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One of the problems with fozzie sov is that now that all groups have to condense down into only the space they can reliably defend. All of a sudden nullsec is too big. There's more than enough sov for everyone willing to defend it. Without crowding there's little financial incentive to fight besides money moons and those are unrelated so sov.
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Jul 11, 2016 14:18
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It has been very strange to join again after several years away and hear the call from leadership for strategic mining fleets. Is there a motivation beyond "it's the homeland" for reclaiming Deklein? Did people not have time to evac assets, or are tech moons still worth the effort of smashing against the grudge coalition? It's said a lot that "the rest of the galaxy teamed up against us" but did the russians or anyone south of cloud ring join in?
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Jul 11, 2016 14:24
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turevidar posted:It has been very strange to join again after several years away and hear the call from leadership for strategic mining fleets. Is there a motivation beyond "it's the homeland" for reclaiming Deklein? Did people not have time to evac assets, or are tech moons still worth the effort of smashing against the grudge coalition? Tech moons are still decent income, but there's alchemy reactions that reduced their overall demand. The push for Deklein (for anyone outside of GSF) is kind of mind boggling, but yeah for the most part "it's the homeland" seems to be the common reason. The Russians and southern alliances did not in fact join in, it was mostly pissed off lowsec alliances + TEST + PL/NC. "All of EVE" is a talking point and that's about it.
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Jul 11, 2016 14:28
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Zephyrine posted:One of the problems with fozzie sov is that now that all groups have to condense down into only the space they can reliably defend. All of a sudden nullsec is too big. There's more than enough sov for everyone willing to defend it. Without crowding there's little financial incentive to fight besides money moons and those are unrelated so sov. Fozziesov is intended for an Eve with a vastly larger active playerbase whilst also relying on the nullsec incentives that existed in previous sov systems and which CCP have actively torn down.
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Jul 11, 2016 14:29
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Zephyrine posted:One of the problems with fozzie sov is that now that all groups have to condense down into only the space they can reliably defend. All of a sudden nullsec is too big. There's more than enough sov for everyone willing to defend it. Without crowding there's little financial incentive to fight besides money moons and those are unrelated so sov. I noticed Fade ADMs have dropped across PH sov. If Horde can't prove the value of living in space with their numbers there's nothing left to support the idea that Aegis sov is a matter of occupying space sensibly.
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Jul 11, 2016 14:31
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Elsa posted:I'm not sure you get to have an opinion on this matter rude as hell man what did i ever do to you?
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Jul 11, 2016 14:43
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Elsa posted:I noticed Fade ADMs have dropped across PH sov. No? Unlike in any other situation. Red-orange is actually good colours for ADMs.
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Jul 11, 2016 14:45
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Helicon One posted:Fozziesov is intended for an Eve with a vastly larger active playerbase whilst also relying on the nullsec incentives that existed in previous sov systems and which CCP have actively torn down. This seems to be on point. The hilarious thing is that on an individual level, there's practically no incentive to live in null. A ~marginal~ decrease in manufacturing costs, and a considerable decrease to manufacturing time... but other than that I struggle to see why it would be important. I guess if you want to build supers and titans then sure, knock yourself out. But I can float around low/null/wh in my cloaky Tengu and run sleeper caches and ghost sites to make my ISK, or just do HS incursions. The ISK is better than ratting - it just requires  .There are also a surprising amount of unclaimed low sec moons and plenty of space... I've recently set up a nice little drug lab, which has much less logistical hassle than trying to ship technitium out of null sec. Literally it seems like sov exists to provide a place for people to AFK rat with better returns than high sec, and to build supers and titans (which a growing portion of the playerbase doesn't really have any interest in). We could either take some sov somewhere else that the MBC won't care to follow, or just all pile into a couple of wormholes and live like the golden horde - emerging from our bees nests when new holes open to raid and pillage. Both of those sound more fun than grinding ADMs all through Pure Blind to Dek... to say nothing of the ADM hijacking episode that happened last time we tried this same loving thing.
