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I saw this a week ago and I really really liked it for a lot of reasons, but I think the biggest one is as follows: I like a lot of Marvel movies but I've gotten really bored with almost all of them because of "The Ending Fight." If the last 20 minutes of your movie is punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch punch then I'm going to be bored after 5-10 minutes. Ditto if it's all energy beams replacing the punches. The end fight to this movie however was a lot different, and as befits a movie about sorcery it was a magical puzzle. It just felt fresh and new.
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Nov 7, 2016 08:55
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Hollismason posted:All of these questions were answered in the film though.. Yeah I mean I get that they said all that stuff but just going "his whole family died and now he mad" isn't character development or interesting at all. They didn't even show a flashback or something, so there's no emotional connection to it, there's no consequence to his character's actions, or motivation. And the "she used the dark powers so I'm outta here" was still stupid as hell, the dude talked about how he was totally going to kill anyone to save the world but then when they break the rules or whatever, he just bounces. What? Again, if he was an actual character instead of just an oscar winner stuck into a role to fill a void, it'd make more sense. The ending was good because it seemed like someone went "gently caress it I'm not gonna do some stupid Marvel poo poo ending" and actually went off the rails and wrote something original
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Nov 7, 2016 10:12
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I keep seeing comment chains on Twitter of Dormammu! I've come to bargain!, and I loving love it. Seriously, once we hit the spoiler free zone, mods please update thread title.
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Nov 7, 2016 10:15
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Ensign_Ricky posted:So I guess that thing that Strange threw at Kaecillius to tie him up? I don't remember them being red... Also, Dr. West is a character they don't mention. He comes straight out of The Oath as well and may be a potential villain later, though this movie seems to diffuse the problems that lead him to villainy.
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Nov 7, 2016 13:27
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The writing wasn't great, but I enjoyed the film.Neo Rasa posted:It's not much a key, since Mordo broke off from the group (it doesn't get more "breaking the rules" than that) and also says he had to travel the world for months before coming to the conclusion that the best way to fix whatever damage the Ancient One and Mr. Doctor may have done is to kill every sorcerer on Earth. "Consequences down the road" has nothing to do with the current or any upcoming threats to Earth, but the inevitable toll messing around with stuff will have on one personally. The Ancient One tells us this outright before she dies, the bill catching up is that she reaches a time and place where there is zero possibility of her not dying. Even Mordo's examples of why messing with time is dangerous early in the movie have no effect on the Earth, just on whether or not Strange himself personally exists, dies, or where he could be trapped forever were he to tamper with time too much. Mordo is badly written. Mordo doesn't kill the guy, does he? He just says no more sorcerors, so I guess he'll try and strip as many wizard people of their powers as possible. Mordo doesn't recommend Strange to the Ancient One because he breaks the rules, but because he has strength and pride. Like, at that point their entire encounter was Strange disbelieving in magic, The Ancient One showing him, then kicking him out, and his argument was that Strange was a strong guy and the Ancient One can fix him. The rule breaking stuff comes later. I think Mordo's alright in terms of how he's written, if we receive the thing about there being always consequences to not being some grand rule, but rather Mordo's personal philosophy. (In terms of him bouncing, well, in his POV the big bad has been defeated, and is he going to serve Strange now? Of course not.) My bigger issue is with the Ancient One, I don't think we really ever see enough of her to understand what *she* sees in him. Fangz fucked around with this message at 13:38 on Nov 7, 2016 |
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Nov 7, 2016 13:34
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Fangz posted:The writing wasn't great, but I enjoyed the film. I took it that the Ancient One knows that that Strange is going to be there at the scene of her death (she she says she's "seen" the moment coming) and therefore knows she has to bring Strangein, since he's obviously going to become a wizard dude who is at her side when she dies I think it adds some nice tension in retrospect to that scene and the Everest scene, since part of her is obviously hoping that he gives up/goes away/dies.
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Nov 7, 2016 16:27
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I didn't even realize the cape was wiping away his tears in that scene. My cat spends so much time poking me in the face when he wants attention that that's just what I automatically parsed it as.
