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I mean their payment processing is in london, and I don't think poo poo happens in the US including the ATL office doing Jack poo poo. Being in various jurisdictions does present CCP with some crazy unique circumstances legally (in theory) but lol as with most the time this dude is stupid and wrong as poo poo and is just mad and blabbing out his rear end.
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Oct 14, 2016 09:06
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Teal deer nothing will happen. CCP Falcon will likely be a smug unprofessional dickhead about I but that's about it
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Oct 14, 2016 09:07
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I'm no lawyer but I would assume it's more to do with Tax and CCP not wanting to be an accessory to fraud if they are earning real money off of space money. Gambling is a free for all in the UK but the inland revenue do get a tad pissy if you don't pay gambling duties https://www.gov.uk/guidance/general-betting-duty-pool-betting-duty-and-remote-gaming-duty
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Oct 14, 2016 09:15
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The max any of these sueing CCP could net would be reimbursement for remaining subs. Now, Almost certainly only subs paid for directly and not through plex would qualify. So yeah Lenny's 20 bux per billion empire could prolly net him 120 bucks in court, being extremely generous. Extend to all the dumbos
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Oct 14, 2016 09:41
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If I was CCP, would send Lenny 20 bucks with A4 paper with trollface printed on it.
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Oct 14, 2016 10:26
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learnincurve posted:I'm no lawyer but I would assume it's more to do with Tax and CCP not wanting to be an accessory to fraud if they are earning real money off of space money. Gambling is a free for all in the UK but the inland revenue do get a tad pissy if you don't pay gambling duties https://www.gov.uk/guidance/general-betting-duty-pool-betting-duty-and-remote-gaming-duty Actually we don't have one of those any more  (It's HMRC these days)
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Oct 14, 2016 11:02
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feedmegin posted:Actually we don't have one of those any more Probably changed their name due to Ken Dodd's excuse; "I told the Inland Revenue I didn't owe them a penny because I lived by the seaside"
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Oct 14, 2016 11:29
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Kirby Superscare! posted:I know the whole "I will get my lawyers involved" stance happens a lot when players feel aggrieved by games, however when they say broke USA law, does that matter when CCP is not an American company? I've always wondered this sort of thing. CCP is actually an Icelandic company. They do have offices in Atlanta (I think) and London, though.
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Oct 14, 2016 11:42
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CainFortea posted:I thought you were saying that EVE-Bet and EOH got nailed for RMT. Since I forgot that nothing you say can be taken seriously I thought this was actual real information. In a thread full of terrible posters, you somehow take the prize for worst.
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Oct 14, 2016 13:00
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Syndic Thrass posted:I mean their payment processing is in london, and I don't think poo poo happens in the US including the ATL office doing Jack poo poo. Being in various jurisdictions does present CCP with some crazy unique circumstances legally (in theory) but lol as with most the time this dude is stupid and wrong as poo poo and is just mad and blabbing out his rear end. The only thing CCP does in Atlanta of any significance is that's where CCP Manifest (their PR dudes) works out of. Other than that its where the hopes and dreams of White Wolf Publishing died. Syndic Thrass posted:The max any of these sueing CCP could net would be reimbursement for remaining subs. The sperg about "I can sue CCP over this" is always comedic when something like this happens. It's their service, they found him to be in violation of the terms of use for that service which he willingly and consciously agreed to. Mekchu fucked around with this message at 13:42 on Oct 14, 2016 |
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Oct 14, 2016 13:36
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to be fair, white wolf died long before ccp acquired them
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Oct 14, 2016 13:43
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Something about CCP having the reasonable expectation that they would know they would be doing a significant amount of business within the US. But look the important thing is someone is butt hurt enough to invoke the threat of legal proceedings, lets just bask in the glow of it. Besides if you were going to space sue someone I am pretty sure you would need a space court for that 
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Oct 14, 2016 13:47
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Scooter_McCabe posted:Something about CCP having the reasonable expectation that they would know they would be doing a significant amount of business within the US. But look the important thing is someone is butt hurt enough to invoke the threat of legal proceedings, lets just bask in the glow of it. Besides if you were going to space sue someone I am pretty sure you would need a space court for that With the Honorable justice emeritus Scooter McCabe presiding.
