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drilldo squirt posted:It's also interesting how seriously you take feminist issues when it involves Muslim groups. I'm sure you'll be comforted to know I'm very much opposed to Christian attempts to restrict women's rights too. Thanks for asking.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:42
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khwarezm posted:It will always be politically charged but dummies like you have charged it even further hopelessly unintentionally with elements of Muslim resistance to an intolerant west thanks to your brutally clumsy actions and rhetoric that can't even be squared with your oft cited love of freedom against the supposed oriental despotism. It's actually impossible for individual clothing to be politically charged (in a liberal democracy, anyways), because one of the central principles of pluralist liberalism is that the political sphere cannot extend into the personal one such that choice of clothing is a politicized issue
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Aug 12, 2016 23:43
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Sinteres posted:It's interesting to see how easy it is for people to justify women being coerced into second-class status as long as there's a pretense that they chose it at some point along the way after being taught it's their role for their entire lives. That's not what anyone is saying and you should stop strawmaning.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:42
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icantfindaname posted:For reference, historically modern France has said yes resoundingly to both of those Sounds like a pretty lovely place.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:43
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YF-23 posted:That's not what anyone is saying and you should stop strawmaning. That's the reality of the burqa. It's not a strawman at all.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:44
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Nitrousoxide posted:Sounds like a pretty lovely place. *insert pithy comment about Continental European totalitarianism vs Anglosphere Liberty*
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Aug 12, 2016 23:46
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Sinteres posted:That's the reality of the burqa. It's not a strawman at all. No it is not the reality of the burqa, except in the mind of deranged racists. But I'm sure you've been out there campaigning to ban frumpy dresses and nun's robes as well? I mean, that's what someone who was intellectually honest would be doing, if they truly believed what you claim to believe rather than just wanting to torment muslims.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:46
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Sinteres posted:That's the reality of the burqa. It's not a strawman at all. No-one here is talking about women who are under social pressure to wear the burka. When you say that we're defending that you are building a strawman.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:47
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Sinteres posted:It's interesting to see how easy it is for people to justify women being coerced into second-class status as long as there's a pretense that they chose it at some point along the way after being taught it's their role for their entire lives. I too think that french catholic nuns should be banned after they've been coerced into enforced celibacy after being indoctrinated and forced into never enjoying sex by a pretense of they chose it after being indoctrinated by Catholicism for their entire lives. In a democracy, people should wear what they want and express themselves freely. Why, who where what, it's none of your business if they're not harming you.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:48
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Sinteres posted:I'm sure you'll be comforted to know I'm very much opposed to Christian attempts to restrict women's rights too. Thanks for asking. I'm sorry friend they tone of your arguments make it hard to believe you would also call for legal restrictions to enforce your cultural beliefs on them also.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:48
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Al-Saqr posted:I too think that french catholic nuns should be banned after they've been coerced into enforced celibacy after being indoctrinated and forced into never enjoying sex by a pretense of they chose it after being indoctrinated by Catholicism for their entire lives. I'm sure sinteres is campaigning right this minute to making it illegal to be a nun.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:48
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Hell why are priests allowed to not have sex, when the only reason they do it is a life time of cultural indoctrination. We should make it illegal for priests not to gently caress.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:50
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icantfindaname posted:France did almost end up like Spain, though, and the Spanish left was vociferously laicitist, so I'm going to go with no not really on that one But they didn't end up like Spain, in the brief period where those who wanted to return France to the glory of a counter-revolutionary openly Catholic state found success they needed an outside Nazi invasion to achieve their five minutes in the sun, with the post war fallout being predictably disastrous for them. Jesus, the Papal denunciation that you pointed out here for Action Francaise was stripped away just in time for world war 2 when the Catholic Church decided that working with Spanish style notfascism was A-OK to heed off those drat commies.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:50
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Why are we allowing some women to wear bras when it's a holdover of patriarchal dominance? They should be illegal.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:52
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khwarezm posted:But they didn't end up like Spain, in the brief period where those who wanted to return France to the glory of a counter-revolutionary openly Catholic state found success they needed an outside Nazi invasion to achieve their five minutes in the sun, with the post war fallout being predictably disastrous for them. They'll have to wait until next year's election to do that, yes. And lol if you don't think laicite is a big part of why the French right is so awful
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Aug 12, 2016 23:53
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fishmech posted:No it is not the reality of the burqa, except in the mind of deranged racists. Modest clothing which doesn't include face covering for a small self-selected group in a religion I'd be happy to see die out anyway isn't really the same as a legal mandate for all women in multiple countries to wear burqas or be beaten or arrested, which has subsequently spread as a coercive practice outside their borders. Also, aren't you a socialist? What are you doing defending anti-egalitarian religious customs in the name of personal liberty? drilldo squirt posted:I'm sorry friend they tone of your arguments make it hard to believe you would also call for legal restrictions to enforce your cultural beliefs on them also. I specifically said I don't support a ban several times, and such a ban wouldn't be permissible in my country, but of course you're not interested in my actual position since you're just congratulating yourself on your virtue in the first place. Dr Kool-AIDS fucked around with this message at 23:56 on Aug 12, 2016 |
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Aug 12, 2016 23:53
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Al-Saqr posted:I too think that french catholic nuns should be banned after they've been coerced into enforced celibacy after being indoctrinated and forced into never enjoying sex by a pretense of they chose it after being indoctrinated by Catholicism for their entire lives. By the way, another thing that modern France actually literally did. Nun's habits and Priest clothing was banned in public for a long time
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Aug 12, 2016 23:54
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Sinteres posted:It's interesting to see how easy it is for people to justify women being coerced into second-class status as long as there's a pretense that they chose it at some point along the way after being taught it's their role for their entire lives. It changes to astonishing when it's from the same crowd that sees structural violence everywhere *but* in a patriarchical society stemming from the 600s AD. The ECB offering incentives to Greece to adhere to civilized economical principles ? Capitalist tyranny! The worker having to toil in the factory while enjoying social security, paid holidays etc. while there are people even better off than him? Fascist Oppression! A society that instills into women, but not men, the notion they have to hide like lepers from the public to be considered decent? Well, that seems like a worthy cause to be defended by free Western males.
