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BarbarianElephant posted:This is very nicely written. You could probably interest online left magazines in this article (expanded a bit) and it would be better than having it lost in page 497 of a thread on a forum of no particular significance. Seconded, that was very good stuff
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Nov 14, 2016 21:50
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BarbarianElephant posted:This is very nicely written. You could probably interest online left magazines in this article (expanded a bit) and it would be better than having it lost in page 497 of a thread on a forum of no particular significance. I agree, I think you're actually probably the best poster in the thread, Toph. Edit: pretty good for a blind girl
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Nov 14, 2016 21:51
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Majorian posted:It's the lowest total of any major party candidate since 2004 actually, op. Too bad that doesn't mean poo poo, huh? Sorry I just can't get over how monumentally pathetic the "looks like TRUMP voters are the real losers here!!" line is. But I get it - it's easier than facing up to the people Clinton supporters let down. "Sure, the climate will be destroyed along with labor and gays, but TRUMP voters are the real losers!" - Sad, pathetic idiot Radbot fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 21:51
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Covok posted:If we get into another war, I don't think our national debt can handle that. Will the man with 11 bankruptices declare bankruptcy on our nation? As long as you recognize that part of you is sick, it's okay that it's there. I'm sure a lot of people feel that way on some level. "I loving TOLD YOU SO!" would be satisfying if the thing you were right about wasn't the potential ruination of the free world.
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Nov 14, 2016 21:52
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Radbot posted:Too bad that doesn't mean poo poo, huh? I mean, it kind of disproves the argument that Trump somehow managed to attract a large number of Democratic voters. Radbot posted:If you thought that, you're just as dumb and misinformed as you were on November 7th. They know poo poo's not getting better, they just want to take you down with them. If that's what they're gunning for, they're actually the dumb and misinformed ones. Smug, effete left-wingers like me aren't the ones who are going to be hurt under a Trump administration, hate to tell you. Poor rural whites are going to suffer pretty badly, though. So, gg poor rural white Trump voters!  quote:"Sure, the climate will be destroyed along with labor and gays, but TRUMP voters are the real losers!" - Sad, pathetic idiot Oh, I'm sad about the climate, labor, gays, people of color, etc, definitely. But if middle/upper-class white liberals are who the Trump supporters were aiming at, they managed to hit pretty much every group that WASN'T middle/upper-class white liberals. But hey, keep telling yourself that Trump supporters didn't just blow themselves up. Majorian fucked around with this message at 21:58 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 21:55
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Majorian posted:It's the lowest total of any major party candidate since 2004 actually, op. Good thing Clinton didn't lose to the least popular candidate ever. Boy, the amount of egg on her face if she did.
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Nov 14, 2016 21:56
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Business Gorillas posted:This is a very interesting take after the DNC ignored a populist upswelling and instead of capitalizing on it, began to demonize the disenfranchised and send them running into the arms of a right wing ideologue who was more than happy to blame their economic problems on otherized groups. Am I missing your point here? Someone posted a newspaper clipping in which the establishment parties of Weimar Germany decided to tolerate the Nazis as an example of what not to do in that circumstance. I agree that it's a useful example not to repeat. I'm not sure how that's a defense of the DNC.
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Nov 14, 2016 21:56
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Business Gorillas posted:Good thing Clinton didn't lose to the least popular candidate ever. Boy, the amount of egg on her face if she did. You'll note that I've acknowledged she was a terrible candidate. Also, abolish the electoral college.
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Nov 14, 2016 21:57
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menino posted:Absolutely. Give them dignity (listen to what they're saying) and give them a figure who took that dignity from them (motivation to do something about what they just said). The liberal narrative of victims without victimizers is, hopefully, DOA for the Democrats going forward. I firmly believe that talking about the "billionaire class"/"ruling class" was 100% right on for Bernie (there are something like 500 billionaires in the US, they are not that powerful but make for a good story) While I'd very much like it to happen it's going to take a very, very different kind of national political party than the DNC (or GOP) to cast the villains as the selfsame capitalists who sign their campaign checks. The class-blind mainstream Democratic social narrative was entirely constructed to account for the subjugation of poor minorities and promise them a better day in a way that let the millionaires running the party and the courtiers glomming onto them avoid an uncomfortable discussion that'd pit their voter base against their own clique and a wave of popular dislike and distrust is going to prompt them to double down on that ideology, not abandon it for intersectional socialism and convert their Georgetown apartments into homeless shelters. A Wizard of Goatse fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 21:58
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DAD LOST MY IPOD posted:John Bolton as SoS so be prepared for us to pull out of the UN/actual war with Iran Oh no, my Model UN club. 
