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the best thing about Jill forcing a recount instead of Hillary is that when it inevitably fails to stop Trump, we can finally run Jill Stein out of town with pitchforks and torches instead having yet another Clinton witchhunt
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Nov 23, 2016 20:38
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Quorum posted:
never let a little thing like a third party's total irrelevance to the election outcome get in the way of a good Democratic Nader-sulk
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Nov 23, 2016 20:37
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Also, just lol that more Americans think Trump is more likely to heal racial divides and bring needed change to America than Obama. Basically this: I, Racist - John Metta posted:But here is the irony, here’s the thing that all the angry Black people know, and no calmly debating White people want to admit: The entire discussion of race in America centers around the protection of White feelings.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:38
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SunAndSpring posted:I feel like the Republicans are getting a Trump bump and that'll wear off real soon once they realize they're going to be cutting their paychecks, Medicare, et cetera. But the whole "We love Trump AND Obama" stuff doesn't really surprise me. People like charismatics candidates for change. Of course, Trump is a incestuous freak thief and Obama is just a bland centrist, but they have that image and that works for them. Republicans and Trump are getting a 'wow those crybaby protesters are really loving stupid' bump.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:39
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:never let a little thing like a third party's total irrelevance to the election outcome get in the way of a good Democratic Nader-sulk It didn't swing the election, stop being so defensive of your stupid choices. But it was dumb of Jill Stein to suggest the man currently proposing to burn down the planet was a better choice, and if you disagree with this statement, I'd really like you to say so rather than just being snide.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:40
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Quorum posted:
or shes not actually expecting to get the full amount of money necessary and will pocket what she does get
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Nov 23, 2016 20:40
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paranoid randroid posted:or shes not actually expecting to get the full amount of money necessary and will pocket what she does get tbh this probably comes down to nothing more than a desperate last stab at relevance Quorum posted:It didn't swing the election, stop being so defensive of your stupid choices. But it was dumb of Jill Stein to suggest the man currently proposing to burn down the planet was a better choice, and if you disagree with this statement, I'd really like you to say so rather than just being snide. I voted for Clinton, actually, but I'm starting to seriously regret it.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:41
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paranoid randroid posted:or shes not actually expecting to get the full amount of money necessary and will pocket what she does get Bingo. Learn how to spot a scam, we're in for a lot of them in the next few years. Case in point: smoke and mirrors "infrastructure bill" that mostly consists of tax credits.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:41
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:I voted for Clinton, actually, but I'm starting to seriously regret it.  I am very sorry that making fun of noted useful idiot Jill Stein is causing you to seriously question your electoral decisions, what on earth. What is your position here?If you're hurt that I implied you voted for Stein, then I apologize for implying that, it was wrong of me to do.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:42
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:Also, just lol that more Americans think Trump is more likely to heal racial divides and bring needed change to America than Obama. Some people think not talking about racial issues is the best way to deal with racism.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:43
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Stein is just doing this to remain relevant. Her party is already not doing so hot and with Trump as President they're gonna be completely crushed. Does she even qualify for federal funding with her numbers?
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Nov 23, 2016 20:43
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:tbh this probably comes down to nothing more than a desperate last stab at relevance well naturally, but snagging a couple hundred large certainly aint a bad value add to the whole thing
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Nov 23, 2016 20:44
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:It's actually extremely easy to predict that there will still be humans, and technological innovation, in a hundred years, and on the outside change there aren't it won't be because of climate change; all you have to do to get an analysis that good is spend a couple hours boning up on history or ecology instead of watching anime. ...Are you literally incapable of saying anything non-abrasively?
