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MMM Whatchya Say posted:Then again, Beyond Earth Is great, and my personal favorite entry in the franchise to date. 
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Aug 29, 2016 22:31
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Beyond Earth isn't necessarily bad, at least, not in the same way vanilla CiV was. It's just really loving boring, and miasma is dumb, and I have ADHD and literally can't read the tech web
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Aug 29, 2016 22:41
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majormonotone posted:Beyond Earth isn't necessarily bad, at least, not in the same way vanilla CiV was. It's just really loving boring, and miasma is dumb, and I have ADHD and literally can't read the tech web Except it tries to be a spiritual successor to SMAC while also providing a more generic environment. That's part of why it's boring: the factions have no flavour except in the civilopedia, so it's hard to care. The VAs reading the tech quotes sound fairly bored, too, and then there's the lack of dialogue for buildings... It's a bland puréed mess.
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Aug 29, 2016 22:53
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Vanilla Beyond Earth was just a really fancy Civ V mod, with all that entails. Rising Tide helped Beyond Earth quite a lot. I really liked the diplomacy overhaul, and I hope they incorporate at least some of the best elements of it (war score, cooperative relationships automatically giving open borders, the ease of the respect/fear system) into Civ VI. The newer leaders were better and had some more character to them too, although the vanilla ones were still lame. Also the KP's special power sucked so hard, they really should've retooled them after cutting the religion analogue from the vanilla during development. Affinities should've had more to do with what you actually do rather than what you research too. Quests could've been good but even now I find a number of them to be buggy as hell, especially the multi-part ones. Honestly, the game's biggest problem was bringing it's science-fiction to the fore, integrating it with play, and giving it a distinctive voice, like SMAC or even Call To Power. That would've made it 99% better. I still like BERT a lot though, as I'm much better at it than Civ V. 
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Aug 30, 2016 00:52
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The best game In the series was Civ Rev and you're dumb if you think anything else
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Aug 30, 2016 01:21
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Aerdan posted:Except it tries to be a spiritual successor to SMAC while also providing a more generic environment. That's part of why it's boring: the factions have no flavour except in the civilopedia, so it's hard to care. The VAs reading the tech quotes sound fairly bored, too, and then there's the lack of dialogue for buildings... It's a bland puréed mess. Before release, they'd continuously avoided saying that they wanted to be a spiritual successor to SMAC. I mean, it's easy to take that as PR speak, but they were very conscious about not wanting to be directly compared to that game.
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Aug 30, 2016 01:22
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If you're trying to ape SMAC you're going to get a poo poo game because SMAC was a poo poo game.Darth Windu posted:The best game In the series was Civ Rev and you're dumb if you think anything else Civ Rev is a really really good idea for a game but every 4x maker wants to make their retarded sci-fi/fantasy game.
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Aug 30, 2016 01:22
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Cythereal posted:Is great, and my personal favorite entry in the franchise to date. I didn't even dislike BE all that much, but it was admittedly flawed. majormonotone posted:Beyond Earth isn't necessarily bad, at least, not in the same way vanilla CiV was. It's just really loving boring, and miasma is dumb, and I have ADHD and literally can't read the tech web This is true though, it was flawed in ways that civ won't really have to deal with
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Aug 30, 2016 01:28
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:I didn't even dislike BE all that much, but it was admittedly flawed. Flawed, but I like it a lot with Rising Tide.
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Aug 30, 2016 01:34
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Cythereal posted:Flawed, but I like it a lot with Rising Tide. It's ok bud I never said you couldn't I mean I like civ v so
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Aug 30, 2016 01:41
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My issue with BE was that it was advertised as this kind of dynamic/emergent kind of game where every decision influences which direction you go but at the end of the day, the only decisions that really affected your affinity were the techs you researched. There were the quests, sure, but science still steered the ship, so to speak. They also had a golden opportunity to turn the leaders into organic abominations, Space Marines, or augmented cybernetic terminators and chose to simply change their clothes and eye color. The IP begs the question "What does it mean to be human?" but they never went far enough. Rising Tide did add a lot of flavor and gave BE its own voice but unless another x-pac comes out that further pushes it into the sci-fi realm, it will never live up to its potential. Civ VI, on the other hand, seems to have learned a lot of BE. The expanded cities seem to genuinely put a ton of choices on the player's plate and it truly does influence what happens later in the game. It isn't selling the emergent gameplay as much BE did but it sure as hell looks like it has more emergent gameplay than BE ever did. Just watching the livestreams and whatnot, it seemed like every turn was a fork in the road. That's drat impressive and I hope it gives the game a lot of longevity.
