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A White Guy posted:So, "I'm not a conservative but I always vote Republican". Chavismo, in the style that it used to exist, is dead and it's never going to make a comeback in Venezuela, not as society continues to fail. I'm curious if there will actually be a revolution. This exact same thing happened in Zimbabwe a few years ago, with the currency rapidly becoming worthless and goods becoming difficult to acquire, but the people didn't spring into action. Granted, those two countries exist on entirely different planes, but I'm beginning to doubt that the opposition is competent enough to do anything worthwhile. Zimbabwe at least abandoned the pretense of having a working national currency and "dollarized", with the US dollar being the official currency for government transactions and it (with other hard currencies like the Japanese yen, Chinese yuan, and so forth) also being legal tender elsewhere in the country. So they at least have that going for them, with exchange rates based on the global currency-to-currency value rather than the multi-tiered exchange rate bureaucracy that I'm under the impression exists in Venezuela. And while I admit to not being wholly informed about Zimbabwe's situation, I don't think Mugabe's regime has had any particular interest in blocking people from moving around or bringing things in from neighboring countries the way Maduro's government seems to want to have its fingers in the import/export trade and abuse it for its own ends. If any of this is an inaccurate impression, I'd appreciate correction, of course.
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Aug 15, 2016 01:38
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I'm surprised this hasn't been linked here yet.http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/15/world/venezuela-malaria-mines.html posted:The 12th time Reinaldo Balocha got malaria, he hardly rested at all. With the fever still rattling his body, he threw a pick ax over his shoulder and got back to work — smashing stones in an illegal gold mine. As a computer technician from a big city, Mr. Balocha was ill-suited for the mines, his soft hands used to working keyboards, not the earth. But Venezuela’s economy collapsed on so many levels that inflation had obliterated his salary, along with his hopes of preserving a middle-class life. It's a really great article but unfortunately is illustrating a terrible situation. The PSUV, through its corruption and negligence, is perpetrating an enormous crime against the Venezuelan people.
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Aug 15, 2016 01:49
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And they're turning their county into a post-apocalyptic hellscape, making them well ahead of the rest of the world.quote:Despite the constant churn of workers from across Venezuela, there is a clear order to the mines.
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Aug 15, 2016 02:15
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Is this unnamed man's name Humberto per chance?
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Aug 15, 2016 02:46
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William Bear posted:And they're turning their county into a post-apocalyptic hellscape, making them well ahead of the rest of the world. That excerpt reminds me of a recent Caracas Chronicles piece (http://www.caracaschronicles.com/2016/08/12/pgv-lesson-statecraft) which also discusses how crime bosses have moved in to fill the vacuum left by the state within prisons as they now leave prisoners to their own devices. quote:The 1933 Montevideo Convention on Rights and Duties of States defines a “state” as a space that possess a permanent population, a defined territory and a government that is capable of maintaining effective control over the corresponding territory and of conducting International relations with other states.
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Aug 15, 2016 02:53
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Well maybe the PSUV can all get loving malaria, let a more effective form of parasite deal with the ones infesting your government.
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Aug 15, 2016 05:20
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What is the plan for Venezuelans? Ride out the government, hope things get better?
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Aug 15, 2016 07:21
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The New York Times posted:The 12th time Reinaldo Balocha got malaria, he hardly rested at all. That's one hell of a lede. 
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Aug 15, 2016 07:31
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When I read about the response to the Economic crisis, I am effing glad now the Marxian-literature strand economists in my country are a fringe group. This is how things look when you listen to these 'capitalism is Bad, we need an alternative' peeps, because they really do not have a working alternative. Lols
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Aug 15, 2016 07:36
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Polidoro posted:Is this unnamed man's name Humberto per chance? I laughed when I saw that paired with the text too. Probably the writers subtle "gently caress you" to that guy. Still, I doubt anyone in the police is competent enough to cross reference all dentists with guys named Humberto and try to trace him down. Otoh it gives them a chance to shake down a rich person and demand bribes, and it sounds like that encourages police work like nothing else. Horrifying re: malaria's resurgence.
