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Xenoletum posted:Is the number of aimbots in QP really drat high or did this Widowmaker just straight headshot all six of my teammates in less than six seconds with skill. Probably a smurf account
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Nov 28, 2016 05:06
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Winston shuts down Sombra's abilities pretty hard, but she can do a lot more damage with that little SMG than you would think--in fact, I'm pretty sure that if you had Sombra and Winston stand right in front of each other and start holding M1, Sombra would kill Winston before he could kill her if she was hitting 100% headshots. And of course if she's standing on top of a hacked medkit the healing will all but cancel out Winston's damage, so she's not always as free a kill as you might think.
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Nov 28, 2016 06:19
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i have been running into a lot of smurf accounts this past week as well as one particular tracer i am almost positive was cheating quick play has been notably poo poo in the competitive off season but i keep playing because i like overwatch so much 
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Nov 28, 2016 07:13
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I decided to play Sombra as much as possible tonight, and holy poo poo is she fun. You can very easily fall into this loop where it feels like you're just running around doing nothing, but in the right situations (especially 2nd point defense) she's just a huge pain in the rear end.
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Nov 28, 2016 08:11
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Yeah, its great when you can pick off healers or at least get the attention of some defense heroes. I do wish they'd reduce the cast time on hack a bit, seems super unwieldy right now.
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Nov 28, 2016 08:47
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Lyer posted:Yeah, its great when you can pick off healers or at least get the attention of some defense heroes. I do wish they'd reduce the cast time on hack a bit, seems super unwieldy right now. She can't even hack turrets in normal situations because they'll just shoot her. EMP doesn't affect Symmetra's poo poo either.
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Nov 28, 2016 10:35
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TastyLemonDrops posted:She can't even hack turrets in normal situations because they'll just shoot her. EMP doesn't affect Symmetra's poo poo either. She can hack them with her gun.
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Nov 28, 2016 11:39
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Help Im Alive posted:I mean every online game ever made will probably have a tiny group of people that'll play it until the day they die Someone should do a study on this and the people who still play these games. For arcade-y games like shooters or racing and stuff I can sort of see it because every match is (theoretically) different. But why would someone play an MMO with an active user base of less than like 300 with mechanics and graphics from 17 years ago?
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Nov 28, 2016 12:01
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By using them as glorified chat rooms to keep in touch with friends they made in said game, mostly.
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Nov 28, 2016 12:22
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But there are a million different ways to keep in touch with each other. I'm still friends with people I met in wow 10 years ago, but neither them or I still play the game. I'm guessing you're right but it just seems very bizarre.
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Nov 28, 2016 12:38
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Opposing Farce posted:Winston shuts down Sombra's abilities pretty hard, but she can do a lot more damage with that little SMG than you would think--in fact, I'm pretty sure that if you had Sombra and Winston stand right in front of each other and start holding M1, Sombra would kill Winston before he could kill her if she was hitting 100% headshots. And of course if she's standing on top of a hacked medkit the healing will all but cancel out Winston's damage, so she's not always as free a kill as you might think. winston has 100 armor so it'd be a little close than you might think because sombra's damage would be cut in half until she gets through that portion of his health. tho either way that particular contest isn't impressive because winston has the lowest single target dps in the game you know how people find recon bastion's gun to be trash? well, guess what: sombra and recon bastion have the same dps at 160. they actually share a lot of the same flaws (spread, falloff, and damage). yea, think about that for a sec; sombra can't damage race recon bastion. the big benefit of sombra's gun is the massive clipsize, but that's offset by her bad spread and unimpressive falloff. the spread is the big thing tho because it means her effective range for max damage is actually shorter than the cutoff for her damage falloff, meaning you have to get pretty close. you can compare that to pre buff soldier, who had a similar problem but with twice the range and a slight edge in damage (170/340 dps compared to sombra's 160/320) that bastion comparison is a little harsh (sombra's gun is absolutely better, it reloads faster and can fire 3 times as many shots before it even needs to) but you get the idea
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Nov 28, 2016 13:24
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Sombra is pro-tier anti genji, anti mei material. You want to get a genji so drat tilted that he chases you around in overtime and loses the game? Be Sombra. Just hack that dopey gently caress so he can't reflect anything or do his little dash trick and empty your mag into his shiny metal rear end. Hack Mei and use your teleporter to keep from being frozen.
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Nov 28, 2016 13:44
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Giving an offensive, hit-and-run class such a large clip and low dps seems weird to me. It seems hard to utilize it. I guess making it bursty could make her too similar to Tracer but I dunno. Maybe it should be accurate so she can pick off low-health enemies behind cover?