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Oct 14, 2016 13:54
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you would be surprised. one of the stranger things I've seen in this game was a rich jewish corporate lawyer who would remind you he was one at least once a minute. he sued ccp and settled it for not needing to pay subscription on his accounts and getting an allowance of free plex each month.
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Oct 14, 2016 13:56
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Emeritus?!
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Oct 14, 2016 13:57
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I am really enjoying all this fallout. This must be what it feels like when people remind GSF line members of stupid poo poo Mittens has said over the years. You literally have the mouthpieces of PL on Reddit trying to explain that people will not generate content unless they are paid, or at least paid in ISK. You then have confirmed neurosurgeon Grath Telkin trying to tout the same basically retarded argument, to a loving streamer who gets paid by Twitch... And the best, most coherent thing Grath can string together is "uh without ISK in their coffers how will these people fund their ships and splosions to stream". How do you pick a ridiculously easy fight and still embarrass yourself... Then Elise suggests the confiscated money basically be used to fund CZ and EN24 and whatever other outfits PL shills are operating. I'm also willing to bet a lot of people logged in right after the IWI ban to neg wallets - and those people aren't necessarily disclosing that their wallet is overdrawn a half-trillion, but I am sure they're front and center demanding "justice" (compensation) for the "victims" (black market customers) of IWI.
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Oct 14, 2016 14:12
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tickets to the gunt show posted:Then Elise suggests the confiscated money basically be used to fund CZ and EN24 and whatever other outfits PL shills are operating. lol did he really? Because that's amazing.
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Oct 14, 2016 14:51
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Rhymenoserous posted:lol did he really? Because that's amazing. yep https://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/576jes/so_long_casinos_o7/ M-MUH COMMUNITY 
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Oct 14, 2016 14:53
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i will give credit to PL though, they're adapting quickly to life without unlimited out-of-game casino isk https://zkillboard.com/kill/56589079/
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Oct 14, 2016 14:56
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Gwyneth Palpate posted:yep The suggestion that CCP take over the running of gambling services is particularly funny. Because it isn't as though CCP have ever had problems caused in the past by running a lottery system for, say, tech 2 BPOs or anything like that.
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Oct 14, 2016 15:19
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Rhymenoserous posted:lol did he really? Because that's amazing. Yeah it was pretty hilarious. And actually goes a long way towards demonstrating how everyone, including PL, were blindsided. PL just also probably stood to lose the most financially. While I do feel something should be done with the money - rather than simply deleting it from the game - over my biomassed loving characters will they use it to pay for EN24 or CZ. Might as well just add it to the AT prize pool in that case.
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Oct 14, 2016 15:24
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If they delete it. I want to see it added to the isk sink statistics for the year when they publish it.
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Oct 14, 2016 15:28
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tickets to the gunt show posted:Yeah it was pretty hilarious. And actually goes a long way towards demonstrating how everyone, including PL, were blindsided. PL just also probably stood to lose the most financially. They should just delete it because any other option is stupid.
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Oct 14, 2016 15:29
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They could give the money to all newbies who join. They'd log on and there'd be a message saying they've found a pod of money or something similar with a note. Then it could be a mission to go find the guy who lost the money and it could be a neat little storyline where they get to keep the money and learn about the bad casinos/dangers of losing ISKs to bad people in game.
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Oct 14, 2016 15:29
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Kirby Superscare! posted:They could give the money to all newbies who join. They'd log on and there'd be a message saying they've found a pod of money or something similar with a note. Then it could be a mission to go find the guy who lost the money and it could be a neat little storyline where they get to keep the money and learn about the bad casinos/dangers of losing ISKs to bad people in game.   Eve players are assholes and would game the poo poo out of this with newbie accounts
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Oct 14, 2016 15:37
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I love VG in no small part because he doesn't assume or understand that all EVE players are horrible, terrible, broken people.
