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Magnetic North
Dec 15, 2008

Beware the Forest's Mushrooms
So I scrubbed at the inside of the squirter, and it didn't seem to help. I played with the tubing a little bit. but I figured I'd put it off for a day where I have less time, so I could work on the interior of the door off as referenced in my earlier post.

Everything has gone pretty much fine except that the door is still attached by the little warning light nested inside the lower outside portion of the door itself. (So that traffic can see the door is open? I don't know what it's called) The rest is totally free but I can't seem to get this loose and the whole thing is fulcruming around it. I cannot find anything online referencing it at all, all the camry videos don't mention it, I don't know if my model is just different? I think it's an LE, but that doesn't seem to alter my search results. I don't know if I have to force it or not, but it is resisting me pretty hard. Any ideas?

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Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!

Magnetic North posted:

Everything has gone pretty much fine except that the door is still attached by the little warning light nested inside the lower outside portion of the door itself. (So that traffic can see the door is open? I don't know what it's called) The rest is totally free but I can't seem to get this loose and the whole thing is fulcruming around it. I cannot find anything online referencing it at all, all the camry videos don't mention it, I don't know if my model is just different? I think it's an LE, but that doesn't seem to alter my search results. I don't know if I have to force it or not, but it is resisting me pretty hard. Any ideas?

This is in refernce to your window that's stuck down? Are you removing the whole door, or just popping off the interior door trim? If the latter, you should be able to pry a bunch of lovely little clips loose, peel back the vapor barrier, and then hulk the window up and jam it in place with a chunk of wood.

Magnetic North
Dec 15, 2008

Beware the Forest's Mushrooms

Safety Dance posted:

This is in refernce to your window that's stuck down? Are you removing the whole door, or just popping off the interior door trim? If the latter, you should be able to pry a bunch of lovely little clips loose, peel back the vapor barrier, and then hulk the window up and jam it in place with a chunk of wood.

Just removing the interior. And what you describe was the plan. My confusion is that between prying the clips and peeling the vapor barrier, I have the panel still attached by that little light. I don't know if it disconnects somewhere somehow. None of the videos reference it and my websearching has found people talking about 'popping it out' but no one explains how.

Godholio
Aug 28, 2002

Does a bear split in the woods near Zheleznogorsk?
Can you post a picture? I have no idea what you're talking about.

Boaz MacPhereson
Jul 11, 2006

Day 12045 Ht10hands 180lbs
No Name
No lumps No Bumps Full life Clean
Two good eyes No Busted Limbs
Piss OK Genitals intact
Multiple scars Heals fast
O NEGATIVE HI OCTANE
UNIVERSAL DONOR
Lone Road Warrior Rundown
on the Powder Lakes V8
No guzzoline No supplies
ISOLATE PSYCHOTIC
Keep muzzled...

Magnetic North posted:

Just removing the interior. And what you describe was the plan. My confusion is that between prying the clips and peeling the vapor barrier, I have the panel still attached by that little light. I don't know if it disconnects somewhere somehow. None of the videos reference it and my websearching has found people talking about 'popping it out' but no one explains how.

I'm guessing the little courtesy light has a removable cover. If you pop that cover off, there's probably a screw in there that has to come out.

Magnetic North
Dec 15, 2008

Beware the Forest's Mushrooms

Godholio posted:

Can you post a picture? I have no idea what you're talking about.

Magnetic North
Dec 15, 2008

Beware the Forest's Mushrooms

Boaz MacPhereson posted:

I'm guessing the little courtesy light has a removable cover. If you pop that cover off, there's probably a screw in there that has to come out.

Gave it a bit more and, yeah, it popped lose.



(not shown, the screw set right behind that fixture)



Screw you, gently caress. I mean, gently caress you, screw.

Door popped right off, should be good now. Thanks for all the help. Hopefully, you guys also had a nice laugh at my incompetence.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!

Magnetic North posted:

Door popped right off, should be good now. Thanks for all the help. Hopefully, you guys also had a nice laugh at my incompetence.

Nah. "Just yank harder" oftentimes leads to broken things, so I think your instinct to stop and ask if you're doing the right thing was a good one.