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Nov 14, 2016 21:58
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Swan Oat posted:The true answer, now and forever, is full communism. I don't think that. But certainly in ensuring certain ways of thinking are treated as the threats they are. Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Here are the Republicans that opposed his nomination: Yeah this is also a reason the DNC should spend money on forcing both of them from power. The vote like R 95% of the time? They are enemies to be flushed out of power. Crowsbeak fucked around with this message at 22:02 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 22:00
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:While I'd very much like it to happen it's going to take a very, very different kind of national political party than the DNC (or GOP) to cast the villains as the selfsame capitalists who sign their campaign checks. The class-blind mainstream Democratic social narrative was entirely constructed to account for the subjugation of poor minorities and promise them a better day in a way that let the millionaires running the party and the courtiers glomming onto them avoid an uncomfortable discussion that'd pit their voter base against their own clique, that people don't like or trust them is going to push them to double down on that kind of ideology not abandon it for intersectional socialism. Fo sho. Bernie showed you can get $200mil + from small donors. Not sure what normal pull is for Dems in off cycles but if Our Revolution can keep that going, would be good to see.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:01
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menino posted:Fo sho. Bernie showed you can get $200mil + from small donors. Not sure what normal pull is for Dems in off cycles but if Our Revolution can keep that going, would be good to see. I think Our Revolution probably needs an overhaul and relaunch before it gets going, unfortunately. It was looking pretty sad in the months before the GE.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:02
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So basically it seems like not burning bridges is the way to go. Take a stop at a rural place in the midwest, big city in newyork. little place in the desert, then los angeles. minot, then seattle.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:03
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Flip Yr Wig posted:Am I missing your point here? Someone posted a newspaper clipping in which the establishment parties of Weimar Germany decided to tolerate the Nazis as an example of what not to do in that circumstance. I agree that it's a useful example not to repeat. I'm not sure how that's a defense of the DNC. The post in question was talking about internalizing the lessons of fascism. The lessons of fascism definitely aren't "laugh off/ignore the right wing idealouge and demonize his supporters".
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Nov 14, 2016 22:03
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Majorian posted:If that's what they're gunning for, they're actually the dumb and misinformed ones. Smug, effete left-wingers like me aren't the ones who are going to be hurt under a Trump administration, hate to tell you. Poor rural whites are going to suffer pretty badly, though. Good, glad to hear that smug, effete liberals (you're not a "left winger") don't like gay marriage, abortion rights, or climate change regulation and that you won't be hurt by changes to any of that. Because they're coming - have fun! Luckily liberal strongholds aren't the ones that will be going underwater first, oh wait, they are. Majorian posted:I think Our Revolution probably needs an overhaul and relaunch before it gets going, unfortunately. It was looking pretty sad in the months before the GE. Gee, I wonder why that might be. Now why weren't Bernie supports all-in with the DNC, when they saw the writing on the wall? Radbot fucked around with this message at 22:06 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 22:03
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mango sentinel posted:Do you think Trump will wait for open revolt from his base to start a war with Iran or will he just do it right out the gate? So I'm at the point where top military brass are the people I think are most likely to save us from this poo poo. If they can straight up tell Clinton no gays in the military, you think they would be able to tell Trump no bombing a well equipped foe with the means to seriously retaliate while we are undermanned and over stretched.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:05
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Majorian posted:I think Our Revolution probably needs an overhaul and relaunch before it gets going, unfortunately. It was looking pretty sad in the months before the GE. I wonder if we shouldn't consolidate OFA and OR. I don't know enough about organizations to know if a single big one is more effective than multiple medium to smaller ones though. Maybe they could specialize in certain demos/areas.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:06
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menino posted:Fo sho. Bernie showed you can get $200mil + from small donors. Not sure what normal pull is for Dems in off cycles but if Our Revolution can keep that going, would be good to see. Yeah, and we're definitely lucky to be in an era when grassroots movements with small budgets can reach out to people all over the country crowdfunding and organizing without having to pay off mass-media gatekeepers (Unless President Trump rolls back net neutrality and all online speech must be approved by Verizon)
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Nov 14, 2016 22:07
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The only certain thing is that you should keep the stench of Democratic analytics/GOTV/establishment well away from any strategy you'd like to consider successful.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:07
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Ugh, as far as I can tell from my social media the Democratic pundit consensus has determined that "economic issues" ONLY means poor white people and apparently poor POC don't exist. Let's all ignore how when working class white people get screwed because of bad policies, working class POC usually suffer even more (because their monetary resources are more fragile to begin with, and their jobs are more likely to be the first cut). If the only thing that comes out of this election is the idea that economic issues and racial issues are inherently opposed and you have to pick a side, then there really is no hope of getting the GOP out in 2020, let alone the 2018 midterms.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:07
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Radbot posted:Good, glad to hear that smug, effete liberals (you're not a "left winger") don't like gay marriage, abortion rights, or climate change regulation and that you won't be hurt by changes to any of that. Because they're coming - have fun! Luckily liberal strongholds aren't the ones that will be going underwater first, oh wait, they are. Bullshit "They saw the writing on the wall". They were sore losers moaning about not getting their way. This is as much their fault as anyone's.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:08
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Radbot posted:Good, glad to hear that smug, effete liberals (you're not a "left winger") don't like gay marriage, abortion rights, or climate change regulation and that you won't be hurt by changes to any of that. Because they're coming - have fun! Luckily liberal strongholds aren't the ones that will be going underwater first, oh wait, they are. "i cant wait for the poor minorities to drown!" screeches the dude hectoring others for being insufficiently leftist
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Nov 14, 2016 22:08
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Radbot posted:The only certain thing is that you should keep the stench of Democratic analytics/GOTV/establishment well away from any strategy you'd like to consider successful. What's the alternative then? Something like Civitas? How far is too far?
