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Case 3 was an uphill battle, yeah.Waffleman_ posted:"Let it go, Mr. Edgeworth. It's clear you don't know much about flowers. It's not like you have anybody you'd actually give any to, after all." That was so brutal that I had to put the game down for a moment just to digest that line.
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Oct 10, 2016 04:21
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Hobgoblin2099 posted:That was so brutal that I had to put the game down for a moment just to digest that line. The rebuttal to that saying Phoenix only knows the name of three flowers had me struggling to think of what the third would be after iris and dahlia. Nova Odin fucked around with this message at 04:58 on Oct 10, 2016 |
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Oct 10, 2016 04:56
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Nova Odin posted:The rebuttal to that saying Phoenix only knows the name of three flowers had me struggling to think of what the third would be after iris and dahlia. I believe that the three flowers would be roses, sunflowers, and whatever the gently caress flower is the prosecution's badge. (Chrysanthemums?) Meaning that he doesn't know that dahlias and irises are, in fact, also flowers.
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Oct 10, 2016 05:09
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Nova Odin posted:The rebuttal to that saying Phoenix only knows the name of three flowers had me struggling to think of what the third would be after iris and dahlia.  If that was intentional, then that went right over my head.
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Oct 10, 2016 06:04
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Nova Odin posted:The rebuttal to that saying Phoenix only knows the name of three flowers had me struggling to think of what the third would be after iris and dahlia. You're already there, a Hawthorne flower.
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Oct 10, 2016 06:09
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The three flowers he actually knows are sunflowers, tulips and possibly roses.
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Oct 10, 2016 06:51
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I'm pretty sure one of the original trilogy cases Phoenix talks about flowers a bit once, he says something about only knowing a few types like tulips or daisies or whatever common ones. I think upon seeing a rose in AA4, Phoenix exclaims something like "I thought I only knew tulips and daisies but I can say this is a rose!" I know Fransizka gives Edgeworth a lot of poo poo about flowers in the AAI games.
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Oct 10, 2016 07:27
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Ive finished the game last week, definitely my favorite game in the series now! I jumped right into AA:I 2 since I never played it.
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Oct 10, 2016 13:57
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TheKingofSprings posted:You're already there, a Hawthorne flower.  FrickenMoron posted:Ive finished the game last week, definitely my favorite game in the series now! I jumped right into AA:I 2 since I never played it. Good choice, it's many people's contender for Best Game.
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Oct 10, 2016 21:49
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Finally finished the DLC case last night. Full thoughts, including major spoilers, below. I liked it! Aesthetically it was right up my alley, with a gorgeous clockpunk vibe. I really liked Ellen, Larry's new animations were very funny and it's nice to see him doing well enough for himself as a published author, and in general it was a good cast. Teaming up with Maya again was nice, and I liked facing off against Edgeworth. It wasn't as powerfully nostalgic to me as I think it was to others, considering I didn't even feel bringing Maya back in this capacity was necessary in the slightest, but it was...yknow, fun. It was fun. The character names were awesome. The mystery was quite good, but very oddly-paced. I'll talk about that more in my cons section, but overall it had satisfying twists and potential red herrings and I enjoyed the ending a lot. It was serviceable. I really liked Ellen. Her animations were so funny and full of life, my personal favorite being when she clangs the pot and ladle together. I wanted to help her out, despite the, uh...unusual introduction to her thanks to Larry. Sorin was great! When his jetpack went off I lost my poo poo, such an unexpected moment and it happening after such a serious moment really took me by surprise. I also ended up feeling really bad for him and how his condition was treated in-game especially post-case was excellent. Also, again, him taking off with Ellen while doing the threshold carry was phenomenal. I really, really liked Pierce's breakdown. At first I wasn't sure and was afraid it was going to be too comedic, but when the pictures started flashing in the background and the beeps began to fade it hit me right in the heart. I'd rank it highly overall. Pierce himself was very cool, and while I guessed the twist, him going full-surgeon and dropping his posh accent was a hoot. Big fan. At first I was wondering if he'd be much more of an rear end in a top hat villain but instead you get a nice middle-of-the-road sort-of-sympathetic