TWSS
Jun 19, 2008
How should I go about acquiring a replacement ECU (PCM?) for my buddy's 6.0 LQ4 2003 Yukon Denali? A mechanic told him he needs a new one and the guy got injured at work and needs the truck to run errands now that he doesn't have his work truck on hand. The local junkyards want $150 for an ECU with no guarantee of functionality and no returns. He should come into a good amount of money at the end of October, so maybe a cracked ECU that can be tuned for the FAST LSX intake and some headers would be neat.

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009

TWSS posted:

How should I go about acquiring a replacement ECU (PCM?) for my buddy's 6.0 LQ4 2003 Yukon Denali? A mechanic told him he needs a new one

I'll give this a 99.9% probability that he needs a new mechanic, not a new ECU.

Unless you can see water damage or burnt components inside the ECU it's likely just fine but the mechanic is incompetent and points at the scary box he doesn't understand since he can't find the real problem.

Christobevii3
Jul 3, 2006

TWSS posted:

How should I go about acquiring a replacement ECU (PCM?) for my buddy's 6.0 LQ4 2003 Yukon Denali? A mechanic told him he needs a new one and the guy got injured at work and needs the truck to run errands now that he doesn't have his work truck on hand. The local junkyards want $150 for an ECU with no guarantee of functionality and no returns. He should come into a good amount of money at the end of October, so maybe a cracked ECU that can be tuned for the FAST LSX intake and some headers would be neat.

Contact current performance. They do lsx swaps but will be able to source an ecu cheap and flash to factory file I'm sure. A $150 junkyard ecu of the same model may cause security light or no start issues

scuz
Aug 29, 2003

You can't be angry ALL the time!




Fun Shoe
OK, really dumb question here: my Golf's 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated motor makes 114hp, and Honda's F20C 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated engine makes 237hp. How are they able to make so much more? I realize that one is geared towards common commuting and the other is a full-on sports car, but I still would love to know how that whole thing is done.

PaintVagrant
Apr 13, 2007

~ the ultimate driving machine ~

scuz posted:

OK, really dumb question here: my Golf's 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated motor makes 114hp, and Honda's F20C 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated engine makes 237hp. How are they able to make so much more? I realize that one is geared towards common commuting and the other is a full-on sports car, but I still would love to know how that whole thing is done.

Higher compression, tighter tolerances, variable valve timing (vtec), shorter stroke/bigger bore for more revs, much freeer flowing cyclinder head.

Geoj
May 28, 2008

BITTER POOR PERSON
Higher rev limit & higher compression ratio. The F20C hits peak power ~2000 RPMs higher than your engine is likely rev limited to (I'm guessing like most econoboxes your Golf's engine hits the rev limiter between 6000-6500 RPMs, and probably makes peak power well before that), and higher compression means you get more power out of each cylinder.

F1DriverQuidenBerg
Jan 19, 2014

scuz posted:

OK, really dumb question here: my Golf's 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated motor makes 114hp, and Honda's F20C 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated engine makes 237hp. How are they able to make so much more? I realize that one is geared towards common commuting and the other is a full-on sports car, but I still would love to know how that whole thing is done.

What year is your golf? The VW four cylinder design dates back to the old GTI engine so you're talking about a 25 year old design that's mostly been a cost saving exercise reworked for fuel economy and drivability versus a clean sheet for a sports car.

16v versus 8, VTEC and probably injection system are the major differences right off the bat but VW has always shot itself in the knees when it came to engine performance. The switch to crossflow heads is probably the best example, they stuck with the long intake runners but wrapped it around the head so it still bakes the intake, just slightly less that hanging it directly over the exhaust. If your interested in the real specifics look up the oettinger GTI 16S, which had a better designed 16v engine than VW offered in my opinion

scuz
Aug 29, 2003

You can't be angry ALL the time!




Fun Shoe
Thanks for the answers, dudes!

1500quidporsche posted:

What year is your golf? The VW four cylinder design dates back to the old GTI engine so you're talking about a 25 year old design that's mostly been a cost saving exercise reworked for fuel economy and drivability versus a clean sheet for a sports car.