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Aug 15, 2016 09:42
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Boner Slaem posted:When I read about the response to the Economic crisis, I am effing glad now the Marxian-literature strand economists in my country are a fringe group. This is how things look when you listen to these 'capitalism is Bad, we need an alternative' peeps, because they really do not have a working alternative. There is a working alternative - it's called Democratic socialism. The Nordic Countries are good example of countrys that actually care about doing right by their citizens, and working to work for general health and welfare. I think the Socialist system in Venezuela being such an abysmal failure was because of more than just it being socialist. Rampant government corruption, nationalizations of western owned affiliates, and a government whose main propaganda line is that the US gave Chavez cancer do not inspire confidence in potential investors.
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Aug 15, 2016 09:54
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A White Guy posted:There is a working alternative - it's called Social Democracy. The Nordic Countries are good example of countrys that actually care about doing right by their citizens, and working to work for general health and welfare. Social Democrats and Democratic Socialists are closer in ideology than most, but are not the same. The Nordic nations have many social welfare programs and a heavily regulated economy, but it still is that: A Market Economy. There's no heavy spread ownership of production means or heavily suppressed hierarchies or democratic commune workplaces as an example of the general ideal.
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Aug 15, 2016 10:05
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Saladman posted:I laughed when I saw that paired with the text too. Probably the writers subtle "gently caress you" to that guy. What makes you think that a dentist is the one who put those gold teeth on him? This is legitimately a Venezuelan thing: dental braces are for some reason fashionable, you will see a lot of women with huge fake tits and asses, and dental braces. These are not put in by an orthodontist but rather by clandestine "beauty specialists". I've even heard of people sticking them on their teeth with superglue.
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Aug 15, 2016 10:09
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fnox posted:What makes you think that a dentist is the one who put those gold teeth on him? "One of the Union’s bosses came to the mines years ago to work as a dentist. He still does. But the squads of patrolmen on motorbikes who dominate this place are the real source of his wealth and power. He sports gold chains, two gold teeth — and brass knuckles made of gold." Although I guess it's quite likely that "came to work as a dentist" is not the same thing as "is a licensed dentist who would have some medical license registered in Caracas"... ugh. I hadn't even thought about that before.
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Aug 15, 2016 13:54
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Saladman posted:I laughed when I saw that paired with the text too. Probably the writers subtle "gently caress you" to that guy. Well, to be fair, the police usually know who these guys are. The fact that they're allowed to operate is more of a testament to how little an underfunded and corrupt police system can do against criminal enterprises that have access to better weaponry, – often military grade stuff – money, and for whom the idea of going to prison is not a deterrent, since prisons are also under criminal control. In these circumstances, the police are better off cooperating with guys like him and 'allowing' him to operate in exchange for not getting killed and maybe some kickbacks here and there while they focus on making GBS threads on regular people. Labradoodle fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Aug 15, 2016 |
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Aug 15, 2016 16:07
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Mozi posted:I'm surprised this hasn't been linked here yet. There is no price that the Venezuelan people can pay that is too high for armchair leftists to bear
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Aug 15, 2016 16:31
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Yeah, I can't really criticise. If I were in their shoes I know I'd be the type to accept small bribes and commit petty corruption too -- if I don't steal myself, someone higher up will - and I'd paint a target on my back for being not corrupt and have to worry about my safety and next meal. Sounds pretty awful.
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Aug 15, 2016 16:32
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Saladman posted:Yeah, I can't really criticise. If I were in their shoes I know I'd be the type to accept small bribes and commit petty corruption too -- if I don't steal myself, someone higher up will - and I'd paint a target on my back for being not corrupt and have to worry about my safety and next meal. Sounds pretty awful. I was wondering before, along these lines, if somebody robs you, or commits some other serious crime, and you go to the cops, do they do anything? Do you have to bribe them? How does it work now?
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Aug 15, 2016 16:37
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People have started eating stray dogs Just saw a pic and its so loving disgusting dear god
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Aug 15, 2016 19:29
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El Hefe posted:People have started eating stray dogs Wait until the dogs run out. Pigeons/rats are next in the list. It is truly dismal how ideological certainty and sheer incompetence can bugger an entire nation. Edit: that was supposed to be beggar an entire nation, but the point stands. Austen Tassletine fucked around with this message at 19:54 on Aug 15, 2016 |
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Aug 15, 2016 19:51
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El Hefe posted:People have started eating stray dogs I mean never mind 'how far can this go before people revolt' because honestly with the military on Maduro's side that might never be possible. It feels like we're approaching 'how far before there is literally no more wealth for him and his cronies to squeeze out of the country' because everyone's starving and dying of loving malaria.
