CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

Fluffy Chainsaw: Jul 6, 2016; I'm likely a pissant middle manager who pisses off IT with worthless requests. There is no content within my posts other than a garbage act akin to a know-it-all, which likely is how I behave in real life. It's really hard for me to comprehend how much I am hated by everyone.

flakeloaf posted:

The wish and desire of this DM was to be able to do his job. That's not a big ask.

Also I love having mandatory patches delayed indefinitely because one of the affected ministers can't go without his black berry for two hours on a Sunday. That's way better than having each department able to call its own shots.

As a rule, every single DM makes the same argument about whatever "mission critical" project she or he pushes, no matter what it is.

e: quote != edit

# ? Sep 18, 2016 23:49

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# ? Jun 8, 2024 00:32

Arivia: Mar 17, 2011

Fluffy Chainsaw posted:

The Government of Canada, as a rule, never gets anywhere, no matter what it does.

If this is what you think it's no wonder you have such bad opinions. Did you vote Libertarian last election too? How deep is your stupidity well?

# ? Sep 18, 2016 23:58

Fluffy Chainsaw: Jul 6, 2016; I'm likely a pissant middle manager who pisses off IT with worthless requests. There is no content within my posts other than a garbage act akin to a know-it-all, which likely is how I behave in real life. It's really hard for me to comprehend how much I am hated by everyone.

Arivia posted:

If this is what you think it's no wonder you have such bad opinions. Did you vote Libertarian last election too? How deep is your stupidity well?

Easy there, AS-03 (Acting). No need to get so worked up. It's all lighthearted internet fun.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 00:03

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

fyi fluffy chainsaw is melian dialogue/p-value hack/swagger like us

# ? Sep 19, 2016 00:03

Fluffy Chainsaw: Jul 6, 2016; I'm likely a pissant middle manager who pisses off IT with worthless requests. There is no content within my posts other than a garbage act akin to a know-it-all, which likely is how I behave in real life. It's really hard for me to comprehend how much I am hated by everyone.

namaste faggots posted:

fyi fluffy chainsaw is melian dialogue/p-value hack/swagger like us

Thanks, Jenny Kwan. I thought the latest was that I'm Fraternite?

(Maybe I'm off-meds you?)

# ? Sep 19, 2016 00:05

Jordan7hm: Feb 17, 2011; Lipstick Apathy

namaste faggots posted:

fyi fluffy chainsaw is melian dialogue/p-value hack/swagger like us

swagger was far more reasonable than fluffy

Fluffy Chainsaw posted:

(Maybe I'm off-meds you?)

This, however, I buy.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 00:27

TinkerBell: Dec 4, 2002; For the last %#$@ing time, I'm not a fairy! I'm a pixie.

Love the A/ AS-03 reference. Well played.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 00:52

Subjunctive: Sep 12, 2006; ✨sparkle and shine✨

When I was in discussion about a DM-level tech-related position with the Ontario government, they were falling all over themselves to say that there wouldn't be any SSC-like constraints. In their approximate words, they knew they'd never get anyone good to operate in an environment like that.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 00:57

Lain Iwakura: Aug 5, 2004; The body exists only to verify one's own existence.; Taco Defender

I like watching people talk about IT department policy and implementation like anyone else outside of said department would.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 01:13

The Butcher: Apr 20, 2005; Well, at least we tried.; Nap Ghost

OSI bean dip posted:

I like watching people talk about IT department policy and implementation like anyone else outside of said department would.

It's good to put CanPol in perspective. The yanks are dealing with deciding to hand over the nuke keys to either a deranged TV character or a lizard creature wearing human skin while still maintaining the balance of global power and prosperity while having their fingers in the pie of every government everywhere.

Back up here we can't figure out how to work the software to pay government employees and that's the best we can bitch about besides giving very stern looks of disapproval at shipping arms to assholes and hand wringing over the PMs well defined abs.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 02:09

Brandon Proust: Jun 22, 2006; "Like many intellectuals, he was incapable of scoring a simple goal in a simple way"

namaste faggots posted:

i just want to remind all of your that this is the sort of opinion that only can be yielded by a member of the cf

the fact that members of the cf are allowed to operate weaponry really worries me, sometimes

# ? Sep 19, 2016 05:54

MA-Horus: Dec 3, 2006; I'm sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome I am.

