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Sep 6, 2016 21:14
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Loomer posted:Crazy bullshit like the Giovanni and Setites forming a new faction.The rules don't bother me - it's the awful ideas that do, and if they liked MET20 that means they liked those ideas. In BTS's defense, the new sect is entirely built on the desire to put a final, lasting bullet into The Promise Of 1528. It is still woefully underdeveloped while the writers were working on Werewolf. Also, yes, announcing new poo poo that only appeals to airplane-hopping LARP convention nerds at a nationally-focused LARP convention to rapturous applause is definitely what I expected out of this news.
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Sep 6, 2016 22:09
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Loomer posted:Killing off all the elders, while good in terms of power balance and options for PCs, significantly diminishes the scope of the game. I'd rather see them torpid than dead - even more options that way, and less closed doors. Well, the quote did say "most", though I fully acknowledge the dumbness of parsing a facebook post that parses a presentation. Late-stage VtM was really lousy with low gen elder NPCs running around, to the point where even killing off 75% of the ones presented throughout the supplements would probably still leave you at least a few in most big cities that were active. I think that bloat kind of robbed elders of their mystique and intimidation, as well as straining at the "mystery" element of the setting. As far as the by night rules go, anyone have any experience with them? Drivethru's being dumb about downloading the quickstart, and my last LARP experience was over a decade ago. Are they at all decent in balance, or are they just as broken as the original TT rules were? I wouldn't mind a complete overhaul if it actually made the game less prone to swingy results and massive imbalances in attribute/discipline value in combat and the like.
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Sep 6, 2016 22:13
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IIRC they are mostly about being able to rethrow in RPS, and occasionally winning on ties.
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Sep 6, 2016 22:29
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I think the "They" referred to was the Rules themselves, not the elders in the rules. I'm curious too since if MET's running the show I'd like to know how bad it's gonna be.
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Sep 6, 2016 22:49
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Mors Rattus posted:All I know is that I am trying to decide what anime to badly shop fangs onto for my upcoming viichan RP Twitter's avatar.  So, this is only tangentially related to the hilarious runaway World of Darkness train, but here's something I just caught in Dark Eras that the errata pass obviously did not: quote:While in Duat, you may attempt to rise prematurely, pitting a roll of your Willpower pool against a difficulty of your Memory rating. For those unfamiliar with nWoD rules, rolling your Willpower pool doesn't generally happen, but more importantly, "difficulty" doesn't exist system-wise. It isn't a thing.
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Sep 6, 2016 23:06
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I'm pretty sure that Mummy had TN Shifting and people were really mad about it.
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Sep 6, 2016 23:08
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It did but even that required using Mummy Powers, not just general use.
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Sep 6, 2016 23:11
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Kurieg posted:I'm pretty sure that Mummy had TN Shifting and people were really mad about it. It did, as a magic power that tilted it up or down by a couple points. But it didn't refer to "difficulty," and a player who wasn't familiar with WoD terminology wouldn't know what "difficulty" means in this context. It's the difference between deliberately trying something weird, and just forgetting which game you were writing for.
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Sep 6, 2016 23:14
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quote:1) White Wolf is a content IP licensing company now. Their sole business is the control and licensing of the World of Darkness IP. They will be controlling the overarching metaplot, which will be consistent across all media (so novels, RPGs, computer games, TV or movies, etc will all use the EXACT SAME continuity). From one of their execs "Netflix show by 2020 or bust".
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Sep 6, 2016 23:18
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I Am Just a Box posted:It did, as a magic power that tilted it up or down by a couple points. But it didn't refer to "difficulty," and a player who wasn't familiar with WoD terminology wouldn't know what "difficulty" means in this context. It's the difference between deliberately trying something weird, and just forgetting which game you were writing for. Which reinforces the idea that this particular author may have been doing the latter while insisting he was doing the former. It's a whacky idea I swear guys, it just so happens to be exactly the same idea and terminology that oWoD/Exalted uses.
