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vintagepurple posted:Goons hate on it in my experience bc the Clinton campaign latched onto it and bc Hamilton's politics were bad. I assure you, I hate it wholly and entirely because it is wack.
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Nov 15, 2016 03:03
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Tiny Brontosaurus posted:I assure you, I hate it wholly and entirely because it is wack. I get that you think "wack" is a legit criticism because you are a minority but lemme blow your mind so am i and I DISAGREE So do a bunch of black and latinx thinkers and performers with more cred than you
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Nov 15, 2016 03:58
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Actually, they recently found that Brontosaurus is in fact its own species.
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Nov 15, 2016 04:46
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Byzantine posted:Actually, they recently found that Brontosaurus is in fact its own species. Yeah! Racist. 
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Nov 15, 2016 06:05
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Tiny Brontosaurus posted:Yeah! Racist. I hear you like to have race-themed breakdowns in DnD
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Nov 15, 2016 06:08
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Cumslut1895 posted:I hear you like to have race-themed breakdowns in DnD Lol yes let me just defend myself to you, Cumslut1895. Here in the PYF Historical Fun Fact thread.
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Nov 15, 2016 06:15
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Tiny Brontosaurus posted:Lol yes let me just defend myself to you, Cumslut1895. Here in the PYF Historical Fun Fact thread. fun historical fact: Slavery good?!?!? (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 15, 2016 06:28
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Cumslut1895 posted:fun historical fact: Slavery good?!?!? Fun historical fact: Cumslut1895 unfunny.
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Nov 15, 2016 10:22
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Page or so late, but the stuff about Lincoln made me remember a story I'd read about the guy. No idea if it actually happened or not, but he was challenged to a duel, and as the challenged party he had the choice of weapon. Lincoln being pretty huge, he immediately decides the weapon will be sledgehammers, and his would be opponent discovers this and promptly remembers he has a prior appointment in South America.
King Doom has a new favorite as of 20:10 on Nov 15, 2016 |
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Nov 15, 2016 13:42
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Jaramin posted:It also makes Arron Burr out to be a huge piece of poo poo when he was no worse than Hamilton. Actually, the show makes a pretty big point of the fact that Hamilton and Burr were very similar people who had different motivations and thus methods for getting through life: Hamilton was obsessed with rising above the lovely circumstances of his childhood (being the bastard son of a Scotsman and a possibly part-black Huguenot woman in the West Indies and nearly dying more than once, including a hurricane drat near wiping out the town he lived in), while Burr was obsessed with gaining importance and power to live up to his already prominent and wealthy family. Burr was enough of a genius to get into the University of New Jersey at 13 and get a Bachelor of the Arts degree by 16 (he had been rejected after trying to get in at the age of 11), and both he and Hamilton did all of the crazy poo poo they got up to in the American Revolution in their 20s. They divided on the subject of how they actually gained power, with Burr playing both sides when it was preferable; the criticism Hamilton makes in the musical of "Jefferson has beliefs, Burr has none" was an actual thing he said. If anything, the musical actually downplays some of the lovely antics Burr got into. One of the big causes of tension between him and Hamilton is that he set up a private bank in New York City purely to compete with Hamilton's bank (another fun fact: this Manhattan Company merged with Chase National Bank in 1955 and is one of the predecessor companies of JPMorgan Chase), but ostensibly was setting up the company to provide fresh water to the city. He used a clause in the charter to use surplus capital for banking transactions and used most of the money granted to the company to start up the bank, with the water system being crappy and insufficient to prevent deaths during a yellow fever epidemic. Hamilton personally held Burr responsible for the deaths. The fateful duel is portrayed in the musical as being directly after the election of 1800 where Hamilton openly supports Jefferson over Burr for the presidency. In reality, the letter published in the news that resulted in Burr getting pissed was a response to Burr trying to run for governor of New York while still Vice President (not technically illegal since the end of his term was coming up, but still a bit of an obvious power grab). After he ended his Vice Presidency, he almost immediately got into trouble again when he started trying to set up a conspiracy to capture some American and/or Mexican land for himself. He stayed just barely on the sidelines enough (in a convenient political time for this kind of thing) that there wasn't any hard evidence to convict him of treason, though it still wrecked what was left of his career. The final straw for acting like a scumbag? The 77-year-old Burr married the 58-year-old Eliza Jumel (whose home, the Morris-Jumel Mansion, is still sitting north of Harlem and can be visited if you're in New York) for her money, and promptly began wasting it on lovely financial speculation. Burr's wasting of Eliza's fortune resulted in them separating after only 4 months, and Burr died as the papers were on their way to be served to him. The musical at least dignifies Burr by letting his story end with Hamilton's murder. If they had done what they did with the other characters and detailed their lives and deaths afterward, you'd have been sitting there for a minute or two while they listed the downward spiral Burr put himself into.
