- EvilJoven
- Mar 18, 2005
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NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?
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Fun Shoe
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If you're a construction worker and you work for a company that does new builds you really ought to consider moving to a company that primarily does repairs and maintenance. We live in a full recourse country (except Alberta) and for the next 5 years or so everyone's going to be stuck in 'gently caress we're stuck with this disaster' mode.
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Sep 1, 2016 16:30
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- Adbot
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Jun 6, 2024 15:59
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- leftist heap
- Feb 28, 2013
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Fun Shoe
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To be fair, if you ran a racket where you could make loans to people and have them insured against default by a third party the debtor has to pay, plus have the rights to the asset if that happens, wouldn't you want as much of that action as you could get?
It sounds so sleazy and stupid when you put it like that. I prefer to think of it as ~*Promoting Home Ownership*~
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Sep 1, 2016 16:37
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- leftist heap
- Feb 28, 2013
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Fun Shoe
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Soft landing incoming.
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Sep 1, 2016 16:42
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- Femtosecond
- Aug 2, 2003
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quote:
Tax shows no sign of slowing luxury condo market as Bosa's Cardero project sets new high price
Vancouver’s real-estate transfer tax for foreign buyers doesn’t appear to have slowed the market for high-end, high-rise properties.
In May, the Holborn Group said it had hit a new high price for a project in Canada when it sold all 214 luxury condos at its Trump International Hotel and Tower Vancouver at an average of $1,615 per square foot — but now Bosa Properties has claimed the record, with more than 100 of the 116 units at its Cardero development in Coal Harbour pre-selling in the $1,750-per-square-foot range.
It comes just weeks after the B.C. government brought in a new 15-per-cent property transfer tax for non-Canadian buyers of residential real estate in Metro Vancouver in a bid to dampen the hot market.
There appeared to be little concern over the tax at the first pre-sale of new condo units since the levy was introduced. Bosa began marketing its luxury Cardero project, which is slated for completion in late 2019, on Aug. 20.
The launch coincided with heated debate about what the immediate and long-term impact of the foreign buyer tax might be on blistering home prices. There have been some initial signs of a significant slow down in the percentage of sales in some Metro areas compared to last year, along with examples of price cutting.
And yet, less than two weeks after the Cardero launch, Bosa had pre-sold all of its one-bedroom (443 sq. ft., $600,000-$700,000) one-bedroom plus den (682 sq. ft., $730,000-$840,000) and 718 sq. ft. two-bedroom units. Just the larger two-bedroom and three-bedroom units remain, measuring between 1,389 sq. ft. and 1,545 sq. ft. in size, with starting prices for the largest of these hitting $2.9 million, or $1,880 per square foot.
“We’re incredibly pleased with the response thus far to our offering, and please to welcome well over 100 new homeowners to the Bosa Properties family,” said Daryl Simpson, vice-president of marketing at Bosa Properties in an email.
There have only been a few new condo launches this year in the downtown core and outside of it, “there are a handful of units available on Cambie and at UBC, but if you look at the number of units in East Vancouver, there are also just a few left and they are the sub-penthouse ones in the $1.2-million range,” said Jon Bennest, co-owner of Urban Analytics, which analyzes real estate data and compiled the report information for the Urban Development Institute.
The affordability of new concrete condominiums in the City of Vancouver has fallen noticeably in the last few quarters, according to UDI, which represents developers and this week released its second quarter report.
By comparison, the UDI’s affordability index for new concrete condos in the suburban areas is more stable.
Bennest said at one recent pre-sale of a development on Main Street, there were some “500 to 600 real purchasers” for about 100 units. Developers understand that some “400 buyers might not be as keen” on buying if they moved the price higher.
“People with more equity are (the ones) getting to buy when there is not as much choice,” he said.
The development industry is generally known for believing the antidote to high prices is adding more supply. But increasing density in the West End and downtown won’t bring down prices, Bennest said — particularly bearing in mind the designs for some proposed high-rises in the area.
This week, Bosa Properties and Kingswood Properties filed an official rezoning application for another luxury condo building across from Cardero. They are planning a 43-storey tower with 217 condo units in a design that involves several sets of cantilevered floors and looks like a giant stack of Jenga blocks. Bosa paid $120.5 million for the land in 2014, according to vancouvermarket.com.