16v versus 8, VTEC and probably injection system are the major differences right off the bat but VW has always shot itself in the knees when it came to engine performance. The switch to crossflow heads is probably the best example, they stuck with the long intake runners but wrapped it around the head so it still bakes the intake, just slightly less that hanging it directly over the exhaust. If your interested in the real specifics look up the oettinger GTI 16S, which had a better designed 16v engine than VW offered in my opinion
2002. And that Oettinger stuff is pretty fascinating! I tend to get bored with some physics stuff, but this is up my alley.

PaintVagrant
Apr 13, 2007

~ the ultimate driving machine ~
F and K series 4 cylinders are really incredibly well designed engines. Honda rules because REVS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RwRiPF_Qpcc

Percipient Badger
Mar 21, 2008

spog posted:

Dunno, but 2>1, so must be twice as good?

Post your findings after you've spoken to them.

Didn't find a whole lot; it's more about adaptability, apparently. IE easily transferred to a different car. Value for money if you will. Also there is a couple buttons on that one that let you easily change the state of tune, few modes available apparently, focused on economy or performance or a blend.

As for my car, not a massive effect; may help refine the various tuning options on it, rather than add hoooge boost powah.

How boring.

The lady on the phone wasn't as good at customer service as you made out.

totalnewbie
Nov 13, 2005

I was born and raised in China, lived in Japan, and now hold a US passport.

I am wrong in every way, all the damn time.

Ask me about my tattoos.

scuz posted:

OK, really dumb question here: my Golf's 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated motor makes 114hp, and Honda's F20C 2.0 liter 4-cylinder naturally-aspirated engine makes 237hp. How are they able to make so much more? I realize that one is geared towards common commuting and the other is a full-on sports car, but I still would love to know how that whole thing is done.

For fun comparison:
The original LT1 engine in the 1972 Corvette was rated at 255 bhp. It had a displacement of 5.7 liters. That's another 3.7 liters for an 18 hp improvement from the modern Honda engine.
Nevermind that it has more torque

The current LT1 makes 455 bhp (and a hell of a lot more torque) and has 6.2L displacement.

Engine technology has gotten a lot better over the years.

TremorX
Jan 19, 2001

All Hail Big Hairy Mike

Just wondering if anyone else has had this problem and if so, what part(s) I might need.

2005 Dodge Magnum RT.

• The door-lock switches only operate the driver's front door; the passenger front door switch only operates the driver's front door. I can manually operate the passenger's side lock.

• The rear door locks are stuck in the UP (unlocked) position and cannot be pushed down manually. The rear hatch will also not lock. Edit: double-checked and yeah, it does lock when I push either front lock switch.

My key fob's battery is dead but it's been months and I haven't had problems before.

However, this came after this morning's usual "it's cold so the alarm is going to go off for 10 minutes" this car does in the mornings, which I also can't seem to nail down the cause of (it was doing this when the key fob worked, too). When it does this I have to unlock the door with the key, then start the car and let it idle for about 10 minutes before the alarm stops going off. During this time, I have no instruments, stereo or blinkers, either. If I leave the car unlocked and in the garage at night, then I don't get the alarm problem, just no dash instruments until it warms up. It's only an issue when the temps outside get below around 60°F. Last night everything worked fine.

I checked all of my fuses (had one blown 20amp, but that was just the cigarette lighter outlets), and pulled the neg terminal for about an hour and tried again. Even without the battery the door locks are stuck in the 'up' position and can't be pushed down manually.

Would I seriously lose 3 locks at the same time? Are the actuators bad or is this some other electrical gremlin?

TremorX fucked around with this message at 21:40 on Sep 16, 2016

Boaz MacPhereson
Jul 11, 2006

Day 12045 Ht10hands 180lbs
No Name
No lumps No Bumps Full life Clean
Two good eyes No Busted Limbs
Piss OK Genitals intact
Multiple scars Heals fast
O NEGATIVE HI OCTANE
UNIVERSAL DONOR
Lone Road Warrior Rundown
on the Powder Lakes V8
No guzzoline No supplies
ISOLATE PSYCHOTIC
Keep muzzled...

TremorX posted:

Just wondering if anyone else has had this problem and if so, what part(s) I might need.

2005 Dodge Magnum RT.

• The door-lock switches only operate the driver's front door; the passenger front door switch only operates the driver's front door. I can manually operate the passenger's side lock.

