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What I'm curious about is if they update the kind of monsters It changes into. The 50's setting gave him a good in for having all kinds of monster movies on the kids's minds. When they take that and put it in 1989, do they just change it from "saw it at the matinee and got spooked" to "saw it at 3 AM on Channel 8 and got spooked"? The dream here for me is if they somehow are able to use the more setting-relevant aesthetic of like, 80's horror movie villains. I can just imagine some poor kid in this who saw a Friday the 13th and got spooked by it, only for Pennywise to come at him in the form of a lumbering Jason Voorhees with pompoms on his shirt.
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Aug 21, 2016 13:05
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Or a caricature of The Thing. Or the girl from the Exorcist. There's a ton of potential there.
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Aug 21, 2016 13:31
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Ronald Reagan with orange pompoms on his chest. "Mr. Gorbachev, tear this child apart."
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Aug 21, 2016 13:42
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FreezingInferno posted:What I'm curious about is if they update the kind of monsters It changes into. The 50's setting gave him a good in for having all kinds of monster movies on the kids's minds. When they take that and put it in 1989, do they just change it from "saw it at the matinee and got spooked" to "saw it at 3 AM on Channel 8 and got spooked"? Don't forget VHS rentals of all those low budget monster movies, which would be cheaper at the time to rent or buy then more recent movies.
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Aug 21, 2016 14:29
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MrMojok posted:Thanks to this thread, I'm reading IT again for the first time in 23 years. The book has its problems, but drat, what a ride. I don't think I've ever seen anyone in this thread say The Stand as King's favourite work. The Stand is really loving good for about a third (until they get to Boulder) at that point it just becomes an absolute drag to get through
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Aug 21, 2016 16:46
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Like CARRIE, I never got around to reading THE BODY because I had seen the movie like a hundred times, but I read through DIFFERENT SEASONS for the first time and loved it. Both SHAWSHANK and STAND BY ME are pretty faithful to their stories (Though its interesting that in the former, the guy that can get Andy freed is shot whereas in the book he has the much more cynical end of taking a deal to go to a minimum security prison in exchange for keeping quiet) with some minor changes. I thought it was weird how in the movie Chris is the only one who dies but in the book Vern dies in a house fire in a slum and Teddy drives a car full of friends into a pole and kills them. Also, for all the laughing about how King likes to clue you in to someone's fate really early sometimes, the second shot of the movie is a closeup of a headline that says CHRIS CHAMBERS KILLED IN FIGHT, which diminishes the ending a little bit. I think THE BODY is a genuinely great piece of work and overwhelmingly sad. Basically every adult in the story is a fuckup at best, or just straight abusive at worst. Even the shopkeeper that Gordie visits tries to gently caress him over. For all of King's writing and love for small town life, he's just as equally critical of the people within it. DrVenkman fucked around with this message at 19:31 on Aug 21, 2016 |
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Aug 21, 2016 19:25
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A Typical Goon posted:I don't think I've ever seen anyone in this thread say The Stand as King's favourite work. Lot's of people have. Many fans consider it his greatest book. Probably if you polled King fans, The Stand would come out on top. edit: yep http://www.rollingstone.com/culture/lists/readers-poll-the-10-best-stephen-king-books-20141105/it-20141105 http://www.barnesandnoble.com/blog/top-10-must-read-stephen-king-books/ http://www.ranker.com/crowdranked-list/the-very-best-of-stephen-king BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 20:52 on Aug 21, 2016 |
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Aug 21, 2016 20:48
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I read an anecdote (here I think) that King had seen a childhood friend get turned into a pink mist by a train when he was a small child. Went home to his moms in complete and total apoplectic shock. Anyone confirm/deny, have a source?
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Aug 21, 2016 20:49
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A Typical Goon posted:I don't think I've ever seen anyone in this thread say The Stand as King's favourite work. The Stand is really loving good for about a third (until they get to Boulder) at that point it just becomes an absolute drag to get through I give The Stand a lot more credit than it may deserve partially because Larry Underwood is one of my favorite King protagonists (wish he got the main focus instead of Stu), but mainly because I find that Randall Flagg, as he is in The Stand on its own, is the best character that King has written. If I had to chalk up a single favorite it might be Pet Sematary. 'Salem's Lot is up there too.
