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penus penus penus posted:Decided to check my own valve clearances on my sv650 which was overdue. Went pretty smooth once I figured poo poo out. imo I never use a torque wrench on anything less than 10 ft/lbs, because I had an identical experience with clutch plate bolts that needed 10 ft/lbs.
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Nov 6, 2016 07:32
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grade 7 swiss fuckin cheese maybe, I still can't believe this poo poo happened. I've stripped and broken more bolts on this bike than any other vehicle in my life.
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I have a little baby 1/4" drive torque wrench that measures from 2 to 18 ft-lbs that I use for little fasteners like that where the torque is specified. I can't imagine what would get those bolts jammed in so badly that they stretched and broke coming out. Maybe the DSPO really gorilla'd them down? Like, yeah, OEM Japanese bolts are often made of moon cheese, but usually that only shows up in stripped heads, not bolts breaking apart outright.
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Nov 6, 2016 07:40
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Sagebrush posted:I have a little baby 1/4" drive torque wrench that measures from 2 to 18 ft-lbs that I use for little fasteners like that where the torque is specified. Yup, I got one too, also marked in in-lbs since some of the really low torque bolts use inch-pounds instead of foot pounds. Also, it's a Suzuki, so of course the bolts are cheaper and shitter than other brands, it's par for the brand.
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Nov 6, 2016 08:21
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I really need to stress how I literally could not tell it was happening at all. The reason they twisted where you see is simply because thats where the threads ended in the head. Also never before have I done such severe damage to a bolt ever before without any effect to the receiving threads. I could spin one of them out with my finger! I got the rest out by tapping an eyeglass screwdriver into the twisted mess and forming a slot (while a huge pain in the rear end that took hours, that shouldn't be possible). The force these bolts faced was downright minimal I just can't fathom it, also can't believe they hold spinning camshafts It makes me wonder if they are that soft on purpose but I mean... why? These are pretty standard bolts I may just get some hardware store stuff for this. grade 7 edit:  quote:In the service manual: penus penus penus fucked around with this message at 08:37 on Nov 6, 2016 |
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Nov 6, 2016 08:30
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penus penus penus posted:I really need to stress how I literally could not tell it was happening at all. The reason they twisted where you see is simply because thats where the threads ended in the head. Also never before have I done such severe damage to a bolt ever before without any effect to the receiving threads. I could spin one of them out with my finger! I got the rest out by tapping an eyeglass screwdriver into the twisted mess and forming a slot (while a huge pain in the rear end that took hours, that shouldn't be possible). The force these bolts faced was downright minimal I just can't fathom it, also can't believe they hold spinning camshafts Could it be fatigue damage? I assume camshafts vibrate like a fucker because of the asymmetric load and high speed and if they weren't tightened down enough that would have put a lot of strain on them.
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Nov 6, 2016 08:57
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penus penus penus posted:I really need to stress how I literally could not tell it was happening at all. The reason they twisted where you see is simply because thats where the threads ended in the head. Also never before have I done such severe damage to a bolt ever before without any effect to the receiving threads. I could spin one of them out with my finger! I got the rest out by tapping an eyeglass screwdriver into the twisted mess and forming a slot (while a huge pain in the rear end that took hours, that shouldn't be possible). The force these bolts faced was downright minimal I just can't fathom it, also can't believe they hold spinning camshafts I've always thought they make them soft so you snap one harmlessly instead of stripping the thread in the head because that's The Sensible Thing To Do. How big is the wrench physically? 3/8 is too big I'd say, the click wrenches sort of...lose resolution the more extreme the setting is in proportion to the size of the tool. Alternatively: PO fuckery.