Brandon Proust posted:

the fact that members of the cf are allowed to operate weaponry really worries me, sometimes

don't worry

lots of it won't operate no matter how hard you try to mongo on it.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 14:23

RBC: Nov 23, 2007; IM STILL SPENDING MONEY FROM 1888

there was a time in this forum when duplicate accounts would be banned

# ? Sep 19, 2016 14:43

MA-Horus: Dec 3, 2006; I'm sorry, I can't hear you over the sound of how awesome I am.

RBC posted:

there was a time in this forum when duplicate accounts would be banned

lowtax needs the money

# ? Sep 19, 2016 14:44

Count Roland: Oct 6, 2013

quote:

Thousands of pages of secret files obtained by CBC reveal how Canada's police and intelligence service not only knew three Canadians were being tortured in Syrian jails in a post-Sept. 11 crackdown, but co-operated with Syrian officials in their interrogations.

The files also show a Canadian ambassador helped deliver questions the RCMP and CSIS wanted put to the Canadians imprisoned in Syria, a country with a dismal human rights record

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/terrorism-torture-syria-canadians-1.3669425

loving scum. Look at some of this poo poo.

quote:

After nearly two weeks of 24/7 surveillance of Almalki, an RCMP case officer wrote in a memo: "O Div task force are presently finding it difficult to establish anything on him other than the fact that he is an arab running around."

Even so, the RCMP put out a worldwide terrorist alert about Almalki to its agents and passed it along to the CIA and FBI.

quote:

When he went to visit his ailing grandmother in early 2002, he was detained upon arrival at the Damascus airport, taken to a prison and subjected to a vicious cycle of torture. He was beaten with an electric cable, strung up to the bars of a window and lashed with leather belts.

Back in Ottawa, documents show the RCMP and CSIS were eager to exploit Almalki's vulnerability as he sat in a dark cell, described by Amnesty International as "a grave."

An RCMP memo marked "secret" read: "Insp. [Michel] Cabana believes it would be prudent ... to begin the planning for a potential interview of Almalki by Syrian officials based on questions derived from the [RCMP] Project A-O investigation."

Instead of pressing Syria for the release of Almalki, documents show Canada's ambassador to Damascus, Franco Pillarella, arranged for the RCMP's questions to be hand-delivered to the Syrian agency that was responsible for torturing him.

Pillarella later testified about his excellent relations with the Syrian prison authorities, claiming "no ambassador has ever, with my exception, has ever had access to the head of military intelligence." He also said he was aware of widespread allegations of torture in Syria, but unless a person witnessed it "one cannot say for a certainty that this is what would happen."

quote:

In the summer of 2001, U.S. border agents in New York stopped Elmaati on the Lewiston-Queenston Bridge and searched his truck. The RCMP, documents reveal, pegged its case against Elmaati on a map of federal government buildings in Ottawa.

The RCMP determined the map suggested Elmaati was preparing to attack nuclear and biological facilities in Ottawa. The map listed the location of Atomic Energy of Canada, Eldorado Nuclear Ltd., HBW Virus Labs, and HBW Disease Control.

Alex Neve, the head of Amnesty International Canada, said the map "was a simple photocopied map that was given regularly to delivery people and truck drivers so they could find their way around that particular office complex."

quote:

By the end of 2003, the torture of Canadians in Syria and Egypt was beginning to make headlines. Maher Arar was speaking openly about his torture in Syria. Members of Parliament were being asked uncomfortable questions.

But on Oct. 16, 2003, more than a week after Arar's release and his public testimony that he was tortured, documents show the RCMP was trying to have one more Canadian interrogated in Damascus.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 15:48

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

Polls agree with Ikantski, "Kathleen Wynne makes Stephen Harper look like Mr. Rogers!" HIGH ENERGY! Wynne at 16 percent approval. Stephen Harper bottomed out at 30%. Two more years

quote:

A survey conducted by Forum Research Inc. shows Patrick Brown�s Progressive Conservatives have increased their lead over the struggling Liberals to 20 percentage points.

Wynne�s pledge to remove the 8 per cent provincial tax from hydro bills starting in January enjoyed 56 per cent support in the poll, with 28 per cent disapproving and 16 per cent unsure.

The poll, conducted over two days following the tax break announcement in Monday�s throne speech, showed the Progressive Conservatives rising to 45 per cent support, the Liberals falling to 25, the NDP steady at 23 and the Green Party with 6 per cent.

