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Nov 10, 2016 21:19
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steinrokkan posted:I don't want to marginalize your sound point That depends Do you think the government would go ahead and allow the militarized police to attack entire black neighborhoods and trigger a national crisis the likes of which it hasn't seen in a very long time?
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Nov 10, 2016 21:20
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WampaLord posted:She just didn't lie enough. I mean, if there isn't a feasible way to get most people a decent livelihood, then people should just prepare for real, bona fide fascism, because at that point the system has failed to do its one job.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:21
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Scent of Worf posted:That depends Under Trump?
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Nov 10, 2016 21:21
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The Ninth Layer posted:How many people do you think you personally convinced not to vote? Noone, everyone on this dead gay forum's mind is made up
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Nov 10, 2016 21:21
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WampaLord posted:She just didn't lie enough. yeah very cute have fun pissing and moaning about Donald Trump's second term steinrokkan posted:I don't want to marginalize your sound point for all their shiny new GI Joe toys police nationwide are tremedously less violent than cops with batons and revolvers were in the 60s. Like, there's not even a comparison. IDK why liberals love jerking off to this fantasy of jackbooted government thugs armed with high-tech superweapons slaughtering all resistance en masse so much but it's sort of what makes people wanna buy guns.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:21
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I mean I guess it's good that his campaign rhetoric isn't going to be his actual policy because his campaign rhetoric was historically awful and maybe we can hope his policy will just be generic Republican poo poo.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:21
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If it's true that Bern people voted at the same rate as HRC people, do you think the people current blaming the left will walk back their statements or reflect in any way on the consequences of that behavior on enthusiasm? Laffo of course not, but just saying
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Nov 10, 2016 21:24
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From my facebook feed: "Hmmm the 2 party system has the nation deeply devided in half. That couldn't be intentional could it? WAKE UP AMERICA" "Wow how sad and infuriating is this?! The two party system has made our once great nation into an international joke." 
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Nov 10, 2016 21:24
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icantfindaname posted:If it's true that Bern people voted at the same rate as HRC people, do you think the people current blaming the left will walk back their statements or reflect in any way on the consequences of that behavior on enthusiasm? Laffo of course not, but just saying lol
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Nov 10, 2016 21:24
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The best thing about the next 4 years is going to be watching tens of millions of republicans realize they've been duped by the establishment yet again 
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Nov 10, 2016 21:23
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Scent of Worf posted:Do you think the government would go ahead and allow the militarized police to attack entire black neighborhoods and trigger a national crisis the likes of which it hasn't seen in a very long time? Sometimes soundtrack: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjuA03FlXiU
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Nov 10, 2016 21:23
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Scent of Worf posted:That depends I can imagine a situation where a black militia gets into a shootout with a white militia, initiating a military-style response to purge the area of "resistance". Other than that, probably not.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:24
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icantfindaname posted:Once again, HRC was a genuinely terrible candidate with huge problems in an absolute sense, even with Trump's being much wrose. The near-pathological inability to admit this on the part of her supporters and surrogates is IMO the biggest reason Trump is now president. They could have nominated someone who could win, but they didn't Honestly, they weren't given a lot of options. Only Bernie, and he had some negatives too. You can't blame people for not voting Warren when she didn't run.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:25
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again, I think rabid Trump supporters are going to be a bit less rabid and supportive of Trump when his presidency actually begins
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Nov 10, 2016 21:25
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Squashing Machine posted:All of these examples happened before the rise of the militarized police, or are objectively indistinguishable to declaring that you would have personally stopped the Sandy Hook massacre or the attempted assassination of Gabby Giffords. It is "good guy with a gun" rhetoric wrapped in a tarp. Dylann Roof literally happened last year, dude. Again, it's not about personally stopping poo poo, it's about a deterrent. Abuse of power only happens when there's no consequences for it. The reason why police can shove a broom handle up a black guy's rear end or a dude can stalk and kill a teenager is because they know they're not gonna get any serious consequences thanks to their actions.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:25
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:yeah very cute have fun pissing and moaning about Donald Trump's second term You're acting as if there's anything that could be done to stop it. This nation has already made up its mind, and it's to fully embrace bigotry and hatred.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:25
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Dr Christmas posted:It seems to me that Clinton tried to talk a both economic anxiety early on, and no one paid attention. She did give talks outlining her policies, and they got a fraction of the coverage of Trump's empty podium. She ran some ads with stiffed contractors, and they made less of an impact than ads about his sexism or instability. In the first debate Trump basically admitted to being the establishment elitist he claims he wants to fight ("Maybe [the contractors I didn't pay] did a bad job") and it got less scrutiny than montages of him sniffling. I remember back in the primaries when people were pointing out that Bernie had made large strides to do a better job of addressing racial issues including hiring blm people, letting them speak at his rally's (while hillary kicked em out), and generating more talking points to those issues. It didn't end up working and Bernie lost the primaries pretty much off racial lines, some bernie fans were kind of upset about this because it felt like people were ignoring his actual platform and instead just going off feelings and assumptions, but all the hillary fans came to gloat about how it was bernie and his campaign's fault for not doing a better job in delivering these messages. It wasn't the voter's fault for not giving his campaign a fair chance on social issues, it was the campaigners fault for failing to convince them to. So why now that the exact same thing happened to hillary the other way around in the rust belt, is it suddenly the voter's fault for her doing a bad job of campaigning the economically progressive parts of her campaign? Isn't this basically the same scenario?