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Aug 12, 2016 23:58
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Sinteres posted:Modest clothing which doesn't include face covering for a small self-selected group in a religion I'd be happy to see die out anyway isn't really the same as a legal mandate for all women in multiple countries to wear burqas or be beaten or arrested, which has subsequently spread as a coercive practice outside their borders. It's hard to take you seriously when you say Sinteres posted:It's interesting to see how easy it is for people to justify women being coerced into second-class status as long as there's a pretense that they chose it at some point along the way after being taught it's their role for their entire lives. and Sinteres posted:Kind of ironic how anti-racism rightly inspired by a rejection of the horrors of the Holocaust has had the unintended consequence of enabling violent elements of new migrant communities to once more victimize Europe's Jewish population. I was going to quote more but it's p much every post in this thread is an attack on Muslim refugees who you keep suggesting are responsible for an uptick in antisemitic violence.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:01
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Sinteres posted:Modest clothing which doesn't include face covering for a small self-selected group in a religion I'd be happy to see die out anyway isn't really the same as a legal mandate for all women in multiple countries to wear burqas or be beaten or arrested, which has subsequently spread as a coercive practice outside their borders. Also, aren't you a socialist? What are you doing defending anti-egalitarian religious customs in the name of personal liberty? I'm sorry, did France also pass a law saying you have to be beaten if you're not wearing a burqa? Because that's the only way it'd be relevant. You violent European types used to beat women for daring to show their bare calves, so we're going to have to ban pants and and any dress that goes below the knee. Since you're so concerned about clothing, after all. There's nothing socialist about your bizarre racial hatred of women dressing unstylishly.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:02
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drilldo squirt posted:I was going to quote more but it's p much every post in this thread is an attack on Muslim refugees who you keep suggesting are responsible for an uptick in antisemitic violence. Are they not? fishmech posted:I'm sorry, did France also pass a law saying you have to be beaten if you're not wearing a burqa? Because that's the only way it'd be relevant. You violent European types used to beat women for daring to show their bare calves, so we're going to have to ban pants and and any dress that goes below the knee. Since you're so concerned about clothing, after all. The coercive values that led to those laws have spread beyond the borders, as I said. France banned the burqa, which is an extreme solution, but may help some women escape that tyranny. Your regard for women is really coming through in thinking that the worst part of an oppressive uniform that actually is mandated in many places for women is that it's unstylish though. Your phony sentimental attachment to traditions that oppress half the population has nothing to do with socialism.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:12
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Sinteres posted:Are they not? They aren't.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:14
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So I'm glad we established that sinterest doesn't actually care about feminism as he has posted no arguments against what I posted.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:16
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drilldo squirt posted:So I'm glad we established that sinterest doesn't actually care about feminism as he has posted no arguments against what I posted. I'm glad we've established that you're a pedophile since you've never denied it to my knowledge.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:18
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Sinteres posted:
No they haven't. Sinteres posted:Your regard for women is really coming through Yes, unlike you, I don't believe in punishing women for wearing unfashionable clothing, and then i really don't go and back up that lunacy with racism.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:18
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It's kinda sad how he is grasping at whatever he can to excuse a hate that goes against the values he grew up with I hope. I mean he could have grown up a nazi or something but I hope not.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:19
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icantfindaname posted:They'll have to wait until next year's election to do that, yes. And lol if you don't think laicite is a big part of why the French right is so awful Being racist against Arabs is the main reason why they are so awful and the current crop like the Front National obviously descend from the Catholic Supremacism of the French Right, its notable that openly Catholic voters favor them more strongly. Some of their rhetoric has revolved around Catholicism being superior and more intrinsically French than Islam, while they tend to take a familiarly conservative view on things like Gay marriage and abortion. It doesn't change the fact that they spent most of their existence being furiously opposed to Laicite and everything it represented. But then the poor Catholic Church, it get such a hard rap in France, and for what? Supporting the Ancien Regime for centuries? Being integral to Counter Revolutionary movements right from day 1? Normalizing virulent Anti-Semitism and anti-Protestantism in French society for decades, helping to lead to things like the Dreyfus Affair? Cosying up with proto-fascist groups in opposition to the Third Republic? ...um. khwarezm fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Aug 13, 2016 |
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Aug 13, 2016 00:19