The flip side of Wynne�s 16 per cent approval rating was disapproval from 74 per cent of voters surveyed, with 9 per cent undecided.

In terms of who would make the best premier, 25 per cent of voters in the poll picked Brown, with 19 per cent for Horwath, 15 per cent choosing Wynne and 24 per cent saying none of the above.

quote:

If these results are projected up to sets in the legislature, the Progressive Conservatives would take 70% of them, or 75 seats, to 24 for the New Democrats. The Liberals would keep just 8 seats.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 15:55

Square Peg: Nov 11, 2008

Ikantski posted:

24 per cent saying none of the above.

Sounds like Ontario is ripe for a (right wing, obviously) populist party like Alberta's! Get ready for the
*googles Ontario's official flower*
Trillium Grandiflorum? Sure, whatever, the White Trillium Party!

Square Peg fucked around with this message at 17:10 on Sep 19, 2016

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:04

Reince Penis: Nov 15, 2007; by R. Guyovich

It's good.

We're ready for a change.

Patrick Brown and Doug Ford are surely the people to turn Ontario around.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:07

Monaghan: Dec 29, 2006

I'm looking forward to the ontario conservatives somehow managing to gently caress up the next election.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:08

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

Oh good, can't wait for the Conservatives to somehow prove they're still worse than even the godawful OLP. Privatize GO Transit, OLG, and the LCBO, drop our per capita government spending to the lowest of any province, leave nothing for the next government.

Fuuuuuck this province is a dumpster fire. Queens Park is actually the worst.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:17

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

Square Peg posted:

Sounds like Ontario is ripe for a (right wing, obviously) populist party like Alberta's! Get ready for the
*google's Ontario's official flower*
Trillium Grandiflorum? Sure, whatever, the White Trillium Party!

Meet Bob.

http://www.trilliumpartyontario.ca/

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:17

Risky Bisquick: Jan 18, 2008; PLEASE LET ME WRITE YOUR VICTIM IMPACT STATEMENT SO I CAN FURTHER DEMONSTRATE THE CALAMITY THAT IS OUR JUSTICE SYSTEM.; Buglord

Ikantski posted:

Polls agree with Ikantski, "Kathleen Wynne makes Stephen Harper look like Mr. Rogers!" HIGH ENERGY! Wynne at 16 percent approval. Stephen Harper bottomed out at 30%. Two more years

Even if they throw her out, Brown will inherit about two decades of awful energy policy and I doubt he will make a large enough splash to right the albatross. We need to build more CANDUs immediately, and move containment to beyond north bay not Huron.

Wynne was supposed to announce something today @ 10am regarding energy, does anyone have an update?

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:17

flakeloaf: Feb 26, 2003; Still better than android clock

Square Peg posted:

Sounds like Ontario is ripe for a (right wing, obviously) populist party like Alberta's! Get ready for the
*google's Ontario's official flower*
Trillium Grandiflorum? Sure, whatever, the White Trillium Party!

Wynnejungtrillia

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:23

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...rticle31946755/

quote:

No excuse for Ottawa's bungled technology

Maybe you don�t think it�s a big deal that tens of thousands of federal government workers are going unpaid because of the botched roll out of a new pay system.

Most civil servants are overpaid and underworked anyway, right?

Many Canadians may feel similarly untroubled that government data centres are frequently crashing, downing websites and leaving key agencies, such as Statistics Canada, unable to get timely economic information to financial markets.

But it does matter. Canada isn�t some tin-pot country that can�t pay its workers, run a computer or produce timely data. It�s a G7 country, a modern, advanced economy that should be a model of good governance.

There is a disturbing back story to these embarrassing headlines.

Turn back the clock to 2010. Stephen Harper�s Conservative government was eager to demonstrate it could wring billions of dollars in savings out of a fat government bureaucracy it neither liked nor trusted.

Two of the signature initiatives that emerged from this effort was the centralized Phoenix pay system and the birth of Shared Services Canada, a $1.9-billion super agency that would consolidate all of the government technology systems.

And for years afterward it would point to these efforts to bolster its reputation as a sound manager of the machinery of government.

Both have been unmitigated disasters.

The fallout from these moves continues to reverberate through the government. Not only have the promised savings never materialized, but Ottawa is now spending tens of millions more to fix the problems.