“I don’t feel adding towers in the West End will increase affordability,” said Bennest. The land prices being paid by developers are one thing. There are also “the design guidelines,” he said.
“When you go to 50 storeys, the construction costs are much higher. Developers and the City of Vancouver want buildings they can be proud of aesthetically and in an architectural way.”
Bennest cited the twisting shape of Westbank’s Vancouver House as an example. “Every single floor plate is different because they (need to) sit 3/4 of an inch (off from the floorplate below)” in order to achieve the building’s shape.”
“It’s going to be very expensive,” he said.
Oh yeah market is definitely cooling and there's gonna be tons of out of work construction workers.
I'm actually pretty surprised by how Bennest drops the usual development industry talking points and frankly explains why the next wave of downtown residential towers will be in no way affordable.
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Sep 1, 2016 16:59
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- namaste friends
- Sep 18, 2004
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by Smythe
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But you said supply will
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Sep 1, 2016 17:09
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- tagesschau
- Sep 1, 2006
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Can't post for 16 hours!
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Schrödinger's tax: simultaneously causing the market to crash and not doing anything at all, depending on what the writer wants to believe at the moment.
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Sep 1, 2016 17:22
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- namaste friends
- Sep 18, 2004
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by Smythe
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Did you see the lineup for that $840/month rental
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Sep 1, 2016 17:26
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- namaste friends
- Sep 18, 2004
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by Smythe
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No you see this is just pent up demand just build more supply and this will bring in a soft landing
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Sep 1, 2016 21:43
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- ocrumsprug
- Sep 23, 2010
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by LITERALLY AN ADMIN
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That's 3 times the per-sqft price of my detached home a < 10 min walk from the subway in Toronto, in a great school district.
Y'all are a whole different kind of hosed.
The article states luxury-condos.
I think you will find their cost/sqft do not mingle much with the plebeian cost/sqft's of the Toronto SFH market.
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Sep 1, 2016 21:54
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- Bob Ross Nuke Test
- Jul 12, 2016
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by Games Forum
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Why are we building 7-story low rises at SFU? It's the top of a loving mountain, if we're going to sell off the limited land up there why aren't we building some fuckin' Burj Kalifa style bullshit. 60 stories minimum, drive a foundation down to sea level ffs.
World class city my rear end.
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Sep 1, 2016 22:04
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- namaste friends
- Sep 18, 2004
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by Smythe
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Because no one wants to loving live at the top of sfu
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Sep 1, 2016 22:06
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- Bob Ross Nuke Test
- Jul 12, 2016
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by Games Forum
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Because no one wants to loving live at the top of sfu
Tell that to the hordes of idiots up here, there's so many they put in an elementary school FFS.
And if nobody wants to live there then who gives a poo poo, build it anyways and charge $100M+ for the tallest condo tower in the western hemisphere. Some shitheel mainlander will buy it and then maybe SFU can stop charging $60k for a Liberal Arts degree.
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Sep 1, 2016 22:26
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- Saltin
- Aug 20, 2003
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Don't touch
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It sounds so sleazy and stupid when you put it like that. I prefer to think of it as ~*Promoting Home Ownership*~
Well, it's like Communism. Good on paper, well intentioned and actually worked for a while, but totally out of touch with actual human nature.
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Sep 1, 2016 23:04
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- ocrumsprug
- Sep 23, 2010
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by LITERALLY AN ADMIN
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Because no one wants to loving live at the top of sfu
SFU may be the single worst place to live in 200km of SFU.
There are a couple of reasons SFU has the suicide rate it has.
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Sep 2, 2016 00:20
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- I would blow Dane Cook
- Dec 26, 2008
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https://twitter.com/mollous/status/771472783406567424
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Sep 2, 2016 01:42
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- I would blow Dane Cook
- Dec 26, 2008
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quote:
North shore mum shells out to buy unit for six-year-old daughter
A MILSONS POINT mum has joined a new wave of parents ‘shelling out’ for their kids to give them a leg up into Sydney’s booming property market.
Brenda Wayman - mother-of-one - bought an apartment on the lower north shore at auction this month for her six-year-old daughter Matilda.
Brenda Wayman bought a house for her six year old daughter Matilda last week.
Ms Wayman, who lives in Milsons Point, said she had decided to invest in a place for her daughter to live in on advice from her solicitor.
