Auspol June/Election - hang parliament - The Something Awful Forums

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Solemn Sloth: Jul 11, 2015; Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 10:24

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# ? Jun 4, 2024 13:39

Brown Paper Bag: Nov 3, 2012

What is NXT's deal anyway? Basically the Australian Democrats?

# ? Jul 8, 2016 10:37

Cleretic: Feb 3, 2010; Ignore my posts!
I'm aggressively wrong about everything!

Brown Paper Bag posted:

What is NXT's deal anyway?

To South Australia what Katter is to rural Queensland.

I've got no loving clue what they're doing outside of there.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 10:41

Cthulhu Dreams: Dec 11, 2010; If I pretend to be Cthulhu no one will know I'm a baseball robot.

Cleretic posted:

To South Australia what Katter is to rural Queensland.

I've got no loving clue what they're doing outside of there.

The fact that they are all refugees from the young libs should tell you what you need to know

Pork for SA plus vaguely left social policy plus rightish economic policy

# ? Jul 8, 2016 10:46

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

I don't think NXT can be frightened off by the gaming lobby like the ALP, there's going to be a lot of pain for everyone unless they get a good deal early. Xen has been waiting a long time to get his hands on some real power and he's been very patient about it.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 10:54

Solemn Sloth: Jul 11, 2015; Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Cthulhu Dreams posted:

The fact that they are all refugees from the young libs should tell you what you need to know

Pork for SA plus vaguely left social policy plus rightish economic policy

yeah, so the australian democrats

# ? Jul 8, 2016 10:58

Robodog: Oct 22, 2004; ...how does that work?

If NXT manage to limit pokies even a little bit then this parliament might be worth something in the end.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 11:05

Vladimir Poutine: Aug 13, 2012

Yeah, remember that the Democrats had their strongest support in metro Adelaide. A lot of NXT voters probably are former Democrats voters. The main gamer-changer here is that he's trying to expand beyond the senate.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 11:07

I would blow Dane Cook: Dec 26, 2008

Nick Xenophon wants a license to punt? Un-australian.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 11:10

SMILLENNIALSMILLEN: Jun 26, 2009

SynthOrange posted:

FORMER One Nation leader Pauline Hanson, the outspoken proponent of polarising immigration policies, has discovered she is of Middle Eastern heritage.
Ms Hanson said she was "amazed" and "mystified" to learn of her ancestry.
A recent DNA swab, taken with Ms Hanson's permission by The Sunday Mail, has revealed the controversial former MP's genetic makeup is drawn from a rich multicultural background, with 9 per cent originating in the Middle East, 32 per cent from Italy, Greece or Turkey and 59 per cent from northern Europe.

When told of the results, the former fish and chip shop owner appeared flustered, making references to "rape and pillage" in ancient times, adding: "All I can think of is that probably down the track it eventuated from some war.

http://www.news.com.au/national/dna-test-shows-hansons-middle-eastern-heritage/story-e6frfkp9-1111112976024

How have I never heard this before :lol:

GrandMaster posted:

The continuing shitshow is going to be fantastic. I saw Katter on TV the other day, laughing HARD talking about how lib party members better hope nobody they know dies in a sitting week because they won't be able to attend the funeral now that pairs are going to be a thing of the past.

I saw that too. Hes really enjoying himself

# ? Jul 8, 2016 11:39

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

WhiskeyWhiskers posted:

Katter said he'd bash in Turnbull's face if he went against the unions. And given going against the unions was the entire point of the DD, you might get your wish.

The other crossbenchers probably wouldn't go along with it though.

Yeah do we have a quote on that, that's the second time someone in this thread has said it without a quote.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 11:46

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

open24hours posted:

Considering Tasmania gets 12 senators I think that line is still valid.

code:

State	Population	Senators	Population per senator
NSW	6,917,656	12		576,471
Vic	5,354,040	12		446,170
Qld	4,332,738	12		361,062
SA	1,596,569	12		133,047
WA	2,239,172	12		186,598
Tas	495,351		12		41,279
NT	211,944		2		105,972
ACT	357,219		2		178,610
Total	21,504,689	76		282,956

Outrageous.

