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So you're saying it's historically accurate.
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Oct 23, 2016 12:25
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Montezuma's: 1 Spices For my: 1 Silk 40 Gold 1 Gold Per Turn Nope, Montezuma won't take it. Counter offer: Montezuma's: 1 Spices For my: 1 Silk 9 Gold 1 Gold Per Turn what the gently caress, guys.
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Oct 23, 2016 12:28
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Yeah, no, the trading system seems really hosed up. They should just overhaul the whole thing re: trade value calculation and make it like the Vox Populi mod where the AI will take any trade they consider to be equal, everything has a set and visible trade value, and then it's weighted against a few factors like a given AI's opinion of you and how much it wants to offer you a given proposal (like it can be persuaded to put one vote against its interests in the UN--well, to a certain extent--but the price is incredibly high). See also when the AI contacts you for peace and offers to cede cities, give you a lump sum, and then pay gpt tribute, but if you refuse this deal they keep offering you every turn and contact them yourself, they basically ask you to give them what they were offering you instead. It's extremely  how this even happens.
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Oct 23, 2016 12:59
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Victoria, it's turn 400. Why have you not built a second city? You've had a settler sat in London for centuries now. I mean I'm cool with it but you're last place in every single category.
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Oct 23, 2016 13:03
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AbrahamLincolnLog posted:Yeah the AI loving sucks at science, apparently. I feel like it's that they're bad at production. Gilgamesh in my game definitely has the tech to make better things but he's rolling around with donkey carts still.
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Oct 23, 2016 13:10
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I have one city, I haven't built any districts yet. Why do my districts have a base cost of 60, but an actual cost of 124?
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Oct 23, 2016 13:11
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If you don't found a religion, how do you stop someone taking over your cities with their religion, or later winning the game?
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Oct 23, 2016 13:13
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Comstar posted:If you don't found a religion, how do you stop someone taking over your cities with their religion, or later winning the game? You can declare war on them every time they get a missionary near you and blow it up with your army, but even then outside pressure can and will eventually take your cities over. The only real way to stop someone from converting your cities is to have your own religion and always have Inquisitors ready.
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Oct 23, 2016 13:15
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Gort posted:I have one city, I haven't built any districts yet. building things is bad, and should be minimized as much as possible this is also why wonders cost five times what they're worth
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Oct 23, 2016 13:24
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Apparently same leaders can have multiple copies in the game. I found Pericles, as Pericles. Time to wipe away those heretics to reduce confusion.
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Oct 23, 2016 13:25
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what's the point of corps i lose the possibility to attack with two different units, possibly with two different strategically deployed promotions, just for a +7 or whatever combat strength? seems dum
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Oct 23, 2016 13:34
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How are trade route yields even calculated? My city with the lowest production provides the biggest production bonus for internal trade routes, and it doesn't even have an industrial district, which seems like the complete opposite of what Civilizopedia says. On an unrelated note, it seems to me that the best early terrain development strategy for any new city is to deforest everything and remove all bonus resources so you can slingshot it into a functional state, and then start caring about improvement placement. Confirm/deny. e: quadrophrenic posted:what's the point of corps The most scarce military resource in the game is not production, but tiles. If you have enough space to attack with two units, but you have four, combining them into two corps is a better option than attacking with two weaker units and have two others just faff about. Rexides fucked around with this message at 13:38 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 13:35
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 Genoa found in the files listed among the major civilizations (and Barbarian). To be fair, it's the only mention, and there are City-States named in the same file. Could be a hint, though. Hogama fucked around with this message at 14:11 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 13:55
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What decides if new city state quests get created? I find I'm getting new ones every age but my girlfriend isn't getting any at all beyond the original ones. The Civilopedia has no word on it whatsoever in a huge surprise.
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Oct 23, 2016 13:56
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It was every new age for me. I bet she just ran into a bug.