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Sep 6, 2016 23:20
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I mean Bioware made some good games out of the insane mess of a metaplot that was the Forgotten Realms, but that setting, hated as it was, was designed such that basically anything could happen (and often did) without mattering to anything else. If Wizards of the Coast had enforced continuity it would have been a real shitshow They're probably working on a new Bloodlines now (or a spiritual successor) and if anything it will probably be released just before this whole disastrous machine gets kicked into gear (assuming it does). Any sequels, however, are likely to be tainted Basic Chunnel fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Sep 6, 2016 |
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Sep 6, 2016 23:21
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Mors Rattus posted:It did but even that required using Mummy Powers, not just general use. "The Trail of Heresy" in Book of the Deceived did something kind of similar as an optional mechanic. The second act of that adventure has the players make a roll to not be caught up in the villain's illusion. It suggested that the Storyteller roll a d10, re-rolling on 1s and 10s. The result would be the target number for the roll, referred to as a "difficulty". The player could spend a point of willpower to make a roll of their own to change the target number, though if they rolled a 1 or a 10, the entire roll would be either a Dramatic Failure or an Exceptional Success, respectively. The justification for this was that the villain spun a magic wheel to help create the illusion. Needless to say, I did not use the mechanic when I ran that adventure.
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Sep 6, 2016 23:27
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Personally I am a big fan of setting and metaplot (if you need one) being sancrosanct against player influence, because most gamers who bother to learna s system are powergamers. I've been in very few long-running games that did not involve a ton of crazy escalation and incident, because those are things that easily get the blood pumping. So they're going to get into a situation where the mob-led storytelling goes wildly off the rails and it looks like an urban fantasy version of the Forgotten Realms, or they intercede a heavy hand to keep things coherent and thereby piss off the people they're currently pandering to. Then again, my sense of LARP (and digital equivalents like pre-WoW "persistent world" RPG servers) is that it is actually very static, by and large, more a gothy coat of paint on mundane social gatherings than a grand project, because nothing huge usually happens and when it does, people tend not to take it seriously and they move on quickly. Trying to make it all matter and tie down players with the weight of their choices sounds like a nightmare. This whole direction sounds like a nightmare!
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Sep 6, 2016 23:31
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Basic Chunnel posted:Personally I am a big fan of setting and metaplot (if you need one) being sancrosanct against player influence, because most gamers who bother to learna s system are powergamers. I've been in very few long-running games that did not involve a ton of crazy escalation and incident, because those are things that easily get the blood pumping. So they're going to get into a situation where the mob-led storytelling goes wildly off the rails and it looks like an urban fantasy version of the Forgotten Realms, or they intercede a heavy hand to keep things coherent and thereby piss off the people they're currently pandering to. Honestly one of the big problems with running LARPs is fine-tuning the plot so that players actually react to it. Of the four or five Vampire LARPs I've played most of the time you get maybe 10-20% of the players who actually want to play Vampire, specifically, and go all-in on backstabbing, making enemies, and generally playing the game 'correctly' - that is to say, as a PvP social experiment where the fail state is character death. Then you get maybe another 10-20% who won't do anything no matter what and seem content to sit in the OOG room playing Pokemon or whatever. The remaining 60-80% are only motivated by huge plots that the whole city can fight together, and usually only if the antagonist is objectively in the wrong and the PCs objectively in the right. The conflict has to be clearly against something worse than Vampires and powerful enough to lure Lord Gunnington of Many Guns to actually respond to it. Maybe a huge cell of hunters show up to kill everybody; maybe Literally Cthulu tries to eat the city; maybe a pack of Black Spiral Dancers sets up shop in the sewers. It is not the stuff that is particularly compelling to recount.
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Sep 7, 2016 02:52
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Gee, most players in an RPG want to think of themselves as the protagonists? How unexpected.