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Nov 28, 2016 14:00
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the way you play sombra is you hack a health pack, drop your translocator somewhere safe (near the health kit preferably), then invis behind the enemy team and shoot someone. it doesn't matter if you kill them or not, tho obviously it's a nice bonus if you do, because the goal is to charge your ult. when they see you and you don't feel safe anymore you just warp back to your health kit and heal yourself with it. this creates and ult charge loop and lets you get emp up before the other team can manage any defensive ults. another huge benefit is that your team using your hacked health pack also charges your ult, meaning you can get ult charge even if you happen to die they gave her a gun that's ok but not amazing because she can get behind the enemy team and then back to complete safety easier than any other hero. if her gun could do soldier or tracer damage, she'd be the best hero in the game because she could get an easy, free pick on the backline and get a ton of ult charged up, then escape for free. the ult charge thing is key here because an emp loop can snowball in the same way that the nanoboost loop did if you play it right. so long as you kill the other team fast enough that they can't get their ults up, you can freely wipe them 2-3 times off the back of your sombra before they can do much to you. her gun could be a little better but only a little imo. tighten the spread a bit and she'd be really good without being overpowered
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Nov 28, 2016 14:08
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Opposing Farce posted:Winston shuts down Sombra's abilities pretty hard, but she can do a lot more damage with that little SMG than you would think--in fact, I'm pretty sure that if you had Sombra and Winston stand right in front of each other and start holding M1, Sombra would kill Winston before he could kill her if she was hitting 100% headshots. And of course if she's standing on top of a hacked medkit the healing will all but cancel out Winston's damage, so she's not always as free a kill as you might think. Widowaker out duels Winston if he's just walking forward at her and she doesn't scope. Thinking anyone is a free kill with him is dangerous
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Nov 28, 2016 15:00
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Sombra's gun is pretty good. Anything more than a minor buff will make it probably too good considering the rest of her kit. Overall though she seems pretty niche. She's pretty good at solo kills, but in competitive that's not really so useful, so she's really just a walking ult that is situationally very strong in combination with other ults. I agree that a slight spread decrease could be a good solution, or perhaps being able to unload her damage in 2.5s rather than 3.
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Nov 28, 2016 15:27
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Jeza posted:Sombra's gun is pretty good. Anything more than a minor buff will make it probably too good considering the rest of her kit. Overall though she seems pretty niche. She's pretty good at solo kills, but in competitive that's not really so useful, so she's really just a walking ult that is situationally very strong in combination with other ults. I agree that a slight spread decrease could be a good solution, or perhaps being able to unload her damage in 2.5s rather than 3. She's good if you need to take out one particular support, but as you say that's not really a good role for competitive, where you have a whole team working together and not one mercy carrying the whole thing. But in QP she's stupidly good at taking the wind out of the enemy teams sails by taking out their Zenyatta so he can't roll in with Transcendence or their Mei so she can't hit the point with a Blizzard, Ana so she can't Nana, etc. You have to be able to read the enemy team well enough to know they're prepping for an ult push but when you call it right, it's insanely useful. In QP.
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Nov 28, 2016 15:39
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Manatee Cannon posted:they gave her a gun that's ok but not amazing because she can get behind the enemy team and then back to complete safety easier than any other hero. if her gun could do soldier or tracer damage, she'd be the best hero in the game because she could get an easy, free pick on the backline and get a ton of ult charged up, then escape for free. The problem with this line if thinking is that Reaper already does the same thing and does it better. He teleports behind/above the enemy team, eats a healer/tank, then ghosts to safety. His DPS is like 280 before he has to reload. So now the only thing Sombra does better is a situational hack and being able to lockout health kits. If her hack was instant, then she might serve a roll in disabling a key opponent while doing some mild damage. But right now she has the choice of dealing 80-120ish damage against a healer, or disabling their abilities for six seconds and having to teleport away because the enemy team will drop everything they're doing to kill Sombra.
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Nov 28, 2016 15:43
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Thor-Stryker posted:That said, I miss tribes, and it is an honor duel when you run into another Pharah. Air to air phara dueling being a matter of who can land a body shot as a result of her longer air time is pretty great.
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Nov 28, 2016 15:45
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he absolutely does not. effective reaper play is not going behind the other team by yourself. his escape buttons are straight garbage compared to translocator because one makes him a huge, immobile target and the other is just him walking away; you can still follow a reaper using wraithform. what you can't do is follow a sombra that placed a translocator in advance. they play nothing alike
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Nov 28, 2016 15:53
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i think there might be a problem with your game design blizzard if someone can turn 180 degrees and kill me before my hack finishes
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Nov 28, 2016 15:56
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Oxyclean posted:Air to air phara dueling being a matter of who can land a body shot as a result of her longer air time is pretty great. Provided it's safe to my go-to counter to Pharah in QP or comp is switching to Pharah
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Nov 28, 2016 16:27
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Thor-Stryker posted:The problem with this line if thinking is that Reaper already does the same thing and does it better. He teleports behind/above the enemy team, eats a healer/tank, then ghosts to safety. His DPS is like 280 before he has to reload. Wraith Form is absolute garbage compared to Translocator. They don't really play the same at all. Reaper is about waiting for opportune moments to drop in, Sombra is about constantly and aggressively annoying the backline.
