|
Majorian posted:Actually, Iraq was relatively quiet for several months after the initial invasion. Posters in this very forum were bullish about the country's chances of holding free and fair elections that would turn it into a bastion of democracy. Neocon goons posted photos of Iraqi women with purple smudges on their thumbs, indicating that they had voted. Things only got noticeably worse when it turned out that the rift between Sunni and Shia Iraqs was wider than Bush understood. In both cases, the initial invasion went swimmingly. It was winning the peace that neither administration had prepared for. To be fair, D&D was a very different beast back in 2003. Why is ballistic missile defense such a republican thing? I mean i get defense spending in general as a siphon of public money to generally their supporters, but why missile defense? Is it a Reagan totem? Proust Malone fucked around with this message at 00:14 on Sep 8, 2016 |
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:12
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 4, 2024 15:28 |
|
|
A Winner is Jew posted:Of course there was violence in the months after the fall of Qaddafi. Only an idiot would think that there would be total and immediate peace and security following a loving civil war. This is what you said: "Iraq went to poo poo while Bush and Rumsfeld were at the wheel. Libya was relatively stable given they just went through a civil war when Clinton stepped down and didn't go to poo poo until over a year later." The reality is, both went to poo poo after the initial invasion. Your suggestion that Libya was "relatively stable" just isn't borne out by the facts, sorry.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:15
|
|
|
Wait, but I thought Trump knew about the situation better than the generals. He told us to believe him! So why is he going to ask them for a plan?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:16
|
|
|
Wasn't ABM something Bush II pushed for pre-9/11 despite nobody wanting it?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:16
|
|
|
Don't candidates usually at least pretend that they ideas of their own? PROPOSAL: Heritage Foundation appointed Sec. of Defense
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:16
|
|
|
If the gap doesn't widen at or after the first debate, I'll start panicking. Until then I'm assuming it's political fatigue or disinterest because nothing exciting has really happened since Trump in Mexico.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:16
|
|
|
Instant Sunrise posted:Wasn't ABM something Bush II pushed for pre-9/11 despite nobody wanting it? Yeah, he was gearing up for it from the get-go. Pulling the U.S. out of the ABM Treaty was probably one of the reasons why Russia has gone so hard down its revanchist nationalist road, unfortunately. It was pretty much exactly what Putin wanted: "Hey, look at those duplicitous Americans! They want to get the upper hand on us again, after convincing us that we're at peace and loving over our economy! Vote for me, the guy who will take revenge for you!  "Power Walrus posted:Don't candidates usually at least pretend that they ideas of their own? Reminder that he has said that he will turn to Heritage for his SCOTUS nominees.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:18
|
|
|
Chokes McGee posted:If the gap doesn't widen at or after the first debate, I'll start panicking. Until then I'm assuming it's political fatigue or disinterest because nothing excited has really happened since Trump in Mexico. I'm still :arzy: about the numbers that the libertarians are getting. I can't imagine all those people actually pulling the lever for Johnson. I look at the state races while breathing into a paper bag to calm down, but I don't think this race is as settled as those poll numbers make it out to be.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:19
|
|
|
There is no way The Johnson's Rise will actually show up on election day in a major way. He'll go flaccid, you see.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:22
|
|
|
Chokes McGee posted:If the gap doesn't widen at or after the first debate, I'll start panicking. Until then I'm assuming it's political fatigue or disinterest because nothing exciting has really happened since Trump in Mexico. That's part of it. Also, in spite of my complaints about Clinton's self-inflicted wounds, I think her team's getting gradually better at answering criticisms. So I expect it's only going to go up for her from here on out. Tatum Girlparts posted:There is no way The Johnson's Rise will actually show up on election day in a major way. Son of a bitch...
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:24
|
|
|
Tatum Girlparts posted:There is no way The Johnson's Rise will actually show up on election day in a major way.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:26
|
|
|
Majorian posted:This is what you said: "Iraq went to poo poo while Bush and Rumsfeld were at the wheel. Libya was relatively stable given they just went through a civil war when Clinton stepped down and didn't go to poo poo until over a year later." The reality is, both went to poo poo after the initial invasion. Your suggestion that Libya was "relatively stable" just isn't borne out by the facts, sorry. Only it literally is. Libya was relatively stable between 2011 and the beginning of 2013 given that they just went through a civil war. The vast majority of the incidents in that period were low intensity tribal conflicts that weren't directed at the post Qaddafi government or islamists wanting to create chaos. Iraq's insurgency was almost purely directed at occupation and post Saddam government forces, was drastically more intense, and started almost immediately after "mission accomplished" But yeah, totally the same. 
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:27
|
|
|
Lol the Clinton campaign book doesn't have a free pdf??