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Sep 7, 2016 03:15
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Yes, which is why owod was so bad, and why it's COMIN BACK BABY
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Sep 7, 2016 03:17
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Night10194 posted:Gee, most players in an RPG want to think of themselves as the protagonists? How unexpected. There's nothing wrong with wanting to be the protagonist; the problem is when you're playing a blood draining walking corpse with no regard for human life, it's a little silly to only get out of bed for evil monsters at the Cthulu tier or higher. Which, in my limited experience, is what happens at most LARPs; most people are only motivated by conflicts that put the whole city in jeopardy which leads to dull escalation of the worst kind.
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Sep 7, 2016 03:23
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Mendrian posted:Honestly one of the big problems with running LARPs is fine-tuning the plot so that players actually react to it. Of the four or five Vampire LARPs I've played most of the time you get maybe 10-20% of the players who actually want to play Vampire, specifically, and go all-in on backstabbing, making enemies, and generally playing the game 'correctly' - that is to say, as a PvP social experiment where the fail state is character death. I think it says a lot more that playing the Vampire LARP "correctly" meant more or less stripping everything out that involved vampirism. Like, that 30%+ probably wanted to get up to some vampire shenanigans, and what they got was boring goth politics instead.
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Sep 7, 2016 03:25
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All the more reason why the guts of fiction should be protected from its consumers
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Sep 7, 2016 03:45
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I wonder where this puts Onyx Path. I know the proposed V4 was killed in the cradle by the shift from CCP to Paradox, but this feels like OPP will be running CoD / nWoD and WWP / BNS will be running this meta plot train wreck. As an active TTRPG and specifically WoD player during the end of the line one of our criticisms for nWoD was the lack of meta plot or anything approaching a "real setting". But my group grew up in the FR-heavy 2nd and 3rd ed DND and many players only had played WOD games. So our touchstones were all meta plot / setting heavy games. Then we broke up and moved away and got old. But this likely wouldn't have appealed to the early 20s me, let alone the mid 30s me who was mildly interested in how this would turn out. But I had a bad history with the LARP side of WoD and I distrust anything that shares more then a fleeting association with it.
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Sep 7, 2016 04:39
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I played a bunch of BNS and for 18 months was the local ST for a Mind's Eye Society game starting immediately when we adopted the BNS rules, ask me whatever. My biggest problem with the rules is the way the new rules homogenize vampires' control over society (in particular, "We need to find somebody with pull on the streets/banks/local police" has been entirely replaced with "We need to find somebody with any pull whatsoever!", which sounds great until you realize that there's no longer any reason whatsoever to fight over influence or really anything in the mortal world.
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Sep 7, 2016 05:01
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So what I am getting from this discussion is that the entirety of OWOD is that everything ends up vampires; and that all the other lines have no real pull compared to the vampires.
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Sep 7, 2016 05:10
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Senior Scarybagels posted:So what I am getting from this discussion is that the entirety of OWOD is that everything ends up vampires; and that all the other lines have no real pull compared to the vampires. Nah. Vampire always had more LARPers, and every line was controlled by its splat or antagonist, so from a Vampire POV the mages and werewolves don't matter as long as you don't raid House Flambeaux or try to travel in the wrong rural areas:
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Sep 7, 2016 05:18
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Nystral posted:I wonder where this puts Onyx Path. I know the proposed V4 was killed in the cradle by the shift from CCP to Paradox, but this feels like OPP will be running CoD / nWoD and WWP / BNS will be running this meta plot train wreck.
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Sep 7, 2016 05:43
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Yessod posted:That is awesome in a very nerdy way. Do you plan to share it at all, or is it just a personal thing? I hope to, but it'll have to be in one of three forms. Either new White Wolf'll want it, they won't and I'll offer the commentary+gematria but not the compiled text (copyright stuff), or through some miracle they'll say 'go ahead and release the whole thing' and it'll float around on the internet perfectly legally. It'll amuse me enormously beyond the grave if the hardcover one I'm going to have bound for myself winds up mixed in with a lot of serious occult books at like, Weiser or something, and inadvertantly taken seriously.