culprit. Pleasantly nuanced. Edgeworth felt a little rougher than I'd have liked but the flowers exchange was pure gold and you can tell that at the end of it they're needling each other and trying to bring out the best in each other. Besides, he was also under the thumb of an incredibly powerful family, so I think Edgeworth had reason to be a bit on-edge. I prefer him as a companion rather than an adversary though, but I got my fill there with case 5. So yeah, it was a nice thumbs up as a serviceable mystery with a pretty aesthetic and some likable characters. Now for a few negatives: It desperately needed at least two more characters, even just as side-characters rather than witnesses. I'm echoing the others here in that my main problem with SOJ is that it seems like all we're getting are "the detective", "the witness that didn't do it", and "the witness that did do it". It worked for case 3 since that was such a twisty mess and we got Datz out of it, and it worked for case 4 since we got four characters in one with Uendo and the whole thing was cleverly set up and written like a one-act play, but you look at Turnabout Reclaimed and you have Pearl, Marlon, Sasha, Crab, and Norma, and all of them have something to offer that keeps you guessing. I don't mean to compare the two just because they're DLC cases, and it's probably unfair since Turnabout Reclaimed was that drat good, but still, one more Sprocket servant would have been nice. The mystery was...y'know, serviceable as mentioned. The thought route was very weird and anticlimactic and the idea that Pierce committed the crime during the reception itself was far more of a massive realization than the idea that the clock would have a different state while active. I hope they got that clock repaired though; it was cute. It was just weirdly meandering, I suppose, and something about the presentation just wasn't there for me. I'm pretty sure it was the music - the love theme was pretty and all but it really needed something more fitting. No theme for Pierce or Sorin? C'mon. At least the animations were extravagant. As mentioned, the nostalgia did very little for me other than be nice. The one time it hit me straight in the heart was Maya quoting Mia, who is then referenced by name. THAT was fantastic. Still, though, while I understand logically that the idea was to travel back to the original trilogy, I really do like the new trilogy's characters that much more. I'm not even a Larry hater, and definitely no Maya hater, but this entire case just felt like a grab that didn't work for me like it must have for others. Then again, I've had to as an AJ fan deal with people pining for the original trilogy for about eight years now so I think I'm just tired at this point. The running gag of Trucy chasing Athena around was really funny except for one specific instance and it made Phoenix very, very out-of-character for me. I don't remember which time it was - I believe the second - but Athena offers to go see Ellen and it ends in Phoenix telling Athena to "run along now". Straight up dick move, and this isn't even Hobo Phoenix who was at his lowest point. It was jarring as hell and made me stop playing for a few hours. It was just super condescending in a way that didn't work for me. Of course, the next time it happened, Phoenix said "Good luck, kiddo!" in a really cute and genuine manner so that made up for it. It's just weird how inconsistently Phoenix was written in this case alone, "time travel" or no, when Dual Destinies did such a good job at balancing him returning from his fall from grace in AJ and growing into a true mentor character. I'm not too upset that we didn't get more time to nail Pierce before he shifted into surgeon mode (which owned), because it felt like you were quietly pursuing him all case. That said, again, if we had one more character it would've felt far more satisfying. Still, the silent testimony was absolutely fantastic. Top notch. I think that's my main issue with the case: the writing and pacing were inconsistent. It was good but unusual, with more bright moments than a bright overall. It really was just an extra episode, which would have been fine if I cared more about what they were going for. I will say one last thing that owned about it, though: Sorin and Ellen's wedding and seeing everyone in pretty clothes! That was a great feel-good cutscene that was funny as well, and Athena threatening to beat the poo poo out of Maya to grab the bouquet at the end of the case was hilarious. Can't believe Larry is gonna die. Edgeworth grabbing his shoulder and silently shaking his head was amazing. Whew! Now to wait for Athena Cykes: Ace Attorney. Robin or riot. Erin M. Fiasco fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Oct 10, 2016 |
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Oct 10, 2016 22:49
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Also on the topic of the DLC: I was mildly surprised examining the piano at the office with Maya around and having her say she wanted to play it didn't turn into a reference to the live action movie somehow.
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Oct 10, 2016 23:27
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The DLC case was just ok, but it felt too short, too easy (with the notable exception of the last cross-examination), and too obvious in general. It wasn't bad by any means but it almost felt like it would've been more satisfying if this was the game's Case 2 and Case 2 was the DLC instead.