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Aug 30, 2016 01:42
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FooF posted:My issue with BE was that it was advertised as this kind of dynamic/emergent kind of game where every decision influences which direction you go but at the end of the day, the only decisions that really affected your affinity were the techs you researched. There were the quests, sure, but science still steered the ship, so to speak. They also had a golden opportunity to turn the leaders into organic abominations, Space Marines, or augmented cybernetic terminators and chose to simply change their clothes and eye color. The IP begs the question "What does it mean to be human?" but they never went far enough. The thing with BE is that it's designed to feed the player a steady stream of decisions which seem superficially important to make it feel like you're constantly doing things, but everything is so homogenous that most of the decisions you make don't particularly matter. And the ones that do are generally no-brainers.
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Aug 30, 2016 01:54
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do you want 2 energy this turn or 1 more energy a turn for the rest of the game?
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Aug 30, 2016 01:56
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Or the infamous "+1 Production from Trade Depots or Trade Convoys are immune to alien attacks."  I'm not seeing that kind of idiotic stuff in Civ VI, though. I'm not sure if that's because we just haven't seen enough or because the the competence of the Dev team on Civ VI is just that much better. Civ VI will have its issues, sure, but some of the stuff in BE at launch was pants-on-head retarded. FooF fucked around with this message at 02:39 on Aug 30, 2016 |
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Aug 30, 2016 02:36
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I feel like they were yusing beyond earth to toy around with some ideas, and they certainly found some things not to do
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Aug 30, 2016 02:41
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FooF posted:I'm not seeing that kind of idiotic stuff in Civ VI, though. I'm not sure if that's because we just haven't seen enough or because the the competence of the Dev team on Civ VI is just that much better. 
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Aug 30, 2016 02:41
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FooF posted:Or the infamous "+1 Production from Trade Depots or Trade Convoys are immune to alien attacks." That doesn't exist. Trade depots could be +1 production or +2 (I think) energy. Ultrasonic fences could make your trade routes immune to alien attack or increase the range on the fence from 2 tiles out to 3. I actually like BE a lot but it does have a lot of no brainer decisions in it and it really gets dragged down by how all of the win conditions are lovely.
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Aug 30, 2016 02:42
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Every single win condition is "well, I'm already scientifically dominant but I have to sit here for up to 50 more turns until the game says it's over."
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Aug 30, 2016 02:53
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Failboattootoot posted:That doesn't exist. Trade depots could be +1 production or +2 (I think) energy. Ultrasonic fences could make your trade routes immune to alien attack or increase the range on the fence from 2 tiles out to 3. I think he was referring to the pre-Rising Tide autoplant quest: +1 energy from autoplants, or +1 trade route. That was pretty drat overpowered, and was justifiably nerfed. Then we got Rising Tide Hutama and Daoming. I really like Beyond Earth, but yeah for a lot of gameplay mechanics it's hard to defend.
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Aug 30, 2016 02:54
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:I feel like they were yusing beyond earth to toy around with some ideas, and they certainly found some things not to do The impression I'm getting is that Beyond Earth was a comparatively low-budget cash-in that was meant to tide them over between releases of their headline games. They almost certainly did not have their A-team working on it.
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Aug 30, 2016 02:55
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I think it would have been cool, and given BE its own voice, if the track of the game was the player retreading the paths of the precursor aliens, and how they speciated into their own version of Purity/Supremacy/Harmony. So physical ruins would be remnants of Purity, barely-functioning upload servers would be remnants of Supremacy, and the wildlife would be remnants of Harmony. Kind of what Endless Space did with the Concrete and Virtual Endless. Your goal would have been to rise above their mistakes (maybe because all we have to maintain our longevity is a reluctance to use planet-busters).
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Aug 30, 2016 02:59
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Cythereal posted:I think he was referring to the pre-Rising Tide autoplant quest: +1 energy from autoplants, or +1 trade route. That was pretty drat overpowered, and was justifiably nerfed. Daoming was better before Rising Tide. People lost their minds over the free wonders, neglecting that most of the wonders are still not worth the effort thanks to being attached to middle-of-nowhere techs and just mediocre in general that getting them for free is a tiny bump.
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Aug 30, 2016 03:01
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Phobophilia posted:I think it would have been cool, and given BE its own voice, if the track of the game was the player retreading the paths of the precursor aliens, and how they speciated into their own version of Purity/Supremacy/Harmony. So physical ruins would be remnants of Purity, barely-functioning upload servers would be remnants of Supremacy, and the wildlife would be remnants of Harmony. Kind of what Endless Space did with the Concrete and Virtual Endless. Your goal would have been to rise above their mistakes (maybe because all we have to maintain our longevity is a reluctance to use planet-busters). Huh. I always got the impression the "aliens" in Beyond Earth were actually humans monkeying with time. Failboattootoot posted:Daoming was better before Rising Tide. People lost their minds over the free wonders, neglecting that most of the wonders are still not worth the effort and usually attached to middle-of-nowhere techs. There's a hard cap on how much you can speed up workers, though, and I've been able to snag slumber-slaughter extract in most of my games. Instantly grabbing the Ectogenesis Pod, Resurrection Device, Euphotic Strand, and the like does save a good clip of time. Also, in case anyone thought Beyond Earth was balanced? I'm playing a game right now, and one of my cities has every farm tile pumping out 5 production, 3 food, 2 science, and 1 energy. Cythereal fucked around with this message at 03:07 on Aug 30, 2016 |
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Aug 30, 2016 03:02
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I played BE like once during a free weekend, and that was it. I can't remember anything about the canon plot. Thanks for reading my fanfiction.
