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Can't think what else the royal canadian artillery would use that looks like that other than a priest. E: Wait, no, looks more like a sexton: It's missing the ridges around the vision slots for carrying stuff and the gun's on the wrong side, also no MG cupola. And it's got that sticky out bit in the middle around the gun. 
OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 03:44 on Oct 2, 2016 |
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Oct 2, 2016 03:37
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Yep. It doesn't have the cylindrical pulpit, or the hydraulic tube over the gun.
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Oct 2, 2016 04:06
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xthetenth posted:Yep. It doesn't have the cylindrical pulpit, or the hydraulic tube over the gun. And considering it doesn't wear a mitre, one wonders more about the nickname.
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Oct 2, 2016 04:07
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Kemper Boyd posted:I drunkenly explained ww2 carrier combat once to someone as two boxers who both throw a right hook at each other while hoping they manage to block the other guy's blow. Ian W. Toll, author of Pacific Crucible, described carriers as boxers with a very long reach, stone hands, and a glass chin. Seems very accurate.
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Oct 2, 2016 04:47
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SeanBeansShako posted:And considering it doesn't wear a mitre, one wonders more about the nickname. That's because the Bishop has it.  AKA "Why is there a KV2 in North Africa?" Apparently we really liked this naming scheme and so used it for the Bishop, Sexton, Priest, and Deacon SPGs. E: Speaking of the Priest I can't get over how loving weird the M3 was, as a tank. It looks like it was designed by a committee of drunk Orks. OwlFancier fucked around with this message at 05:08 on Oct 2, 2016 |
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Oct 2, 2016 04:57
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The US Bureau of Ordnance was really into cramming extra machine guns on tanks for a while.
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Oct 2, 2016 05:35
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OwlFancier posted:E: Speaking of the Priest I can't get over how loving weird the M3 was, as a tank. Multi-level armament was still in vogue at the time.  
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Oct 2, 2016 06:06
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Thanks to all on the ID assist, that had been bugging me for a while.OwlFancier posted:the Bishop 
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Oct 2, 2016 07:33
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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MarsellusWallace posted:There's a good reason BB shells had so much other *stuff* in them instead of additional explosive - it was needed to punch through the armor plate. Mortars and HE artillery rounds often had significantly more explosive power then the best antiship shells. Bear in mind that armor (designed to resist the high-velocity kinetic forces induced by a shell impact) tends to be brittle under explosive loading. You see this being a problem sometimes during WWII with torpedo impacts, as in the case of HMS Indomitable: An Italian aerial torpedo struck at the bottom of the side armor, pieces of which broke off and passed through the torpedo protection system and into a boiler room.
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Oct 2, 2016 08:45
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Polikarpov posted:The US Bureau of Ordnance was really into cramming extra machine guns on tanks for a while. Still do, the Abrams has 3 MGs (coax, Commander, Loader) where most other tanks only have two. They might have changed that in later versions.
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Oct 2, 2016 11:03
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ArchangeI posted:Still do, the Abrams has 3 MGs (coax, Commander, Loader) where most other tanks only have two. They might have changed that in later versions. With the TUSK (Tank Urban Survival Kit) there is also a possibility for another .50 cal coaxial placed on top of the main gun, making it 4. 
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Oct 2, 2016 11:26
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Polikarpov posted:The US Bureau of Ordnance was really into cramming extra machine guns on tanks for a while. Wasn't there also one tank design that had two machine guns fixed directly to the front hull with no traverse in any direction whatsoever? That's downright orky, just spraying bullets in the general cardinal direction of the enemy.
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Oct 2, 2016 12:01
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Perestroika posted:Wasn't there also one tank design that had two machine guns fixed directly to the front hull with no traverse in any direction whatsoever? That's downright orky, just spraying bullets in the general cardinal direction of the enemy. Yeah, the M2 light tank and early versions of M3 Stuart did this. 5 machineguns altogether. M2 Medium Tank however had nine machineguns, including two rear-facing machineguns with deflector plates so that when the tank would cross trenches the bullets would be deflected down. I suspect this tank was designed by Browning Arms Company to boost sales.