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Oct 23, 2016 14:04
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Rexides posted:How are trade route yields even calculated? My city with the lowest production provides the biggest production bonus for internal trade routes, and it doesn't even have an industrial district, which seems like the complete opposite of what Civilizopedia says. i could understand that if one corps was twice as strong as a unit, or even 150% stronger but a corps is like 10% stronger than one unit, it's literally less wasteful to just kamikaze the first dude and then move the second up
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Oct 23, 2016 14:13
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Oh good I'm glad there is yet another thing that cripples my ability to play the game: tech boosts. Now I will obsessively avoid researching things I haven't boosted because think of the free beakers just from doing normal game things! Why is there no main menu access to the pedia (unless I'm just missing it)? Also where is the regen map option on turn 1 when playing water civ and your settler spawns 2 tiles away from ocean? Asproigerosis fucked around with this message at 14:16 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 14:14
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Turn 53: Trajan taunts me for having a tiny empire. Turn 54: Trajan compliments me on my far-reaching empire. Territorial chances between the turns: none.
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Oct 23, 2016 14:29
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Steve2911 posted:Victoria, it's turn 400. Why have you not built a second city? You've had a settler sat in London for centuries now. Ok I managed to level her entire empire with one rocket. What the gently caress she was doing all this time I have no idea.
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Oct 23, 2016 14:31
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Steve2911 posted:Ok I managed to level her entire empire with one rocket. What the gently caress she was doing all this time I have no idea. I had similar with Brazil in a game. Egypt eventually expanded all around his stuff and left his one city boxed in. He didn't seem to mind! It feels a little like if a civ gets into an early war then they basically stop expanding.
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Oct 23, 2016 14:38
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quadrophrenic posted:i could understand that if one corps was twice as strong as a unit, or even 150% stronger Combat bonuses work differently in Civ 6. It's the difference between the combat strengths of the two opposing units that matters, not how much combat strength the unit had to begin with. Sort of similar to how roll bonuses work in D&D, if that makes sense to you. e: one more addition to my previous question: What's the advantage of flat terrain compared to hills, other than better movement? It seems that hills give you more improvement options (both mines AND farms), give a flat +1 to production without any penalty, and from what I've noticed it's only certain wonders that require flat terrain. Am I missing something? Rexides fucked around with this message at 14:47 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 14:44
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Rexides posted:Combat bonuses work differently in Civ 6. It's the difference between the combat strengths of the two opposing units that matters, not how much combat strength the unit had to begin with. Sort of similar to how roll bonuses work in D&D, if that makes sense to you. yes but you are LOSING AN ENTIRE UNIT you can rollsplain to me all you want, there' no way "destroy one unit to do 10% more damage in combat" is a good idea in basically any circumstance there's no way that the numbers work out so that "one 87 str unit vs. one 80 str unit" is better than "two 80 str units vs one 80 str unit" you're losing flanking bonuses, individual promotions, future upgradeability, versatility (the capacity to run screens and tactically retreat), and all the hammers/gold/faith you used to get the unit in the first place it's an extraordinarily poorly thought-out mechanic, one of the few "wow they really have no idea what the gently caress they're doing" reactions i've gotten out of this game quadrophrenic fucked around with this message at 14:54 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 14:51
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There's so many weird things about inviting people to multiplayer - depending on which bit you are on and if you're loading a game you have to do it in loads of different places. Why can't I invite from the "friends" prompt in game unless it's a brand new game? Especially when it has the name of the player on the person they were playing before. Alternatively why can't I invite directly from steam if it's a new game and have to use the one in game? Either let me use both always or stick to just one.
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Oct 23, 2016 14:58
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quadrophrenic posted:there's no way that the numbers work out so that "one 87 str unit vs. one 80 str unit" is better than "two 80 str units vs one 80 str unit" math is hard
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Oct 23, 2016 15:00
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Corps and armies definitely have utility in situations where you are constrained by 1UPT and can't pile up enough strength and bonuses into one assault on a city or a fortified unit using only one unit. If you absolutely want 90 strength to assault a position in one tile and you only have 80 strength with bonuses you can merge them to get 90 strength units in those tiles.
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Oct 23, 2016 15:00
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Having used corps, it basically changed battles from me not oneshotting a unit and taking 20-30 retaliation damage into me ripping through two opposing armies like wet tissue paper.