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Nov 28, 2016 16:31
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Relin posted:i think there might be a problem with your game design blizzard if someone can turn 180 degrees and kill me before my hack finishes Nah, that's a good thing that's part of what makes Sombra not oppressive, like her bad fire rate. You gotta learn to hack around corners and make sure your team is providing a distraction.
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Nov 28, 2016 16:33
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Hanging out near an enemy Sombra's translocator and picking her off when she tries to tele out is pretty fun.
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Nov 28, 2016 16:50
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It wasn't that long ago that lots of pro players (I mainly remember IDDQD but others as well) talking about how strong Sombra is. I get the feeling the people calling for buffs to the burst damage of the stealth character with one of the best escapes in the game have never played support. If Sombra could burst she'd be an absolute terror to any back liner, as it is she is just a major nuisance with a really good escape and ult which seems... pretty fair really.
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Nov 28, 2016 16:59
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Irony Be My Shield posted:Giving an offensive, hit-and-run class such a large clip and low dps seems weird to me. It seems hard to utilize it. Everything about her kit to me makes it look like popping out of nowhere to take an even 1v1 is a dumb idea. She can set herself up in weird positions to wait for enemies to pick a fight with one of her allies and then add in some sustained fire support and disabled. Finally, if they turn to deal with her, she should be elusive enough to escape.
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Nov 28, 2016 17:07
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Manatee Cannon posted:he absolutely does not. effective reaper play is not going behind the other team by yourself. his escape buttons are straight garbage compared to translocator because one makes him a huge, immobile target and the other is just him walking away; you can still follow a reaper using wraithform. what you can't do is follow a sombra that placed a translocator in advance. they play nothing alike Papercut posted:Wraith Form is absolute garbage compared to Translocator. They don't really play the same at all. Reaper is about waiting for opportune moments to drop in, Sombra is about constantly and aggressively annoying the backline. Would you rather have the guy that could mulch a tank or a healer by himself (sacrificing himself if needed to,) or the Sombra who can be mildly annoying, but never actually kill anyone of skill? I've spent time with her testing out the multiple ways to play. Hacking a health pack and beaconing it to it after harassing the enemy backline is terribly ineffective, and counter-flankers like Mcree and Soldier are incredibly good in dealing with Sombra at higher levels of play. Plus, if you do teleport out, you have a five second cooldown before you can do anything again, wasting valuable time. She's like a prebuffed Ana: really good ult, but her primary skill as offense is subpar to others in her class.
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Nov 28, 2016 17:18
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if they're playing the same game and doing the solo flank to the backlines, I would prefer the sombra because she's better at it but frankly neither hero is what you think they are. you're not focused on getting behind and dealing with the healers with either of them. play genji or tracer if you want to pick the supports off the way you run sombra isn't to get 1-2 kills in the back like a genji would. your role is to charge your ult, then use it to wipe the whole team on your push. she's a pretty niche hero that doesn't have the versatility of a lot of others because she doesn't really hold her own in a fight, but she does excel at breaking a defense. that's why she's great on 2cp; you only need one team wipe to win the first point. sombra's problem begins with the fight after the emp because the other team is forced to save their ults by virtue of not being able to use them and sombra's not doing enough damage to be winning fair fights against most things. that's why she's less useful on koth and at pushing the payload; you need to snowball your emps or else you're just gonna get trashed after using one reaper, on the other hand, should stick near his team. you're either playing with the bulk of your team or trying to get above and behind the enemy team during a push. going off alone is pointless because you're slow (can't chase people down), have bad range (so if someone else sees you before you reach your target you're just hosed and leave your team down a guy), and your escape is only good when you can use it to make it back to your team (not likely if you're in the back trying to harass the healers). reaper should be trying to kill the enemy tanks (which he's not gonna do if he's a billion miles behind enemy lines). kill other poo poo if it's an option but that's not your focus
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Nov 28, 2016 18:04
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Redundant posted:It wasn't that long ago that lots of pro players (I mainly remember IDDQD but others as well) talking about how strong Sombra is. I mostly play support, and so far I feel like any other Offense class going unchecked is way scarier than Sombra is right now. I think the only support that Sombra has a good chance in 1v1 is Ana, and only if Sombra is able to get a hack off before Ana can react with a dart or pissjar. Mercy, Zenyatta, and Symmetra can all fight back just fine, even when hacked (maybe not when EMP'd, but that's a different story), and Lucio's a hard enough target to hit that he'll likely survive the hack window and get away safely. She's not really a 1v1 character anyway, as Manatee Cannon points out. Sombra's main strengths and priorities are:
It'll be a big deal if/when Sombra's hacking through barriers makes it onto the live build.