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Nov 6, 2016 09:32
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Slavvy posted:I've always thought they make them soft so you snap one harmlessly instead of stripping the thread in the head because that's The Sensible Thing To Do. Lol I've calmed down a bit. What a ride that was for me. I could understand softer bolts, that would make sense going into an aluminum head. And I was indeed using a 3/8 wrench which I knew was generally inappropriate for the job. But I was being what I thought was almost unnecessarily careful. There was no discernible difference in feel between just barely snugging up then suddenly snapping. From the surviving bolts it seemed pretty clear I was twisting the actual bolt for some time before it snapped, especially the ones that broke trying to simply reverse out of the hole. I'm way better off since I was able to dig out all the broken bits. I was so sure I was poo poo out of luck at first. Thoughts of drilling and extractors not working then drilling for hours burning through bits to helicoil then being off by a degree and throwing the cylinder head in the dumpster were racing through my head for a bit.
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Nov 6, 2016 11:04
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PO put them on with a breaker bar last time is my guess. Good to hear you came out of it unscathed though
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Nov 6, 2016 16:21
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Dirty secret about torque wrenches - they are only really accurate in the middle half of their range with decreasing granularity as you get to the extremes of the range. I'd say the PO probably way over overtorqued them, and then the lack of resolution at that level on the torque wrench popped the bolts, when paired with the threads probably having a little oil on them, increasing the amount of torque on the bolt before it reads torqued. The important thing on cam caps is consistent clamping force, which is why I use a torque wrench on them. Also, you weren't trying to install it with the cam lobes depressing the valves, were you?
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Nov 6, 2016 16:46
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Z3n posted:Dirty secret about torque wrenches - they are only really accurate in the middle half of their range with decreasing granularity as you get to the extremes of the range. I'd say the PO probably way over overtorqued them, and then the lack of resolution at that level on the torque wrench popped the bolts, when paired with the threads probably having a little oil on them, increasing the amount of torque on the bolt before it reads torqued. I wasn't looking out for that at all  but the cylinder should have been top dead center
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Nov 6, 2016 17:05
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Z3n posted:
This. Use a torque wrench next time. You'll thank yourself in peace-of-mind.
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Nov 6, 2016 17:29
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 New footpegs! gently caress everyone who thought I was exaggerating when I said they were hilariously small and one of the first things I'd fix.
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Nov 6, 2016 17:43
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cursedshitbox posted:This. I did, thats what broke them. Now I'm afraid. I just remembered they make those lovely beam ones that would probably handle low torque well enough for me though
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Nov 6, 2016 18:12
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Z3n posted:Dirty secret about torque wrenches - they are only really accurate in the middle half of their range with decreasing granularity as you get to the extremes of the range. This can be said for gauges or any other calibrated tool as well. I think there's a MIL or ASME standard out there that defines it, but I usually hear middle two thirds.
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Nov 6, 2016 18:37
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N is for Nipples posted:
Whoa! That's not a footpeg, it's an MP5 charging handle. How do your feet even stay on the pegs in bumpy conditions when it's that small?!
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Nov 6, 2016 18:38
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Coydog posted:Whoa! That's not a footpeg, it's an MP5 charging handle. How do your feet even stay on the pegs in bumpy conditions when it's that small?! My point exactly. Even on flat ground it was hard to find a comfortable, stable position for my feet, but now I might as well have Harley floorboards. It helps a lot with making this little bike feel like less of a toy.
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Nov 6, 2016 22:16
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Sorry to continue my bitching but after finding some hardware store temporary cam journal bolts (which are actually stronger than even the theoretical markings on the factory ones) I moved the crank a tiny bit to move the lobe of a valve and the chain got caught deep in the engine and yanked my camshaft out of its grooves, dropping the chain and wrecking all my timing. So I got to learn how to do another thing today.
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Nov 6, 2016 23:26
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Well man, this is how a lot of us learned how to do this stuff.
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Nov 7, 2016 00:48
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Truth. It learns you pretty quick, plus helps you understand some of those weird unexplained directions in the Haynes manual. But yeah, your situation sucks and I don't envy it, peenus^3.