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Aug 21, 2016 20:49
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DoctorG0nzo posted:I give The Stand a lot more credit than it may deserve partially because Larry Underwood is one of my favorite King protagonists (wish he got the main focus instead of Stu), but mainly because I find that Randall Flagg, as he is in The Stand on its own, is the best character that King has written. Maybe I was being too harsh on the Stand, the whole spy section in Vegas is also very good. Larry is a very strong character and his arc is very well written given the larger themes in the novel. I also really identified with Glen Bateman, I think his transformation from stoic disbeliever to willing sacrifice in the end is very relatable and was well written by King Maybe I didn't like how King seemingly started to write a post disaster survival story and then seemingly changed the tone of the novel to his take on the religious apocalypse story. The book was more enjoyable on a re-read when I was looking for the religious themes and symbolism than the first time when I was bored with the main protagonists by the end and then suddenly God did it
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Aug 21, 2016 21:21
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A Typical Goon posted:Maybe I was being too harsh on the Stand, the whole spy section in Vegas is also very good. Larry is a very strong character and his arc is very well written given the larger themes in the novel. I also really identified with Glen Bateman, I think his transformation from stoic disbeliever to willing sacrifice in the end is very relatable and was well written by King The religious symbolism works and it...doesn't. It depends on how much you can stomach the insane anticlimax of the ending as being thematically important to said religious theme. I see it, I understand it, but I also am still disappointed by it. Glen Bateman was definitely another standout, and I was pleasantly surprised by the amount of focus he got, his death scene being one of the cooler ones in the novel. Another highlight for me was Nadine's backstory, which was horrific - the Ouija board scene might be my favorite King wrote. But Stu was just such a loving drag of a character. Not bad, but not compelling at all. Just there with generic quiet dude wisdom. And the micromanagement of the town gets old.
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Aug 21, 2016 21:25
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A Typical Goon posted:Maybe I was being too harsh on the Stand, the whole spy section in Vegas is also very good. Larry is a very strong character and his arc is very well written given the larger themes in the novel. I also really identified with Glen Bateman, I think his transformation from stoic disbeliever to willing sacrifice in the end is very relatable and was well written by King Lots of folks enjoy a religious apocalypse story, so maybe it's no surprise that the Stand tops the list. Like you though I was into it for the post-disaster survival stuff and found the book increasingly boring after everyone gets to either Good Town or Bad Town and suddenly the main conflict is spiritual instead of physical.
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Aug 21, 2016 21:30
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syscall girl posted:I read an anecdote (here I think) that King had seen a childhood friend get turned into a pink mist by a train when he was a small child. Went home to his moms in complete and total apoplectic shock. Confirm. Source: Danse Macabre
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Aug 21, 2016 21:31
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Thanks to this thread and the upcoming remake, I've finally decided to take the plunge and read IT for the first time. I pretty much know everything that happens due to cultural osmosis, but I'm interested to see how it all plays out (as well as all the stuff with the time period). The Stand was one of the first King books I read, way back when I was in eighth grade. I've re-read the first half or so many times, but have only gone all the way through a handful of times. I love the disease-disaster first third and the postapocalyptic adventure second third, but the spiritual faith journey weirdness of the last third always turns me off (and especially the ending). Even though there are a handful of great bits like "HEY, BOBBY TERRY! YOU SCROOWWWED IT UP!!!"
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Aug 21, 2016 21:31
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syscall girl posted:I read an anecdote (here I think) that King had seen a childhood friend get turned into a pink mist by a train when he was a small child. Went home to his moms in complete and total apoplectic shock. It's true. He doesn't remember it and was only told the story years later. The other incident was when he was a lot older and a friend of his showed up at his house and asked if he wanted to go and see a dead body. It was a local fisherman or something who had drowned. Thirdly is one of the issues that you could probably genuinely call plagiarism on King's part. He was living with another writer when they were both struggling and asked him what he was working on, the writer told him he was working on a story where a group of kids walk along the train tracks to go see the body of a dead dog but he never finished it. He let it pass when he saw it published, but when he saw advertisements for the movie he asked King for a cut and was told no and I don't think they spoke again after that. For what it's worth I don't think he even believes King was being malicious in taking the story, just that he probably locked it away somewhere and didn't think about it until he started work on THE BODY.