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Aug 30, 2016 03:04
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Whenever I consider playing BE again I just boot up Alpha Centauri and play a real game. 
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Aug 30, 2016 03:12
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iirc BE had really interesting and creative lire that they just... Never showed you basically? Like you could go into the civpedia to read about it but if you didn't it was basically just "there's a weird creature here, +1 to food or whatever" or "no village was ruined by trade"
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Aug 30, 2016 03:40
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Peas and Rice posted:Whenever I consider playing BE again I just boot up Alpha Centauri and play a real game. Doesn't it slow down your real game to have AC running in the background though?
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Aug 30, 2016 04:14
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:iirc BE had really interesting and creative lire that they just... Never showed you basically? Prime example of this is one of the wonders basically gives out immortality and gameplay wise nothing comes of it.
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Aug 30, 2016 04:25
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blackmongoose posted:Doesn't it slow down your real game to have AC running in the background though? I don't see why having either AC or BE running on his computer would slow down his game of Seven Wonders
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Aug 30, 2016 15:03
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Gandhi's video is up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUlzrcpSPFE Very religion-heavy. Video also shows infantry and mobilized infantry for the first time I believe.
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Aug 30, 2016 15:06
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India, yay! For those who can't watch the video, they get faith for each civ they've met that have founded a religion (but not when they're at war with that civ!) and enjoy the founder bonuses in their cities (including from religions they haven't founded). Civs declaring war on India suffer from additional unhappiness penalties. Their unique unit lowers combat strength of adjacent enemy units, and their unique tile improvement yields bonus housing, extra food if next to farms, and extra faith if next to holy sites. I've always enjoyed playing as India and this game looks to be no exception. Gwaint fucked around with this message at 15:11 on Aug 30, 2016 |
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Aug 30, 2016 15:07
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Boo Gandhi
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Aug 30, 2016 15:11
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They automatically get the Civ4 Statue of Zeus effect (extra war weariness when fighting the civ that owns the wonder). I hated that thing in my games. Getting founder belief benefits sounds potentially handy, though I don't have any faith (ha!) that the AI will be any better at picking beliefs in Civ6 than they are in Civ5.
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Aug 30, 2016 15:20
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I must say that I have big hopes for the Civ6 opening intro in the game and it's DLCs. They have always been chillingly good, and they better not disappoint this time. Is the trailer that I've seen it? The "we are".
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Aug 30, 2016 16:01
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Vahakyla posted:I must say that I have big hopes for the Civ6 opening intro in the game and it's DLCs. They have always been chillingly good, and they better not disappoint this time. Is the trailer that I've seen it? The "we are". Naw. Parts of it may be used like the civ 5 announcement trailer but it probably isn't in its entirety.
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Aug 30, 2016 16:13
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Vahakyla posted:I must say that I have big hopes for the Civ6 opening intro in the game and it's DLCs. They have always been chillingly good, and they better not disappoint this time. Is the trailer that I've seen it? The "we are". They really are good, whether you like BE or not, the intro loving owns: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=28VDunrSCYk
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Aug 30, 2016 16:16
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MMM Whatchya Say posted:While I expect civ vi to be flawed on release, I think it's reasonable to expect it to be better than civ v was. It was built on the same limited shovelware Civ5 engine and I'm surprised people who saw how limited Civ5 was bought it.
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Aug 30, 2016 20:21
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India's curious; it doesn't appear to favor a particular strategy - Religious is closest since you'll likely afford to purchase plenty more Faith units than average, but there's still nothing like Spain's instant-conversion through Conquistadors. They do lend themselves to faster growth and spreading wide (to encourage other Civs to spread their religion to India). Looking at the Follower Belief list, only two are direct Faith enhancers - most of them boost cities in one way or another. Follower Beliefs posted:Divine Inspiration: All world wonders provide +4 Faith.
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Aug 30, 2016 20:41
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Hogama posted:India's curious; it doesn't appear to favor a particular strategy - Religious is closest since you'll likely afford to purchase plenty more Faith units than average, but there's still nothing like Spain's instant-conversion through Conquistadors. So Ghandi's ability mostly affects the Civ6 equivalent of "Panetheons" and not the 2nd or 3rd belief you'd get upon following a religion? That's worse than I expected, but watching some streams of people getting multiple Workboat/Culture pantheons, I can see how it would be busted to go further than that. It's basically one of the Piety policies for free, right?
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Aug 30, 2016 20:59
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Hmmm, if you get the annoying war weariness crap from warring with Gandhi, it sounds like you're very incentivized to take him out early when the extermination will be much faster due to fewer cities.
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Aug 30, 2016 21:10
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