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Nov 7, 2016 17:57
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It was pretty decent. I'd say my complaints are that: 1. Movie was very timid of being fully sincere. Lots of jokes at odd times like the "Mr. Doctor" thing while Kaecilius is trying to recruit Strange, and some jokes that lingered too long such as the joke about Wong's single name or the cape dragging Strange to the correct relic.. 2. Dormammu's yet another big head made of gas. At least the way he's defeated in this one is clever. 3. I felt like Mordo's character was inconsistent. I felt like he should've been the one resilient to recruiting Strange and the Ancient One being eager to do so. Maybe Mordo should've been the one to expand Strange's mind, but decide against training him fully after realizing Strange is a rule breaker, and then have the Ancient One decide "Nah, that's cool as gently caress actually, let's teach him."
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Nov 7, 2016 18:27
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A few more thoughts after a second viewing: First time through, in the beginning of the movie, I reeeaally thought the shot of Dr. West standing surly-faced in the corner and then a foot pushing down a pedal meant he was loving over Strange so he'd make a mistake. I feel like Strange's being upset at having to kill a man is kind of undercut by his smug satisfaction when he arranges for Kaecilius and his ladies to be cast into a dimension without time as desiccated husks that look very much dead. Seems like it'd be more fitting if he regretted it, but saw no other option. Most of the Marvel film heroes seem to lack the "never kill" policy of their comic book selves, for understandable sake of realism. Strange is the one guy who has his oath as a really good reason to not want to kill, so I hope that remains an important aspect of his character in the movies. There were a few shots in the scene where Strange talks to Kaecilius as he's caught in the harness, where Cumberbatch looks like his face has gone a few rounds with Photoshop. Like they tried smoothing out his wrinkles and boost the contrast just for a few shots. It kind of distracted me on both viewings. Whitewashing aside, I love Tilda Swinton as the Ancient One. She's really charismatic. Any significance to her being mentioned as Celtic? Just to illustrate how old she is? Regarding the after credits scenes, I'm slightly confused that Thor is with Loki, looking for Odin. Last we saw, Loki had replaced Odin and he was heavily implied to be dead, wasn't he? I hope the implications of that aren't just tossed out the window like other setups the Marvel movies have had, such as Steve and Falcon hunting down Bucky. I suppose it might just be that Loki is luring Thor into a trap. The other one: kind of sucks. I know Mordo is a villain from the comics, but him just going SORCERERS ARE THE PROBLEM when he assuredly must know there's plenty of other cosmic dangers out there to protect against, seems like an excuse to make another one-dimensional movie villain. Why not have him start a sorcerer's league of his own that starts stealing books and artifacts from Strange's? Overall: movie's still great.
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Nov 7, 2016 18:27
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For a sequel if it's called The Sorceror Supreme I'm thinking an underground DBZ style tournament where we see all kinds of magic users and such. "Only one can be crowned!" Or my wish is an Indiana Jones style adventure.
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Nov 7, 2016 18:38
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The more I think about the appearance of the big bad guy, the more I think they made a good choice having Dormammu be a gigantic, disembodied head. Even when reading the old comics when they would talk up D as having an insane power level, the look of the guy always left me thinking "...this guy? Really?" As a Strange-sized humanoid he doesn't really sell the idea of god-like power. As soon as Dormammu's face appears in the movie though, it's an unconscious visual cue to tell the audience that this guy is above and beyond mere mortals like Strange and Kaecilius. And since he's not in the movie for very long it helps to sell that idea right away.
