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Torquemadras posted:I think Bloodborne's approach is the best of them all - aside from status/special effects and a minor bonus to defense, armor is almost entirely a fashion choice. WHICH IS HOW IT SHOULD BE. I'm actually glad traditional DS1 poise is dead forever. Perhaps it has more of a place in a slower game like DS3, but overall, good riddance, the only acceptable way of tanking damage is while performing a giant gently caress-off hammer swing The fashion tax sucks just because armor doesn't do anything in particular. For my part, I actually liked finding a balance of "useful" and "doesn't look like poo poo" but I get why people wouldn't.
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Aug 29, 2016 15:19
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Torquemadras posted:Controversial opinion incoming: DS3's greatest flaw is the fashion tax. I am 100% unironic here, folks Yeah I'll sign off on this. The fashion tax is a product of heavy armor being useless (since it wouldn't be a tax but a solid investment if it weren't), so if you lump these two issues into one I'd agree 100%. I'm not a PVPer though so my complaints are limited to single-player.
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Aug 29, 2016 15:23
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Torquemadras posted:Controversial opinion incoming: DS3's greatest flaw is the fashion tax. I am 100% unironic here, folks Yeah
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Aug 29, 2016 15:46
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Is the fashion tax having to wear armor in every slot or getting murdered by stiff breezes? I always loved playing as a naked guy with a sack or other mask on his head with a huge weapon, and was saddened when I found out that I had to at least wear some rags to get like a 50% reduction. Nothing like being a naked barbarian killing gods and putting out their lovely fire. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhy9--YRBD8
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Aug 29, 2016 15:52
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Maleh-Vor posted:Is the fashion tax having to wear armor in every slot or getting murdered by stiff breezes? It's that and leveling endurance so you don't fat roll when wearing heavy armor.
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Aug 29, 2016 15:54
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I thought DS3 was the most permissive so far in that there is barely any difference between mid and fast roll, and the fact that you get mid roll up until 70% equip load. It sucks that the equip load rings are kind of poo poo, but staying under 70 still feels pretty reasonable.
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Aug 29, 2016 16:02
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did they buff any good faith weapons or am i stuck still using a lightning infused longsword?
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Aug 29, 2016 16:03
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RBA Starblade posted:Which is more fun to use, the Wolf Knight's Greatsword or the Farron Greatsword? I've decided I want to spin and slide everywhere this time but not how. I reckon Farron personally, it doesn't actually use any focus and you breakdance.
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Aug 29, 2016 16:12
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Iretep posted:did they buff any good faith weapons or am i stuck still using a lightning infused longsword? a lightning infused dark sword gets an S in faith scaling. raw astora's straight sword is the best long sword I've run across though
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Aug 29, 2016 16:19
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Iretep posted:did they buff any good faith weapons or am i stuck still using a lightning infused longsword? Lothric Knight's Greatsword is really good for faith builds; it doesn't scale with faith, but it has prepacked lightning damage that can be further buffed by lightning blade and other infusions.
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Aug 29, 2016 17:42
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Might do a pure-faith caster build with the dragonslayer axe if I can buff it. Or maybe just a plain old raw mace.
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Aug 29, 2016 17:51
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RBA Starblade posted:The fashion tax sucks just because armor doesn't do anything in particular. For my part, I actually liked finding a balance of "useful" and "doesn't look like poo poo" but I get why people wouldn't. yea it'd be fine if heavier armor was actually worth anything, but it's not. going from light to heavy armor doesn't make enough of a difference to worry about Torquemadras posted:What's up with NG3, anyway? I keep hearing it's incredibly bad... it's incredibly bad
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Aug 29, 2016 18:39
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I've got my punchy character going through ng+ and I keep alternating between full havels and lighter stuff like gundyr's and whatever I feel like and it makes a little difference but not much of one considering how many points I have to put in to normal roll while in full Havel's.