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Nov 15, 2016 14:38
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While the term "Little Englander" is today used to denote people with English nationalist or even xenophobic tendencies, it originated in reference to 19th century advocates of free trade and subsequently became applied to members of the British Liberal Party opposed to imperialist adventurism in general and the Second Boer War in particular. Which is probably pretty ironic in a way. There's plenty of references in biographies (for instance, in the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography) to how David Lloyd George (variously President of the Board of Trade, Chancellor of the Exchequer and finally Prime Minister between 1906 and 1922) was not convinced by British imperialism "but he was not a Little Englander", which no doubt looks rather contradictory to modern readers.
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Nov 15, 2016 22:44
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chitoryu12 posted:
It also sort of portrayed him as being regretful for the murder, when historically he was reportedly considered unsettlingly cool with it (to the point his contemporaries noticed). Work of fiction and artistic licence and all that but the play is very kind to Burr
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Nov 16, 2016 03:00
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CoolCab posted:It also sort of portrayed him as being regretful for the murder, when historically he was reportedly considered unsettlingly cool with it (to the point his contemporaries noticed). Work of fiction and artistic licence and all that but the play is very kind to Burr "The world was wide enough for Hamilton and me" was a real quote from him, but it came years after the duel.
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Nov 16, 2016 03:02
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The greatest story of dueling is the one surrounding Musashi Miyamoto's lengthy career of engineering his duels to be extremely advantageous to himself. Most notably he liked to always arrive late because he knew that the stress of a potentially fatal duel combined with the annoyance of your opponent that you just didn't give a gently caress enough about a literal life and death situation would cause them to become extremely agitated and sloppy. Japanese style dueling at the time was very different from European dueling. While there were similar aspects (usually fought only till the first hit/first blood) all weapons were considered viable choices. Musashi himself often fought with wooden swords (although the historicity of this is a bit touchy) but it was common for, say, a guy wielding sickles and chains to fight a guy with a quarterstaff. Duels were often used, more often than not, for political motivation. Much of, if not all of, Musashi's history was written by victors or people on his side, and there exists a fair amount of evidence that many of his "duels" were actually assassinations hidden as duels. The idea being that he'd meet someone in a remote place for the duel, he and his students would massacre them and their followers and then say "yeah it was totally a duel and they all tried in turn to beat us and so we totally killed all of them legit". We know that when someone else tried to pull this trick on him, he snuck up on them hours before the duel, murdered them and then fought his way out of their castle, although he probably actually just ran away and there was dramatically less "fighting multiple guys with two swords" going on in reality than in the many dramatizations of that event.
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Nov 16, 2016 18:31
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El Estrago Bonito posted:The greatest story of dueling is the one surrounding Musashi Miyamoto's lengthy career of engineering his duels to be extremely advantageous to himself. Most notably he liked to always arrive late because he knew that the stress of a potentially fatal duel combined with the annoyance of your opponent that you just didn't give a gently caress enough about a literal life and death situation would cause them to become extremely agitated and sloppy. 