Tasmania should just be absorbed by Victoria already.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 11:52

You Am I: May 20, 2001; Me @ your poasting

Beetphyxious posted:

Tasmania should just be absorbed by Victoria already.

God gently caress no, it'll be worse than the two Koreas reuniting

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:05

Solemn Sloth: Jul 11, 2015; Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Beetphyxious posted:

Tasmania should just be absorbed by Victoria already.

I knew you were a liberal voter but this is wild

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:10

freebooter: Jul 7, 2009

Robodog posted:

If NXT manage to limit pokies even a little bit then this parliament might be worth something in the end.

There is not a single party or independent in the lower house who is overall worse than the Liberals. So a hung parliament, regardless of who they have to negotiate with, is already a better result than the last three years.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:11

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

You Am I posted:

God gently caress no, it'll be worse than the two Koreas reuniting

Victoria needs more ground troops if we're going to drag the rest of the nation along with us on the road to progress!

Victorian troops landing at Coolangatta as part of Operation Andrews

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:15

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

Solemn Sloth posted:

I knew you were a liberal voter but this is wild

Think of the apples, the cider!

MONA is totally Melbourne, admit it.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:16

Snod.: Oct 3, 2014

Beetphyxious posted:

Yeah do we have a quote on that, that's the second time someone in this thread has said it without a quote.

http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2016/07/07/turnbull-katter-government/

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-07/election-2016-bob-katter-to-support-turnbull-in-hung-parliament/7577738

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...707-gq0ln0.html

quote:

"If there is the slightest hint of union bashing, I can assure you all bets are off," Mr Katter said.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:19

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

Snod. posted:

http://thenewdaily.com.au/news/2016/07/07/turnbull-katter-government/

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-07/election-2016-bob-katter-to-support-turnbull-in-hung-parliament/7577738

http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...707-gq0ln0.html

Cheers porn pony.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:25

Snod.: Oct 3, 2014

Beetphyxious posted:

Cheers porn pony.

I await the embrace of death

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:26

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

Snod. posted:

I await the embrace of death

*whispers*

Sooooon

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:27

Solemn Sloth: Jul 11, 2015; Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Beetphyxious posted:

Think of the apples, the cider!

MONA is totally Melbourne, admit it.

It gives states like Queensland, New South Wales and WA more relative power in the senate

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:28

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

Solemn Sloth posted:

It gives states like Queensland, New South Wales and WA more relative power in the senate

Nah we keep the senators too

or make it not matter anymore, like I said earlier

Beetphyxious posted:

Victoria needs more ground troops if we're going to drag the rest of the nation along with us on the road to progress!

Victorian troops landing at Coolangatta as part of Operation Andrews

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:30

Solemn Sloth: Jul 11, 2015; Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Beetphyxious posted:

Nah we keep the senators too

or make it not matter anymore, like I said earlier

Oh if we get double the senators then gently caress yeah, we can elect derryn hinch and John Madigan at the same time!

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:34

Beaucoup Haram: Jun 18, 2005

Does anyone have any experience with unfair dismissal following a non legitimate redundancy with the FWO ?

I was just made redundant by a large technology services multinational so they could move a cheaper person into my spot and my 3 young kids would be quite keen on a new speedboat/dinosaur/whatever the 3 year olds are in love with this week.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:35

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

StealthBus posted:

Does anyone have any experience with unfair dismissal following a non legitimate redundancy with the FWO ?

I was just made redundant by a large technology services multinational so they could move a cheaper person into my spot and my 3 young kids would be quite keen on a new speedboat/dinosaur/whatever the 3 year olds are in love with this week.

Union? Union.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:37

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

Solemn Sloth posted:

Oh if we get double the senators then gently caress yeah, we can elect derryn hinch and John Madigan at the same time!

John madigan was preference fuckery and you know it. Derryn.. eh..

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:38

Solemn Sloth: Jul 11, 2015; Baby you can shout at me,
But you can't need my eyes.

Beetphyxious posted:

John madigan was preference fuckery and you know it. Derryn.. eh..

idk, personally I feel there is a consistent lunatic voting block in the state, and they rotate through their chosen rep.