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Aug 21, 2016 22:09
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DrVenkman posted:It's true. He doesn't remember it and was only told the story years later. The other incident was when he was a lot older and a friend of his showed up at his house and asked if he wanted to go and see a dead body. It was a local fisherman or something who had drowned. That is interesting. Where does that come from? I suppose this scenario could be a germ for Secret Window...
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Aug 21, 2016 22:38
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:That is interesting. Where does that come from? I suppose this scenario could be a germ for Secret Window... The full quote is from here: http://www.tor.com/2013/01/10/the-great-stephen-king-reread-different-seasons/ quote:But there’s a third, even more important, source for “The Body.” The novella is dedicated to King’s old college friend and roommate, George McLeod, which may be an unintentional act of cruelty. One day, when King was a struggling writer living in Orono, he asked McLeod what he was working on. McLeod described a short story he was writing based on an incident from his childhood in which he and his friends had set out along the railroad tracks to see the corpse of a dead dog. McLeod’s story contained all the incidents that later appeared in King’s “The Body” but McLeod never finished writing it. When he saw his unfinished story appear years later as “The Body” he decided to let it slide. But when the movie adaptation, Stand By Me, came out, McLeod saw a TV commercial for it and decided to contact King. He asked for his name to be on the movie, and for a cut of the money. King refused and their decades-old friendship came to an end.
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Aug 21, 2016 22:52
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/\ /\ /\ /\ /\ That's great. Thanks. On King absorbing unconsciously: I think people who have read certain books that King was reading have noticed stylistic similarities between King and other writers. It has come up in this thread. I don't read much new US fiction so these things have never come to my attention, though I did notice similarities between Matheson/Bloch and early King.
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Aug 21, 2016 22:59
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It's been a long, long time since I reat It. Maybe 20 years or so. But from what I remember, having it set in the '50's really allowed a sort of casual racism, sexism, domestic abuse kind of vibe. Like they were evils which existed, but not really worried about or dealt with, and that's part of the undercurrent of ugliness that Pennywise thrived on. But again, it's been a long time since I read it so I could be remembering things wrong. That said, I don't think it would be a big deal to move the story forward a few decades. A lot of the same social issues exist, except instead of being accepted and ignored they become things people take issue with and defend. Like in the 50's maybe you wouldn't admit to having a black friend (this is maybe a dumb example), but in the 00's you say you aren't racist because you have A Black Friend kind of thing. The racism is still there, but it's changed over the years. Same for whatever other social issues they feel like poisoning Derry with.
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Aug 21, 2016 23:14
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MrMojok posted:I know a lot of people would pick "The Stand", but for me this has always been King's opus. So between Salem's Lot and The Shining I would just ask myself which one I would rather pick up and read right now, and it's almost a dead heat. I think I give the edge to SL though. Just by a hair (standing up on my arm). quote:And the first time I read it in '93, it was especially disturbing because it of this belief I had when I was a kid, that there was some evil thing that grownups just didn't believe in, weren't capable of believing in, but that could be made flesh by my belief in it. And my fear of it. And I thought it could read my mind, and sort of be drawn by my fear.
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Aug 22, 2016 00:14
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:Ronald Reagan with orange pompoms on his chest. DrVenkman please just this once post nothing but: "Print is dead." Dr. Faustus fucked around with this message at 02:30 on Aug 22, 2016 |
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Aug 22, 2016 02:12
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Josef K. Sourdust posted:/\ /\ /\ /\ /\ I think that's the standard for every writer though. You'll always hear that when they started out they would emulate x until they found their own voice. I've never really noticed a lot of other people in King. I know his style has changed over the years, but that's natural as well. It's not too unusual for a writer to absorb ideas. Hell there's been plenty of times I've started writing something only for it to suddenly sound familiar.