On Friday, Statscan�s chief statistician, Wayne Smith, abruptly resigned, complaining that the agency�s independence has been compromised by �disruptive, ineffective, slow and unaffordable� technology supplied by Shared Services Canada.

Mr. Smith�s frustrations boiled over July 8 when the agency�s main website was down for nearly eight hours due to a power switch failure, snarling the release of June�s jobs numbers, one of the country�s most important economic indicators. Statscan staff resorted to snapping the document on a smartphone and faxing pages to data users at financial institutions and media outlets.

Statscan�s website routinely goes down on busy data-release days.

The problems at Shared Services, which consolidated the information technology of 43 departments, go way beyond Statscan. The federal Auditor-General concluded in a report this year that Shared Services� operations are so dogged by hidden costs, delays, security problems and poor accounting that potential savings remain �largely unknown.�

The Liberals quietly boosted Shared Services� budget by $384-million over two years in its March budget, in part to keep creaky old computer systems from crashing. Critics worry that much more will be needed to fully modernize systems.

In late July, smoke inside a federal data centre in Ottawa forced the temporary shutdown of government e-mail and some websites.

Meanwhile, Ottawa says the estimated bill to fix IBM�s Phoenix pay system has reached $45-million to $50-million, and could climb higher. The government has promised to cover any out-of-pocket expenses of workers who couldn�t pay bills or were forced to borrow money when they weren�t paid.

Just like Shared Services, Phoenix was supposed to save the government money � $70-million a year � by consolidating a myriad of pay systems spanning 300,000 workers in more than 100 departments. Most of the first-year savings have now been wiped out.

A big part of the problem can be traced to a decision by the Conservatives to create a new payroll-processing centre in Miramichi, N.B. Roughly 500 � mostly inexperienced � new hires, would replace more than 2,000 payroll staff from across the country.

Ottawa has since been forced to add pay specialists in Gatineau, Que., and at temporary offices in Winnipeg, Montreal, Toronto and Sherbrooke, Que. � all to help fix the problem of workers getting paid too much, not enough or not at all.

Efficiency was never the main reason for choosing Miramichi. Putting the payroll centre in the city was political compensation for the closing of the long-gun registry, which had been located there.

The Conservatives fed the country a narrative about making government leaner and more efficient.

They delivered something quite different.

this is nonsense. canpol poster and AS-03 (acting) CF forces all star fluffy chainsaw/p-value hack/melian dialogue/swagger like us said that there are lots of efficiencies to be

# ? Sep 19, 2016 16:55

Square Peg: Nov 11, 2008

Ikantski posted:

Meet Bob.

http://www.trilliumpartyontario.ca/

That policy page is a hoot. A full third of it is explaining why cops and soldiers shouldn't be allowed to run for office? Like, sure, odds are they've had their humanity systematically removed by their organizations and thus should not have any control over human affairs but what a weird thing to have as a major party plank.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 17:30

Tsyni: Sep 1, 2004; Lipstick Apathy

Count Roland posted:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/terrorism-torture-syria-canadians-1.3669425

loving scum. Look at some of this poo poo.

I hope the people of Canada take to the street and execute the ambassador and the RCMP involved.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 17:34

Helsing: Aug 23, 2003; DON'T POST IN THE ELECTION THREAD UNLESS YOU JOE BIDEN

Square Peg posted:

That policy page is a hoot. A full third of it is explaining why cops and soldiers shouldn't be allowed to run for office? Like, sure, odds are they've had their humanity systematically removed by their organizations and thus should not have any control over human affairs but what a weird thing to have as a major party plank.

Yeah they actually seem to be promising the exact same kind of things that the three major parties promise during elections -- vapid statements about the need for entrepreneurial-ism, a checklist of basic reforms to stuff like the auditor general, soem vague commitment to involving more stakeholders and adopting more "common sense" positions. I don't see anything about full communism, racial purity, the gold standard, bitcoins or fluoride. That one mention of the police being used as a revenue-generating tool seems like the closest thing to a controversial or novel argument here.

Apparently our three main parties become so disreputable, or our political imagination is just so limited, that people are inventing new fringe parties whose only gimmick is not actually being the NDP, PCs or Liberals?