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Sep 7, 2016 05:48
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Senior Scarybagels posted:So what I am getting from this discussion is that the entirety of OWOD is that everything ends up vampires; and that all the other lines have no real pull compared to the vampires. I mean, it's more that the kinds of stories in Vampire actual play are more amenable to LARP than Mage, with Werewolf somewhere in between. So a LARP-focused approach will emphasize vamps more than woofs or wizards.
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Sep 7, 2016 05:50
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Though of course Changeling is perfectly amenable to LARP, because even in-universe, normal people just see a bunch of greasy nerds yelling about swords and fairies when they look at a gathering of changelings. EDIT: RichT is suggesting that the guy who posted what we (okay, I)'ve been melting down over may be a clueless moron since he mentioned BNS's mage book, which does not exist. I assumed it was just a mockup he was talking about but if that's the case, maybe we're not in the Fifth Edition Gehenna afterall. Loomer fucked around with this message at 05:58 on Sep 7, 2016 |
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Sep 7, 2016 05:55
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Living Greyhawk was pretty cool by teenage me standards. Drive an hour to a stanky convention center and throw down with your level 12 halfing sorcerer. Get eaten by an acid elemental, teleport the macguffin around, help struggling lower level tables kick some rear end. LARPing is not my cup of tea, but I can see the appeal of metaplot based around local groups.
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Sep 7, 2016 06:34
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ProfessorCirno posted:I think it says a lot more that playing the Vampire LARP "correctly" meant more or less stripping everything out that involved vampirism. Well... yes, probably. I mean Vampire is a game played primarily indoors without the benefits of boffer equipment. The default mode of play suggests relatively peaceful gatherings with mortal pawns being used to passive aggressively battle one another. You can play a Vampire LARP other ways. "Oh man, me and six other players characters get into a jeep and get into a car chase with a Ferrari full of werewolves. Now we're at the graveyard fighting skeletons with broadswords. A wall explodes and a wizard made of flaming skulls flies in on a guitar" is a valid mode of play. It's not usually conducive to Vampire LARP because you're dealing with extensive narration at that point. You might as well be playing tabletop for all the trouble you're going through. Alternatively you could probably do more like a good boffer LARP and add prop-supernatural elements with a higher production value but it's certainly never been the default assumption. There's nothing wrong with 'goth politics' and getting people to play 'goth politics' is actually incredibly difficult. Vampire LARPs never seem to be able to agree on what their tone is supposed to be.
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Sep 7, 2016 08:21
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Dark Ages Vampire LARP would, strangely, be easier to build a sense of immersion for. People in the right costume with swords on hand etc lends itself easier to sweeping narrative than 'bunch of pale dudes in Gary's house who can't speak too loud because his kid is asleep'.
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Sep 7, 2016 08:26
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Loomer posted:Though of course Changeling is perfectly amenable to LARP, because even in-universe, normal people just see a bunch of greasy nerds yelling about swords and fairies when they look at a gathering of changelings. Hey I actually know that dude, he's the ANST for the Canadian Minds Eye Society. He's anything but a clueless moron, and actually a nice dude. 