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Nov 10, 2016 21:27
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Scent of Worf posted:The best thing about the next 4 years is going to be watching tens of millions of republicans realize they've been duped by the establishment yet again Assuming they actually know literally anything about the foreign policy, and won't just take anything Trump tells them about his bigly achievements abroad at face value. Foreign policy has always been a well of ignorance in any country, more so than any other policy area.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:27
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icantfindaname posted:If it's true that Bern people voted at the same rate as HRC people, do you think the people current blaming the left will walk back their statements or reflect in any way on the consequences of that behavior on enthusiasm? Laffo of course not, but just saying I am pretty confident I convinced a few people I know to show up and vote. I don't think I can say that about everyone who spent the election doing anything and everything they could to make people feel bad for voting Clinton. In fact I'll bet a lot of that kind of rhetoric committed to people staying home. (USER WAS BANNED FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 10, 2016 21:28
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Hillary Clinton loving sucks.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:28
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:
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Nov 10, 2016 21:30
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Scent of Worf posted:The best thing about the next 4 years is going to be watching tens of millions of republicans realize they've been duped by the establishment yet again I think this is something we can all agree on. 
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Nov 10, 2016 21:30
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Rush Limbo posted:Dylann Roof literally happened last year, dude. On the other hand, the "only" consequence for the abuse of power is being shot at. Unless abuse of power has real lawful consequences, the cops are just going to make sure they shoot quicker next time.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:31
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BarbarianElephant posted:Honestly, they weren't given a lot of options. Only Bernie, and he had some negatives too. You can't blame people for not voting Warren when she didn't run. The people with power in the party decided Hillary would be the nominee and pressured everyone out of the race except Bernie
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Nov 10, 2016 21:30
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steinrokkan posted:I mean, if there isn't a feasible way to get most people a decent livelihood, then people should just prepare for real, bona fide fascism, because at that point the system has failed to do its one job. This really isn't the problem. The system could provide these people jobs and security, but they very specifically want a certain type of job we can't give them. That's the problem. Republicans are willing to literally promise people unicorns and they'll vote for it.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:30
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Rush Limbo posted:Dylann Roof literally happened last year, dude. gently caress, I'm still here. I tied the Dylann Roof shooting to two other mass or public shootings, which you decided not to read I guess. I fail to see how saying "a good guy with a gun would've stopped the Dylann Roof massacre" is any different from saying "a good guy with a gun would've stopped the Aurora massacre." The difference is one is something we've routinely derided for the past four years and the other is now just Good Common Sense
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Nov 10, 2016 21:31
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Scent of Worf posted:The best thing about the next 4 years is going to be watching tens of millions of republicans realize they've been duped by the establishment yet again I was thinking this earlier, and then I read some of that 'day 1 of post trump election' twitter feed with all the terrible racist poo poo happening, and now I'm pretty convinced that when he does nothing to fix the midwest all those people will just double-down and that's pretty frightening
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Nov 10, 2016 21:32
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Scent of Worf posted:The best thing about the next 4 years is going to be watching tens of millions of republicans realize they've been duped by the establishment yet again Add to them the millions of people who apparently couldn't vote for Hillary because she got paid to tell some bankers what they wanted to hear. HorseRenoir posted:again, I think rabid Trump supporters are going to be a bit less rabid and supportive of Trump when his presidency actually begins Oh, they'll make plenty of noise if (if) Hillary doesn't get thrown in jail and the wall doesn't get built and they'll swear they'll never vote R again. Then in 3 1/2 years Trump or someone else will start saying the same drat things and they'll come right back.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:32
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The Ninth Layer posted:I am pretty confident I convinced a few people I know to show up and vote. I don't think I can say that about everyone who spent the election doing anything and everything they could to make people feel bad for voting Clinton. In fact I'll bet a lot of that kind of rhetoric committed to people staying home. For the record, I do actually think a lot of the left wing criticism of HRC was a little excessive. But the reverse, the furious hippie punching and smearing of the left had an equally large negative impact, in my opinion actually a greater one, all on top of HRC and her people's own enormous failure
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Nov 10, 2016 21:34