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Nov 23, 2016 20:45
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Gaunab posted:Some people think not talking about racial issues is the best way to deal with racism. There is about 18% of Americans, according to that poll, that approve of Obama's Job as President, while simultaneously believing that he has made race relations worse AND that Trump will make them better. That is an astonishingly high amount of people who believe that. I could see people who disapprove of Obama thinking he made relations worse, but people who approve of him, but also think that he has purposefully made racism worse and that Trump will end racism is bizarre.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:45
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SSNeoman posted:Stein is just doing this to remain relevant. Her party is already not doing so hot and with Trump as President they're gonna be completely crushed. Does she even qualify for federal funding with her numbers? No, even Johnson doesn't and he was more relevant than any third party candidate in ages (i.e. still not relevant). And yes, this is almost certainly as much about the publicity as anything. But leave me my image of Stein as a keffeh-wearing, naturopathy-preaching Lady Macbeth
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Nov 23, 2016 20:46
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Stein wasnt so much a candidate as she was a meme that got out of hand. not even a particularly good meme; she was losing to the dead gorilla in at least one poll.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:48
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paranoid randroid posted:Stein wasnt so much a candidate as she was a meme that got out of hand. not even a particularly good meme; she was losing to the dead gorilla in at least one poll. Giving Stein the credit she's due, I don't think she ever actually wanted to see Trump as president, and I think she's as horrified as the rest of us at what's going on. Harping on Clinton the way she (and others on the left) did was something she felt she had the luxury of doing in order to pick up visibility and votes solely because Clinton was going to win anyway. That the woman she puffed up as Worse Than Trump actually ended up losing blindsided her as much as it did everyone else. Like everything else in this election it's Brexit writ large.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:49
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paranoid randroid posted:well naturally, but snagging a couple hundred large certainly aint a bad value add to the whole thing Does she have a clause that if they don't raise the two million then people's contribution will be returned?
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Nov 23, 2016 20:50
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theblackw0lf posted:Does she have a clause that if they don't raise the two million then people's contribution will be returned? Is she putting it on Kickstarter?
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Nov 23, 2016 20:50
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Quorum posted:And yes, this is almost certainly as much about the publicity as anything. But leave me my image of Stein as a keffeh-wearing, naturopathy-preaching Lady Macbeth Fair enough, I can get behind this. Go Jill Stein! Real talk: she honestly seems like a pleasant enough person and she has obvious cred in her previous career as a doctor.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:52
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Quorum posted:Giving Stein the credit she's due, I don't think she ever actually wanted to see Trump as president, Bullshit. She openly supported people to vote for Trump in final days literally sat at a table for an RT event with Putin and Flynn. She was 100% committed to sinking Clinton at all costs.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:52
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Would copying Australian's voting system be a good idea in the US? I feel like it might have helped avoid Trump, but it probably could have ended up the same.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:52
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https://jillstein.nationbuilder.com/recount I don't really see a clause but I'm not delving in any further than this.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:54
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SSNeoman posted:Real talk: she honestly seems like a pleasant enough person and she has obvious cred in her previous career as a doctor. Which she pissed away by tiptoeing the antivax stuff. Weird BIAS posted:https://jillstein.nationbuilder.com/recount 2.5mil for a recount? wow.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:54
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MacheteZombie posted:Would copying Australian's voting system be a good idea in the US? I feel like it might have helped avoid Trump, but it probably could have ended up the same. Compulsory preferential voting probably would have saved you from Trump but we still get our fair share of poo poo politicians so maybe just embrace the darkness at this point. e: also voter suppression is impossible under our system. Personally I prefer our mess over yours.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:55
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Au Revoir Shosanna posted:Compulsory preferential voting probably would have saved you from Trump but we still get our fair share of poo poo politicians so maybe just embrace the darkness at this point. I like y'alls preferential voting system as well as the compulsory part.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:56
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MacheteZombie posted:Would copying Australian's voting system be a good idea in the US? I feel like it might have helped avoid Trump, but it probably could have ended up the same. Mandatory voting of that sort has some serious problems, namely that in order for it to function you have to apply fines or penalties, which would hit hardest people who have the hardest time voting. Namely, low-income and minority voters. It's not that it's a terrible idea, but you'd have to couple it with making voting far, far, far easier across the board, and doing that would fix many of the problems with the American system by itself.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:56
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:That is an astonishingly high amount of people who believe that. I could see people who disapprove of Obama thinking he made relations worse, but people who approve of him, but also think that he has purposefully made racism worse and that Trump will end racism is bizarre. "Obama's one of the good ones but having to see a black man president made everyone mad and Trump's going to put every minority into a prison, a camp, or send them back where they came from, leaving America glistening white and free of racism."