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Sep 7, 2016 08:54
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Well poo poo, back to rocking back and forth in the corner while I mumble about vampires and evil swedish dracula destroying the precious I guess. EDIT: For an unrelated example of some of the gematria stuff going on with the compiled book of Nod, the Lilin Genesis Fragment (which is accorded status as Chapter 1 of the Book of Lilith for this purpose) has as verse 1 the bit about the Ancient One opening its eyes every 55,555 years. 55,555 as a number has no special kabbalistic correlations, but gematria is basically the root of most forms of numerology. Accordingly, the discipline encourages you to bend the way numbers work (the purpose is not to find secret messages from god, afterall, but to help liberate the mind) so we can use a very common technique of adding the numbers up. If we do so, we get 25 - which equates to several interesting things. 'Hidden', 'Yah Hides' (YAH as in the first component of YHVH) and the pathway between Tifereth (Beauty) and Yesod (Foundation). Jehovah, in that same text, is created out of the Nameless One's emanation, and his number in turn is 26. He goes on to try and deceive people into believing he is the true creator and not the nameless ancient, which makes the use of 55,555 very appropriate. The pathway in question, Samekh, is that of directed will, judgment, and alchemical distillation - all fitting that the universe exists each time for 55,555 years. Additionally, 55 itself is the number of Malkuth, the final sephirot where all crystallizes into material reality. So the number 55,555 consists of a repeating Malkuth number link. And this is where it gets weird. Phil 'an actual wizard' Brucato wrote the Revelations of the Dark Mother. As much as I find the man's body of work on the oWoD largely cringesome, he did a good job here, and it leads me to suspect that there may be deliberate (or subconsciously inserted) qabalistic undertones to the work. Certainly, it refers to the kabbalah on a regular basis, but my instinct was to dismiss that largely as set-dressing until I remembered Brucato wrote this. So I may now be doing gematria on nerdstuff written by someone importing gematria into nerdstuff. Loomer fucked around with this message at 12:38 on Sep 7, 2016 |
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Sep 7, 2016 09:30
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Paging Nifara to the thread. Nifara was the ST for the totally insane high powered oWoD game I was in - part of the game was that the Book of Nod was basically coming true, and we had a physical copy of the book at the table and had to regularly consult it (which made it amusing that we were doing this in character and had to be shirty with each other about how we weren't really Noddists). Nifara wrote a complete set of annotations to the Book, expanding on its meanings and tying it into the mythology that was coming true around us.
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Sep 7, 2016 16:48
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That's my hope for this aspect of the Project, along with the hypothetical jurisprudence compilations on the traditions, cainite law, etc - physical props for sitting at tables. I know I'll be getting at least one hard copy printed and hardcover bound for that exact purpose. Come to think of it, that being their intended use may actually make them appeal more to new White Wolf, with the LARP scene's love of physical props.
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Sep 7, 2016 17:07
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Apocalypse is done, so it's time for another Wall O' Text. I'm going to focus largely on the impact on the mundane world, since there's a hell of a lot of apocalypsing going on in Apocalypse. We're using the normal ranking system, but since it's been a few pages of speculation and meltdown (well, mostly me there) about VtM 5E, here it is for reference. Tier 0: Only an apocalypse for the splat in question, and even then, a remarkably clean one. Tier 1: A 'messy' splat-specific apocalypse. Chaos caused by sudden disruption, one or two cities being badly affected, etc. No direct apocalypse impact on the rest of the world. Tier 2: This is where it overlaps onto humanity in a substantial and direct way. Anywhere from serious problems through to social collapse. Tier 3: These impact the supernatural splat and overlaps onto humanity and everyone else in a major and extremely damaging way. Anywhere from social collapse to total extinction. Tier 4: These impact on laws of the cosmos itself or affect the whole planet in a metaphysical way. First up, the common and 'official' state of the world during the Apocalypse.Human birth rates skyrocket, agricultural production plummets due to extreme weather disturbance, and multiple horrific plagues emerge on the global scene. No Garou