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Nov 16, 2016 21:06
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Khazar-khum posted:Uni lecture, sadly enough. But there's enough sly references to 'early arrivals' in letters from the time that it may have been a popular way of preserving the girl's honor. Not his, of course. I'm still working my way through county accounting records from the 1600s. There's a section for fines given for extramarital sex, and I've just noticed a couple of times where "John Doe & his wife, for coming too soon [sic!], paid a fine of ..." It reads to me like they were a bit too eager to start sharing their bed, so there was at least a lower limit on how short the first pregnancy could be.
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Nov 17, 2016 21:00
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nocal posted:There was a recent article about Native American stories of, essentially, a tsunami. These types of stories were presumed false for decades -- just myths. But it turns out that there is evidence that this actually happened, and may happen again, in the Pacific Northwest. There are oral traditions that preserve in the memory of the volcanic eruption that created Crater Lake something like 8000 years ago, with impressive attention to detail. Those guys know what they're talking about, we should probably take them seriously.
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Nov 17, 2016 23:04
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Whether or not that article was The Really Big One from The New Yorker, its a good read.
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Nov 17, 2016 23:08
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Platystemon posted:Whether or not that article was The Really Big One from The New Yorker, its a good read. Appreciate that, no doubt. Multiple Native American oral tradition describing the same thing and it still took connecting everything completely without them before they could be believable. I think we have a huge huge bias about that, most definitely. Anyone not brought up in that way would have a bias against believing things with absolutely no way to check. You'd have to have a very different definition of "ancestor" to trust that what you were being told from them through these stories is the truth and not drunken ramblings like if I did the same with my "ancestors." I never really considered it from this perspective which makes me feel stupid, but at least a little less so now. In the article near the end when talking about how unprepared the area is every example is great at showing our issues with, and especially paying for, planning ahead when it comes to disasters. Except the one where to build a school it needed the community to agree to a homeowner tax increase of $2.16/ $1,000 of property value. It failed by 62%. No poo poo, If I didn't have kids that needed the school, and even if I did, I probably would vote against increasing my taxes on my house by around $500-$1000+. Usually when things like that are being voted on and it's only 2.00 a year per person and people still vote against it I think, c'mon, it's a couple dollars, why not? But here the "per $1,000 of property value" was just stuck on the end. If I'm alive to see that happen, which I think is on par with winning the lottery despite "being overdue," at least I'm on the opposite side of the country. Most of the "best case" preventative steps that could be taken are just impossible to implement even with unlimited money. I'm sure there's a good reason 90% of the gas/electricity comes from that 1 area and you can't just pickup and move around infrastructure like that. The cheapest and safest option seems to be evacuating entire states for something that everyone alive now might not even see. We're just hosed no matter what, I guess aim for highest damage value, or casualties, or displaced residents. Those are the things we're great at figuring out afterward. The science seemed pretty sound for this whole thing, can anyone who knows comment on how this compares with the "way way overdue Yellowstone supervolcano eruption" ? I assume the Yellowstone thing is just playing with numbers and worst case scenarios whereas this is actually possible, or are both things very unlikely?