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Nov 14, 2016 22:10
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You know what, I think not living in a big city has led to me having more sympathy for the people in my home town. I officially declare that I'm totally a blue dog. Kentuckiana ftw. Honestly there are alot of middleeastern, latin american, african american, and flat out africans in my home town, amongst other folks.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:10
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i wonder how long it will be until secretary of state bolton leads us to The ForeverWar
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Nov 14, 2016 22:11
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FourLeaf posted:Ugh, as far as I can tell from my social media the Democratic pundit consensus has determined that "economic issues" ONLY means poor white people and apparently poor POC don't exist. Let's all ignore how when working class white people get screwed because of bad policies, working class POC usually suffer even more (because their monetary resources are more fragile to begin with, and their jobs are more likely to be the first cut). We all would be incredibly well-served by pushing to replace the "Democratic pundit consensus" with poor POC kids who never went to Yale and have been right on at least two important political issues in the last 20 years. Why anybody would expect Matty Yglesias to be an empathetic or perceptive voice for the downtrodden I'll never understand. A Wizard of Goatse fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Nov 14, 2016 |
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Nov 14, 2016 22:11
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FourLeaf posted:Ugh, as far as I can tell from my social media the Democratic pundit consensus has determined that "economic issues" ONLY means poor white people and apparently poor POC don't exist. Let's all ignore how when working class white people get screwed because of bad policies, working class POC usually suffer even more (because their monetary resources are more fragile to begin with, and their jobs are more likely to be the first cut). The corporate media refuses to acknowledge that economic issues might need to be addressed well I never  Tbh I think the biggest losers in this election are the media. Anyone paying attention knows that they seriously hosed up and everyone else thought they were biased or corporate Rothschild shills. Millenials already know cable news is full of poo poo and the free market will handle them as the boomers die off.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:12
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woke Glenn Beck is one of the weirdest things to come out of this election https://twitter.com/RightWingWatch/status/798250245327044608
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Nov 14, 2016 22:14
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Ogmius815 posted:Bullshit "They saw the writing on the wall". They were sore losers moaning about not getting their way. This is as much their fault as anyone's. Yeah, as long as you don't look at the margin of victory and WHERE it happened, I can see how you want to believe Bernie wouldn't have won. It isn't true, but it is a useful defense mechanism.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:17
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Business Gorillas posted:The corporate media refuses to acknowledge that economic issues might need to be addressed well I never The post-media world isn't doing so hot either- stories are circulating that Facebook had a solution ready to crack down on bullshit stories in the news feed, but hesitated to pull the trigger because it would have disproportionately hit right-wing pages.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:18
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https://twitter.com/sangerkatz/status/798273884797734912
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Nov 14, 2016 22:19
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HorseRenoir posted:woke Glenn Beck is one of the weirdest things to come out of this election I never thought I would see the day when I was on the same side as him. I keep looking for a reason to be optimistic but I can't find one. I guess I will turn out until the bombs start dropping. It won't be long.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:19
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LOL if Rand Paul votes for Guliani or Bolton for Sec State.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:20
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The joke is that the Democrats failed to secure healthcare for vulnerable people because they preferred an unlikable administrator to social democracy
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Nov 14, 2016 22:20
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haveblue posted:The post-media world isn't doing so hot either- stories are circulating that Facebook had a solution ready to crack down on bullshit stories in the news feed, but hesitated to pull the trigger because it would have disproportionately hit right-wing pages. "Reality has a liberal bias," huh?
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Nov 14, 2016 22:20
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mcmagic posted:LOL if Rand Paul votes for Guliani or Bolton for Sec State. As if he has a spine. It's amazing he can walk without one.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:22
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Radbot posted:The joke is that the Democrats failed to secure healthcare for vulnerable people because they preferred an unlikable administrator to social democracy you really take inordinate amounts of glee from the suffering of others, and thats well and truly hosed up
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Nov 14, 2016 22:22
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haveblue posted:The post-media world isn't doing so hot either- stories are circulating that Facebook had a solution ready to crack down on bullshit stories in the news feed, but hesitated to pull the trigger because it would have disproportionately hit right-wing pages. How exactly would it have characterized things like the Podesta emails? Is having a "public position and a private position" bullshit? paranoid randroid posted:you really take inordinate amounts of glee from the suffering of others, and thats well and truly hosed up No, I supported Bernie who wouldn't have lost, like your candidate did. Your candidate losing is going to make a lot of people suffer.
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Nov 14, 2016 22:23
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Radbot posted:No, I supported Bernie who wouldn't have lost, like your candidate did. Your candidate losing is going to make a lot of people suffer. i agree the guy who soundly lost the primary wouldn't have lost the general. wait no, i dont agree, that's pretty stupid actually
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Nov 14, 2016 22:25
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