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Oct 11, 2016 07:35
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Shadow Ninja 64 posted:The DLC case was just ok, but it felt too short, too easy (with the notable exception of the last cross-examination), and too obvious in general. It wasn't bad by any means but it almost felt like it would've been more satisfying if this was the game's Case 2 and Case 2 was the DLC instead. I too would like for the best case 2 in the series to instead be DLC. The DLC just was sorta uninspired I don't think it being a part of the main game would make that feeling any better. Though I do feel like a nostalgia case (which it kinda was) is a decent fit for DLC since the AA series already has enough focus on returning characters and all that. And I don't want it to get bogged down by the past. DLC was probably the best use of that case.
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Oct 11, 2016 08:14
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Shadow Ninja 64 posted:The DLC case was just ok, but it felt too short, too easy (with the notable exception of the last cross-examination), and too obvious in general. It wasn't bad by any means but it almost felt like it would've been more satisfying if this was the game's Case 2 and Case 2 was the DLC instead. Case 2 usually has the position of being the "whatever" case, not great but not loving terrible either. So for them to go out swinging and make a case 2 that in any other game would be worthy of being the finale was pretty cool. I think the long and short of it is that the DLC needed to be... well, better. It's the only traditional two day trial in the game and despite that the killer is obvious from the word "go". As another poster said, this case was really in need of an extra witness or two.
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Oct 11, 2016 12:50
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I've been on board with this game all throughout, but case 4 really, really sucked. A crop of annoying characters that are painful to spend time around A couple instances of "You have to press every statement before anything happens", which really sucks seeing as on multiple occasions the witness is basically contradicting something, and because nothing else stands out you'll often present something only to be frustrated when it leads to nothing. Everyone making GBS threads on Athena got old fast. Seriously, Simon? This is how you talk to someone who played a huge role in saving your loving life? Someone who even saved you in court before? I know the localisation team had an uphill battle here, but gently caress. Sorry I don't know that different types of noodles are made from different types of flour. On its own that's not... terrible, but the fact that that was the "turn the case around" moment meant nothing to me Overall just a dull case on top of everything. I didn't care about anyone's motivations or personality. On top of that it was wedged between cases that actually, I don't know, felt important? With DD the short case made sense because it ultimately related to the larger story. Here it just felt like cutting corners and being lazy with a not particularly important case Good things? I liked Athena, and when Simon wasn't being an annoying dingbat he was fun Hope five is a big step up! I liked case 2 and 3 quite a bit
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Oct 11, 2016 13:22
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I didn't mind 4 overall, but my biggest gripe was it played off the old man as showing tough love for Geiru by pushing her to "Search for her own calling" when it's pretty clear she wanted to be a rakugo story teller enough to kill someone for it  He just ruined some lady's life on a whim and crushed her dreams right in front of her by giving her dad's legacy to some rando, and everyone finds that charming. Screw Toneido.
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Oct 11, 2016 13:31
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Case 4 owns
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Oct 11, 2016 13:57
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irlZaphod posted:Case 4 owns This is true.
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Oct 11, 2016 15:11
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Danaru posted:I didn't mind 4 overall, but my biggest gripe was it played off the old man as showing tough love for Geiru by pushing her to "Search for her own calling" when it's pretty clear she wanted to be a rakugo story teller enough to kill someone for it 
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Oct 11, 2016 15:34
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Rakugo boy owned and was one of the best, if not the best witness in the game.
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Oct 11, 2016 15:36
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irlZaphod posted:Case 4 owns Fairly sure the certificate of ownership is locked away in some safe until case 4 gets its poo poo together.
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Oct 11, 2016 15:46
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I'm tired of the Jimmy Neutron brainblast thing at the end of each case.
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Oct 11, 2016 15:56
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mabels big day posted:I'm tired of the Jimmy Neutron brainblast thing at the end of each case. It's cool though.
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Oct 11, 2016 16:01
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Thought Route loving owns, sorry.
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Oct 11, 2016 16:17
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Waffleman_ posted:Thought Route loving owns, sorry. The music is great, too.
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Oct 11, 2016 16:25
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It's really cool when it's used right, but it's not always great - the DLC case is an example of its worst use where it feels like it's just shoehorned in because it has to be and ends up being a wet fart.
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Oct 11, 2016 16:28
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It's cool but it could work a lot better. Maybe like Edgeworth's Logic? You get a bunch of words you need to connect, maybe you should even look through your evidence as well.
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Oct 11, 2016 16:32
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The DLC one was bad but in general I really like the Thought Route mechanic. It allows them to deliver a big twist all at once in the climax rather than teasing it out over several evidence presentations. And the music is great.