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Nov 18, 2016 05:42
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we
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Nov 18, 2016 10:11
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Infyrno posted:If I'm alive to see that happen, which I think is on par with winning the lottery despite "being overdue," at least I'm on the opposite side of the country. Most of the "best case" preventative steps that could be taken are just impossible to implement even with unlimited money. I'm sure there's a good reason 90% of the gas/electricity comes from that 1 area and you can't just pickup and move around infrastructure like that. The cheapest and safest option seems to be evacuating entire states for something that everyone alive now might not even see. We're just hosed no matter what, I guess aim for highest damage value, or casualties, or displaced residents. Those are the things we're great at figuring out afterward. The Cascadia subduction zone has ruptured seven times in the last 3,500 years, and it's certainly going to rupture again 'soon'. We can't currently predict whether that 'soon' is going to be tomorrow or 300 years from now, but it will happen. Obviously, the best solution is to go through and retrofit older structures to survive earthquakes and replace structures that can't be retrofitted, but people are going to complain about the amount of money you need to do that. The realistic solution is to upgrade building codes and change zoning laws to meet earthquake standards, then allow the changes to phase in over time. The Cascadia fault has been slipping just nicely, releasing most of the strain buildup with what are called "slow-slip" earthquakes that release as much energy as a 7.5-8 magnitude earthquake, but distributed over a period of months. That's a reassuring sign that an earthquake probably won't be happening soon. The northwest is in a quiet period, and that's the best time to start doing infrastructure overhauls to minimize the death and destruction when the big one comes. Yellowstone is a different story. It's only erupted three times in the last 2 million years, so the people trying to hype it as an impending eruption are basically just squinting at the geologic record and trying to find a pattern. If you look at the hotspot track, there's gaps of 1-2 million years between eruptions, and sometimes there are two caldera centers erupting during the same timeframe. Trying to figure out what Yellowstone is doing from the historical record isn't going to get you very far. Some of the geophysical studies of Yellowstone suggest there's not going to be an eruption anytime soon. There's very little magma underneath the landscape there, certainly nowhere near the volume needed to produce the catastrophic eruptions the public worries about. Sure, the caldera floor rises and falls every now and then, and the hydrothermal features come and go, but that's normal inactive caldera behavior. There are way more realistic disasters than Yellowstone erupting tomorrow.
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Nov 19, 2016 00:23
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chitoryu12 posted:One of the big causes of tension between him and Hamilton is that he set up a private bank in New York City purely to compete with Hamilton's bank (another fun fact: this Manhattan Company merged with Chase National Bank in 1955 and is one of the predecessor companies of JPMorgan Chase) JP Morgan owns the pistols used in the Burr/Hamilton duel.
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Nov 19, 2016 00:32
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Gann Jerrod posted:JP Morgan owns the pistols used in the Burr/Hamilton duel. I didn't know a business could have a horcrux but I guess corporations are people.
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Nov 19, 2016 03:33
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Bobby Digital posted:corporations are people. One of the worst decisions ever made in history. Almost totally absolves everyone who works for and (especially) directs a bad company doing bad things. "Just following orders!" I guess it'd be okay if there was a heavier "you should have known better" clause.
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Nov 19, 2016 03:46
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Powaqoatse posted:One of the worst decisions ever made in history. Almost totally absolves everyone who works for and (especially) directs a bad company doing bad things. "Just following orders!" I guess it'd be okay if there was a heavier "you should have known better" clause. I don't know why they can't imprison or execute (in the case of a capital crime of which many companies are very guilty) a company.
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Nov 19, 2016 03:56
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syscall girl posted:I don't know why they can't imprison or execute (in the case of a capital crime of which many companies are very guilty) a company. I'm not saying I don't like this idea, because I very much do, but what would imprisoning a company entail.
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Nov 19, 2016 03:59
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Tiny Brontosaurus posted:I'm not saying I don't like this idea, because I very much do, but what would imprisoning a company entail. All of the employees go to prison, duh. Sentences are proportionate to your salary.
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Nov 19, 2016 04:03
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Tiny Brontosaurus posted:I'm not saying I don't like this idea, because I very much do, but what would imprisoning a company entail. Shutting it down for a period of time determined by a judge or jury. v0v
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Nov 19, 2016 04:03
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Rutibex posted:All of the employees go to prison, duh. Sentences are proportionate to your salary. Not all CEOs actually draw a salary, some just get stock poo poo. So we gotta keep that in mind when we draft the laws after the revolution. Maybe something like if you have 10 people under you and your corp did a misdemeanor, you do time for 10 misdemeanours. You know what I mean. Multiply it for how many people are under you, ie how many people you made do illegal poo poo. Carthag Tuek has a new favorite as of 04:08 on Nov 19, 2016 |
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Nov 19, 2016 04:05
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If you've read 100 Years of Solitude you'll have heard a bit about how politics in Colombia was deeply divided between the Conservatives and the Liberals, two parties that were founded shortly after Colombian independence in 1849 and eventually became two sides in the Thousand Days' War around the turn of the century. I was speaking to my Colombian grandmother (who is a few years younger than García Márquez) a few years ago and she told me that when she was young the children of the town had to avoid traveling down a certain mountain pass, for there dwelled a family of Liberals who dressed only in red and were confirmed to have devil tails. She's an old woman, and deeply religious, but I was surprised that she would tell this story with such seriousness. It was cool to hear the account and consider how stories like that could have informed Marquez's much-discussed "magical realism".