• The rear door locks are stuck in the UP (unlocked) position and cannot be pushed down manually. The rear hatch will also not lock. Edit: double-checked and yeah, it does lock when I push either front lock switch.

My key fob's battery is dead but it's been months and I haven't had problems before.

However, this came after this morning's usual "it's cold so the alarm is going to go off for 10 minutes" this car does in the mornings, which I also can't seem to nail down the cause of (it was doing this when the key fob worked, too). When it does this I have to unlock the door with the key, then start the car and let it idle for about 10 minutes before the alarm stops going off. During this time, I have no instruments, stereo or blinkers, either. If I leave the car unlocked and in the garage at night, then I don't get the alarm problem, just no dash instruments until it warms up. It's only an issue when the temps outside get below around 60°F. Last night everything worked fine.

I checked all of my fuses (had one blown 20amp, but that was just the cigarette lighter outlets), and pulled the neg terminal for about an hour and tried again. Even without the battery the door locks are stuck in the 'up' position and can't be pushed down manually.

Would I seriously lose 3 locks at the same time? Are the actuators bad or is this some other electrical gremlin?

I would have said actuator for the passenger door, but all the added stuff kinda throws that away. It may be a coincidence, but ehhh... Very weird that the back ones won't even lock manually.

TremorX
Jan 19, 2001

All Hail Big Hairy Mike

Yeah, I've never had that happen on anything before. No amount of pushing down works, it's kinda spongy feeling but won't engage. I haven't taken the door panels off yet, I just thought I'd see if anyone else might have an idea before I do.

spog
Aug 7, 2004

It's your own bloody fault.

Percipient Badger posted:

Didn't find a whole lot; it's more about adaptability, apparently. IE easily transferred to a different car. Value for money if you will. Also there is a couple buttons on that one that let you easily change the state of tune, few modes available apparently, focused on economy or performance or a blend.

As for my car, not a massive effect; may help refine the various tuning options on it, rather than add hoooge boost powah.

How boring.

Tempted? Going to get the remap instead?

quote:

The lady on the phone wasn't as good at customer service as you made out.

That's disappointing.
I think I spoke to one of the owners and he was definitely someone who would tell you about it at a party, in great depth, whether you wanted to know or not.
Guess you got a sales drone.

Sorry I let you down, man. I feel bad.

spog fucked around with this message at 22:42 on Sep 16, 2016

Memento
Aug 25, 2009


Bleak Gremlin

TremorX posted:

Yeah, I've never had that happen on anything before. No amount of pushing down works, it's kinda spongy feeling but won't engage. I haven't taken the door panels off yet, I just thought I'd see if anyone else might have an idea before I do.

If the central locking solenoid is really dead and jammed as gently caress it can stop you from pushing down on the lock. I've seen that before where one solenoid dies and makes the car lock then unlock immediately when you press the lock button on the key fob, and the lock won't press down.

Weird that they would both do that at once though.

High Protein
Jul 12, 2009
I've got a 1999 Oldsmobile Alero here, auto trans. It makes a sort of grinding noise taking off, which I identified being due to it being in first gear. If I put the transmission in 1st, hold the brakes and give it throttle, I hear the noise. If I do the same in 2nd, nothing. However this doesn't make sense to me, shouldn't only the torque converter be moving while doing this? Car moves fine, doesn't seem like the transmission is slipping. Also suggests it isn't something rattling around as it doesn't seem to be rpm dependent.

PromethiumX
Mar 5, 2003
1998 Nissan Frontier 2wd, manual transmission, 4 cylinder, KA24DE Engine, 148,000 miles.

I had a fuel injector fail on me recently so I bought a complete new set, along with fuel pressure regulator and fuel filter because all of that was original (~100 bucks from Rockauto).

Got everything swapped out. Started it up and it ran like a boss. Now however, I've noticed that the truck will start just fine (starter engaged for less than a second to bring the engine to idle) the first time, but if I turn it off and come back to it about a half hour later I have to engage the starter and crank it for about 3 seconds for the engine to idle. When it does finally idle its at a very low speed. Like the RPM you'd see sitting at a red light after the car has been on for a while.

Where as when I start it initially it begins at much higher RPMS then slowly backs down to that low idle speed. What have I hosed up?