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Oct 11, 2016 16:56
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HenryEx posted:Rakugo boy owned and was one of the best, if not the best witness in the
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Oct 11, 2016 17:17
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rakugo guy was a good witness but the overall mystery of the case was boring and they should have just made Blackquill the defense since he does all the work anyway
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Oct 11, 2016 17:19
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Yeah I felt it was super out of character for Athena to just keep being like "WELP poo poo CASE IS OVER" at almost every turn, but on the other hand I enjoyed seeing Blackquill clown on everyone, so it evened out.
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Oct 11, 2016 17:21
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Though Route is super cool, but I will say that I felt like it was a bit more satisfying in DD. Always seemed to put a great exclamation point on whatever mystery was at hand. Probably one of the only things I liked more in that game over SoJ to go along with Blackquill being so much better an antagonist than Nahyuta.
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Oct 11, 2016 17:24
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I think the Thought Routes in 3 and 5-2 were good (I can't even remember 5-1's; maybe it was good too). And yeah it's pretty retarded that Athena has to have a mental breakdown every 5 minutes but if that's what it takes to have more Blackquill goodness then so be it.
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Oct 11, 2016 17:29
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The thought route is too formulaic. it comes up and yeah, it's cool usually with whatever the big last twist is and it usually does a good job building up suspense and hype, but at the same time it's like "OK, this is the end of the case, here it is, no critical evidence or last testimony thing, just pick the right option out of these words and figure it out if you haven't already". The old games had kind of creative ways of getting the final break in the case, and I think that's better.
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Oct 11, 2016 17:34
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Danaru posted:Yeah I felt it was super out of character for Athena to just keep being like "WELP poo poo CASE IS OVER" at almost every turn, but on the other hand I enjoyed seeing Blackquill clown on everyone, so it evened out. I waffle back and forth on it because Athena is a 19-yo prodigy that devoted her studies to tackling a very specific case. On one hand the shaky confidence gets annoying, but on the other I think it's more realistic for a rookie professional to still second-guess themselves and get disheartened. Case 4 begins with Athena complaining about defending a client last second with zero prep time; the books on the table at WAA are her's so it suggests she's more comfortable when she has an opportunity to thoroughly study, investigate, and interview. I also wonder if there's meant to be a comedy dynamic there or some imitation of a rakugo story. But big brother Simon is awesome and I hope we get another case featuring them in the future.
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Oct 11, 2016 17:35
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SUPERMAN'S GAL PAL posted:I waffle back and forth on it because Athena is a 19-yo prodigy that devoted her studies to tackling a very specific case. On one hand the shaky confidence gets annoying, but on the other I think it's more realistic for a rookie professional to still second-guess themselves and get disheartened. Case 4 begins with Athena complaining about defending a client last second with zero prep time; the books on the table at WAA are her's so it suggests she's more comfortable when she has an opportunity to thoroughly study, investigate, and interview. I don't mind Athena being slightly less competent in court because she's still fine socially. Every other "prodigy" (Klavier excluded because ofc) is an ace in court but extremely stunted socially, at least initially. I do think they went overboard on her having flaws in the courtroom though.
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Oct 11, 2016 17:44
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It's also worth noting that at this point, Athena has only fully taken on two (and a half) cases as lead defense. Even Mia Fey was nervous as hell in her second case.
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Oct 11, 2016 17:57
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Hell, not even a half. She has like, 1/6th of 5-1. Maybe even 1/10th. You don't even get to the first cross-examination before she peaces out.
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Oct 11, 2016 18:00
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Waffleman_ posted:It's also worth noting that at this point, Athena has only fully taken on two (and a half) cases as lead defense. Even Mia Fey was nervous as hell in her second case. Every lawyer in the series was nervous during their first couple of cases (except of course Edgeworth, but he pretty much had every emotion beaten out of him). It's just every case she's defending in she has a nervous breakdown, and honestly I think she's a cool character and who deserves a little better. 
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Oct 11, 2016 18:54
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Calico Heart posted:
It's funny how divisive case 4 is. I loved it, start to finish. It was such a good pallet-cleanser after the double gut punch that is cases 3 and 5. Blackquil is hilarious- he's a massive weeb in the middle of the most Japanese case ever in the series. The localization team really knocked it out of the park. Blackquil ripping Sad Monk a new rear end in a top hat was so incredibly satisfying, and his rapport with Athena was great. Rakugo guy is the best witness in the series. Between him and Blackquil I couldn't stop laughing.  Great case. Loved it.
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