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Aug 15, 2016 20:45
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Austen Tassletine posted:Wait until the dogs run out. Pigeons/rats are next in the list. It is truly dismal how ideological certainty and sheer incompetence can bugger an entire nation. The Venezuelan people are definitely well buggered nowadays.
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Aug 15, 2016 21:00
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El Hefe posted:People have started eating stray dogs Does this mean mango season is over?
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Aug 15, 2016 21:17
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Yes, but 'man! go!' season is just around the corner.
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Aug 15, 2016 21:42
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Skeesix posted:Does this mean mango season is over? Yeah people ate all the mangoes already Food is so insanely expensive, I have no idea how can anyone survive earning minimum wage.
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Aug 15, 2016 21:47
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I just saw La Campiña powdered milk is back in stock in a lot of supermarkets around the country, but at a new price: Bs. 4,980 per 900g can, or 22% of the minimum monthly salary.
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Aug 15, 2016 21:52
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Feinne posted:I mean never mind 'how far can this go before people revolt' because honestly with the military on Maduro's side that might never be possible. It feels like we're approaching 'how far before there is literally no more wealth for him and his cronies to squeeze out of the country' because everyone's starving and dying of loving malaria. I honestly never thought it would get this bad, in other failed states the situation might be dire but the informal economy is usually enough to allow regular people to satisfy their basic necessities. I didn't take into account that in this case you have the entire executive branch of the government actively trying to make things worse, blaming the effects of their own incompetence and disastrous policies on economic sabotage and 'wreckers', in some ridiculous, anachronistic echo of East Bloc rhetoric. I'm sure Maduro believes what he's saying, no matter how laughable it seems to us, but he needs to go. He's indirectly killing people.
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Aug 15, 2016 22:23
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Feinne posted:It feels like we're approaching 'how far before there is literally no more wealth for him and his cronies to squeeze out of the country' because everyone's starving and dying of loving malaria. Unfortunately, as long as the oil pumps are still working at all, there will be wealth to squeeze from the country. There's a lot more oil being sold than there are top dogs (no pun intended) in Venezuela. Also I would posit that by intentionally withholding food and medical aid, Maduro is directly killing people.
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Aug 15, 2016 23:15
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I'm just worried about how bad this can get. Starvation and disease each make the other worse, so things could get shittier and shittier slowly until suddenly you have a 28 days later set.
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Aug 15, 2016 23:19
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Even the police are trying to kill each other, some guy got his bike stolen by 3 police officers and they asked for ransom, guy goes to the GAES which is an anti-extortion group and they set up a sting to catch the corrupt police officers, when they are about to arrest the corrupt piece of poo poo cops more of their friends arrive and try to save them. https://twitter.com/elsabonin/status/765256496292753408
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Aug 16, 2016 01:14
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Here's a guy trying to live for a week on minimum wage. I kind of hate the video because the guy is clearly quite posh, but it showcases just how hard it is to feed yourself even meagerly at such a low salary. Most Venezuelans earn less than two minimum wages, so you can imagine what it's like to feed a family of four under such conditions, it also showcases some other problems everyday life presents. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXmBEfGaCbg
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Aug 16, 2016 01:51
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El Hefe posted:Even the police are trying to kill each other, some guy got his bike stolen by 3 police officers and they asked for ransom, guy goes to the GAES which is an anti-extortion group and they set up a sting to catch the corrupt police officers, when they are about to arrest the corrupt piece of poo poo cops more of their friends arrive and try to save them. I'm confused whose on which side. Is just that one guy in the black in yellow hat with GAES and all those other cops are trying to protect the robbers?
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Aug 16, 2016 03:10
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Bumming Your Scene posted:I'm confused whose on which side. Is just that one guy in the black in yellow hat with GAES and all those other cops are trying to protect the robbers? Yes, that's what happened, CONAS is the anti extortion group, somebody shot at their car and that's why they crashed.
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Aug 16, 2016 13:44
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Saladman posted:Unfortunately, as long as the oil pumps are still working at all, there will be wealth to squeeze from the country. There's a lot more oil being sold than there are top dogs (no pun intended) in Venezuela. I mean there is going to eventually be a point where the quality of life for even the shitters on top starts to decline, even if it's just because they can't go to their coke parties without passing bloated corpses on the street or all the hookers are laid out with malaria. You probably already know this from having lived where it's endemic but anyone who still has family in Venezuela, get them mosquito netting and anything else you can because the chances of them getting proper medical attention should they catch malaria seem minimal. Feinne fucked around with this message at 15:46 on Aug 16, 2016 |
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Aug 16, 2016 15:42
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Saladman posted:Unfortunately, as long as the oil pumps are still working at all, there will be wealth to squeeze from the country. There's a lot more oil being sold than there are top dogs (no pun intended) in Venezuela. Wasn't there some story about even the oil fields not getting proper maintenance, or am I just misremembering? I could totally see the Venezuelan government managing to strangle the golden goose.