The fuel pump assembly is new as of about 10k miles ago. I've got the proper pressure at the regulator and it doesn't leak down super fast when the engine is off. I've checked the fuel rail to make sure none of the new injectors are leaking by when the engine is off. Anyone have any ideas?

hell astro course
Dec 10, 2009

pizza sucks

Hi, I hope I'm asking this question in the right place. I have a Honda 2004 Civic LX...

I've got a question about trickle chargers and float chargers. My car lives in a damp San Francisco below street level garage, and I rarely take it out. Do you guys have any advice on trickle chargers? Or should I just stop being a baby and start up my car and let it idle once every two weeks?

Christobevii3
Jul 3, 2006
I would try to drive it once a month and get a small battery tender that is easy to plugin. At how little you are driving you might consider selling your car tbh. It would be cheaper to rent or use uber when you need to go somewhere.

hell astro course
Dec 10, 2009

pizza sucks

Christobevii3 posted:

I would try to drive it once a month and get a small battery tender that is easy to plugin. At how little you are driving you might consider selling your car tbh. It would be cheaper to rent or use uber when you need to go somewhere.

Yeah, it's not really a money issue at all, I'd like to keep my car, and I generally like going out on long drives and road trips, I just don't need it for daily use.

Edit: I basically need to learn about battery tenders, and which is a good one to buy

hell astro course fucked around with this message at 02:23 on Sep 18, 2016

Fender Anarchist
May 20, 2009

Fender Anarchist

Idling isn't a great way to top up the battery, you'd be better taking it for a 20 minute drive, but obviously that sort of defeats the purpose.

Honestly the little $9 Harbor Freight float chargers are a pretty good value. It doesn't take much charging output to offset self-discharge, and something that small you don't really have to worry about it overcharging the battery. I used it to keep my battery alive while my car was in pieces for a year, and it cranked beautifully on the first try.

Christobevii3
Jul 3, 2006
Just buy one that has a circuit and a way to bolt a pigtail to the battery for easy hookup. The battery tender brand is usually good but expensive. The amazon black and decker one is probably ok

Jack B Nimble
Dec 25, 2007


Soiled Meat
I'll be buying a car in the next week or two and I'm trying get more info on my choices (this is more a car questions than asking for a recommendation).

So I'll be spending ~4k and I'm looking for an import econbox with an automatic transmission A few days of looking at CL ads in my area tell me I'm looking at 2005 era cars with about 100,000 miles on them, give or take.

I'm mostly looking at the Toyota Corolla, out of what I'd call the big 3 econoboxes (Mazda 3, Civic, Corolla) the Toyota's have aged the best to me (I've heard others here say the same, god bless bland styling), and if my goal is to buy an appliance of a small car why not go with the gold standard. I had a few questions about it, and on buying a high mileage car in general.

  • Can anyone recommend a forum to read up on common problems? I found this sad place and is this what it's like looking at non enthusiast forums, there's barely any replies to anything, but it was the first google hit.
  • I'll be getting an automatic, Toyota automatics are considered simplistic but reliable? I know I "should" get a manual but I've had enough of manuals for now and want an econobox I can drive in my sleep.
  • Timing Chain but also interference engine - assuming the car 100k on it should I just plan to change the tensions as soon as I buy it? I understand I'm probably buying a car with a lot of deferred maintenance and I'm not under any illusions that buying the car itself is just first half of it's costs, but can I get some advice on what I should consider an asap inspect/replace? I plan on having a mechanic inspect the car before I buy it, and will celebrate the purchase by changing all fuids, plugs, and plug wires, but is there anything else I should consider?

hell astro course
Dec 10, 2009

pizza sucks

Christobevii3 posted:

Just buy one that has a circuit and a way to bolt a pigtail to the battery for easy hookup. The battery tender brand is usually good but expensive. The amazon black and decker one is probably ok

Yeah I have a wall outlet in the garage right to my car. This is the kind of thing I am looking for. Thanks! I called a tow truck today to get my car out of my garage, and he just poked some box behind the alternator with a stick and said "yeah just poke that. when it gets cold or damp, you need to poke that. that's why your car didn't start." what was that, and why did he poke it?

