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Subjunctive posted:Tesla's initial reliability was iffy, but is that still the case? Anecdata, but none of the ~50 owners who responded to the post internal to FB indicated any issues beyond fit and finish tuning. (Window glass tapping frame when the door was opened quickly, and a little rattle in one door, in my case. They lightly botched the LTE/Ludicrous upgrade, but it was resolved quickly.) Consumer reports has been talking poo poo about even the most recent vehicles. http://www.consumerreports.org/suvs/2016-tesla-model-x-review/ According to the polls on tesla motor club, the rear drive unit failures are becoming less common, there's still some hilarious other stuff that goes wrong. https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/model-x-reset-techniques.69250/
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Nov 29, 2016 19:31
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My only problem with tesla is that everyone give credit to musk for innovation when it's some poor nerd in the engineering office who's actually come up with it. Also stay tuned to the model x rear doors reliability for some big time lols. A friend of a friend was fired over it being a long term impossibility haha.
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Nov 29, 2016 20:13
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Anecdote: Local Tesla owner's club had an article of a taxi driver who has put 260 000 km (162 000 miles) on his 2014 P85 Model S. Non-warranty maintenance bills ~15 k€ (Charger, power steering, rear subframe, three door handles). One drive-unit replacement which was covered by warranty. The Tesla would need to run flawlessly for next 3 years for the fuel savings to offset the repair bills compared to his previous Volvo. In practice the cars are replaced every three years at ~350 000 km. Edit: Fuel is $6/gallon and electricity 10 c/kWh around here. DoLittle fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Nov 29, 2016 |
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Nov 29, 2016 21:41
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Motortrend gave the Bolt their car of the year award, so it at least drives well. GM chassis engineers are drat good.
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Nov 29, 2016 22:14
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Wrar posted:Motortrend gave the Bolt their car of the year award, so it at least drives well. I always thought GM had the favor of the engine/transmission gods as evidenced by the sheer number of annihilated Cavaliers/Cobalts that somehow start every morning and the Great and Revered TH400, Eater of Torque, Shredder of Differentials. As for the chassis gods, I thought they had completely abandoned GM, because, well, every 90's-late 00's car they've ever made. So count me surprised.
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Nov 29, 2016 22:25
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The Sicilian posted:I don't think this is the be all end all metric. Even if GM manages put the keys in a customers hands first, we have to look at the quality and overall production of the vehicle. okay winnner: GM on all counts (i.e. the manufacturer that has been building cars for over a hundred years and doesn't have problems like door handles falling off or you want a rematch?
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Nov 29, 2016 22:27
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Ripoff posted:As for the chassis gods, I thought they had completely abandoned GM, because, well, every 90's-late 00's car they've ever made. So count me surprised. GM sent some acolytes to learn the ways of the Japanese but they got lost and landed in South Korea instead. Still an improvement.
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Nov 29, 2016 22:28
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The Model X is so dumb.
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Nov 29, 2016 22:46
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Sagebrush posted:okay It took GM 90 years to figure it out, and Chrysler's 91 but still hasn't gotten there.
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Nov 29, 2016 22:54
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Sagebrush posted:GM [...] doesn't have problems like door handles falling off Bad example. Door handles breaking are a common problem on GMT800 and GMT900 trucks/SUVs. You know, only their most popular and profitable models, which just use plain old door handles rather than any kind of automated motorized nonsense. I think the pop-out handles and falcon doors are unnecessarily overcomplicated for sure and that has obvious impacts on their reliability, but come on. GM does do fancy handles from time to time too, as seen on the Corvette, and at least one person has died because of those failing.
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Nov 29, 2016 23:16
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Those things appeal to the luxury market and those types of items will always have issues. The Leaf's 2g connection is no longer connecting for me. Supposedly the upgraded 3g unit is coming out in a month or two, though I'm hesitant to get it since it's just a matter of time for the 3g to go the same route. I only ever use it in winter to preheat, which isn't hugely important with how fast the seat/steering heaters work.