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Nov 28, 2016 18:11
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A lot of heroes don't burst and need to use high ground, camp, or otherwise ambush to damage race people. Sombra has to use the latter two but is the absolute best at getting them even when the map wouldn't normally allow for that. She can find weak targets with her passive and win the damage race by starting before they can turn around and aim at her and/or simulate fighting them with their cooldowns down/ having missed them all via her hack/ult. In other words, she can force competent players to go against the normal rule of "don't fight unless your cooldowns are up." Of course, some heroes are more screwed than others in these situations, and sometimes they already don't have their cooldowns because Sombra pays attention to that while stealthed. That way she starts the gunning sooner instead of spending the time hacking. The counterplay to this is listening for her decloaking. I think an underrepresented but crucial Sombra tactic is to lay down the mine, camp without stealth and therefore no decloak sound, ambush them with the gun and get them to 50% (sometimes if the target has low health you can hack and get them to half), hit the translocator and stealth at the same time, chase them with speed and stealth and the passive, then finally ambush them again, maybe hack first this time as needed.
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Nov 28, 2016 19:34
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Dudes made Genji's Dragonblade and shuriken. https://youtu.be/IF6iBVGKREo
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Nov 28, 2016 19:52
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novaSphere posted:I mostly play support, and so far I feel like any other Offense class going unchecked is way scarier than Sombra is right now. I think the only support that Sombra has a good chance in 1v1 is Ana, and only if Sombra is able to get a hack off before Ana can react with a dart or pissjar. Mercy, Zenyatta, and Symmetra can all fight back just fine, even when hacked (maybe not when EMP'd, but that's a different story), and Lucio's a hard enough target to hit that he'll likely survive the hack window and get away safely. McCree and Soldier deal big damage but struggle to flank defences. Tracer and Reaper have a worse escape and a tougher time getting close. If Sombra could compete for damage with the others she would destroy supports of even coordinated teams before people could react which is exactly what people moaned about happening when a stealth class was brought up originally.
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Nov 28, 2016 21:07
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Foxhound posted:But there are a million different ways to keep in touch with each other. I'm still friends with people I met in wow 10 years ago, but neither them or I still play the game. I'm guessing you're right but it just seems very bizarre. Ask me about still playing a pre-WOW MMO 3-10 hours a week. Although the answer is "because it's still fun, along with being a chat room."
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Nov 28, 2016 21:22
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Redundant posted:Sombras main strength is that she can't be pinned down easily though, so assuming people are going unchecked isn't really fair. The easier you get into, and out of, dangerous positions the less damage you should do. Tracer doesn't have vertical mobility, but what mobility options she does have are more flexible on-demand, and she does a ton of damage to boot. Genji can go pretty much anywhere he wants, and while he's similar to Sombra in that his main goal is to build ult as quickly as possible, he's plenty lethal all while being difficult to pin down. As a support player, I'm way more afraid of a Tracer or Genji in the backline than I am Sombra, at least so far. I'm way more afraid of a Soldier or McCree that has a clear shot at me. I'm way more afraid of a Reaper during a brawl on a point. It's not like Sombra gets in for exactly free, either. She might have invisibility, but she's constantly emitting audio cues as she uses her abilities, which are fairly easy to pick out and pay attention to. Granted, I'd rather see a buff to her hacking gimmick or other abilities before she gets a straight-up buff to her gun, but she needs a little something. novaSphere fucked around with this message at 21:54 on Nov 28, 2016 |
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Nov 28, 2016 21:51
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On the other hand, hacking sleeping enemies is super satisfying.
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Nov 28, 2016 21:55
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either make hack instant or remove cooldown after hacking thanks blizz
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Nov 28, 2016 21:56
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Hack time is what makes her tolerable to play against as a healer.
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Nov 28, 2016 22:05
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I tried playing Sombra with the recommended tactics. It's a lot of fun when it works. I was rarely dying, but in some of the matches I just felt completely ineffective. Unless an enemy is standing still while sniping, her weapon just doesn't do enough damage. Even starting with a headshot at point blank range I was often having trouble killing people.
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Nov 28, 2016 22:19
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sombra does fine damage if you are good at tracking. enjoyed watching surefour's streams where he played a lot of sombra on defense and ate supports alive, because he has very good aim most people who think she doesn't do enough damage just don't have good enough aim. you should be able to consistently hit an enemy even if they are not standing still with most of your shots, but I think a lot of people are much closer to this guy than they'd like to admit. the 'issue' is if they buff her gun's damage, the people who were already able to get results with her because of their good aim will now find her very powerful. perhaps something like tightening of spread could happen, but it's possibly too early for that as well. idk.
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Nov 28, 2016 22:59
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