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Nov 7, 2016 01:56
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I will say I was pleasantly surprised at the process and intricate markings and multiple ways to verify it before turning on. It started right up. For like 20 seconds then ran out of gas. I guess I didn't consider my gas evaporating being disconnected for 2 days (? I thought it didnt but I never actually checked if there was a valve or whatever)
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Nov 7, 2016 02:11
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penus penus penus posted:Sorry to continue my bitching but after finding some hardware store temporary cam journal bolts (which are actually stronger than even the theoretical markings on the factory ones) I moved the crank a tiny bit to move the lobe of a valve and the chain got caught deep in the engine and yanked my camshaft out of its grooves, dropping the chain and wrecking all my timing. So I got to learn how to do another thing today. Uh, you shouldn't have to move the crank at all while the cams are out. One cylinder at a time, my man. Do you have a factory repair manual?
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Nov 7, 2016 08:33
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Z3n posted:Uh, you shouldn't have to move the crank at all while the cams are out. One cylinder at a time, my man. Yeah after my little fiasco the cam was in correctly just without the cam journal on. I was so paranoid about stripping my head or new bolts I wanted to make sure the lobe wasn't going to put pressure on it when I screwed it down. Just moving it a tiny bit was a biiig mistake lol, I should have been holding the chain of course since the tensioner was still out I certainly have the service manual now, was excellent for getting the cam timing correct
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Nov 7, 2016 16:57
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On a whim I looked at the sag on my VFR. 65mm sag in the front, nearly 80 in the back. I adjusted it best I could with the preload adjusters and got the back to where it needs to be and the front to 42mm. Holy poo poo, it's like I got a new suspension upgrade. Ride is a lot smoother now, I must have been bottoming out all the time! Moral of the story: check your sag people!
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Nov 8, 2016 10:44
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Yeah suspension and tire pressure are pretty important to get in the ballpark. The uly will go from wobbly and scary to on-rails with just a couple PSI difference in tire pressure.
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Nov 8, 2016 17:40
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 Got it back today after an $800 vacation at a shop across town. So I tore it apart to hook up the battery tender plug and wire in heated grips and I'm happy with them.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:20
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Replaced the clutch. The old discs were definitely starting to smooth out, so this one ought to fix the issue I was having with slippage in high gear and full throttle. I split the difference for the springs and put in two old street ones and two new racing ones. However, I haven't tested it yet, because when I was putting the oil drain bolt back in, I somehow managed to get my torque wrench jammed in a way that I couldn't remove it from the bike.  The wrench needed to turn forwards about an eighth-turn in order to get clearance around a water hose, but the drain bolt was already tightened so I couldn't go forwards, and my wrench doesn't allow you to switch the ratchet direction because why would you ever need to torque something in reverse? So I ended up having to take off the loving water pump to get the wrench back out, losing a quart of coolant in the process, and by the time I dealt with all that it was already dark so I decided to finish the rest of the stuff (clean the bike, adjust the chain, put the exhaust back on) tomorrow. Anyway, the clutch went in smoothly and I am looking forward to steam-cleaning everything tomorrow and going out for a ride.
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Nov 12, 2016 03:24
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New tires on the Street Triple, Dunlop Q3's. I was still running on the OEM nearly 8 year old tires. They had a bit of tread left, but were definitely getting squared off. Feels so nice now, effortlessly drops into turns.
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Nov 13, 2016 00:46
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Moved the needle clip one slot down. Like night and day, huge difference. Lean surging at part throttle - gone. Peculiar response going on-off-on-off throttle - gone. And now it spins up mid-corner again! Who'd have thought the internet was right for once about a bike being too lean from factory.
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Nov 13, 2016 02:51
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New clutch is so good  The slipping at high power, high gear is gone, which was the goal so that's awesome. But also the shifting is now much smoother and more precise, neutral is just a toe-tap away, acceleration from a stop is quicker and less jerky, the throttle feels more responsive, and I think even the transition between throttle and engine-braking has softened out. What a bunch of changes -- it's like it's new again. The pull is significantly stiffer, though, so I think the next thing in my future is an adjustable lever 
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Nov 13, 2016 03:16
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Sagebrush posted:New clutch is so good Did you replace the springs with non-oem springs?