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:28
|
|
|
A Winner is Jew posted:Only it literally is. Except for that Wikipedia page I posted detailing all the examples in which it wasn't. A Winner is Jew posted:But yeah, totally the same. No one said they're the same - just that it's dumb to absolve Clinton of responsibility for what came after 2012, when we have no problem (rightly) blaming the Bush Administration for what continues to go on in Iraq.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:31
|
|
|
Tatum Girlparts posted:There is no way The Johnson's Rise will actually show up on election day in a major way. They'll probably break mainly for Trump, no?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:34
|
|
|
straight up brolic posted:I'm on mobile so this isnt going to be rigorous but just look at the polling average over time, Google trends for Benghazi, Clinton emails & foundation, and favorability levels...all correspond pretty strongly to eachother You don't need to convince me, we're already in your world. So what is it you want nega-Hillary to do?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:35
|
|
|
Ron Jeremy posted:Why is ballistic missile defense such a republican thing? I mean i get defense spending in general as a siphon of public money to generally their supporters, but why missile defense? Is it a Reagan totem? Because it basically is a cheat option for circumventing MAD, even though it isn't. It fits perfectly with Trump's other positions on nukes.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:36
|
|
|
Ron Jeremy posted:Why is ballistic missile defense such a republican thing? I mean i get defense spending in general as a siphon of public money to generally their supporters, but why missile defense? Is it a Reagan totem? Pretty much the same thing as the rest of defense procurement: it's an insane amount of cash spent on developing and rigorously testing technology that doesn't work all that well, but hey, it's pork for Senator Smith's home district. Also what Dead Cosmonaut said.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:38
|
|
|
So apparently news as a whole is more liberal? https://twitter.com/DougSaunders/status/773606554356420608
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:39
|
|
|
Instant Sunrise posted:remember that we were still in the post-9/11 "america needs revenge" mentality, and the only real war in living memory was the first gulf war, which was very widely seen as a success and had cultivated an attitude of "america can do no wrong" on the right. Honestly most New Yorkers probably approved of Hillary's vote at the time. I mean poo poo, the other senator at the time was/is Chuck Schumer. computer parts fucked around with this message at 00:44 on Sep 8, 2016 |
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:41
|
|
|
iospace posted:So apparently news as a whole is more liberal? Not pictured due x axis scale: The Blaze and Brietbart.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:42
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Except for that Wikipedia page I posted detailing all the examples in which it wasn't. Nice selective quoting. quote:The vast majority of the incidents in that period were low intensity tribal conflicts that weren't directed at the post Qaddafi government or islamists wanting to create chaos. Majorian posted:No one said they're the same - just that it's dumb to absolve Clinton of responsibility for what came after 2012, when we have no problem (rightly) blaming the Bush Administration for what continues to go on in Iraq. Only Bush and co. literally oversaw the deterioration of Iraq while. quote:The vast majority of the incidents in that period were low intensity tribal conflicts that weren't directed at the post Qaddafi government or islamists wanting to create chaos.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:42
|
|
|
A Winner is Jew posted:Nice selective quoting. None of that erases the fact that Clinton is partially responsible for what transpired in Libya.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:44
|
|
|
Current Ballistic Missile Defense systems are about shooting down Kim Jong Un's shitmissiles (or Iran's). Nobody thinks it could swat down a full strike from Russia.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:44
|
|
|
iospace posted:So apparently news as a whole is more liberal? reality has a known liberal bias.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:46
|
|
|
Majorian posted:None of that erases the fact that Clinton is partially responsible for what transpired in Libya. Only an idiot would think that. Good think I haven't said that though.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:46
|
|
|
iospace posted:So apparently news as a whole is more liberal? I don't think those charts are normalized by total news sources but instead by news consumers.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:46
|
|
|
A Winner is Jew posted:Only an idiot would think that. This is what you said: A Winner is Jew posted:So she's to blame for what happens over a year after she leaves her position as SoS... got it. So...you're an idiot, following your own criteria. Congrats I guess?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:52
|
|
|
Majorian posted:This is what you said: That was referring to the second civil war dip poo poo. Or do you not understand that a year after she left the second civil war kicked off? To clarify since you're loving dense, she's partially responsible for the low level violence that happened after the first civil war... you know because she was in favor of it and all. The second civil war though... yeah you're a loving moron if you think she's also responsible for that. A Winner is Jew fucked around with this message at 00:56 on Sep 8, 2016 |
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:54
|
|
|
A Winner is Jew posted:That was referring to the second civil war dip poo poo. Or do you not understand that a year after she left the second civil war kicked off? I do. The problem is, you don't seem to get that there was a connection between a poorly-planned out invasion and occupation, and the resulting chaos and civil wars that ensued.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:55
|
|
|
JeffersonClay posted:Current Ballistic Missile Defense systems are about shooting down Kim Jong Un's shitmissiles (or Iran's). Nobody thinks it could swat down a full strike from Russia. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ux3oiWELIQ
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:56
|
|
|
 
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:56
|
|
|
Nms that poo poo god drat son.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:57
|
|
|
You goons sexualizing Trump's narcissistism are gross! 
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 00:59
|
|
|
JeffersonClay posted:Current Ballistic Missile Defense systems are about shooting down Kim Jong Un's shitmissiles (or Iran's). Nobody thinks it could swat down a full strike from Russia. No, but Russians be paranoid. They think it's a prelude to a larger BMD program, aimed at the U.S. asserting strategic supremacy. Ewww.
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 01:00
|
|
|
Majorian posted:I do. The problem is, you don't seem to get that there was a connection between a poorly-planned out invasion and occupation, and the resulting chaos and civil wars that ensued. Invasion and occupation of where?
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 01:01
|
|
|
lol @ people who still believe Iran has ICBMs capable of carrying nukes, let alone a nuclear weapons program
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 01:01
|
|
|
DemeaninDemon posted:Nms that poo poo god drat son. 
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 01:02
|
|
|
clinton v trump townhall is live right now http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/commander-in-chief-forum
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 01:02
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 4, 2024 15:28 |
|
|
oh my
|
|
#
?
Sep 8, 2016 01:02
|
|