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Nov 23, 2016 20:56
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the point is that getting mad at Stein for causing Trump is wrongheaded because Stein is useless in every single way. she was not impactful or meaningful, even compared to Gary Johnson, and her supporters are basically just people who didnt get the memo that saying "Stein 2016" is soooo last year.
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Nov 23, 2016 20:59
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Quorum posted:Mandatory voting of that sort has some serious problems, namely that in order for it to function you have to apply fines or penalties, which would hit hardest people who have the hardest time voting. Namely, low-income and minority voters. It's not that it's a terrible idea, but you'd have to couple it with making voting far, far, far easier across the board, and doing that would fix many of the problems with the American system by itself. This is true. I'm operating under the assumption that an introduction in compulsory voting would be coupled with a bipartisan will to make voting easy and accessible across the board which lol
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Nov 23, 2016 21:00
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Weird BIAS posted:https://jillstein.nationbuilder.com/recount 2.5 million haha holy poo poo
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Nov 23, 2016 21:00
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This speech by Christiane Amanpour is fantastic. A sample. http://edition.cnn.com/2016/11/23/opinions/christiane-amanpour-journalism-in-trump-era/index.html?iid=EL quote:...First, like many people watching where I was overseas, I admit I was shocked by the exceptionally high bar put before one candidate and the exceptionally low bar put before the other candidate.
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Nov 23, 2016 21:04
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Trump fronts the money because he also has second thoughts about being president.
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Nov 23, 2016 21:04
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MacheteZombie posted:Which she pissed away by tiptoeing the antivax stuff. Recounts are horrendously expensive.
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Nov 23, 2016 21:05
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2.5m for a recount cash grab
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Nov 23, 2016 21:05
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How does it cost over $2m? Where does that money go? Are investigations into voter fraud really fronted by the public in the US?
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Nov 23, 2016 21:06
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Au Revoir Shosanna posted:How does it cost over $2m? Where does that money go? Are investigations into voter fraud really fronted by the public in the US? Nah, that's why Stein's asking for the cash. The government pays for the election, but if a candidate demands a recount, they pay for the staff time and resources required to pull off that recount. There may be some cases where this requirement is waived, I'm not clear on the details, but Stein definitely doesn't qualify. This is meant to discourage spurious recounts.
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Nov 23, 2016 21:08
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Trump Jr. Held Secret Talks With Russia Supportersquote:Donald Trump’s eldest son held a private meeting with pro-Russian diplomats, businessmen, and politicians in Paris last month, the Wall Street Journal reported on Wednesday That's normal.
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Nov 23, 2016 21:10
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I know this has probably been gone over numerous times, but does anybody have any suggested reading on the merits of Common Core? A teacher friend of mine says it's terrible because it just teaches you to pass tests, but the Wikipedia info (lol) says the initial results have been positive. The basic idea seems to make sense to me, but that might not mean much as a layman to the educational structure.
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Nov 23, 2016 21:10
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Violator posted:I know this has probably been gone over numerous times, but does anybody have any suggested reading on the merits of Common Core? A teacher friend of mine says it's terrible because it just teaches you to pass tests, but the Wikipedia info (lol) says the initial results have been positive. The basic idea seems to make sense to me, but that might not mean much as a layman to the educational structure. Most if not all states already had test-based standards of learning, which is what your friend is complaining about. Common Core is merely an attempt to ensure those standards meet a common minimum, and imposes no additional tests of its own, to my understanding.
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Nov 23, 2016 21:12
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