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Nov 13, 2016 07:54
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Two old, two new, as recommended by JD Hord, who is probably the world expert on Hawk GTs I like the much more snappy positive engagement that it has now, just that the lever position has never been all that good (you have to really reach for it) and with the increased force it's a strain on my hand. Engagement is in the first quarter of the travel, so I could put a bunch of slack in the cable so it engages closer to the grip, but I don't like the sloppy feeling that gives. Gonna try an adjustable lever and see how that turns out.
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Nov 13, 2016 08:05
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Did my 6,000 mile valve check on the 701sm and one of my intake valves is tight. Does anyone have an extra 2.50mm shim in a 690 kit I can steal? The valve clearance is at 0.04mm and the tolerance is 0.07mm-0.13mm and the shim in there measures at 2.57mm sooooooo I'm guessing I need a 2.5mm shim to get back within spec, right?
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Nov 18, 2016 21:39
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GriszledMelkaba posted:Did my 6,000 mile valve check on the 701sm and one of my intake valves is tight. Does anyone have an extra 2.50mm shim in a 690 kit I can steal? The valve clearance is at 0.04mm and the tolerance is 0.07mm-0.13mm and the shim in there measures at 2.57mm sooooooo I'm guessing I need a 2.5mm shim to get back within spec, right? Swing by your local motorcycle repair shop and see if they'll trade em out for you. That's what I've always done. Protip: bring beer.
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Nov 18, 2016 21:51
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Dropped it off for its winter nap. Now to clean all my gear and treat all that leather.
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Nov 18, 2016 23:51
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Took it on what is probably my last ride home via the best commute ever. My office is moving from a little burb that I can get to completely on twisty back roads to an office in Milwaukee that I'll have to slab it to every day. Also it was drat near 70 today and is supposed to be in the 30's tomorrow. RIP best commute. I'll be taking the highway into Milwaukee when the riding season comes around again  
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Nov 19, 2016 02:12
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gazed longingly at it in the garage after I got back from a flight from SFO. I missed weather in the 70s here while I was gone, and it's supposed to be rain/sleet/bullshit and highs in the 40s this weekend. I hate the midwest so loving much
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Nov 19, 2016 02:44
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Argued with my wife over where to store the bike for the winter. I wanted to put it in the kitchen, she said to put it in an unused shed. We compromised and it's going in the corner of the living room. I really don't want to leave it where the mice can get to it. I also washed it up really nice and cleaned the chain.
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Nov 19, 2016 03:53
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Took it on what is probably my last ride home via the best commute ever. My office is moving from a little burb that I can get to completely on twisty back roads to an office in Milwaukee that I'll have to slab it to every day.  this is genuinely the saddest thing I've read in CA this month. A good, enjoyable commute is one of those little blessings that can really change your entire day, and therefore life. I sincerely hope you find a path to your new place of business that helps you keep a clear mind and light heart.rdb posted:Argued with my wife over where to store the bike for the winter. I wanted to put it in the kitchen, she said to put it in an unused shed. We compromised and it's going in the corner of the living room. I really don't want to leave it where the mice can get to it. I also washed it up really nice and cleaned the chain. Artwork and a conversation piece. Really it's just like an extra large coffee table book.
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Nov 19, 2016 05:07
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Jim Silly-Balls posted:Took it on what is probably my last ride home via the best commute ever. My office is moving from a little burb that I can get to completely on twisty back roads to an office in Milwaukee that I'll have to slab it to every day. Buy an S1000XR and enjoy your freeway riding!
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Nov 19, 2016 18:46
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rdb posted:Argued with my wife over where to store the bike for the winter. I wanted to put it in the kitchen, she said to put it in an unused shed. We compromised and it's going in the corner of the living room. I really don't want to leave it where the mice can get to it. I also washed it up really nice and cleaned the chain. Mice are, like, the number one enemy of bikes. I'm glad you got her out of a bad situation!
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Nov 20, 2016 12:06
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