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Aug 29, 2016 18:44
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Ninkobei posted:a lightning infused dark sword gets an S in faith scaling. raw astora's straight sword is the best long sword I've run across though The correct nomenclature for the raw infused astora straight sword is RAW rear end.
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Aug 29, 2016 20:07
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I'm messing around with a dual mannequin claw build. Anything I should know? I have dex at 40 and am working on getting hp and end up to like 26 or 27 each. I should cap at like 65, and I think I may leave my weapons at like +6. Anything else I should change?
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Aug 29, 2016 20:54
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Doing for a dungeons and dragon style cleric with medium armor, mace and board. What are the essential cleric spells? Heal, a weapon buff like blessed weapon, and maybe something else? I think I want to be more of a simple fighter with some faith based utility, since faith based attack sucks.
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Aug 29, 2016 22:10
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Nioh ends up being quite different since you have to watch the enemies stamina more than their attack strings. And you have to drain the bigger Yokai enemies stamina before you can do real damage. Once you know how to do it it's pretty easy but gets a bit tedious, imo. The high stance dodge triggers the stamina regain so slash - slash - dodge becomes really powerful. I still think Dark Souls is better balanced in most cases though Nioh has potential.
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Aug 30, 2016 00:05
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I have had the worst Souls day ever. To begin, my stupid D&D styled mace wielding cleric was stopped dead in her tracks in Irithyl. Gone is the maelstrom of backstabs and 2 shots with my Lothric knight sword. Despite my mace ~3 shotting pontiff knights, the thing swings slower than a frozen club covered in molasses in the arctic, it consumes stamina like a fish does water, and more often than not I found myself swinging in place. Unlike swords, and basically everything else, you take very little steps when swinging the mace. Often I'd find myself coming out of a roll swinging in place, while the enemy danced away and let me drain my stamina. This got me killed during the Pontiff fight twice. I beat Pontiff my first time ever facing him for the first time months ago, so this is my first time losing to him. Then, to pile on the lovely, lazy coding of the wonky as gently caress hit boxes, back stabs. I don't know if blunt weapons are to blame, but I counted about 8 times where I would execute the backstab animation, even hear the whoooom sound it makes, and see my character do an exaggerated swing, only to have enemies whirl away and pound me while I was trapped in this animation cycle. Pontiff knights were the worst at this. In my mounting frustration I asked a new friend if he'd help me clear out Irithyl. He stopped playing battlefield and logged in, and thats when summon signs decided not to work. I had the online option enabled, matchmaking was on, and our passwords matched, but nothing. He kept sending me screenshots of his location and sign, and it was the same as mine. I'd have to log out, log back in, and then it'd work... only to have us invaded ever single loving time. Which turned out to be twice, because after the 50 minutes it took us to unfuck the multiplayer, I was at my wits end. I couldn't tolerate anymore janky, wonky lovely code, problematic and broken multiplayer, and insufferable fun-ruiners who poo poo in my face as soon as I was ready to play the game. Oh, and every NPC invader in Irithyl invaded me. I lost an ember to the Pale shade of Londor, Creighton did some weird glitch where he would duck into a wall, then jet through the floor and hit me, and Alva, who I didn't know was in the game, also made a token appearance and janked me in the stairway of the Irithyl dungeon. I thought about playing something else, but the only two other games I have are DS 2 and bloodborne, also lovely games. My PS 4 should be behind glass at a torture device museum in Europe. I'm about to take my DS 3 disc to the gun range this weekend, and strap a dose of tannerite to it, but I'll give it a few days while I figure out how to unfuck my build. lite_sleepr fucked around with this message at 02:05 on Aug 30, 2016 |
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Aug 30, 2016 01:53
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Enemies being able to walk out of backstabs while you're initiating them is intensely annoying.
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Aug 30, 2016 02:25
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And far too common. DS 2 was even worse than this, because you had that stupid rear end animation cycle where you'd hit them in the shoulder, then do a dumb flurry combo hit. This is the first time these have ever happened to me. Maybe it is just maces that are prone to it. Who knows. Can you trade tougnes for respecing?