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Oct 2, 2016 12:37
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The early M3 mediums also had the fixed dual bow MGs, but they realised that there are plenty on the tank as it stood and that everyone was too busy to bother with them.OwlFancier posted:Apparently we really liked this naming scheme and so used it for the Bishop, Sexton, Priest, and Deacon SPGs. Arquinsiel fucked around with this message at 18:14 on Oct 2, 2016 |
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Oct 2, 2016 18:11
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OpenlyEvilJello posted:Bear in mind that armor (designed to resist the high-velocity kinetic forces induced by a shell impact) tends to be brittle under explosive loading. You see this being a problem sometimes during WWII with torpedo impacts, as in the case of HMS Indomitable: An Italian aerial torpedo struck at the bottom of the side armor, pieces of which broke off and passed through the torpedo protection system and into a boiler room. Subsurface explosive effects are extremely different (and quite a bit more destructive than) explosive effects in air.
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Oct 2, 2016 18:22
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Arquinsiel posted:The early M3 mediums also had the fixed dual bow MGs, but they realised that there are plenty on the tank as it stood and that everyone was too busy to bother with them. The T6 (Sherman prototype) and pilot M4 also had the two machineguns, but they got rid of them, very, very quickly. Also for some bizarre reason the Soviets decided to shower the IS-7 with machineguns: one coax 14.5 mm, two coax 7.62 mm, one AA 14.5 mm, and four 7.62 mm fixed on the hull and turret, two of them firing backwards.
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Oct 2, 2016 18:47
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Arquinsiel posted:The current SPG that isn't the M109 is the Abbot, based on the FV.432. Wasn't you mean, it's the AS-90 now, though I guess the Indians are still using them.
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Oct 2, 2016 20:21
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feedmegin posted:Wasn't you mean, it's the AS-90 now, though I guess the Indians are still using them.
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Oct 2, 2016 20:52
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Get on with the times and roll out the Rabbi, Ayatollah, Guru and Atheist Professor SPGs!
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Oct 2, 2016 21:10
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Nenonen posted:Get on with the times and roll out the Rabbi, Ayatollah, Guru and Atheist Professor SPGs! The heresiarch SPG can't come soon enough.
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Oct 2, 2016 21:13
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Nenonen posted:Get on with the times and roll out the Rabbi, Ayatollah, Guru and Atheist Professor SPGs! I hear the Atheist Professor SPGs can get knocked out by a Marine with a sufficiently strong right hook though I read that in an email somewhere
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Oct 2, 2016 21:35
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ArchangeI posted:I hear the Atheist Professor SPGs can get knocked out by a Marine with a sufficiently strong right hook though War Nerd, right?
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Oct 2, 2016 21:47
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ArchangeI posted:I hear the Atheist Professor SPGs can get knocked out by a Marine with a sufficiently strong right hook though And then Einstein invented the atomic bomb and clapped.