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Oct 23, 2016 15:05
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Yeah so far I've had nothing but good results from corps. If you're not out in wide open territory just having more power in one tile is a huge boost.Prav posted:Turn 53: Trajan taunts me for having a tiny empire. I've had this a few times with barbarians. Not seen a single barbarian in 20 turns, a Civ tells me off one turn for letting them run amok, then thanks me next turn for dealing with them. stev fucked around with this message at 15:09 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 15:05
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Antti posted:Corps and armies definitely have utility in situations where you are constrained by 1UPT and can't pile up enough strength and bonuses into one assault on a city or a fortified unit using only one unit. If you absolutely want 90 strength to assault a position in one tile and you only have 80 strength with bonuses you can merge them to get 90 strength units in those tiles. but in that circumstance you would need an economy good enough to poo poo out units that you could corp together, but if your economy is that good then you could probably win by attrition anyway? it's not even a "win more" mechanic, it's purely a "save time pushing dudes around" mechanic like i used corps and it worked out for me in my germany game, but that was already a snowball. is there ever a circumstance in which you would think "man i'm gonna lose this war unless i start lumping my men together", i would submit that there is not
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Oct 23, 2016 15:10
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quadrophrenic posted:is there ever a circumstance in which you would think "man i'm gonna lose this war unless i start lumping my men together", i would submit that there is not Corps is +10 str (army +7 more for a total of +17). That's a significant bonus. Having 30 str more than the enemy is the point where you oneshot them, for reference. (Also I tried to search Civilopedia for corps, zero hits. I had to check the manual instead. Why is the civilopedia even in the game, it's useless, they should have just replaced it with a link to the manual.) e: In my current Scythia game, I have 19 horsemen on turn 110 (150 BCE). I'd definitely like to turn a bunch of them into corps, but I'm not anywhere close to unlocking that. Of course, that's Scythia, but if you're military focused you can definitely poo poo out a ton of units. If you had a close war (and had a significant amount of units), I'd be surprised if getting better force concentration through corps wouldn't be huge. You could focus down their frontline better with ranged units, forcing them to waste time shuffling units forward (and possibly denying them an attack if you're in 2 movement cost terrain), and it would be harder for them to do the same. Staltran fucked around with this message at 15:30 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 15:21
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Corps seem like they would be good in certain situations, but I would probably take the extra unit instead.
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Oct 23, 2016 15:29
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well, now i'm thinking about this i mean my point ultimately is that wars in 4x games are never about armies vs. armies, they're about economies vs economies. and if your enemy has the capacity to make 12 corps, they also have the capacity to make 24 units, and if you find the former insurmountable you'll also find the latter just as insurmountable i was gonna type "ofc 12 corps is better than 24 units", but now that i think about it, i'm not really sure if that's true 12 corps: +stronger front line, w/ ability to pierce through lines +more kills possibly means faster acquisition of deeper promotions -twice as much economic cost per tile defended 24 units: +easier to get flanking bonuses, protect your ranged units, etc +in a trench situation with 2 big straight lines pushing against each other, you can swap out damaged units on the front line, which leads to: +more efficient healing -weaker front line, less ability to push i mean obviously it's going to come down to the individual circumstance, and in cases having an extremely narrow front yeah maybe corps will be better for you, but it just seems like such a waste. especially because by the time the corps civic rolls around your only challenging foes will probably be big fuckoff empires and you will have to cover a larger front. whoever starts collapsing their army first probably loses in that scenario, idk Staltran posted:e: In my current Scythia game, I have 19 horsemen on turn 110 (150 BCE). I'd definitely like to turn a bunch of them into corps, but I'm not anywhere close to unlocking that. Of course, that's Scythia, but if you're military focused you can definitely poo poo out a ton of units. btw all this corps theorycrafting came up because in my germany game i got the great general who lets you make a corps, and i put him on a swordsman and then proceeded to start winning the game, lol
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Oct 23, 2016 15:33
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Staltran posted:(Also I tried to search Civilopedia for corps, zero hits. I had to check the manual instead. Why is the civilopedia even in the game, it's useless, they should have just replaced it with a link to the manual instead.) It's funny you'd say that, the civilopedia's problem is actually the fact that it takes much of its info directly from the manual rather than having more individual keywords. For example the info about corps/armies is in there but it's under Concepts -> Combat -> Formations as that page covers both supporting units and corps/armies. The text is pretty much directly from the manual, although many of the word choices are different (I assume the manual is the "original" version and the civilopedia version is a more recent one). You can still find almost everything from the civilopedia, but if you're looking for explanations for game concepts you'll have better luck with finding what you need by going down the Concepts list rather than with keywords.