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Nov 7, 2016 19:00
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My take on Mordo and what happens to him: The scene that makes it clear what kind of dude Mordo is is when he tells the Ancient One that she gave him the power to defeat his demons. The Ancient One corrects him, saying that you can't defeat your demons, you just live without letting them control you. Mordo thinks he gained a new perspective on things coming to the Sanctum, but he really didn't. Whatever his earlier life was, the lessons from it (obey the rules, kill those who'll kill you before they can kill you, that sort of thing) are Mordo's real demon, and he hasn't conquered them. The Ancient One knows it, which is why she never tells him about how she's managed to live so long. The Ancient One confiding in Strange later on is her making sure Strange knows that he's still that nonspecific terrible person he always was, deep down. It's a low-key warning about the dude. "You need him, but you need to know this dude could snap over this". Sure enough, he does. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 19:43 on Nov 7, 2016 |
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Nov 7, 2016 19:40
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davidspackage posted:
He isn't just going sorcerers are the problem - he's against sorcerers like The Ancient One who, in his eyes, abuse their power and risk greater danger by doing so just for their own convenience and benefit. Which was set in motion by him putting so much faith in The Ancient One and buying in to her words rather than her deeds, to the point that when he found out they differed he didn't care why, just that she had, in his eyes, betrayed what she taught and consorted with the Devil (well, essentially) while talking about how they must never work with him. He's willing to help against beings like Dormammu who pose a threat regardless and is almost certainly not going to be the full villain of a film on his own, but he thinks sorcerers should guard against those powers without ever compromising or working for their own benefit as opposed to The Ancient One and Strange who are more flexible and willing to skirt those principles for a greater good.
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Nov 7, 2016 19:43
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Alright, but then why go after Pangborn, of all people? Dude uses sorcery for only the most basic thing, keeing himself walking. This way, it made Mordo look like a power-vampire. I guess possibly Pangborn drew power from the same well as the Ancient One or Mordo resents him for leaving the Sanctum, but none of that was implied. edit: You did mention 'sorcerers using power for their own benefit,' which is what Pangborn's doing. Still, talk about starting small.
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Nov 7, 2016 20:47
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davidspackage posted:Alright, but then why go after Pangborn, of all people? Dude uses sorcery for only the most basic thing, keeing himself walking. This way, it made Mordo look like a power-vampire. I guess possibly Pangborn drew power from the same well as the Ancient One or Mordo resents him for leaving the Sanctum, but none of that was implied. Because he knows he's an easy target. The Ancient One says that he uses all his power all the time to make himself not crippled, so Mordo knows he can't fight back and it will be simple to take his power.
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Nov 7, 2016 20:49
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Mordo's probably just practicing and that's his first field test.
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Nov 7, 2016 20:58
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davidspackage posted:Alright, but then why go after Pangborn, of all people? Dude uses sorcery for only the most basic thing, keeing himself walking. This way, it made Mordo look like a power-vampire. I guess possibly Pangborn drew power from the same well as the Ancient One or Mordo resents him for leaving the Sanctum, but none of that was implied. Like GonSmithe said, he's an easy target to test the waters and get his feet wet while he sets himself up. And also to show his intentions within the scope of a post credit scene. Taking on a sanctum or the real sorcerer's would require much more time and effort, where taking out guys like Pangborn is something he can do anytime with little to no effort. And he's still doing something he believes needs to be done at some point, taking out people abusing the natural order for their own benefit and not sticking to the "rules". Dude was crippled, so to Mordo he should stay crippled - not abuse dimensional powers to enable mobility at the expense of twisting the natural order. Mordo doesn't care that what he was doing was small in the grand scope, because the way he talked any infraction is too much of an infraction and needs to be stopped.
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Nov 7, 2016 21:18
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davidspackage posted:Regarding the after credits scenes, I'm slightly confused that Thor is with Loki, looking for Odin. Last we saw, Loki had replaced Odin and he was heavily implied to be dead, wasn't he? I hope the implications of that aren't just tossed out the window like other setups the Marvel movies have had, such as Steve and Falcon hunting down Bucky. I suppose it might just be that Loki is luring Thor into a trap. This scene was taken directly from Thor: Ragnarok. It's like how made a Civil War clip one of Ant-Man's teasers.
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Nov 7, 2016 21:43
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Someone earlier in the thread pointed out that Asgard, Thor, Loki etc. were all considered science based. How does Loki's power work then?
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Nov 7, 2016 21:42
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About Mordo, if him taking Pangborn's power adds to his own, it makes sense to start small so that power taken from each sorcerer makes facing the next sorcerer that much easier. Though from a script sense and the POV of the audience, Pangborn is also the only person left other than Wong to be a victim of Mordo to set up a sequel. Can't use Strange himself, Ancient One is dead, and nobody else is a named character or even recognizable enough to use.