“He said, ‘if you don’t get her into the market in Sydney now, she probably will never be able to do it’,” Ms Wayman, who owns a real estate business, said.
“He just said, ‘start thinking about her future because it’s going to be difficult.”
The light-filled, one-bedroom apartment in Wollstonecraft “ticked all the boxes”, she said.
The home, which had already been let out since the auction, would be somewhere her daughter could live when she left home “to have her own space and not have to pay someone else’s mortgage”, she added.
Not that Matilda would know this for some time – Ms Wayman said she did not want her daughter to know about the house until she was older.
“I don’t want her to think this is the norm – I want her to realise people have to work for things in life,” said Ms Wayman, who grew up in western Sydney.
The north shore mum is part of a growing trend of worried parents looking to fork out for their kids, including friends who had already done so and even some with newborns who were thinking about it, she said.
Two other bidders at the auction this month had also been looking to buy for their kids, she added.
“I keep saying the bubble will burst but people want to live in Sydney … they continue to flock here from everywhere.”
https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/n...8192696df3252f8
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Sep 2, 2016 02:01
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- HookShot
- Dec 26, 2005
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There have been a number of statistics posted in this very thread that show that people do in fact need a degree if they want to get better wages, by and large.
I dropped out of university and make more than most people and even I understand that a degree is a major key to getting a good-paying job for most people. It's not like education is useless poo poo.
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Sep 2, 2016 02:38
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- Lexicon
- Jul 29, 2003
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I had a beer with Stephen Harper once and now I like him.
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There have been a number of statistics posted in this very thread that show that people do in fact need a degree if they want to get better wages, by and large.
I dropped out of university and make more than most people and even I understand that a degree is a major key to getting a good-paying job for most people. It's not like education is useless poo poo.
The mistake is when you confuse correlation with causation. I'm not saying you're doing this, but tons of students, their families, and echelons of government policymakers, do.
Highly paid people by and large have degrees, true. This does not imply that getting a degree - any old degree in whatever bullshit - will grant you high wages.
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Sep 2, 2016 02:57
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- computer parts
- Nov 18, 2010
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PLEASE CLAP
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The mistake is when you confuse correlation with causation. I'm not saying you're doing this, but tons of students, their families, and echelons of government policymakers, do.
Highly paid people by and large have degrees, true. This does not imply that getting a degree - any old degree in whatever bullshit - will grant you high wages.
The inverse is true, however - that not having a degree is a significant handicap on your future earnings.
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Sep 2, 2016 04:58
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- namaste friends
- Sep 18, 2004
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by Smythe
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http://www.theglobeandmail.com/report-on-business/rob-commentary/toronto-dont-let-vancouvers-housing-crisis-become-yours/article31644646/
quote:
Toronto, don’t let Vancouver’s housing crisis become yours
Josh Gordon is assistant professor at the Simon Fraser University School of Public Policy.
Toronto-based commentators have been eager to weigh in on the recent foreign-home-buyer tax in Vancouver. Unfortunately, many of them have been confused about the issue, perhaps due to the novelty of the debate there.
The issue deserves better consideration in Toronto. There is ample evidence of foreign capital’s influence in Canada’s largest city. Not getting it right with policy on this issue could leave it in Vancouver’s unenviable position, where only a substantial price correction will get the city back to affordability, leaving many first-time home buyers underwater on their mortgages.
So it should be helpful to alert Torontonians to a host of bad arguments they will hear about why they shouldn’t address the influx of foreign capital in the real estate market.
Concern about foreign capital is xenophobic or racist: Ninety per cent of Vancouverites support the recent foreign-buyer tax. Unless you think 90 per cent of Vancouverites are xenophobic or racist, then you’ll realize that this claim is silly. The issue is that the local housing market has become disconnected from the local labour market, largely due to the influence of foreign capital, and people don’t like that. That concern cuts across all groups – the concern is with the foreign money, not the foreign people. And yes, there are straightforward policies to address the impact of capital, without targeting people.
Rising prices are all about low interest rates: Interest rates are low across the developed world, but only in a small minority of cities do we see housing prices galloping ahead of income levels on a long-term basis. What matters are house prices relative to incomes, not just price growth. In this respect, Toronto and Vancouver are by far the least affordable cities in Canada; other cities remain fairly affordable despite historically low interest rates. Also, prices surged in 2015-16, about seven years after interest rates were reduced to very low levels – and that coincides with a roughly $1-trillion (U.S.) exodus of capital from China.