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Aug 16, 2016 16:37
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Wasn't there some story about even the oil fields not getting proper maintenance, or am I just misremembering? I could totally see the Venezuelan government managing to strangle the golden goose. Yeah, oil production has continuously declined since Chavez took power since oil fields require continuous maintenance and reinvestment to stay productive, and that has not been the government's funding priority. This is on top of other factors such as electricity cuts, corruption, and foreign firms cutting back investment. The situation is bad enough that the countries output is looking at a 27 year low, and about 60% of the production level when Chavez took power. Good luck paying for almost 2 decades of deferred maintenance and exploration costs with oil prices in the toilet. http://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/Venezuela-Oil-Production-Faces-Worse-than-Estimated-Decline.html
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Aug 16, 2016 16:50
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Farmer Crack-rear end posted:Wasn't there some story about even the oil fields not getting proper maintenance, or am I just misremembering? I could totally see the Venezuelan government managing to strangle the golden goose. I'm too lazy to look for the respective articles but both Halliburton and Schlumberger severely cut back on their oil operations in Venezuela earlier this year. As far as Schlumberger went they let go of most non-essential personnel, including a close friend of mine who worked in maintenance for some drilling operations. PDVSA owed both companies billions and after toughing it out for a while they decided to cut their losses for the foreseeable future. This breakup coincided with a steep drop from nearly 2,5 million barrels per day to an average of 2,37 million bpd in May alone. The Venezuelan government is so incompetent they're unable to keep their lifeline pumping. I mean, you'd think they would at least put someone competent at the head of PDVSA, but they're pathologically unable to keep from meddling with any major industry. Labradoodle fucked around with this message at 16:57 on Aug 16, 2016 |
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Aug 16, 2016 16:55
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I'm not surprised. Heavy oil like Venezuela's is a capital hog. It requires a ton of money, constantly being spent, to maintain production. It's why oil companies can have a poo poo ton of income, yet low profits in proportion to their cash flow. I would hazard a guess that as oil prices dropped (probably even before) maintenance and so forth got put permanently on hold to allow the government to siphon off the cash flow for their foreign exchange issues. But now it means that Venezuela is probably three or four major equipment failures from their oil industry going tits up. A major fire or other damage to a major cleaning or upgrading plant could shut in tens of thousands of barrels a day and cost hundreds of millions to fix.
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Aug 16, 2016 17:25
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Gorau posted:But now it means that Venezuela is probably three or four major equipment failures from their oil industry going tits up. A major fire or other damage to a major cleaning or upgrading plant could shut in tens of thousands of barrels a day and cost hundreds of millions to fix. Honestly it seems like that is the best chance for salvation for Venezuela I can think of that's within the realm of possibility, as it would lead to imminent government collapse (and if it didn't, then literally nothing will make it collapse).
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Aug 16, 2016 17:48
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Saladman posted:Honestly it seems like that is the best chance for salvation for Venezuela I can think of that's within the realm of possibility, as it would lead to imminent government collapse (and if it didn't, then literally nothing will make it collapse). Only you can make it collapse. Government will do everything to enrich itself first and foremost, no matter how small its territory becomes. Oil goes out, so loving what? You got illegal gold and lumber to get rid of. Your country can be stripped so loving bare that you make Haiti look like a developed nation what with its Domino's Pizza and operational McDonald's. Mudcakes. Learn how to bake mud into food if you want to survive in Venezuela 10 years from now. Otherwise, organize and rise up against PSUV yourself. Trust me, when oil is gone, you'll loving wish that natural resources were the only thing your government were exploiting. Just wait until your government starts its involvement in human trafficking for hard currency purposes. Get the gently caress out, organize the death of PSUV as a political entity, be sold into sex slavery if lucky or starve to death if you don't learn to bake mud: Which do you prefer? My Imaginary GF fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Aug 16, 2016 |
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Aug 16, 2016 19:40
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