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Floodkiller
May 31, 2011

Thanks for making the vault I was too lazy to actually create, Brannock.

In related news, blame Brannock for removing newts and replacing them.
(Then, they came for the quokkas...)

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Sage Grimm
Feb 18, 2013

Let's go explorin' little dude!
Good changes. Frilled lizards are a good way of letting you play around with sprinting creatures before you're sideswiped by alligators later on.

Xom could be even better if the greatest gift was randomly different each time but I'm having a hard time thinking up alternatives.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
So if giant newts are gone than what is the weakest creature in the dungeon now so I know what to feel really embarrassed by when it kills me on D:1.

Shady Amish Terror
Oct 11, 2007
I'm not Amish by choice. 8(
Find a way to die to a butterfly and I'll show you a true legend of bad play.

Sage Grimm
Feb 18, 2013

Let's go explorin' little dude!
Die to a zombie brain worm, back when that was a possibility. They didn't even have an attack! They just kept trying to move closer and closer to you.

Can Of Worms
Sep 4, 2011

That's not how the Triangle Attack works...
They say if a lost soul kills you, you get revived.

Akett
Aug 6, 2012

Shady Amish Terror posted:

Find a way to die to a butterfly and I'll show you a true legend of bad play.

One time years ago a butterfly trapped me in a dead end hallway in Lair. I must have spent a few hundred turns trying to kill it. It flew off eventually.

cheetah7071
Oct 20, 2010

honk honk
College Slice

Sage Grimm posted:

Good changes. Frilled lizards are a good way of letting you play around with sprinting creatures before you're sideswiped by alligators later on.

Xom could be even better if the greatest gift was randomly different each time but I'm having a hard time thinking up alternatives.

I had no idea alligators could sprint

Shady Amish Terror
Oct 11, 2007
I'm not Amish by choice. 8(
I thought that that was just in water, but then most of my information is literally years out of date.

Jiangshi are still one of my favorite enemies with their stupid gimmick.

PleasingFungus
Oct 10, 2012
idiot asshole bitch who should fuck off

cheetah7071 posted:

Does that restriction exist for any reason other than making MuBe unplayable so greaterplayers have no choice but to suffer?

Sage Grimm posted:

Preventing Ancient Liches from becoming decidedly ineffective if they happen to be near a moth of wrath in Zot? :v:

mummies and liches are undead, not 'nonliving'. golems, lightning spires, hep ancestors, and certain weird abyss monsters (e.g. starcursed masses) are nonliving; it's basically a catch-all for things that aren't alive and never were alive.

this confuses everyone who runs into it, because the categories are poorly named.

anyway, the restrictions on berserking are some weird mix of 'flavor' and 'mechanical differentiation'. it's not about balance, either way.

Devlan Mud
Apr 10, 2006




I'll hear your stories when we come back, alright?
Suggestion: some sort of invocations power display like the spellpower one so I can get some sort of indicator how much invocations I want to train, besides just the success indicator.

Floodkiller
May 31, 2011

PleasingFungus posted:

mummies and liches are undead, not 'nonliving'. golems, lightning spires, hep ancestors, and certain weird abyss monsters (e.g. starcursed masses) are nonliving; it's basically a catch-all for things that aren't alive and never were alive.

this confuses everyone who runs into it, because the categories are poorly named.

anyway, the restrictions on berserking are some weird mix of 'flavor' and 'mechanical differentiation'. it's not about balance, either way.

Yet again, (player) gargoyles breaking all the rules.

FulsomFrank
Sep 11, 2005

Hard on for love


Uhh, neat?

Shady Amish Terror
Oct 11, 2007
I'm not Amish by choice. 8(
Good ol' Robe of Misfortune. Once upon a time, it was one of the few Nethack level 'why would you put that on its appearance never changes idiot' gotchas. Though it's always amusing getting a positive or neutral mutation from a malmute source; I once got Clarity and Resist Mutation mutations from the same neqoxec.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
So who's gonna take the challenge to keep Xom buddy goblin alive all the way until ascension? :shepface:

Emmideer
Oct 20, 2011

Lovely night, no?
Grimey Drawer

Internet Kraken posted:

So who's gonna take the challenge to keep Xom buddy goblin alive all the way until ascension? :shepface:

Deposit on floor 1, find during ascension.

Brannock
Feb 9, 2006

by exmarx
Fallen Rib
Xom's best friend is an att:good_neutral creature, which means it behaves like freed slaves or the quokka from that one Elyvilon vault. It won't follow you around, but it'll help you kill enemies on that floor.

RPATDO_LAMD
Mar 22, 2013

🐘🪠🍆
FR: There's a small chance for Xom to banish your new friend after 5-10 turns.

Sage Grimm
Feb 18, 2013

Let's go explorin' little dude!
"Lets play hide & seek!"

Kumog
Dec 28, 2006
Am I your god?
FR: A change to how the character generation displays Recommended Combos.

Was helping a friend of mine learn the game, and they legit thought that grey combos (like High Elf Enchanter) were ones they couldn't pick, only the white (High Elf Skald). Could it be swapped so Green for recommended, yellow for not-advised-but-doable? Or at least add text saying "White is recommended, gray combinations will be rougher"?

Shady Amish Terror
Oct 11, 2007
I'm not Amish by choice. 8(
Orange text to let you know all Mummy, Ogrecaster, and Demigod combos are rad as hell and should definitely be played as often as possible.