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icantfindaname posted:The people with power in the party decided Hillary would be the nominee and pressured everyone out of the race except Bernie There were like six people who ran and another who would have seriously challenged for the nomination but his son died. It's not the DNC fault four out of the six were laughable joke candidates.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:34
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The DNC and the Democratic Party have been making GBS threads all over their constituents for years now by forcing them to vote for the lesser of two evils. Is it really so surprising that a bunch of Democratic voters saw what seemed to them to be another centrist, mealy-mouthed, DNC tool and decided to finally sit one out? Don't get me wrong - I voted for Clinton and I had hoped she would have been a good President. But a lot of Democrats of every color, gender, and creed have been told, "It'll be your turn next time" for a long, long time, and maybe they finally got sick of it. So rather than sell out the party even more by reaching across the aisle to a bunch of lovely, bigoted Trump supporters who won't ever vote Democratic anyways, maybe Dems could, oh, appeal to their actual core constituents with something other than "vote for us or something REALLY BAD will happen."
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Nov 10, 2016 21:34
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Christ I loved Huey. And Robert. Riley annoyed the piss out of me though.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:35
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Polygynous posted:Add to them the millions of people who apparently couldn't vote for Hillary because she got paid to tell some bankers what they wanted to hear. it doesn't matter if they come back if the dems get their poo poo together (lol). the trump base is not some sort of paradigm-shifting unstoppable mass of voters, they barely even won the first time
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Nov 10, 2016 21:37
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icantfindaname posted:The people with power in the party decided Hillary would be the nominee and pressured everyone out of the race except Bernie Additionally, the DNC was not supportive of Bernie during the primaries, and fed the narrative that Bernie can't even unite the party, how can he unite the nation? Bernie had more cross demographic appeal than Hillary and a poo poo load of nontraditional and across the aisle support. PoC didn't go for Bernie because no one knew who the gently caress he was, and the media narrative was that Hillary (rightfully) has a history of helping minorities, and Sanders (supporters) are racists that care more about feee college than helping minorities. Of course that was all bullshit and Clinton supporters were way worse on race issues, but the damage was already done.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:37
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Squashing Machine posted:gently caress, I'm still here. I tied the Dylann Roof shooting to two other mass or public shootings, which you decided not to read I guess. I fail to see how saying "a good guy with a gun would've stopped the Dylann Roof massacre" is any different from saying "a good guy with a gun would've stopped the Aurora massacre." The difference is one is something we've routinely derided for the past four years and the other is now just Good Common Sense i'll never stop marveling at how many folks like this dude here who would call themselves progressives continually demonstrate how loving moronic they are by telling poc what they should or shouldn't do it's genuinely incredible
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Nov 10, 2016 21:39
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HorseRenoir posted:it doesn't matter if they come back if the dems get their poo poo together (lol). the trump base is not some sort of paradigm-shifting unstoppable mass of voters, they barely even won the first time They are a paradigm-shifting mass, for the Republican party. They're going to continue to eat the GOP establishment alive in primaries for years to come, as they have for years with the Tea Party, and continue to nominate absolute whackjobs that appeal to nobody outside the base, and were the Democrats even a little bit competent or motivated by an actual ideology they could relay to people we'd be a one-party country nationally.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:41
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icantfindaname posted:The people with power in the party decided Hillary would be the nominee and pressured everyone out of the race except Bernie Maybe leftists could develop some organizations and power structures of their own. Wouldn't it be cool if you had national leaders who were left of the Democratic Party center driving organizing at the state and local level? Imagine how that would change the Democratic Primary!
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Nov 10, 2016 21:40
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:They are a paradigm-shifting mass, for the Republican party. They're going to continue to eat the GOP establishment alive for years to come (as they'd already started to with the Tea Party), and were the Democrats even a little bit competent or motivated by an actual ideology they could relay to people we'd be a one-party country nationally. Interesting.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:41
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Trabisnikof posted:Maybe leftists could develop some organizations and power structures of their own. Wouldn't it be cool if you had national leaders who were left of the Democratic Party center driving organizing at the state and local level? Different driving forces provide different levels of motivational energy.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:43
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