Madigan, Fielding, Muir, Hinch

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:40

Beaucoup Haram: Jun 18, 2005

Beetphyxious posted:

Union? Union.

No union. I'm in I.T, there isn't one and I resigned from the ASU a year ago because in the 3 years I was a member I had two enquiries and each time they responded 3 months after I'd approached them with a "sorry, can't help you"

Seems like a poor choice now though.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:41

birdstrike: Oct 30, 2008; i;m gay

Beetphyxious posted:

Yeah do we have a quote on that, that's the second time someone in this thread has said it without a quote.

not payifn attention huh that's a scumtlel ##vote bwet

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:42

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

StealthBus posted:

No union. I'm in I.T, there isn't one and I resigned from the ASU a year ago because in the 3 years I was a member I had two enquiries and each time they responded 3 months after I'd approached them with a "sorry, can't help you"

Seems like a poor choice now though.

They still might help you being an ex member (as long as you rejoin), I've also seen union happy to offer limited support to new people as long as they sign up.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:43

hambeet: Sep 13, 2002

Birdstrike posted:

not payifn attention huh that's a scumtlel ##vote bwet

nice fake typos. almost like soag.

hmmm

# ? Jul 8, 2016 12:44

WhiskeyWhiskers: Oct 14, 2013; "هذا ليس عادلاً."
"هذا ليس عادلاً على الإطلاق."
"كان هناك وقت الآن."
(السياق الخفي: للقراءة)

"ABC posted:

BOB KATTER: And what I tried to glean out is what does this bloke want to do? Does he want to bash up unions, in which case, I'll bash him up.

I like this quote better.

WhiskeyWhiskers fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Jul 8, 2016

# ? Jul 8, 2016 13:22

Graic Gabtar: Dec 19, 2014; squat my posts

tithin posted:

Unsurprised by this, Telstra are as savage as my employer about outsourcing

True that.

# ? Jul 8, 2016 13:39

Chicken Parmigiana: Sep 12, 2007

Hello, thread. Here is a good and necessary article that I think you will enjoy. It's sort of like an opinion piece but with actual research and a thoughtful, considered approach to the topic! What the gently caress!?

(It's from a couple of days ago but I don't recall it being posted or linked.)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jul/08/the-elites-v-pauline-hanson-we-dont-have-to-choose-one-or-the-other-we-can-reject-both

Jeff Sparrow at the Grau posted:

The elites v Pauline Hanson. We don't have to choose one or the other � we can reject both

It�s not a choice between embracing elitism to fight Hanson or embracing Hanson to fight elitism. We should embrace progressive mass-based politics instead

----------

�The only cure we�ve got is to have a dictator like in China or something like that. Our democracy at the moment is not working.�

That was billionaire retailer Gerry Harvey�s reaction to the inconclusive Australian election.

His quote exemplifies a strange paradox. In response to the Brexit vote, the Trump phenomenon and One Nation�s resurrection, we�ve seen a flurry of warnings about the growth of the far right. Yet many of these pieces themselves strike a distinctly authoritarian note.

In May, for instance, the blogger and editor Andrew Sullivan wrote a long anti-Trump screed under the headline �Democracies end when they are too democratic�.

More recently, Jonathan Rauch from the Brookings Institution weighed in with an article entitled �How American politics went insane� in which he outlined ways in which �the parties could move insiders back to the centre of the nomination process�.

Over at Foreign Policy, contributing editor James Traub explained, �It�s Time for the Elites to Rise Up Against the Ignorant Masses�.

There are plenty of other examples. As Matt Taibbi said about Brexit, �because the vote was viewed as having been driven by the same racist passions that are fuelling the campaign of Donald Trump, a wide swath of commentators suggested that democracy erred, and the vote should perhaps be canceled, for the Britons� own good.�

It�s difficult to imagine a more disastrous response to the real threat of neo-fascism in Europe and rightwing populism elsewhere.