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Nov 19, 2016 06:43
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Kevin DuBrow posted:If you've read 100 Years of Solitude you'll have heard a bit about how politics in Colombia was deeply divided between the Conservatives and the Liberals, two parties that were founded shortly after Colombian independence in 1849 and eventually became two sides in the Thousand Days' War around the turn of the century. Eyes out though, the Columbian idea of conservatives & liberals is nothing like the North American, or the European. You can't compare labels across countries like that. Also Trump is dirt Anyway I was talking to my good friend last night and he said CUM ON FEEL THE NOIZE
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Nov 19, 2016 06:50
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Tiny Brontosaurus posted:I'm not saying I don't like this idea, because I very much do, but what would imprisoning a company entail. freeze all company assets and operations for a number of years
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Nov 19, 2016 06:58
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Elfgames posted:freeze all company assets and operations for a number of years That's the death penalty for any company. You can't freeze them for years and expect them to survive. So just skip the prison part of the punishment. Bring back the guillotine.
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Nov 19, 2016 07:04
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Revoke the corporate charter. Split up their assets.
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Nov 19, 2016 07:04
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Kevin DuBrow posted:If you've read 100 Years of Solitude you'll have heard a bit about how politics in Colombia was deeply divided between the Conservatives and the Liberals, two parties that were founded shortly after Colombian independence in 1849 and eventually became two sides in the Thousand Days' War around the turn of the century. That's confusing because I just read that book and I'd swear the "Liberals" had them paint the houses blue and the other side wanted them painted red?
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Nov 19, 2016 07:16
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Yes to guillotines if the company does a crime, just shoot anyone above simple managerial level. after a while they probably wont do that anymore you know?
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Nov 19, 2016 07:18
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syscall girl posted:That's confusing because I just read that book and I'd swear the "Liberals" had them paint the houses blue and the other side wanted them painted red? I don't have my copy on hand but I'm pretty sure that the Conservatives favored blue.
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Nov 19, 2016 07:23
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Kevin DuBrow posted:I don't have my copy on hand but I'm pretty sure that the Conservatives favored blue. Yeah the painting blue was apparently was Don Apolinar Moscote's idea and he was a Conservative stooge. Had to look it up.
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Nov 19, 2016 07:47
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why dont we just nuke any country where anything bad happens, thatd solve the problem
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Nov 19, 2016 16:55
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Every great novel has wonderful stories about how they came to be, but since we're talking about Solitude:Marquez posted:...I sat down at the typewriter and began: "Many years later, facing the firing squad, Colonel Aureliano Buendía was to remember that distant afternoon when his father took him to discover ice." I had no idea of the meaning nor the origin of that phrase or where it was leading me. What I know today is that I did not stop writing for a single day for 18 straight months, until I finished the book. While writing the book, Marquez, his wife and two children were very poor. In desperation, they went to pawn their family jewels and the appraiser informed them that they were all made of glass. When it was completed in 1966, Marquez and his wife, heavily in debt to their landlord, finally went to the post office in Mexico City to ship their massive manuscript to the publisher in Buenos Aires. They discovered that they only had enough money to send part of it. In their haste, they accidentally shipped the second half, not realising their mistake until the publisher wrote to him, eager for the first half. Crippling poverty, how romantic  https://www.democracynow.org/2014/4/18/gabriel_garcia_marquez_in_his_own
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Nov 19, 2016 17:40
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