There is no data: While precise data are indeed lacking, we can infer the influence of foreign money in reliable ways. We have academic and government studies of the now-defunct Immigrant Investor Program showing that Toronto and Vancouver were by far the most popular destinations for wealth-based migration in Canada – and remain so, due to Quebec’s insistence on continuing its own program.
Australia and the United States also keep track of foreign buyers and they’ve seen a recent surge in buyers from China coinciding with rapid price appreciation in affected cities. Canada is just as enticing a target, if not more so, so it’s reasonable to assume that the same has happened in “attractive” cities here.
And while the B.C. government’s recent data collection confirms that foreign buying is substantial – around 10 per cent of transactions in Vancouver – it is actually a major underestimate: What matters is the primary source of income or wealth for a purchase, not buyer nationality. It is when income or wealth is generated outside of the local labour market that local incomes and housing prices can become “decoupled,” as we have seen in Vancouver. By this more accurate measure, much more than 10 per cent would be deemed “foreign.”
The problem is all about supply: Some in the real estate industry will proclaim that Toronto needs to build its way out of the problem and open up land for development in the greenbelt around the city. However, supply of new housing in Toronto has kept up with population growth and the recent price surge can’t primarily be explained with reference to supply issues, such as excessive regulatory hurdles. While the supply of new single detached houses is slowing, and will eventually stop if the greenbelt regulations continue to be enforced, this is ultimately a good thing: Toronto already suffers from snarled traffic and if Canada is to ever tackle climate change, we will need to have densely populated cities. Besides, there is little evidence that restricting land in this manner has been the main cause of escalating prices, as I documented in a recent report.
We want foreign “investment”: This isn’t productive “investment,” this is buying houses. There are no productivity gains from residential real estate spending – for all of its foreign “investment,” incomes in Vancouver remain among the lowest in urban Canada.
That’s a preliminary list. There will undoubtedly be much more obfuscation from those with a vested interest in the status quo. They have money at stake and will throw it around to have the provincial government listen. And they will be persistent, repeating endlessly the same misleading or disproved claims.
Yet, 82 per cent of Vancouverites say the foreign-buyer tax was long overdue. Don’t let the Ontario government lead you into the same crisis Vancouver now faces.
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Sep 2, 2016 07:39
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- Wasting
- Apr 25, 2013
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The next to go
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That was beautiful
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Sep 2, 2016 09:38
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- Aagar
- Mar 30, 2006
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E/N Gestapo
I am talking to a mod right now about getting you probated/banned/gassed
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#itshappening
http://www.cbc.ca/news/business/vancouver-canada-home-prices-bubble-1.3744304
CBC News posted:
Fear and loathing in the Vancouver property market
Watch today's numbers — sharp declines would likely spread fear to other parts of the market
The subtitle of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, Hunter S. Thompson's best-selling 1971 tale of drug-addled adventure, is "A Savage Journey into the Heart of the American Dream."
Scary comments in blogs and on Facebook and even in credible publications show a serious bout of fear and loathing in the heart of the Canadian property-owning dream as we wait for the latest data on Vancouver property sales, expected today.
"I tell you my friend, this is the American Dream in action," says Thompson's character to his attorney in the hilarious but distorted autobiography. "We'd be fools not to ride this strange torpedo all the way out to the end."
Thompson wrote something described as gonzo journalism, which, even more than other forms of journalism, left you puzzled as to what was true.
In advance of today's Vancouver real estate data, a number of reports seem to have followed Thompson's style, warning the world that Vancouver's strange torpedo of property prices — which as recently as June had risen 23.4 per cent in a year — has come "all the way out to the end."
"Vancouver Real Estate Bubble Has Burst and Home Owners Are Panic Selling," says an article in Canadian Investor, adopting the fear-and-loathing style.
Backed by some truly horrifying statistics, Canadian Investor quotes former Lehman trader Jared Dillian, who tells Canadians to sell your real estate assets, including your home, because you can buy them back in a few years for significantly less.
I should make it very clear that CBC does not endorse Dillian's financial advice.