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Oct 14, 2016 15:39
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tickets to the gunt show posted:I love VG in no small part because he doesn't assume or understand that all EVE players are horrible, terrible, broken people. Had this thread not taken him under its collective wing, VG would have been scammed so hard. "A guy promised to move all my ships to his station. That's so kind" "I got let into this awesome corp, I only had to pay a deposit which they promised to pay me back with interest"
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Oct 14, 2016 15:46
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Oodles posted:Had this thread not taken him under its collective wing, VG would have been scammed so hard. And it would be Syndic 
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Oct 14, 2016 15:56
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Gwyneth Palpate posted:i will give credit to PL though, they're adapting quickly to life without unlimited out-of-game casino isk  i would like to suggest the members of pandemic legion contact any member of theta squad for efficient ratting fits we're here to help in this, your time of need
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Oct 14, 2016 16:34
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Gwyneth Palpate posted:yep The first response is magnificent, and from someone on CSM 11 no less.
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Oct 14, 2016 16:49
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Since it's been cleared and I think it fits within the rules, the story of how a love triangle brought down a coalition. I'm guessing that most of the people in this thread are at least casual EVE observers, and so are familiar with the lead up to the casino war thing involving Eep, the guy who runs IWI, and SpaceMonkey's Alliance. The basic public story was that SMA infiltrated IWI to out it as an RMT operation, and that Eep got made and declared a vendetta to kill SMA. While that's kinda true, it's nowhere near the whole stupid tale that I've been able to reconstruct. Back when IWI was first spinning up, Eep wasn't the only guy helping to code it. There was another guy, not sure on his in game name and no reason to give his real one, who also was helping him code it. From what I gathered, he was either the husband or boyfriend of one of SMA's diplomatic directors, Widget Zombie. He didn't play EVE, but she did. As near as I could tell, she steadily rose up through SMA's leadership structure by playing up the "giggle I'm a girl" act endlessly. There were numerous odd exchanges between her and our people, including several super weird ones where she hit on Digi to try to get CI favors. Unlike Widget, her man had long ago quit EVE and didn't really have a stake in things. He was just working for Eep for fun I guess, not really sure why they linked up in the first place. But at some point early on, he brought in Widget to do IWI stuff too, and the presumably the couple had a merry time banking, coding, rolling in isk, and otherwise being looped into the dev and day to day of IWI. During this process, Widget did her usual "giggle I'm a girl on the internet" flirting thing with Eep--who I'm told is a handsome fellow--and this is where it gets messy. As for Widget, I met her briefly in EVE Vegas, she seemed friendly, happy, and is on the big side. I'm not saying that in a judgmental way, I don't care what people look like, but because it's important later on in this. Eep got sucked into it, and is I guess a swinger of sorts, so he agreed to meet up with Widget and her guy at their home for sexy funtimes. Except when he got there, instead of sexy funtimes, he walked into a mess. As in a literal mess, stuff everywhere. So instead of sexy funtimes, he set to cleaning the place up. No idea why, maybe he thought it would help, maybe he felt it was awkward, couldn't say. At some point the awkwardness level or whatever it was became such that he eventually left, having traveled who knows how far, with no funtimes had. That would probably be the end of it except that Widget was livid about the whole ordeal. The combination of the rejection and perhaps the embarrassment of the guy she invited over for a threesome moonwalking out after doing a bit of cleaning set her off. She took it personally, blamed Eep for not finding her attractive enough (through presumably they'd shared pictures, so this seems unlikely) and set about soothing her fury by getting revenge. Revenge for being snubbed, not for his cleaning job, probably. Her husband/boyfriend/whatever was still coding on Eep's thing, and she had him build in a backdoor to it. Which I'm told is illegal, but I'm not a lawyer. Then she brought in a stack of SMA bankers, and started using the backdoor to siphon away billions of isk to individuals in SMA. Eventually, she straight up robbed Eep. At this point, he kicked her from banking stuff, but Widget's guy was still working on it. Which doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me, but I guess they bonded. So after Widget robbed Eep and they'd both technically defrauded him, Eep started funding people to hit SMA. Initially, it was likely less about pride, and more him just wanting his money back. Why he didn't just ask for it from the guy coding his stuff, I don't know. Best guess is Widget was playing them both. It's unclear at what point SMA leadership as a whole learned of this, or how much they ever knew. Sidebar on this is that the three brothers who had been running SMA and who are standup dudes had been largely out of game due to family stuff and business stuff. So the vast majority of the day to