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Aug 22, 2016 11:53
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RE: The new timeframes for IT I think I heard that the Duffer Brothers were trying to get an IT movie off the ground for a long time, and after seeing Stranger Things they'd have probably gone with having the kids be rooted in the 80s. The themes, I think, would all still work shifting it forward like that. If anything it'll work better for a modern remake just because you have the contrast of the kid years with something people can actively see around them. Keeping it rooted in the 50s to the 80s will like less of an organic story coming from a creative team that didn't experience it first hand.
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Aug 22, 2016 23:05
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Reading the Dark Tower for the first time now, just finished The Wastelands. What a ride so far. I've heard Wizard + Glass doesn't advance the immediate story and the series then goes off the rails a bit for the latter three books - how much should I be setting myself up for disappointment? I couldn't imagine reading these in real time, especially after the ending to The Wastelands. Six years to clear that up? Yeesh.
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Aug 23, 2016 03:55
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NicelyNice posted:Reading the Dark Tower for the first time now, just finished The Wastelands. What a ride so far. I've heard Wizard + Glass doesn't advance the immediate story and the series then goes off the rails a bit for the latter three books - how much should I be setting myself up for disappointment? I couldn't imagine reading these in real time, especially after the ending to The Wastelands. Six years to clear that up? Yeesh. Wizard and Glass doesn't do much to advance the storyline, but it DOES resolve the cliffhanger at the end of The Wastelands. It's also widely considered to be one of the best books in the series. The best, by many. (My personal favorite is The Wastelands). The series is rushed after that, though. Wolves is enjoyable, but odd. The Dark Tower is pretty good, but the ending to the series as a whole is very controversial. Song of Susannah is just awful.
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Aug 23, 2016 04:00
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NicelyNice posted:Reading the Dark Tower for the first time now, just finished The Wastelands. What a ride so far. I've heard Wizard + Glass doesn't advance the immediate story and the series then goes off the rails a bit for the latter three books - how much should I be setting myself up for disappointment? I couldn't imagine reading these in real time, especially after the ending to The Wastelands. Six years to clear that up? Yeesh. Wizard & Glass is a great book but you're right in that it doesn't advance the story much at all - it's an extended flashback, tracing Roland's first year as a gunslinger. After that... Yeah, things go crazy. On the other hand, it's been my experience that a lot of folks that read the series for the first time now that it's done tend to not judge the last three books nearly as harshly as those of us that waited a long rear end time for frankly mediocre (at best) books. Also, when you get to the end of The Dark Tower, there's a STUPID loving INTERRUPTION by King - skip that poo poo and move on to the last chapter. Trust me on this, it'll only detract from your enjoyment.
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Aug 23, 2016 04:01
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Cheers. The rough outlines I've received so far (Drawing of the Three is about introducing characters, the eponymous Wasteland doesn't show up until the conclusion) have helped me enjoy the individual books so much more after halfway expecting seven novels about tearing through the desert. I'm sure knowing Wizard and Glass is a flashback will allow me to savor the book for what it is, rather than racing through expecting to get caught up in real time. The flashback in Iron Council by China Mievelle is one of my favorite bits of his writing, but I blazed through it the first time I read through expecting it to end anytime instead of comprising like 1/4 of the book. (not really a spoiler, but it's about a diff. author, so I'll take care)
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Aug 23, 2016 04:40
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I wouldn't say Song of Susannah is awful, but it is definitely the worst of the 7. I liked the bits with John Cullum at least. It does end on a cliffhanger I found even more annoying than the Wastelands one (ignoring the 6 year wait which would have probably made me hate it more, to be fair). Wolves of the Calla is alright if you can stomach King making people talk like idiots with made up words. I think the annoyance with the pop culture stuff like the light sabers and harry potter poo poo is a little overblown, but it is still kind of goofy. Then the last one I think has some of my favorite/most memorable parts of the series but also some of the worst, and I second skipping the annoying interruption bit where he berates you for wanting to know the ending. Still great overall.
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Aug 23, 2016 11:22
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I went back and reread the 7th book about a month ago and I forgot how loving boring so much of it is. The books about 700 pages and I feel like it could have been 400 and lost almost nothing. I'm reading parts and willing myself to not just skip pages buts its like Come on Steve I don't care about alot of this poo poo. Pimli's past who cares, 4 pages describing hunting a deer and skinning it who loving cares.