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Oct 23, 2016 15:40
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Tbh corps are probably more of a "do this if you already have enough units for the front and have a bunch of units twiddling thumbs in the backline" thing, which translates to "build more units to make corps if you can't beat the enemy (fast enough/effectively enough) with a full front+at least one line of range units behind that". Since the AI can't really challenge you late game, that means you never end up bothering since you can just beat them with a smaller investment in military. Also I've only completed one game, in which I made 3 corps for a eureka -one of which was 2 spearmen that I only built for that eureka- and never fought with them, so this is all complete theorycrafting. I was just kneejerking because I remember release Beyond Earth where I had a frontline a dozen hexes wide and three deep when I stopped building units, and corps/armies would have been real nice to avoid that mat of doom. e: Okay maybe only the Civilopedia search function sucks. Also the whole "clicking on Getting Started because it looks more like a searchbox than the actual searchbox" thing e2: Reading through the formations entry, you could merge new 0-exp units into a few of your high-promoted units and keep the rest of your army as... non-corps units . Is there an actual term for that? If you managed to get the multiple attacks per turn promo on someone you'd probably want to buff them up as much as possible. Or the +1 range for siege weapons maybe. Staltran fucked around with this message at 15:54 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 15:45
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I'm confused when people are mentioning not understanding the district bonuses. Are you referring to the little +1 or +2 icons that appear in the good places to place the district when you're about to do so? That seems pretty obvious to me... The advisor also won't recommend something if there are no bonuses it seems.
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Oct 23, 2016 15:48
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OH you know one thing i just remembered because i never actually did it in my game, but actually this changes my mind about the whole thing: you can directly produce corps and armies from cities. and the production cost didn't actually seem that much higher. i think towards the end of my game it was like 8 turns to mech infantry and 10 turns to a mech inf corps so uh, nevermind
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Oct 23, 2016 15:50
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quadrophrenic posted:OH you know one thing i just remembered because i never actually did it in my game, but actually this changes my mind about the whole thing: Oh yeah the later encampment buildings give +25% to "corps training" or something? I actually weren't sure what that did and never bothered to find out e: Armory says "faster corps and army training", doesn't mention how much faster
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Oct 23, 2016 15:56
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You can pump corps out of the build menu and I'm pretty sure they're not twice as expensive. So basically it's more like corps are an upgraded unit that you can also sacrifice a unit to create if had the units sitting around doing nothing.
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Oct 23, 2016 15:58
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Sort of posted earlier about this. I'm at turn 250 on Prince as France going for Culture. All 8 civs are still around and I'm winning with 323 points to the next at 248. Just barely leading science and running away with culture. There doesn't seem to be anything to do now. I'm just mindlessly clicking next buildings to make. I'm friendly with America, but not FRIENDS. Everyone else is unfriendly or denounced, so there's nothing to do diplomatically. France is good with spies, but they keep getting caught and there's no science to steal anyway. What should I be doing?
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Oct 23, 2016 16:08
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So what's the chance on the Eagle Warrior ability proccing? And do they keep it when you upgrade them?
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Oct 23, 2016 16:15
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KingKapalone posted:Sort of posted earlier about this. I'm at turn 250 on Prince as France going for Culture. All 8 civs are still around and I'm winning with 323 points to the next at 248. Just barely leading science and running away with culture. What's the state of religion looking like for you Was in the exact same spot as you in my France game, I built Mont St. Michel and just started suiciding apostles during my downtime. That won me the game because I'd picked cathedrals as one of my reform beliefs If you can't do that, keep on teching up. The next big tourism surge will probably come when you unlock archaeology, then it's game shortly after that That was a neat game, I stumbled on an actual strategy and I completely didn't intend to Eta: also, remember that spies don't steal techs, they generate eurekas. You should definitely be keeping your spies in enemy campuses at all times, because the late game tech/civic disparity is so egregious it's really loving hard to come across late game eurekas the regular way quadrophrenic fucked around with this message at 16:22 on Oct 23, 2016 |
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Oct 23, 2016 16:19
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