say Shock was too powerful no they said having shock in every core/base set limits what they can print in terms of R burn spells
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Jun 23, 2016 23:46
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Yeah it was more about removing boring evergreen staples.
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Jun 23, 2016 23:49
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https://twitter.com/wizards_magic/status/746086432402464769
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Jun 23, 2016 23:53
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I'm pretty sure I know the person behind that and the Tumblr Loss and I absolutely need to buy them a beer
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Jun 24, 2016 00:19
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Alaan posted:People love to conflate red not having good burn now to red will never again have good burn. We are coming off a long run of red being really solid with lots of powerful face and creature hitting burn. When it was KtK/BfZ, there were the Atarka Red decks that had Atarka's Command, Hordeling Outburst, Dragon Fodder, and Wild Slash. We even had options like Exquisite Firecraft in the format (still do!), which is a pretty chunky burn spell that can go to the dome. At the beginning of the DtK/BfZ/SoI standard format, we had the top-end for burn being tested again with Fall of the Titans and Fiery Temper being used in Pyromancer's Goggles decks. not having a one or two cmc burn spell at 2/3 that goes face does not make the burn in the format weak, what the gently caress is this noise. poo poo, I'm not even sure Lightning Strike or Wild Slash would interact in a meaningful way with current standard G/W powerhouse. Is this just a perennial complaint about "my old mono-r aggro deck I put together for a song and a smile is no longer legal, abloo bloo bloo?"
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Jun 24, 2016 00:35
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Sestze posted:I don't understand, really, back when it was Theros and KTK, we had that Jeskai deck that was entirely based around Mantis Rider, Stoke the Flames, Lightning Strike, and Jeskai Charm. Red, or at least decks with strong burn spells, were super prevalent. I am 100% sure lightening strike would be a meaningful card that would see play.
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Jun 24, 2016 00:38
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Sestze posted:I don't understand, really, back when it was Theros and KTK, we had that Jeskai deck that was entirely based around Mantis Rider, Stoke the Flames, Lightning Strike, and Jeskai Charm. Red, or at least decks with strong burn spells, were super prevalent. Look man some of us just want to dome you for 3.
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Jun 24, 2016 00:42
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Some men just want to watch the world play burn.
black potus fucked around with this message at 01:03 on Jun 24, 2016 |
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Jun 24, 2016 00:55
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Reminder that the Origins superstandard RDW deck had Shock, Searing Blood, Lightning Strike, Exquisite Firecraft and Stoke the Flames along with two modern playable burn creatures. I'm pretty sure it actually had a favorable matchup against modern burn (mostly due to them doming themselves for loads with their mana, but still).
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Jun 24, 2016 01:04
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Sestze posted:When it was KtK/BfZ, there were the Atarka Red decks that had Atarka's Command, Hordeling Outburst, Dragon Fodder, and Wild Slash. We even had options like Exquisite Firecraft in the format (still do!), which is a pretty chunky burn spell that can go to the dome. Atarka Red slowly faded out as the format moved forward and the decks evolved and got better and those ramp decks faded pretty rapidly after the pro tour. Burn has historically been red's defining mechanic due to its efficiency and versatility and I feel like wotc hasn't yet figured out exactly what they want to do with red when those spells are weaker.
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Jun 24, 2016 01:07
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Is it even up for debate that colors in standard are imbalanced atm?
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Jun 24, 2016 01:15
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Tim Raines IRL posted:WINGMATE ROC N ROLL One time I played a Wingmate Roc after a long time of not playing it, and announced it by saying "FINAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALY THE ROC HAS COME BACK.....TO STANDARD!" My opponent was not amused.
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Jun 24, 2016 01:16
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I kind of like the wax and wane of each color's power in Standard. It makes for an interesting dynamic with every set release. I don't know why people get so attached to one color being "weak", just play whatever's good.
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Jun 24, 2016 01:22
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BJPaskoff posted:I kind of like the wax and wane of each color's power in Standard. It makes for an interesting dynamic with every set release. I don't know why people get so attached to one color being "weak", just play whatever's good. Uh, Black has been consistantly strong for the past 4 years. Probably longer actually.
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Jun 24, 2016 01:35
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The reason why Red doesn't have Lightning Strike is actually really obvious: both design and development are consciously experimenting with designing colors without certain crutches that every color is assumed to have. There's no Elvish Mystic, white doesn't have a 4-mana wrath, blue's card draw is significantly less powerful, red doesn't have relatively cheap direct damage. All of these things occurring around the same time isn't a random coincidence.
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Jun 24, 2016 02:18
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Count Bleck posted:Uh, Black has been consistantly strong for the past 4 years. Reminder that black was considered the weakest colour and people were begging for it to be good again in this very thread sometime around when AVR was in standard
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Jun 24, 2016 02:27
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Angry Grimace posted:The reason why Red doesn't have Lightning Strike is actually really obvious: both design and development are consciously experimenting with designing colors without certain crutches that every color is assumed to have. There's no Elvish Mystic, white doesn't have a 4-mana wrath, blue's card draw is significantly less powerful, red doesn't have relatively cheap direct damage. All of these things occurring around the same time isn't a random coincidence. Yes. It is the hand of our lord Jesus Christ at work in Standard. godbless.
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Jun 24, 2016 02:28
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TheKingofSprings posted:Reminder that black was considered the weakest colour and people were begging for it to be good again in this very thread sometime around when AVR was in standard All I remember is people whining that they wanted mono-black control to be viable again, then it was and everyone whined about it. It's almost like people complain about everything in standard.
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Jun 24, 2016 02:33
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suicidesteve posted:All I remember is people whining that they wanted mono-black control to be viable again, then it was and everyone whined about it. Everyone saying every set, "THIS is the card that will bring monoblack back" and then monoblack not being back was always funny Truly, Theros ruins everything
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Jun 24, 2016 02:37
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suicidesteve posted:All I remember is people whining that they wanted mono-black control to be viable again, then it was and everyone whined about it. This is exactly why I ignore people's comments about new cards and bulk buy dumb poo poo like Goblin Rabblemaster when everyone keeps telling me it's a bulk rare and I shouldn't be wasting my nickels. That was a good release weekend.
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Jun 24, 2016 02:37
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Angry Grimace posted:The reason why Red doesn't have Lightning Strike is actually really obvious: both design and development are consciously experimenting with designing colors without certain crutches that every color is assumed to have. There's no Elvish Mystic, white doesn't have a 4-mana wrath, blue's card draw is significantly less powerful, red doesn't have relatively cheap direct damage. All of these things occurring around the same time isn't a random coincidence. I'll buy that, but blue's card draw is less powerful compared to what? As a long time player, it seems like between RTR and now been extremely powerful blue card draw.
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Jun 24, 2016 02:41
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