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Jul 11, 2016 14:53
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Baculus posted:This seems to be on point. The nr 1 reason to hold sov is to plant a flag and say "Here is our flag. By the strength of our forces we put it here and by our strength it remains here"
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Jul 11, 2016 14:57
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So what happens when gsf fucks off somewhere else, pisses off a new bunch of people and the mbc chases? You said it yourself baculus that there's a massive hateboner. bitching about raising Adms is funny, no one is making you do them. Its part of making isk for our new players who may not have the capability to high sec incursion or set up drug labs or w/e the gently caress else is possible after months of training. If you want to do some small scale fuckery just join the standing fleets, it's not like horde or nc haven't got dudes littering the systems around us gate camping or hot dropping all day. Ps you can already do wormhole poo poo just join hole squad. The concept of moving everyone into whs though requires a lot more commitment and effort that's just not practical for a large portion of members 4th Horseman fucked around with this message at 15:18 on Jul 11, 2016 |
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Jul 11, 2016 15:16
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avatarinwin posted:rude as hell man avatarinwin posted:Is this the new posting meta? Posting things that are inherently wrong or incorrect to bait out pl posters like xolve (and me apparently) into correcting you? I mean you can't be so stupid to actually believe the things you say can you? I always gave you the benefit of the doubt mr. orange red bull but I don't know any more. Talk to your boy Xolve who keeps coming around to post un-chill poo poo any time his vagina is dry. I'm not one to hold grudges but he does it so goddamn always that I've made up my mind to be just as un-chill. Seriously it is wayyyyy too late to start acting offended. suckit
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Jul 11, 2016 15:33
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Zephyrine posted:The nr 1 reason to hold sov is to plant a flag and say "Here is our flag. By the strength of our forces we put it here and by our strength it remains here" That is a stupid reason. And also a stupid thing to say. The Imperium did not survive the war - but GSF did, and that's an achievement in and of itself (because this sort of thing kills massive alliances all the time). But we can't enjoy that achievement because we have to wage hellwar or some other stupid poo poo. It doesn't seem like the polestar guiding leadership right now is "What's best for GSF?" It doesn't make sense. We're not mad, but we want revenge? We are concerned about people's ratting incomes, so rather than invade territory we could hold in another region we're going to continue playing tug of war with Pure Blind and ask people to mine in Ventures? We're up to our necks in conflict and surrounded by enemies, but we won't 'sound the horn of Goondor'? At the very least we could go take a couple constellations away from the conflict to give people a place to Jew, and then try to reconquer Deklein later. We talk a bunch of poo poo about the MBC infighting and their short memories, but then we don't leave them alone long enough to forget about GSF and move on.
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Jul 11, 2016 15:49
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invade fountain IMO
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Jul 11, 2016 15:50
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Elsa posted:Talk to your boy Xolve who keeps coming around to post un-chill poo poo any time his vagina is dry. I'm not one to hold grudges but he does it so goddamn always that I've made up my mind to be just as un-chill. Seriously it is wayyyyy too late to start acting offended. suckit same but about that racist orange redbull guy
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Jul 11, 2016 15:51
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Baculus posted:That is a stupid reason. And also a stupid thing to say. Moving somewhere else would be admitting defeat. It would be more demoralizing than staying in Saranen for another month (at which point GSF would be established in some sov anyway)
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Jul 11, 2016 15:52
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Elsa posted:I noticed Fade ADMs have dropped across PH sov. If Horde can't prove the value of living in space with their numbers there's nothing left to support the idea that Aegis sov is a matter of occupying space sensibly. Is there even a debate anymore? Sovereignty is entirely dick waving and the right to build supers. CCP admits benefits to sov holders are needed and has been promising that for years - but a plan for accomplishing this doesn't exist, even at a conceptual level.
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Jul 11, 2016 15:52
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Shut up sadbrains frozencooch
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Jul 11, 2016 15:52
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Zephyrine posted:The nr 1 reason to hold sov is to plant a flag and say "Here is our flag. By the strength of our forces we put it here and by our strength it remains here" Which is a daft reason because if no-one is going to bother taking it then the "strength" part is entirely unnecessary. Apologies if that was your point and you were being facetious but sometimes it is difficult to tell. e: someone else said the same thing and it looks like you were serious so there we go... My understanding with us taking sov again is that we were never going to be a true "sov inhabiting" alliance anymore. We're keeping our assets in Saranen permanently and just slowly pushing out and gaining sov as we go- it's also 100% likely that we're going to lose that sov again at some stage, and the plan was based entirely around us making it more irritating for them to take it than it is for us to take it back (Citadels, which weren't there last time we got booted out). Maybe I misunderstood something about the plan but it sounded pretty decent to me. It's a way of getting back some space to rat/mine/whatever in so we can go back to making money but not putting ourselves in a position that we can get wiped out as quickly as we did last time. NtotheTC fucked around with this message at 15:56 on Jul 11, 2016 |
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Jul 11, 2016 15:54
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I should have said "in several systems" rather than making it sound like all of PH sov. I don't watch PH (or anyone's) ADMs closely and was going by what I saw in this r/eve post 
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Jul 11, 2016 15:55
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NtotheTC posted:My understanding with us taking sov again is that we were never going to be a true "sov inhabiting" alliance anymore. I'm incredibly content with the idea of not being a true sov inhabiting alliance anymore - but if that's the case I don't understand the obssessive fixation with Deklein.
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Jul 11, 2016 15:58
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Rust Martialis posted:Shut up sadbrains frozencooch
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Jul 11, 2016 15:58
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Baculus posted:I'm incredibly content with the idea of not being a true sov inhabiting alliance anymore - but if that's the case I don't understand the obssessive fixation with Deklein.