Today, commentators depict the far right as a movement of uneducated plebs too ignorant to appreciate multiculturalism�s virtues. Yet the fascist organisations of the thirties actually recruited most heavily from the middle classes � and they did so using an anti-democratic rhetoric very similar to that of today�s �anti-fascist� elitists.

Consider a little 1932 pamphlet entitled �The Greater Britain�, the document in which Oswald Mosley, the most prominent fascist leader of the English-speaking world, presented his ideas. In his tract, Mosley barely mentions race. Instead, he writes at length about the failure of parliamentary democracy.

�Nobody, nowadays,� he wrote, �expects election promises to be fulfilled. Governments are elected on the strength of their appeal to passion and to sentiment. �The increasingly technical nature of all problems in an economic age has made it difficult or impossible to explain the real issues to the electorate as a whole. The division between daily politics and the reality of government has become ever greater. The technician has become ever more enchained by the passion, the prejudice and the folly of uninstructed politics.�

Much of his argument could have been reprinted as a hot take responding to Brexit. The easily-duped masses should not, he said, be permitted to decide matters too complicated for them to assess. Much better to delegate authority to experts and technicians � the people Mosley calls �the architect[s] of our industrial future�.

Twenty-first century enthusiasts for technocratic governance don�t necessarily embrace every element of Mosley�s fascist corporatism � but the underlying critique of mass politics is almost identical.

Another passage:

�Electors vote on general considerations of policy, which they cannot understand, since the facts are not fully before them. The truth is, simply, that the issues behind every political decision are far too complicated to set before the public. The result is that elections are fought in a welter of journalistic catchwords � Debate, therefore, is no longer constructive but purely destructive and concentrated on transient issues of popular passion which tend yet further to obscure the real issues which should receive the attention of Government.�

Later, Mosley�s British Union of Fascists grew explicitly anti-Semitic and militaristic, engaging in violent punch-ups with the working class organisations its supporters despised. The influence of Mussolini (and, to a lesser extent, Hitler) became far more evident. Yet, as Martin Pugh argues in Hurrah for the Blackshirts!, Mosley also drew on a critique of democracy as mob rule that was widely held within conservative circles. �[A]lthough fascism had some distinctive ideas,� he says, �much of what fascists had to say was not particularly distinctive. The common ground was advantageous in that it enabled them to address the concerns of a large body of potential recruits.�

In Australia in the 1930s, the situation was similar. Michael Cathcart�s Defending the National Tuckshop chronicles the efforts of the various fascistic secret armies of the period, organisations that believed that �democracy was defunct�. There was, he makes clear, �a great deal of sympathy for this view in Establishment circles, particularly among the officer caste.�

Thus, in 1931 the Melbourne Age explained, that �it is fashionable at the moment to talk of mob rule and mass emotion as the unstable elements of democratic government � to suggest that dictatorship, or any form of government which is not democratic, is the rule of cold reason and high intellect.�

That�s why the growing momentum today of what Taibbi calls the �too much democracy train� is so alarming. Many (though not all) of the people calling for the reduction of popular participation see themselves as opposing racism in a context where, as John Gray says, across Europe �far-right parties with roots in the darkest years of the 20th century have been inching their way towards government�.

But, whatever their intentions, the anti-democracy crowd are helping popularise a core contention of historical fascism � a sense of good government as an elite project, in which experts run the show and the masses are kept forcibly in their place.

That�s by no means to suggest that we should acquiesce to right wing populism, just because it�s popular.

In a recent Guardian article, Margo Kingston queries �will we, the educated, the elites, the right-thinking city folks, learn from [the] nightmare� that was the response to Hanson in the nineties?

But Kingston�s riposte to what she calls the �elitist snobbery about Hanson and her voters� gives far too much ground to One Nation.

Hanson, she tells us, is a �nice person� and so, too, are most of her supporters. Their fears about Islam �are natural and understandable�; Hanson�s �return to our parliament� provides a chance to bring together the �warring tribes� of Australia.

Well, Hanson might be �nice� but she�s also an Islamophobic demagogue providing encouragement to every bigot in the nation.