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Oct 2, 2016 23:40
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Pontius Pilate posted:And then Einstein invented the atomic bomb and clapped. Can I suggest a name change to : Pontius Pilates
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Oct 3, 2016 00:54
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No one messes with the Atheist Professor. Part man. Part machine. All roboprofessor. The future of academia. And might as well leave this here... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpTSp5ArKfQ
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Oct 3, 2016 01:00
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Ensign Expendable posted:The T6 (Sherman prototype) and pilot M4 also had the two machineguns, but they got rid of them, very, very quickly. The strv m/42 originally had a forward facing hull machine gun mounted to the right of the driver, where the radio operator in a Panther would sit. Except... there was no such crew member in the m/42. It's just a machine gun with nobody there to fire it - there's not even a seat for it, the only thing under it is an ammo rack. To fire it, either the loader has to slide down from the turret and lean over the ammo rack, or the driver has to lean way over from his seat to handle it. As far as I can tell from minutes of meeting it was concluded that the tank should have four machine guns, and that a hull machine gun had been useful on the WW1 era strv m/21-29, but that adding a fifth crew member would add at least another 100 kg to the tank, and their strict weight budget didn't allow for that. So... they voted on it and said yes, it should have four machine guns, and four crew members. And there it went, four machine guns it had when it was delivered (the fourth one is pointing backwards in the turret). The hull MG was rarely mounted on field exercises though and it disappeared entirely within a few years, and the port where it had been was welded over. Considering that the thing was basically designed by cargo culting committee in a few months in 1941 it actually turned out surprisingly well, but you still got a few oddball issues like this one. TheFluff fucked around with this message at 01:08 on Oct 3, 2016 |
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Oct 3, 2016 01:02
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The BMP3 also has two bow machineguns for some odd reason. I guess it sort of makes sense for an IFV but I wouldn't want to be the two buggers who had to sit in it while it was close enough to the enemy to use them.
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Oct 3, 2016 01:35
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BMPs also have rifle ports so all passengers can participate in the drive-by shooting. Which makes more sense when you remember the original idea of mechanized formations having to drive through an NBC inferno where any footmen would have to be wearing heavy hazmat suits and so would be disadvantaged.
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Oct 3, 2016 01:47
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Nebakenezzer posted:Can I suggest a name change to : Pontius Pilates It's been a regret for a while that I didn't register as that but name changes are too rich for my blood.
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Oct 3, 2016 02:08
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Im working through the last thread but thisquote:Yeah the US is really going to regret it when those Mexican tank divisions start pushing up through Texas in 2020. should have been a Clancy novel
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Oct 3, 2016 03:06
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A few pages ago but:OwlFancier posted:The RN can arguably lay claim to having the oldest ship in the world still kicking around, though I don't know if it's still in commission. I want to know everything about the HMS Diamond Rock 
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Oct 3, 2016 03:42
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MarsellusWallace posted:There's a good reason BB shells had so much other *stuff* in them instead of additional explosive - it was needed to punch through the armor plate. By "other stuff" you mean hardened steel -- a 2700-pound AP shell was 98% hardened steel, a sheetmetal aerodynamic cover, a soft steel nosecap, and 50lb of RDX. And it's moving at about the speed of a .30-cal rifle bullet. That's 355Mj muzzle energy. I can't easily find a comparison, but y'know how TV shows frame things in car crash equivalents? It's like a smallish car going 1700mph. The bursting charge is just a "gently caress you" afterthought once it lodges inside the ship. For comparison, HMS Victory's entire broadside was about half the weight of one shell from a 16" gun.
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Oct 3, 2016 04:52
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Bad Angus! Bad!