have been born since 2003, Black Spiral Dancers are systematically hunting down Garou kinfolk, and a huge swarm of wyrm-locusts rises in Africa, devouring crops while Dobrul the Brave (an ancient Anda) leads a horde of fomori into China, sacking and pillaging all he finds. These alone are pretty bad - Tier 2 or 3 between mass famine and seriously bad disease outbreaks - but there's one other entry here that deserves special entry, which I talked about before. Every single volcano erupts. So, that's everyone dead. I somehow think that wasn't quite what was intended, so like Changeling we have a tier 2 baseline that could easily slide to Tier 3's far extreme. The first scenario, The Last Battleground, takes place almost entirely in the Umbra. In theory, that should mean it has a limited impact on the world, and that's how its presented. Not quite - three major asteroids strike the earth, causing mass dust clouds. Not a good start. Then, the spirit of Earth is brutalized, and spirits worldwide are butchered in the umbra. The combination sees entire cities collapse, wars break out in the middle east, and a global shortfall in the harvest of 90%. For reference, currently the world produces enough food for 10 billion - even with all our waste, it's a bad outcome with mass starvation no matter how much people tighten their belts. Maybe 2 billion will survive, between rationing and cannibalism, but there's also going to be energy disruption due to the Mid-East conflicts and disease ravaging the hunger-weakened mortal population, so I don't think so. That puts this on a Tier 3 no matter how it gets sliced, as some 85% of the human race dying off is a Big Deal. Of course, if the Garou lose, the Wyrm eats the world, which is a Tier 4. This is the 'low impact' scenario. A Tribe Falls comes next, and is a bit weird as it contains 14 options. I'm not going into huge detail on each, but here's the biggest hits. IF the Bone Gnawers fall, they kill at least 1 billion people with disease. If the CoG go, the entire Northeast of America and Canada is swallowed up by spooky scary fog - cue Stephen King film. If the Fianna go, the entire UK collapses due to their brutality. The Fenrir going causes mass rioting. But if the Glass Walkers go, poo poo gets real - the sky turns black as pitch, and at some point the spirit of Pentex itself consumes the minds and souls of all its employees (millions, world-wide) while becoming a Celestine. This would be very loving bad for everyone. In the RT option, 1% of all human beings have madcow disease, and the Red Talons blow up the Pacific Rim, which is Very loving Bad news. The Shadow Lords trigger a nuclear war in the middle-east - also very bad, but only a tier 2 unless it massively escalates. The Striders have no real impact on non-Garou. If the Silver Fangs go, the world descends into open war, and a meteor like that which killed the dinosaurs strikes the earth. Uktena cause mass floods and droughts in America, which is a bit of a de-escalation after the Fangs option. If the Wendigo go, Buffalo NY and at least two other major american cities are nuked, but that kind of pales before the bit where the entire Northern Hemisphere is plunged into a horrific winter, where wendigo spirits break into houses to eat people and there's feet of snow as far south as Libya. Also, a bunch of wars break out, but again: Wendigo spirits are breaking into houses to eat human flesh here. Of those, your best hope is if the Striders go. If the Fangs go, well, everyone dies. Tier 0 on its own merits if the Striders go, and Tier 3 if one of the big boys comes out to play. Weaver Ascendant. Technology run amok! Literally, that's the problem. The Machine wakes up and eats the Weaver, before using a corporate shell to eat Pentex too. Next thing you know, there's an airborn virus killing garou and their kin, and the Garou retaliate by doxxing all the vampires, spirits, ghosts, and other nasties they can. Cue mass chaos, fighting, and war as the Veil, MAsquerade, Etc shred apart. The Dinosaur Kings return, rampaging as giant monsters through over a dozen major cities, presumably killing plenty of people. In the best case scenario here, the Weaver loses and the Wyrm of Balance returns, but even then he breaks the entire Pattern Web, so that's modern civilization and the world as we know it hosed. If the Weaver wins outright, she calcifies the web and everything dies as chaos fades out - it turns out that life is chaotic, so without that factor, the universe becomes cold, sterile, and meaningless. Tier 4 either way.  