# ? Sep 19, 2016 17:46

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

https://twitter.com/LJKawa/status/777910525191741442?s=09

# ? Sep 19, 2016 17:51

Fluffy Chainsaw: Jul 6, 2016; I'm likely a pissant middle manager who pisses off IT with worthless requests. There is no content within my posts other than a garbage act akin to a know-it-all, which likely is how I behave in real life. It's really hard for me to comprehend how much I am hated by everyone.

namaste faggots posted:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/repo...rticle31946755/

this is nonsense. canpol poster and AS-03 (acting) CF forces all star fluffy chainsaw/p-value hack/melian dialogue/swagger like us said that there are lots of efficiencies to be

Is your point that SSC is doing it wrong, or that an overhaul of government IT isn't needed?

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:01

JawKnee: Mar 24, 2007; You'll take the ride to leave this town along that yellow line

well you did say that SCC is a good thing, not that it could be, or should be

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:02

DariusLikewise: Oct 4, 2008; You wore that on Halloween?

Clearly SSC could be a good thing, but like most things that have happened in the last 11 years, the Conservatives did something to say they did it and starved funding so it went to poo poo. That said for all the funding announcements the Liberals have they made, they haven't put any money back into public service so it's still a shitstorm.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:07

Fluffy Chainsaw: Jul 6, 2016; I'm likely a pissant middle manager who pisses off IT with worthless requests. There is no content within my posts other than a garbage act akin to a know-it-all, which likely is how I behave in real life. It's really hard for me to comprehend how much I am hated by everyone.

JawKnee posted:

well you did say that SCC is a good thing, not that it could be, or should be

I did also say that it was obviously experiencing growing pains, and that when those are sorted out, it will be better than what existed before.

Seriously, check out the 2010 AG report on Aging Infrastructure if you wonder what the alternative to trying to reform the system would end up like.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:08

tagesschau: Sep 1, 2006; Guten Abend, meine Damen und Herren.

Fluffy Chainsaw posted:

I did also say that it was obviously experiencing growing pains, and that when those are sorted out, it will be better than what existed before.

Seriously, check out the 2010 AG report on Aging Infrastructure if you wonder what the alternative to trying to reform the system would end up like.

The idea that any restructuring, no matter how ham-fisted, is necessarily better than no restructuring at all, is not supported by evidence or experience.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:11

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Yeah like you loving know better that stats can

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:11

HackensackBackpack: Aug 20, 2007; Who needs a house out in Hackensack? Is that all you get for your money?

Tsyni posted:

I hope the people of Canada take to the street and execute the ambassador and the RCMP involved.

Yeah, I'm sure people will be outraged at the govern

RCMP and CSIS aren't idiots, guys.

HackensackBackpack fucked around with this message at 18:23 on Sep 19, 2016

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:21

Fluffy Chainsaw: Jul 6, 2016; I'm likely a pissant middle manager who pisses off IT with worthless requests. There is no content within my posts other than a garbage act akin to a know-it-all, which likely is how I behave in real life. It's really hard for me to comprehend how much I am hated by everyone.

namaste faggots posted:

Yeah like you loving know better that stats can

I do know better than you.

tagesschau posted:

The idea that any restructuring, no matter how ham-fisted, is necessarily better than no restructuring at all, is not supported by evidence or experience.

Far better to let a system that's been in crisis since 1995 continue to decay and fall apart, amirite?

Fluffy Chainsaw fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Sep 19, 2016

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:22

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

"vinncent khalsa" eh

Hmm if only csis prosecuted their investigation of the air India bombings a little harder

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:23

Lain Iwakura: Aug 5, 2004; The body exists only to verify one's own existence.; Taco Defender

Fluffy Chainsaw posted:

I did also say that it was obviously experiencing growing pains, and that when those are sorted out, it will be better than what existed before.

Seriously, check out the 2010 AG report on Aging Infrastructure if you wonder what the alternative to trying to reform the system would end up like.

So what experience do you have with IT infrastructure beyond looking at it from a beancounter's point of view?

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:28

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

The head of stats can resigned because SSC undermined the independence of his department by design. That's not a bug, but a feature.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:29

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# ? Jun 8, 2024 00:32

Helsing: Aug 23, 2003; DON'T POST IN THE ELECTION THREAD UNLESS YOU JOE BIDEN

I can understand why people are dismissive of the random criticisms about the overhaul being made in the thread because we're just a bunch of ingrates posting on the internet. What I find slightly weirder is this insistence that it's no big deal and doesn't at all reflect poorly on the sitting government when the head of StatsCan resigns and very explicitly blames the current government.

# ? Sep 19, 2016 18:36

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