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Cliff notes ( ) of the story is the RN were having a tiff with France (something about Napoleon but frankly like the RN needs an excuse to shoot the French) near Martinique. Diamond rock sits off the coast at the western arm of the large southern bay of the island and overlooks the strait between Martinique and St Lucia.The RN sends a fella by the name of Commodore Hood to blockade the place and generally annoy the French, again not entirely sure the Napoleonic wars were necessary for this but supposedly that's the rationale they used. So Hood sails about in his ship Centaur generally being a dick. He's visiting the rock because it's got some greens that the crew can eat to keep the scurvy away and eventually decides to lug a pair of 18lb cannons up onto the rock and fortify it. He commissions it as a sloop of war and assigns his second lieutenant to command it. They also stick a few 24lb cannons in caves around the rock and basically decide to pre-enact the movie Guns of Navarone, shooting up anything passing between the rock and Martinique proper, and using the high elevation of the rock to take potshots at anything that tries to get near them from the south. Having fortified the rock and stashed a good amount of supplies on it (including some goats) he writes to the admiralty telling them about his awesome new "ship" and it basically becomes a thorn in French-controlled Martinique's side for about 18 months, as it makes it a right pain in the arse to get around the south side of the island. The French try to set up a mortar battery on Martinique to shell the poo poo out of the rock, but a group of slaves tells the garrison about it, they lead a sortie out and capture the only engineer on the island so that never happens. Eventually, French high command gets really sick of this bullshit and sends 16 ships out to get the drat rock back. Alas, the actual battle also goes rather like the Guns of Navarone in that the French assault goes pretty well because the garrison runs out of ammo and water very quickly and surrenders. Also they had 16 ships blowing the crap out of the rock as well. The guy in charge of the rock is court martialed for "losing his ship to the enemy" but they acquit him on the grounds that it's fairly reasonable to lose 16 to 1. All in all the French didn't try much to attack the place and when they finally took it they mostly did so by besieging it. It's more funny for the idea of a rock being treated like a ship than anything though the RN does this sort of by habit with a lot of their land installations. Though as the RN also once upon a time did a lot of their home operations on hulked ships moored permanently in port that does make a certain sense, they just kept their names when they moved them onto land, and it saved on updating the legislation too.
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Oct 3, 2016 05:07
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OwlFancier posted:Cliff notes ( That is all very fascinating. Thank you
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Oct 3, 2016 06:04
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Stone frigates are a neat tradition from the Royal Navy that some of her offshoots have inherited that sounds insane when you first hear about it: the Devonport Naval Base in Auckland is commissioned as HMNZS Philomel and the RNZN used to operate a communications station several hundred kilometres inland called HMNZS Irirangi.
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Oct 3, 2016 06:10
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OwlFancier posted:The guy in charge of the rock is court martialed for "losing his ship to the enemy" but they acquit him on the grounds that it's fairly reasonable to lose 16 to 1. I doubt that an admiralty court would have had any authority to rule on a freeman on the land. The flag had a golden fringe, right?
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Oct 3, 2016 06:27
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OwlFancier posted:The guy in charge of the rock is court martialed for "losing his ship to the enemy" but they acquit him on the grounds that it's fairly reasonable to lose 16 to 1. But the court martial didn't acquit one of the other officers for the unforgivable act of eating a meal with the ship's company rather than in the 'wardroom' (a tent a few yards away). He was reprimanded but his field promotion to lieutenant was substantiated and he was later given command of a brig so there was some leniancy. RN ships passing Diamond Rock still dip their ensigns and man the sides in salute to this day. I'm pretty sure the rock is no longer considered 'in comission' these days, though.
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Oct 3, 2016 10:16
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Nenonen posted:BMPs also have rifle ports so all passengers can participate in the drive-by shooting. Which makes more sense when you remember the original idea of mechanized formations having to drive through an NBC inferno where any footmen would have to be wearing heavy hazmat suits and so would be disadvantaged. I never quite understood that logic. Were the gunports sealed in any way? It sounds like it would just produce openings for the VX to seep in, forcing anyone inside to still wear full MOPP gear.
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Oct 3, 2016 10:18
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OwlFancier posted:The guy in charge of the rock is court martialed for "losing his ship to the enemy" but they acquit him on the grounds that it's fairly reasonable to lose 16 to 1. This is routine, btw. Lose your ship, get court martialled, no matter the circumstances; if you lost it honourably it's a formality. Edit: I would assume they're sealed, yeah, some kind of rubber hood or whatever, otherwise what would be the point.
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Oct 3, 2016 10:31
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Nenonen posted:BMPs also have rifle ports so all passengers can participate in the drive-by shooting. Which makes more sense when you remember the original idea of mechanized formations having to drive through an NBC inferno where any footmen would have to be wearing heavy hazmat suits and so would be disadvantaged. Wait wait wait Were you supposed to wear hazmat suits inside a loving BMP 
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