RAGNAROK! poo poo gets hosed up. The moon explodes when Rorg hurls a 9 mile long asteroid at the Earth. As you might expect, the moon exploding causes some problems. Even bigger problems follow when fragments of the moon hit the Earth, unleashing 5000MT of energy - and this is where I started to hate this scenario. It treated the impacts as nuclear blasts and used nuclear winter as a basis, which is neat and all, but also not how it works. The presented outcome is actually unlikely for that amount of energy, so leaving it unspecified would have worked much better. I'll do a whole effortpost later. But, moving on - as the asteroid approaches, societies collapse, yadayada. As the sky fills with ash, global temperatures plummet, there's ten months of near total darkness in which the Antediluvians rise, glaciers melt, and huge firestorms rage across the globe. Someone nukes Karachi, Medina and Jerusalem. As the sun disappears, huge volcanic rifts open up in Japan, California, and the African Rift Valley - the jaws of the wyrm. All told, at least 3-4 billion people die before the ash clears out, and by that point the Maeljin Incarna are rampaging across the globe with their armies. Everyone in Southern California dies of first, the Bay Area liquifies, hundreds of millions of people in Africa die, the Amazon rain forest burns down, and all out war rages between Garou and Kin against the forces of the Wyrm. If the Wyld wins, virtually all life is dead. Sweet victory! If the Weaver wins, see Weaver Ascendant's weaver victory. If the Wyrm wins, society recovers! Sort of. The wyrm's servants turn earth into hell, and build a new society out of bone and ash by enslaving the survivors. So, either Tier 3 or Tier 4, but not a good outcome for humanity.Lastly, the novel. The Wyrm eats Pluto and Uranus, and knocks Neptune out of orbit. Those are in the Umbra, but will have knock-on physical affects in short order. They'd actually be quite mild for Earth, though the loss of the spiritual forces those planets represent is far worse. The Pattern Web shatters, and with it so do all power grids and communication networks. Then, the Gauntlet collapses and spirits rampage, killing and maiming everyone they see. At the end, the Garou all die, but a single flower blossoms from the ashes and the Wyrm is implied to have been healed, so this is actually the least destructive and most positive outcome of any Werewolf apocalypse scenario - it's a tier 4, though, since the gauntlet no longer exists. Demon still takes the case for 'worst universe to exist in', but not by very much - especially not with the volcanos in play.
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Sep 8, 2016 18:27
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Loomer posted:Lastly, the novel. The Wyrm eats Pluto and Uranus, and knocks Neptune out of orbit. Those are in the Umbra, but will have knock-on physical affects in short order. They'd actually be quite mild for Earth, though the loss of the spiritual forces those planets represent is far worse. The Pattern Web shatters, and with it so do all power grids and communication networks. Then, the Gauntlet collapses and spirits rampage, killing and maiming everyone they see. At the end, the Garou all die, but a single flower blossoms from the ashes and the Wyrm is implied to have been healed, so this is actually the least destructive and most positive outcome of any Werewolf apocalypse scenario - it's a tier 4, though, since the gauntlet no longer exists. I think this is the Hengeyokai ending, I know there's a thing about them possibly falling or the African court falling like the tribes but those are not really fleshed out. The kitsune are supposed to inherit the next age because they're "original character idea, do not steal" incarnate.
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Sep 9, 2016 14:39
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The kitsune's dumb special snowflake crap is a vestige of 2nd edition werewolf. Revised and W20 got rid of the "Fox shall inherit the earth" thing, even then it could have just been the foxes lying out their asses at how important they are.
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Sep 9, 2016 15:26
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The novel is more The Last Battleground, only the Garou lose that fight and the rest takes place on Earth in a spectacular inversion of the 'umbra only' aspect of that scenario. Quite specifically, most of the Garou all die in the umbral war, and the remnants are the ones who make a heroic last stand in the first caern, and sell their lives dear enough that a magic gurahl seed can sprout and (impliedly) heal the Wyrm. If viewed as part of the trilogy, it's that holding action that permits the final result of all things returning to Unity, as all three forces of the triat exhaust themselves fighting and, restored to their proper roles, carry out a cosmic reboot.
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Sep 9, 2016 15:38
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| # ? Jun 2, 2024 23:41 |
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Loomer posted:...gematria... Mods, can we get Loomer namechanged to Beckett please?
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Sep 9, 2016 18:01
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