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Nov 7, 2016 21:46
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Admiral Joeslop posted:Someone earlier in the thread pointed out that Asgard, Thor, Loki etc. were all considered science based. How does Loki's power work then? In Asgard, magic is considered a science, and vice versa. What are considered separate disciplines in Midgard are practiced in Asgard as just different tools within the same tradition.
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Nov 7, 2016 23:02
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Admiral Joeslop posted:Someone earlier in the thread pointed out that Asgard, Thor, Loki etc. were all considered science based. How does Loki's power work then? It's the "sufficiently advanced technology" rule.
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Nov 7, 2016 23:06
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Fair enough!
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Nov 7, 2016 23:33
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Lobok posted:About Mordo, if him taking Pangborn's power adds to his own, it makes sense to start small so that power taken from each sorcerer makes facing the next sorcerer that much easier.
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Nov 8, 2016 00:09
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Drifter posted:It's not a victim of Mordo's, but the black dude killed protecting the English wizard mansion will likely be Dr Voodoo. Teh director mentioned at in an interview - at least that's what he wanted. Considering Brother Voodoo's brother (say that three times fast) got killed, if they decide to include the character in later films then the person who died will probably be the brother. FWIW, I enjoyed the movie. I had some of the same complaints as other people (I'd have prefered magic duels instead of kung fu), but it was a fun time. When they have a sequel I'll be going out the first weekend again. My brother who had only the vaguest idea of who Dr. Strange was liked it as well. These "side" Marvel movies have turned out to be a lot more enjoyable than the "main" ones...
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Nov 8, 2016 01:18
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Admiral Joeslop posted:Someone earlier in the thread pointed out that Asgard, Thor, Loki etc. were all considered science based. How does Loki's power work then? In The Dark World it's mentioned that he learned his tricks from his mother Frigga/Renee Russo (who we also see using some similar stuff during the first big battle scene. Asgard in general uses technology incomprehensibly advanced by human standards that the Asgardians still refer to with traditional names and flowery prose so it comes off like magic to an outsider. But Natalie Portman has a conversation with some of the "fates" or whatever and it's clear plenty of them can have a conversation about their stuff in technical terms, just most of them don't. THAT said, I think Loki/Frigga's stuff is more connected than we think, note how Loki teleports around and appears to people through reflections. He knows of "other pathways" to earth besides the Rainbow Bridge, etc. Between that and the interdimensional effects in Strange looking so much like the microverse I'm sure all three are connected (we know the microverse similarity is intentional from interviews) and that Loki/Frigga do that stuff via straight up magic. The Eye of Agamotto being a gem also is interesting though. The gem from Loki's staff in the Avengers flicks, in Ultron I forget if they sya the gem seems to have a straight up AI in it or if it's literally so complex that it's a "soul." In the comics IIRC Cagliostro (dude who compiled the books the Ancient One and Keselius come to blows over) is Mordo's dad, anyone recall?
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Nov 8, 2016 02:21
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If Mordo is supposed to be a rival rather than a villain, it's possible that he's specifically targeting Pangborn because Pangborn is using his power for a single selfish purpose rather than for the good of the world, and he would have left him alone if he'd been healing himself with magic and also a superhero.
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Nov 8, 2016 02:36
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Maybe it would have been more interesting if Girl Doctor blind-sighted the Ancient One by saving her using medical science, preferably mid--my-last-day-speech to make it less like the movie was pissing on medicine and to mirror what happened to Strange in the first act
Baron Porkface fucked around with this message at 12:35 on Nov 8, 2016 |
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Nov 8, 2016 12:26
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twerking on the railroad posted:I saw this a week ago and I really really liked it for a lot of reasons, but I think the biggest one is as follows: I like a lot of Marvel movies but I've gotten really bored with almost all of them because of "The Ending Fight." Yeah, but didn't this movie do the exact opposite? Wong and the bad guys square off.for the big fight. Camera goes.to.something else. Strange shows up and the fight is already done... And it looks like it was epic, bodies everywhere and a city block destroyed. Then he turns back time and it never happened, we never saw any of it. Edit -and I just saw the end of your post and you already agree. Sorry I am toilet posting, small screen.