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Aug 30, 2016 02:31
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RBA Starblade posted:Enemies being able to walk out of backstabs while you're initiating them is intensely annoying. I have no idea why they didn't keep the quick punch of animation from DS2. Missing a stab wasn't so bad when the trigger animation was just the short punch. Now if you get a fake stab you have to watch your idiot character plunge his sword into thin air and draw it back, totally immobilized. And then the fat lady you were trying to backstab crushes you into pulp.
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Aug 30, 2016 02:32
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it's funny you say that because I can't ever remember missing more backstabs than in dark souls 2
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Aug 30, 2016 03:58
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DS3's backstabs are janky for a really stupid reason. See, on every enemy that can be backstabbed, there's a zone for initiating the animation and one for actually triggering the backstab, and they're not the same thing.  The effect is so bad that you can continuously fail to backstab a stationary enemy. (This screenshot depicting the problem was taken months ago, but I'm guessing it hasn't been fixed since.)
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Aug 30, 2016 04:13
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The dark souls 2 method was way less frustrating because the sync occurred after you physically hit the enemy, so it was clear and explainable why it did or didn't work, whereas in dark souls 3 it happens at some invisible point after you press attack which suddenly snaps the enemy into the sync. Also dark souls 2 had awesome critical animations that matched the weapon type why did they take that out
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Aug 30, 2016 04:22
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After cooling off and playing offline, I went back and avenged myself of Alva. Got his armor too after a sprint thru the dungeon. I like the look of it, and something about a wayfaring knight seems neat, so I've like Alva since DS 2. His big curved sword sure is a bag of puke though. So bad.
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Aug 30, 2016 04:36
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Manatee Cannon posted:it's funny you say that because I can't ever remember missing more backstabs than in dark souls 2 I really don't remember missing backstabs in DS1 or 2 outside of PvP. Certainly not to the extent at which I've missed backstabs on enemies in DS3.
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Aug 30, 2016 05:21
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lite_sleepr posted:After cooling off and playing offline, I went back and avenged myself of Alva. Got his armor too after a sprint thru the dungeon. I like the look of it, and something about a wayfaring knight seems neat, so I've like Alva since DS 2. I'm going to add some extra salt on the murakumo DS3 edition: it uses more stamina than the exile greatsword. It only does slightly more damage than the carthus curved greatsword while using way more stamina and weighting more. So it's basically poo poo compared to the other two curved greatswords.
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Aug 30, 2016 09:18
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Internet Kraken posted:I have no idea why they didn't keep the quick punch of animation from DS2. Because that's not quite how DS1 did it. How DS3 does it is a modified version of how DS1 does it with an extra step. You should be noticing this as a recurring theme by now. DS3 is DS1 with a new coat of paint, and for once a statement like that is only barely an exaggeration. Tallgeese fucked around with this message at 09:43 on Aug 30, 2016 |
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Aug 30, 2016 09:32
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The only reason DS3's backstabs can miss is because DS2 started that stupid idea (after PvPers complained about it endlessly). There was nothing wrong with Demons and DS1 backstabs, but they listened to the complaints and we got DS2 and DS3 style backstabs that can miss.
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Aug 30, 2016 11:05
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I can't really complain about how backstabs work now, since I don't do much PvP, but as a PvE thing, I'm glad they tweaked backstabs from DS1. They were absurdly easy to pull off and made a wide range of enemies utterly trivial in single combat. I'm still not very happy with the DS3 model, which has that strange hiccup with failing backstabs, and that's not fun either. As a result, backstabs pretty much vanished from my arsenal. It's not much of a loss, admittedly, but I wish they had some other mechanic to make up for it. ...oh, what's that? That mechanic already exists? It's stunning enemies when hitting them with charged-up attacks from behind, allowing a critical followup attack? WOW! Too bad it's in another game. Seriously, all that Bloodborne was missing were weapon-specific backstab/parry animations, and I'd rate it the superior mechanic in the entire series. EXTREME FISTING has its value, sure, but the weapons are just too rad not to have those. It's funny how so many complaints would've been easily dismissed by GIT GUD if this were the first (or rather, the first widely-known) game.  It really shows that the series has truly matured......and needs to die
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Aug 30, 2016 11:38
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DatonKallandor posted:The only reason DS3's backstabs can miss is because DS2 started that stupid idea (after PvPers complained about it endlessly). ...should we tell him that DS1 backstabs could and would often miss because they were buggy pieces of crap that didn't handle network lag well, folks?