E: ...huh. Butterflies that are generated hostile but unaware of you blissfully fly around with their asleep brand on. Who knew they slept on the wing?

Shady Amish Terror fucked around with this message at 14:17 on Sep 16, 2016

megane
Jun 20, 2008



Kumog posted:

FR: A change to how the character generation displays Recommended Combos.

Was helping a friend of mine learn the game, and they legit thought that grey combos (like High Elf Enchanter) were ones they couldn't pick, only the white (High Elf Skald). Could it be swapped so Green for recommended, yellow for not-advised-but-doable? Or at least add text saying "White is recommended, gray combinations will be rougher"?

We considered something like this when we switched it to the way it is now, but if I recall correctly we thought it looked too busy and hard to read. Maybe it could be an rc option?

Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Dec 22, 2005

GET LOSE, YOU CAN'T COMPARE WITH MY POWERS

megane posted:

We considered something like this when we switched it to the way it is now, but if I recall correctly we thought it looked too busy and hard to read. Maybe it could be an rc option?
The people who most need it use the default rc though. Maybe the game should check if you're a new player, by polling akrasiac if you're online and looking for high scores if you're offline, and give additional suggestions based on that?

Sage Grimm
Feb 18, 2013

Let's go explorin' little dude!

Shady Amish Terror posted:

Orange text to let you know all Mummy, Ogrecaster, and Demigod combos are rad as hell and should definitely be played as often as possible.

E: ...huh. Butterflies that are generated hostile but unaware of you blissfully fly around with their asleep brand on. Who knew they slept on the wing?

You can replicate the same behaviour by Confusing a monster then Englaciated Hibernating it. They'll start sleepwalking.

Fhqwhgads
Jul 18, 2003

I AM THE ONLY ONE IN THIS GAME WHO GETS LAID
I've got a FoFi^Qaz with one rune and gunning for more, and as a tanky axe/shield wielding fighter, would a regen amulet or a +4 amulet of reflection be better? I'm also stacking resistances with a +2 Shield of Resistance and GDA over a +3 large Shield/Artefact +0 CPA (no resistances but +Str big deal). Good idea if I want to consider tackling extended?

Sage Grimm
Feb 18, 2013

Let's go explorin' little dude!
Regen amulet is always the better choice; reflection only checks if you manage to block an attack in the first place whereas regen is operative as long as you are hurt. As for the other equipment recommendation, I'd go with the Shield of Resistance and the CPA. The first level of resistance is the most important while the other levels are nice to have, excluding various edge cases like Orbs of Fire and rF++ (because fire mutation are literally the only two things it has).

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh

Sage Grimm posted:

Regen amulet is always the better choice; reflection only checks if you manage to block an attack in the first place
It's true that reflecting projectiles isn't that good, but SH is not bad at all and I consider getting more SH basically equal with getting more AC/EV.

I would still usually use regen amulet over it though, but if I have gear which gives regen, am worshipping mak, or the +SH on the amulet is big I might consider reflection over regeneration.

Brannock
Feb 9, 2006

by exmarx
Fallen Rib
Hey InternetKraken I think it's time for a new avatar ;)

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused

Brannock posted:

Hey InternetKraken I think it's time for a new avatar ;)

I actually dug through the commit log just to make sure eyes of draining weren't removed.

Thankfully, they just got a fancy glow now.

Roctavian
Feb 23, 2011

Brannock is my new favorite dev, as the new one who is enabling my lazy "submit tiles, avoid git" behavior

resistentialism
Aug 13, 2007

Trove wants a wand of hasting that's for sale on the other side of the level. Hope this isn't a scam.

Also, FR: put this scam in the game, with mimics.

Internet Kraken
Apr 24, 2010

slightly amused
Troves are already a scam half the time anyways.

Johnny Joestar
Oct 21, 2010

Don't shoot him?

...
...




i suppose the argument would be that it's basically gambling, but usually gambling tends to have actual reasons to try it instead of troves where it usually turns out be 'give up something guaranteed to be useful and get a handful of worthless crap in return'

Shady Amish Terror
Oct 11, 2007
I'm not Amish by choice. 8(
I wouldn't mind a trove to give one of the five wands of teleport I've found before Depths this run.

Granted, it still wouldn't get me anything in return, but I'd at least FEEL like I'd done something with it.

resistentialism
Aug 13, 2007

Ended up with 2 pots of xp but also a faith amulet and an artifact faith amulet wasting my piety. Pretty good all told.

cheetah7071
Oct 20, 2010

honk honk
College Slice
My logic with troves is "would I be happy to get the item it wants from acquirement?"

If so, don't go in

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh

Johnny Joestar posted:

i suppose the argument would be that it's basically gambling, but usually gambling tends to have actual reasons to try it instead of troves where it usually turns out be 'give up something guaranteed to be useful and get a handful of worthless crap in return'
Sometimes what you give up isn't something useful, it''s piety you can earn back quickly or a +3 demon trident you're likely to just randomly find in depths or something anyways, or just showing it the horn of geryon

Johnny Joestar
Oct 21, 2010

Don't shoot him?

...
...




well, the end result is that you're still probably going to get a handful of crap

Shady Amish Terror
Oct 11, 2007
I'm not Amish by choice. 8(
Ah, yes, the real benefit of doing Elf: the Abyss rune.

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Sage Grimm
Feb 18, 2013

Let's go explorin' little dude!
Well if a distortion weapon hadn't dropped yet, you haven't reached the Depths or you're doing silly things for a banner.. :shrug:

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