The Royal Nonesuch
Nov 1, 2005

Raluek posted:

Make a thread when you get working on it! My daily is a 4-door non-SS one of those.

As for the Hantavirus concerns, are you working on it out in the field, or indoors somewhere? According to the CDC, the droppings/urine/etc are no longer contagious infectuous after about a week. So what I'd do is clean out all you can, then seal the car up in your work space with some traps (to make sure there aren't any live ones hiding) for a week or two. Then you can use more mild cleaning agents than bleach on e.g. the door panels without worrying about suddenly catching respiratory failure.

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Automotive Insanity: As for the Hantavirus concerns,

PaintVagrant
Apr 13, 2007

~ the ultimate driving machine ~
Jackbnimble add scions to your list, they are all basically corollas anyways. Corollas will outlast the cockoroaches

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

PaintVagrant posted:

Jackbnimble add scions to your list, they are all basically corollas anyways. Corollas will outlast the cockoroaches

And you can can get an XB/XD for like 2/3 the price of a Corolla.

hell astro course
Dec 10, 2009

pizza sucks

Enourmo posted:

Idling isn't a great way to top up the battery, you'd be better taking it for a 20 minute drive, but obviously that sort of defeats the purpose.

Honestly the little $9 Harbor Freight float chargers are a pretty good value. It doesn't take much charging output to offset self-discharge, and something that small you don't really have to worry about it overcharging the battery. I used it to keep my battery alive while my car was in pieces for a year, and it cranked beautifully on the first try.

This is exactly the kinda thing I am looking for. Can I just hook it up to a wall socket, plug it in, and not worry about my battery if I dont' take my car out for a month?

randomidiot
May 12, 2006

by Fluffdaddy

(and can't post for 11 years!)

Pretty much, yeah. You'll want to check on it now and then to make sure the battery isn't bulging, and if it's not a maintenance free battery, you'll want to make sure the electrolyte isn't low about once a month (you can usually top it off with distilled water).

Christobevii3 posted:

Contact current performance. They do lsx swaps but will be able to source an ecu cheap and flash to factory file I'm sure. A $150 junkyard ecu of the same model may cause security light or no start issues

This. GM has been pairing their ECUs with the rest of the vehicle electronics for a long time. The ECU will need to be paired to the car, otherwise you'll get a security light and nothing from the starter.

randomidiot fucked around with this message at 05:55 on Sep 18, 2016

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





TremorX posted:

Just wondering if anyone else has had this problem and if so, what part(s) I might need.

2005 Dodge Magnum RT.

• The door-lock switches only operate the driver's front door; the passenger front door switch only operates the driver's front door. I can manually operate the passenger's side lock.

• The rear door locks are stuck in the UP (unlocked) position and cannot be pushed down manually. The rear hatch will also not lock. Edit: double-checked and yeah, it does lock when I push either front lock switch.

My key fob's battery is dead but it's been months and I haven't had problems before.

However, this came after this morning's usual "it's cold so the alarm is going to go off for 10 minutes" this car does in the mornings, which I also can't seem to nail down the cause of (it was doing this when the key fob worked, too). When it does this I have to unlock the door with the key, then start the car and let it idle for about 10 minutes before the alarm stops going off. During this time, I have no instruments, stereo or blinkers, either. If I leave the car unlocked and in the garage at night, then I don't get the alarm problem, just no dash instruments until it warms up. It's only an issue when the temps outside get below around 60°F. Last night everything worked fine.

I checked all of my fuses (had one blown 20amp, but that was just the cigarette lighter outlets), and pulled the neg terminal for about an hour and tried again. Even without the battery the door locks are stuck in the 'up' position and can't be pushed down manually.

Would I seriously lose 3 locks at the same time? Are the actuators bad or is this some other electrical gremlin?

It's a stretch, but then again, it's Chrysler. Check your driver's door wiring - WJs commonly end up with shorts and because all of the windows / locks can be controlled from here, poo poo gets really weird sometimes depending on what shorts to what.

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Godholio
Aug 28, 2002

Does a bear split in the woods near Zheleznogorsk?
Does anyone besides race mechanics from the 1970s and collector car owners use non-maintenance free batteries anymore? I've never even seen one in a normal parts store. Or in a normal car, for that matter.

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