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Aug 30, 2016 12:06
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It wasn't a gameplay mechanic that allowed backstabs to miss in DkS1 though, it was a bug. Backstabs were consistent for everything but PvP-- which also describes a dozen other mechanics in this series.
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Aug 30, 2016 12:31
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It became a gameplay mechanic, funny enough. Especially positioning yourself just right so that they would do the backstab animation into air, which should sound awfully familiar.
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Aug 30, 2016 12:58
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Torquemadras posted:Seriously, all that Bloodborne was missing were weapon-specific backstab/parry animations, and I'd rate it the superior mechanic in the entire series. EXTREME FISTING has its value, sure, but the weapons are just too rad not to have those. On the other hand, decoupling the backstab and parry damage from weapon used means a whole lot of dumb weapon juggling (parry - switch to dagger/quickly two-hand for more damage) is gone which is awesome. Weapon specific animations are really cool though - wish we could have both.
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Aug 30, 2016 13:01
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quote:...oh, what's that? That mechanic already exists? It's stunning enemies when hitting them with charged-up attacks from behind, allowing a critical followup attack? WOW! Almost nothing ever stayed still long enough to land that charged attack to the butt so it was largely useless.
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Aug 30, 2016 13:22
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The brutal and repeated nerfs to backstabbing is one of the best things about dark souls game progression
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Aug 30, 2016 13:24
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Miyazaki should just release a pure demo version of DS 3 that plays itself. That way he can simply show us how he wants the game to be played :no faith or backstabs. Only sword and shield.
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Aug 30, 2016 13:26
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RBA Starblade posted:Almost nothing ever stayed still long enough to land that charged attack to the butt so it was largely useless. I've watched people do it even on incredibly mobile bosses like OoK so this isn't really true, you have to be good to do it though.
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Aug 30, 2016 13:28
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Sakurazuka posted:I've watched people do it even on incredibly mobile bosses like OoK so this isn't really true, you have to be good to do it though. Do you have a video? That sounds rad. For me Orphan of Kos spent so much time in the air I wouldn't think to even try. Against bosses I mostly just chain-backstabbed Yharnam to death.
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Aug 30, 2016 13:54
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RBA Starblade posted:Almost nothing ever stayed still long enough to land that charged attack to the butt so it was largely useless. EXACTLY. For real, I think that was a good move on From's part. Backstabs in DS in general are kinda ridiculous - it shut down enemies, it turns PvE fights even more into bizarre strafe-offs, it slows everything down. I never really liked 'em. Bloodborne does it better, if you ask me. They're still perfectly feasible for classic sneak attacks, because the enemy won't dodge, but they cannot interrupt a fight unless you're great about your positioning & timing (or your enemy is dumb). Fishing for backstabs, the combination of the most terrible mechanics DS1 poise + backstabs, is effectively dead, leaving only very smart backstabs OR parries as tools to trigger criticals. Better mechanic all around, if you ask me. Also reiterating what Sakurazuka said - if you're smart about it, you can pull that off even against mobile fuckers like the Orphan! (Try it after his overhead smash in phase 1, directly after the explosion following his transition to phase 2, or if you're lucky and he lands right next to you after throwing several bombs mid-air in phase 2.) tl;dr version: backstabs triggering by merely attacking from behind is a horrible mechanic, it's been rightfully nerfed up to its best incarnation in Bloodborne, and DS3 made a mistake in going back on that a bit.
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Aug 30, 2016 14:10
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