Fortunately, we don�t have to choose between embracing elitism to fight Hanson or embracing Hanson to fight elitism. It�s perfectly possible to reject both One Nation and the anti-democratic snobs � to embrace instead a progressive mass-based politics.

Those who call for limitations on popular participation generally assume that the populace is incorrigibly bigoted. But that�s not necessarily the case at all � as a recent poll for the Australia Institute demonstrates. That survey revealed that 63% of respondents believed that refugees should be resettled within Australia.

Now, in the most recent election, of course, both parties made off-shore settlement central to their campaign. In fact, for years, pundits have insisted that the ever-more draconian policies adopted by politicians were a response to the innate racism of the voters. But if the recent study�s to be believed, the opposite seems to be the case. Despite the best efforts of the political class to drum up hostility to refugees, the majority of Australians have, quite remarkably, retained their basic decency.

Sure, it�s only one survey. But it hints at a quite different relationship between the elites and the masses than what�s usually assumed.

To put it another way, Pauline Hanson is not the inevitable outgrowth of outsider politics in Australia. On the contrary, there�s clearly a constituency upon which a mass struggle against the racist right can be based. The problem, however, is reaching people who have often given up on the political process altogether. In other words, we�re not suffering from too much participation � we�re suffering from too little.

That�s the key task for progressives to address.

# ? Jul 9, 2016 03:53

open24hours: Jan 7, 2001

People complain bitterly about having to buy a whole package just to get the one Foxtel channel they want. That's unfair they say, why should I have to get all this crap I don't want and don't need? No one seems to care much when it comes to politics though. Want a party that rejects liberalism? Well, you'll have to take racism too.

# ? Jul 9, 2016 04:07

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Chicken Parmigiana posted:

Hello, thread. Here is a good and necessary article that I think you will enjoy. It's sort of like an opinion piece but with actual research and a thoughtful, considered approach to the topic! What the gently caress!?

(It's from a couple of days ago but I don't recall it being posted or linked.)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jul/08/the-elites-v-pauline-hanson-we-dont-have-to-choose-one-or-the-other-we-can-reject-both

Yeah I can sense disaster. When you've got a new aristocracy in all but name, and this kind of idiotic response, the disconnection reaches 1798 levels. It isn't just that they don't care, they believe they know better and are actually angry that we aren't following the script. Nothing illustrates this better than the obvious hunger in the political class here for a terrorist attack. Just so they have a justification to look like leaders and have popular support. That's the sign of people with nothing better to do.

# ? Jul 9, 2016 04:11

Lizard Combatant: Sep 29, 2010; I have some notes.

e:nm

# ? Jul 9, 2016 04:13

Redcordial: Nov 7, 2009; TRUMP TRUMP TRUMP

lol the country is fed up with your safe spaces and trigger warnings you useless special snowflakes, send the sjws to mexico

Good read to accompany my coffee, thanks.

Death is evidently certain.

# ? Jul 9, 2016 04:25

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# ? Jun 4, 2024 13:39

SMILLENNIALSMILLEN: Jun 26, 2009

Chicken Parmigiana posted:

Hello, thread. Here is a good and necessary article that I think you will enjoy. It's sort of like an opinion piece but with actual research and a thoughtful, considered approach to the topic! What the gently caress!?

(It's from a couple of days ago but I don't recall it being posted or linked.)

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jul/08/the-elites-v-pauline-hanson-we-dont-have-to-choose-one-or-the-other-we-can-reject-both

quote:

Those who call for limitations on popular participation generally assume that the populace is incorrigibly bigoted. But that’s not necessarily the case at all – as a recent poll for the Australia Institute demonstrates. That survey revealed that 63% of respondents believed that refugees should be resettled within Australia.

Now, in the most recent election, of course, both parties made off-shore settlement central to their campaign. In fact, for years, pundits have insisted that the ever-more draconian policies adopted by politicians were a response to the innate racism of the voters. But if the recent study’s to be believed, the opposite seems to be the case. Despite the best efforts of the political class to drum up hostility to refugees, the majority of Australians have, quite remarkably, retained their basic decency.

How timely lmao

# ? Jul 9, 2016 06:34

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Auspol June/Election - hang parliament

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