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Jul 11, 2016 15:58
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Baculus posted:I'm incredibly content with the idea of not being a true sov inhabiting alliance anymore - but if that's the case I don't understand the obssessive fixation with Deklein. To get the assets we have there out. If we get kicked out again after that then who cares, we can go anywhere.
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Jul 11, 2016 16:00
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ChickenWing posted:
Let's be honest - Delve would probably be more fun. I'm surprised we haven't just sent a random fleet out to piss all over DJ's little circlejerk.
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Jul 11, 2016 16:01
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avatarinwin posted:same but about that racist orange redbull guy un-chill posts about the other side is basically politics, and I'm not one for that type of thing. I'm under the impression most of us aren't. yet people think it's worth doing anyway and fool me once, shame on me, fool me twice I can't be fooled again. I like to think there is a chat room where goons of all affiliations cackle about how poo poo their posts are. There's just no way the un-chill can be real right?
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Jul 11, 2016 16:02
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Rust Martialis posted:Shut up sadbrains frozencooch sadbrains is not one of my problems but thanks for posting anyway
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Jul 11, 2016 16:03
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dialhforhero posted:I like how you're addressing CCP as if they are in this thread listening to you/reading your post. They probably do read this thread and eve-o is a shithole so where else?
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Jul 11, 2016 16:23
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Iv always been Team Move Somewhere Else, but I also live in a wormhole so 
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Jul 11, 2016 16:23
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Couldn't we just crash on Stainwagons couch since they are the Russians that like us? Hell all we would need is 1 constellation. Gets us more space without the "pissing people off" part and we could Voltron up with the Russians to drive away anyone who tried to follow us.
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Jul 11, 2016 16:25
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Venom Snake posted:Couldn't we just crash on Stainwagons couch since they are the Russians that like us? Hell all we would need is 1 constellation. Gets us more space without the "pissing people off" part and we could Voltron up with the Russians to drive away anyone who tried to follow us. My understanding is that crashing on some foreigner's couch is how we got Deklein in the first place. So we stumbled into the lease on a rent controlled midtown apartment... there are still other (arguably better) places to live.
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Jul 11, 2016 16:32
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p7hk9 posted:You know we give them away for free, right? But going on an adventure is fun, hitting up the mentors for freebies is boring.
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Jul 11, 2016 16:33
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Elsa posted:sadbrains is not one of my problems Only because you don't meet the prerequisites. Also- I don't have a 'grudge' against anyone, nor am I part of that 'grr goons' camp- I'll (badly) call out dumbshit posters from any alliance. Xolve fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jul 11, 2016 |
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Jul 11, 2016 16:38
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Xolve posted:Only because you don't meet the prerequisites. 
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Jul 11, 2016 16:43
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Elsa posted:sadbrains is not one of my problems but thanks for posting anyway Ambien and what, Ritalin script? Yeah no, your brain's working JUST fine, you're the fuckin' Jack Kirby of Ephebophilia Art.
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Jul 11, 2016 16:45
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jesus christ rust on fire
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Jul 11, 2016 16:56
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wowwww
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Jul 11, 2016 16:57
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this is my favorite eve thread page ever. for real
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Jul 11, 2016 16:57
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Rust Martialis posted:Ambien and what, Ritalin script? Yeah no, your brain's working JUST fine, you're the fuckin' Jack Kirby of Ephebophilia Art. So I just sprayed diet cola all over my desk and possibly ruined my tie. 
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Jul 11, 2016 17:00
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Xolve posted:Also- I don't have a 'grudge' against anyone, nor am I part of that 'grr goons' camp- I'll (badly) call out dumbshit posters from any alliance. Please don't; the inevitable outcome would be to keep recursively quoting yourself forever until the forums keeled over
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Jul 11, 2016 17:06
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NtotheTC posted:To get the assets we have there out. If we get kicked out again after that then who cares, we can go anywhere. What is the expected ratio of assets lost trying to freeport dek to the firesale value whatever of is still trapped there (of active players anyways)? If we just want to hang around and poo poo on people that's cool but we'll need to come up with better ways of dealing with blobs than interceptors or docking up (and I generally enjoy interceptor fleets FWIW). As yeah yeah I know the standard talking point of "but PL/LSV" but as far as I can tell the relevant corps in LSV are exclusive to high SP, experienced, financially established players and both groups can deploy doctrines that leverage that. Picture putting every sub-20m SP GSF player into Karma and then A continuation of the status quo will not work because the whole strategy of "make it annoying for them to retake our sov because citadel spam" only works if we somehow either 1) are able to stop them from killing our structures and putting up new ones or 2) have a lot of guys who really, really enjoy structure bashing and blueballing. It has to be more annoying for them than it is for us and guess what, we're not doing anything that they can't do with less effort right now. eta: except coordination and logistics because we don't have to pretend we're not a coalition 
Discussion Quorum fucked around with this message at 17:11 on Jul 11, 2016 |
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Jul 11, 2016 17:09
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