day stuff was run by an Aussie named Winet, and Widget. Increasingly, they were running the alliance, and for better or worse, the brothers trusted them to do so. Given all the stuff behind the scenes, it made for a bad situation. Instead of looking into it airlocking Widget immediately, they bought her story about how Eep was wrongfully harassing her, and vowed not to negotiate with terrorists. Then they went to war, either Widget or the SMA guys had the bright idea to infiltrate IWI to prove that it was an RMT operation while staving off the mercenaries hired to kill them. They used the backdoor, the coding loopholes, and generated a pile of data that they sent to CCP, who already had an investigation ongoing with IWI. Eep knew about this in relatively short order. Not sure how he found out, but he wasn't super happy about it all. The backdoor was closed, the CCP investigation stalled, and suddenly SMA's plan to deal with the Eep issue didn't seem so masterful. SMA leaders were furious, both at CCP and at IWI for slandering their beloved Widget. Widget still refused to back down and talk about what really happened, Eep still wanted his money back from her. He'd also extended his retaliation in general to SMA at this point since they tried to prove IWI was an RMT shop, and said now he was going to destroy them too. It was the same line he'd take post-war with GSF when Mittani talked about IWI enabling underage gambling and being an RMT thing, vowed to destroy GSF for besmirching his good name. Given recent events, heh, well, anyway. After that whole SMA expose blew up and fizzled out, Eep redoubled his efforts. SMA circled the wagons. Eventually the conflict started spilling out to reddit, then into bigger war stuff, and eventually became the casino war, though I'm of the opinion that threesome gone wrong war is a better name, but I digress. What makes this all the more sad is that, even unto the last, as the coalition was losing it's space, Widget and her guy were in direct contact with Eep. Eep had contacted her regularly, and and one point he let her that he'd stop funding the war, but only if she returned the isk she'd stolen from him. It was a paltry amount, and perhaps it was a scam, but given how the war was going it would have been dumb not to try. She, of course, refused. Alliance and coalition be damned, Eep had wronged her. This mentality is totally alien to me, so I can't even speculate as to why her getting vengeance over a botched threesome was more important than the thousands of people in her own alliance, or the tens of thousands in the coalition. But it was. Oh, and for reference, all this leadup stuff happened between last summer and last October or so. Long before anyone in GSF knew what an Eep or an IWI was. SMA concealed this stuff from us as well, that there was anything happening, the real scope of it, or why it might be happening. By the time we saw and understood what was really going on, it was far too late. We'd been getting our info on the IWI stuff from SMA initially, and trusted that they were being up front. It wasn't until it became clear that they were trying to snow us to protect Widget and/or that they didn't know themselves and had been suckered by her that we really started digging. By the time we'd figured out what was really going on, we'd already lost the war and no apology, no Widget execution, nothing could stay that headsman's ax. Had SMA been open with us in the beginning, we could have headed the whole thing off easily, and would likely still be burbling along happily in Dek. So there you have it, the root cause of the war and a great study in the price of revenge and unintended consequences. Widget's desire for revenge brought down a coalition, Eep's desire for revenge drew the public spotlight that contributed to him being banned and gambling being banned from EVE. For me at least, it's kind of fascinating that Widget Zombie is the real reason this war kicked off, a space Helen of Troy.
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Oct 14, 2016 17:04
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space booty comes at a high cost
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Oct 14, 2016 17:14
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Holy poo poo 
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Oct 14, 2016 17:17
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who's gonna get that sweet sweet karma by posting sions post to reddit
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Oct 14, 2016 17:17
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Wait, we got kicked out of the north because someone did some cleaning?
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Oct 14, 2016 17:20
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thats hilarious
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Oct 14, 2016 17:25
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eve is real, folks
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Oct 14, 2016 17:28
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Sion's insight posts are great.
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Oct 14, 2016 17:32
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ShaneMacGowansTeeth posted:Wait, we got kicked out of the north because someone did some cleaning? Cleaning out a gooncave from the sound of it, no less.
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Oct 14, 2016 17:45
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Did someone say 20 bucks per billion? Thats absolutely absurd no rmt isk is worth that.
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Oct 14, 2016 17:46
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