Wave of fear
But there is no denying a wave of fear and loathing has hit Vancouver's ebullient market in the wake of the provincial government's tax on foreign buyers. Data collected by realtor Rob Chipman shows that not only sales but prices seem to be falling.
In the property market, where the mood of individual buyers matters so much, there is no question that fear — and loathing — have an effect.
Many high-end house sales in the Vancouver area were focused on overseas buyers, who may have been discouraged by the provincial government's imposition of a 15 per cent tax on them. (Don Pittis, CBC News)
By tradition the two great forces in speculative markets are greed, which makes people buy, and fear, which makes them sell.
In highly liquid stock markets, experienced institutional investors act as an anchor on wild market swings. But the housing market is not liquid. And the majority of traders are inexperienced amateurs.
Fear may make speculators, especially those in debt over their heads, want to sell. But when markets are on the way down, potential buyers are hit by loathing, not wanting to be the ones left holding the baby as prices fall further.
The downside of leverage
Leverage — buying on borrowed money — which propelled markets to new heights, goes into reverse.
Leverage is why you can make so much money in real estate when you have a mortgage. Your equity, the amount of the house you actually own, may be $100,000 or less. When a million-dollar property rises by 23.4 per cent, the profit on the small share you actually own is stupendous. No wonder speculators were interested.
But when property prices are falling, leverage becomes a serious disadvantage, and speculators may be wise to try to get out before prices fall too much more.
Price changes in markets happen at the margin. That means new entrants to the market set the price. Even if foreign speculators represent a relatively small proportion of buyers, those additional new buyers have a disproportionate effect in pushing prices up.
Bursting bubble
But as the Hilliard Macbeth, author of When the Bubble Bursts, told me last year, that can go into reverse "literally overnight."
Even in such emotional times, owners who think of their house as a long-term home are unlikely to jump into the market, especially if they bought before the worst of the speculative frenzy. They will not take Dillian's advice.
But fear and loathing and the resulting fall in prices can be contagious. If the Vancouver decline continues, there is no reason Toronto won't catch the bug. Even lower-priced properties such as those on the Sunshine Coast or in southern Ontario could notice the effect if big-city sellers no longer have windfall profits to downsize out of town.
Even the most enthusiastic real estate bulls know that 20 per cent annual increases in property prices do not continue forever. The question is whether what we are seeing now is a short-term correction in isolated parts of the market, a soft landing, or the popping of the property bubble that so many critics have predicted.
Sometimes it is hard to tell what Hunter S. Thompson is talking about in Fear and Loathing. But perhaps "too weird to live, and too rare to die" was referring to the Canadian property market.
I like this article, because it sets out very clearly that a crash will come from a build-up of panic (sellers will be trying to dump before prices fall, while buyers won't touch anything they think is going to drop 30-40% the day after they buy it), and could happen almost overnight. If enough media outlets start harping on how the crash is coming, it will happen by virtue of everyone believing it will happen.
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Sep 2, 2016 13:36
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- EvilJoven
- Mar 18, 2005
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NOBODY,IN THE HISTORY OF EVER, HAS ASKED OR CARED WHAT CANADA THINKS. YOU ARE NOT A COUNTRY. YOUR MONEY HAS THE QUEEN OF ENGLAND ON IT. IF YOU DIG AROUND IN YOUR BACKYARD, NATIVE SKELETONS WOULD EXPLODE OUT OF YOUR LAWN LIKE THE END OF POLTERGEIST. CANADA IS SO POLITE, EH?
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Fun Shoe
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I need to find that post where I said that me buying a house would trigger the crash and frame it.
I just hope I don't lose too much on my place.
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Sep 2, 2016 13:48
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- namaste friends
- Sep 18, 2004
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by Smythe
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It's not happening yet. At least not until we start seeing unemployment rise.
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Sep 2, 2016 14:11
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- Professor Shark
- May 22, 2012
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Don't ask me, I'm a homeowner
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Sep 2, 2016 14:29
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- Adbot
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ADBOT LOVES YOU
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Jun 6, 2024 15:59
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- DariusLikewise
- Oct 4, 2008
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You wore that on Halloween?
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I need to find that post where I said that me buying a house would trigger the crash and frame it.
I just hope I don't lose too much on my place.
At most you're going to lose 2% here, house prices haven't exploded in Manitoba like they have anywhere else.
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Sep 2, 2016 15:16
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Sep 1, 2016 16:30