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Aug 23, 2016 15:07
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There's a comic book version of the flash back portion of Wizard and Glass. If you find yourself slogging through the book you could get the gist that way. Edit: Fair warning, its been years since I read either. Also thhat vvvvvvvv deoju fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Aug 23, 2016 |
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Aug 23, 2016 18:19
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Wizard and the Glass is awesome just read the book.
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Aug 23, 2016 18:26
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Wizard and Glass is also the last good Dark Tower book. I get some folks like Calla (especially Salems' Lot fans) but the last 3 were so impacted by Kings near fatal accident in 1999 - in between Glass and Calla - it's hard to overlook and really interferes with the story, at least in my opinion. Literally hard to overlook, as those who have read them know (I don't want to spoil them). The big divide on W&G comes between people who read the series as it was released - and thus waited nearly 7 years between Wastelands and W&G - and those who read it one after another post release. If you can jump right to W&G after Wastelands, it's a pretty decent book (though I think the cliffhanger conclusion was rushed). I like the Mejas stuff a lot. On the other hand if you picked up W&G after 7 years of waiting out the cliffhanger ending of Wastelands you might have been more than a little annoyed with how A) quickly that was wrapped (short and to the point and entirely predicable) and B) how the story of the Ka-tet basically stops dead while we get Roland's backstory. And then another 6 year wait until Calla came out. No big deal these days but at the time it had fans frothing at the mouth.
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Aug 23, 2016 18:44
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Wizard and Glass was my favorite when I read the series all in a row. Since then I've kinda come to the realization that of the first 4 books, the favorite constantly switches, depending on my mood. I think it's cause The Dark Tower, at its best, is a combination of three distinct elements (spooky western, post-apocalyptic, and crazy dimension-hopping) and the first four kinda strike a perfect balance of these elements between them. So, basically: Drawing of the Three is my favorite when I'm in the mood for the crazy dimension-hopping feel. Waste Lands is my favorite when I want the post-apocalypse vibe, because it has that the most heavily. Wizard and Glass is best when I'm in the mood for a spooky western (which is what drew me to the series in the first place, and it's why it stands out to me). And The Gunslinger is like a nice sample platter of those three elements. It's also the trippiest and most "literary", which I'm frequently in the mood for and appeals heavily to me. That being said the non-flashback plot of Wizard and Glass is comically anticlimactic. I actually like how they handled the Blaine cliffhanger at the beginning, but that would've been best just at the end of Waste Lands. Could it really not be 30 pages longer, Steve? And as for the ending, where they stumble into the Emerald City where the Tick Tock Man is for some reason, take him out with literally no problem, and Randall Flagg just sorta pops in for a minute like "lmao remember The Stand guys?" well, that poo poo was just weird. It's like Stephen King wanted to shoehorn plot development into a flashback book but realized it was already long as hell so he just rushed the poo poo out of it instead of properly fleshing out a showdown. The one disappointment in that book for me, but the rest is good enough for me to count it as a favorite.
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Aug 23, 2016 19:00
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Ixian posted:Wizard and Glass is also the last good Dark Tower book. I think the general consensus is that The Wind Through the Keyhole is pretty good.
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Aug 23, 2016 19:07
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Ornamented Death posted:I think the general consensus is that The Wind Through the Keyhole is pretty good. Fair enough, I forgot about "4.5". It is pretty good, albeit not exactly essential to the overall story.
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Aug 23, 2016 19:19
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the gunslinger (unrevised) is th ebest book in the series and it aint close.
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Aug 23, 2016 21:08
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Groovelord Neato posted:the gunslinger (unrevised) is th ebest book in the series and it aint close. I don't think anyone indicated otherwise.
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Aug 23, 2016 21:10
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Ornamented Death posted:I don't think anyone indicated otherwise. I did. My favorite is The Wastelands,and it's not even close. Come-commala, motherfuckers.
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Aug 23, 2016 21:52
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How does it feel to be so incredibly wrong about things? The Gunslinger, in the unedited version, is easily the best of the books.
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Aug 23, 2016 22:13
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Khizan posted:How does it feel to be so incredibly wrong about things? I wouldn't know! I'll let you know if it ever happens.
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Aug 23, 2016 22:29
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