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Sinteres posted:I'm glad we've established that you're a pedophile since you've never denied it to my knowledge. I've never done anything to make people think I am one though. You have however. Also calling me a pedophile because your mad about being a racist baby is kinda hosed up.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:20
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icantfindaname posted:They'll have to wait until next year's election to do that, yes. And lol if you don't think laicite is a big part of why the French right is so awful Yeah, as we've seen, adding religion to the mix calms down right-wingers
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Aug 13, 2016 00:20
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fishmech posted:I don't believe in punishing women for wearing unfashionable clothing You don't seem to believe in much of anything at all since you're such a lovely socialist.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:21
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You know, you'd think a feminist would be interested in empowering women to wear whatever they want rather than banning choices because woman can't be trusted to make their own decisions. Very interesting.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:20
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How bout we keep the right of people wearing what they want but we also keep the right of people relentlessly mock them if they look ridiculous,but if you mock someone for any other reason than that you also keep your right of being constantly punched in the dick.or vagina.but really,mainly dicks.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:22
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khwarezm posted:Being racist against Arabs is the main reason why they are so awful and the current crop like the Front National obviously descend from the Catholic Supremacism of the French Right, its notable that openly Catholic voters favor them strongly. Some of their rhetoric has revolved around Catholicism being superior and more intrinsically French than Islam, while they tend to take a familiarly conservative view on things like Gay marriage and abortion. It doesn't change the fact that they spent most of their existence being furiously opposed to Laicite and everything it represented. Sounds like it should be made illegal it's a very regressive institution. .
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Aug 13, 2016 00:22
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Sinteres posted:You don't seem to believe in much of anything at all since you're such a lovely socialist. Watch as sinteres exposed as a virulent racist and rightfuly embarrassed about it turns to insults as his arguments are made irrelevant.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:24
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khwarezm posted:Being racist against Arabs is the main reason why they are so awful and the current crop like the Front National obviously descend from the Catholic Supremacism of the French Right, its notable that openly Catholic voters favor them more strongly. Some of their rhetoric has revolved around Catholicism being superior and more intrinsically French than Islam, while they tend to take a familiarly conservative view on things like Gay marriage and abortion. It doesn't change the fact that they spent most of their existence being furiously opposed to Laicite and everything it represented. When you define liberalism in such a way that necessarily excludes religious people, turns out a lot of them reject liberalism. Both in the 1800s and today cool and good posted:Yeah, as we've seen, adding religion to the mix calms down right-wingers I mean that by excluding religious people from liberalism it removes any incentive for them to uphold any sort of liberal values.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:24
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drilldo squirt posted:Watch as sinteres exposed as a virulent racist and rightfuly embarrassed about it turns to insults as his arguments are made irrelevant. You keep confusing secularism for racism because you're a patronizing poo poo who doesn't think people from the Middle East are capable of letting go of the lovely regressive beliefs practiced in many of their countries of origin despite the fact that the radicalism is a relatively recent phenomenon.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:27
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Sinteres posted:You don't seem to believe in much of anything at all since you're such a lovely socialist. I don't think fishmech ever claimed to be a socialist? Sinteres posted:You keep confusing secularism for racism because you're a patronizing poo poo who doesn't think people from the Middle East are capable of letting go of the lovely regressive beliefs practiced in many of their countries of origin. Laicitist secularism isn't racism, but by its nature it is very easy on racism
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Aug 13, 2016 00:27
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Sinteres posted:You keep confusing secularism for racism because you're a patronizing poo poo who doesn't think people from the Middle East are capable of letting go of the lovely regressive beliefs practiced in many of their countries of origin despite the fact that the radicalism is a relatively recent phenomenon. You're wrong sinteres, about everything. Also you are a racist. We can probably throw stupid on to that list also.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:30
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Sinteres it's not your fault you have an irrational hatred of Muslims, it's something to do with brain chemistry. Maybe try and better yourself instead of wallowing in it however.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:31
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Sinteres posted:you're a patronizing poo poo who doesn't think people from the Middle East are capable of letting go of the lovely regressive beliefs practiced in many of their countries of origin This is pretty rich coming from the guy that thinks a ban on the burka is necessary to protect western liberalism from the muslims.
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Aug 13, 2016 00:32
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