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Nov 8, 2016 14:42
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Re: 3D I haven't seen a 3D movie since Avatar because I hated its 3D effects SO much, but I gave 3D another try for Dr. Strange and I am SO glad I did. Now I regret not having seen Gravity in 3D. The city-bending in 3D is probably one of the coolest visual effects I've ever experienced, and the final battle where Strange and Kaecilius are fighting forward in time while the city reassembled itself backwards in time is also really cool to see. Oh, and the slow-mo hand-crushing during the horrifying car accident and the following surgery and recovery scenes made me physically cringe because it was so realistic. I forgot I was watching 3D about 20 minutes into the movie, which is significant because of how much I hated 3D just a few years ago. Re: stop making jokes, Marvel, and stop trying to be in movies, Stan Lee Personally, the jokes are what make me like Marvel movies more than other superhero/action movies. It felt wrong coming from Kaecilius while fighting Strange in the sanctum and I wish they had kept that one out, but I enjoy the more lighthearted feeling that comes from frequent jokes. And they need to plan Stan Lee's cameos better, because this one was awful. It's like they added a separate 3 second clip into the middle of an action scene as an afterthought. Re: no-maj magician I'm glad they didn't use spellcasting in this movie. But I'm not a comic reader and know almost nothing about the Marvel universe apart from basic pop culture. Dr. Strange's hand movements and the visual effects were more than enough to get the point across that he was doing magic. Adding incantations would have made it feel like Harry Potter, and like someone else said earlier in the thread, with Fantastic Beasts coming out in a few weeks...well, I'm glad they didn't use Harry Potter-style spellcasting. nowthatyouasked fucked around with this message at 18:43 on Nov 8, 2016 |
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Nov 8, 2016 17:23
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Movie was pretty good. The only thing that distracted me was that the theme riffed off of the Star Trek 09 theme.
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Nov 9, 2016 01:55
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nowthatyouasked posted:Re: stop making jokes, Marvel, and stop trying to be in movies, Stan Lee This is how I feel as well. It feels more appropriately comic-book-y this way. Granted I've never read a single page of the comics, so maybe that's not true to them, but I think with such a goofy premise you can't take yourself too seriously. It reminds me of the Mummy movies, especially the first one. The jokes elevated it way beyond any potential it ever had as a serious movie.
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Nov 9, 2016 03:12
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:This is how I feel as well. It feels more appropriately comic-book-y this way. Granted I've never read a single page of the comics, so maybe that's not true to them, but I think with such a goofy premise you can't take yourself too seriously. Dr. Strange the movie had a good amount of humor. The "jokes" involving 15 dead seconds of making fun of Wong's name, or the dumb wifi joke (Dr. Strange had no money and no computer and no phone when he got to the school - he was completely broke according to him what the gently caress does he need wifi for) were fuckin' lame. That was punch-up quip by committee if ever there was any. Drifter fucked around with this message at 03:58 on Nov 9, 2016 |
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Nov 9, 2016 03:55
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Looks like we now know what Mordo was warning about...
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Nov 9, 2016 05:48
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Detective No. 27 posted:Looks like we now know what Mordo was warning about... Haha. Love it.  
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Nov 9, 2016 06:39
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If it had been up to me, I would have set this movie 5 years prior to Iron Man 1, so that by the time Strange teams up with the Avengers he's already a master sorcerer.
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Nov 9, 2016 07:37
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computer parts posted:Movie was pretty good. The only thing that distracted me was that the theme riffed off of the Star Trek 09 theme. HOLY poo poo! Thank you so much for scratching that itch in my brain! Inspector 34 fucked around with this message at 09:18 on Nov 9, 2016 |
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Nov 9, 2016 09:15
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Inspector 34 posted:HOLY poo poo! Thank you so much for scratching that itch in my brain!  Josh Lyman posted:Actually, the theme sounded a lot like the new Star Trek films. Disturbingly so.
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Nov 9, 2016 09:29
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What, you expect me to actually read the thread before posting in it? This Giacchino guy sounds lazy as hell.
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Nov 9, 2016 09:42
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Inspector 34 posted:What, you expect me to actually read the thread before posting in it? Composers usually have a musical signature.
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