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Nov 30, 2016 01:11
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Doesn't preheating help battery too?
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Nov 30, 2016 01:36
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The Leaf battery heats automatically when it is really cold. The alerts I get are typically when it's -15f or more... Alerts that I used to get.
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Nov 30, 2016 01:51
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OPEC is cutting oil production. Prices are forecast to rise. You guys may have picked a good time to get an EV (or a hybrid like mine).
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Nov 30, 2016 16:31
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Preheating in winter is mostly useful because it means you don't have to scrape ice, you just brush the slush off the windscreen.
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Nov 30, 2016 17:01
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MrYenko posted:"Hey cool, maybe I can loot at trading the Volt in on a Bolt lease!" I wonder if the Bolt will be available in Nevada by May when my current lease on a Mazda3 ends. It's in my number one slot, assuming living with an EV with at home charging on 110v only is doable.
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Nov 30, 2016 21:10
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Ciaphas posted:I wonder if the Bolt will be available in Nevada by May when my current lease on a Mazda3 ends. It's in my number one slot, assuming living with an EV with at home charging on 110v only is doable. How long is your commute? I've heard 30-50 miles is a normal overnight charge on 110v. You can also see if there are any fast chargers around which happen to near a place you might do your weekend shopping etc.
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Nov 30, 2016 21:22
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Ciaphas posted:I wonder if the Bolt will be available in Nevada by May when my current lease on a Mazda3 ends. It's in my number one slot, assuming living with an EV with at home charging on 110v only is doable. I lived for months with 110V on a power-hungrier car than the Bolt, with a short commute and weekend errands. I know a lot of people with Leafs who just have 110V, seems to work OK for them.
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Nov 30, 2016 21:24
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My work commute's only ten miles one way, so in theory the numbers check out with room to spare. My only real concern was how much EVs suffer in terms of extra drain from extremely hot weather, and the A/C drain incurred on top of that; 110F+ is pretty normal at peak summer around here. (Last I looked I saw plenty on how cold really screws up LiIon, but didn't see much on high heat.) The car thread in A/T suggested a Volt instead to eliminate the range anxiety problem, but if I'm gonna go electric I kinda wanna go whole hog and I haven't left this city since 2012 so 300+ range isn't a need 
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Nov 30, 2016 21:36
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Three-Phase posted:OPEC is cutting oil production. Prices are forecast to rise. In a really sick and twisted way, I'm happy about this even though the average consumer will be screwed. I was so afraid that perpetually cheap gas would kill the idea of EVs in most Americans' minds, but with expensive gas people will be looking forward to abandoning the pump and saving the planet a bit. That said, I'm driving a gas car now and I'm going to feel the pain in my dick as well, at least until I can find an apartment complex that has outdoor chargers or when I can rent a house. Then it's Bolt/Model III time. 
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Nov 30, 2016 21:57
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Bolt on 110v would be fine for those distances and give you extra range if you suddenly went a few days without charging. Heat will destroy the battery though and I'm not sure what GM is doing for that. I know the Leaf had to get a new kind of battery to handle it and Tesla is water cooled. Being in Nevada, I'm sure you can find a way to get a Bolt from either of the states offering them, unless they strictly won't sell to nonresident.
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Nov 30, 2016 23:35
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The Bolt has active cooling and should handle the heat fine while driving or quick charging. https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/deep-dive-2017-chevrolet-bolt-electric-powertrain/ I'm guessing it'll choke the charging power if the coolant can't keep up, this is as mentioned a weak spot in the Leaf. Active cooling and a/c will steal some range, but not much.
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Nov 30, 2016 23:51
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Ripoff posted:In a really sick and twisted way, I'm happy about this even though the average consumer will be screwed. I was so afraid that perpetually cheap gas would kill the idea of EVs in most Americans' minds, but with expensive gas people will be looking forward to abandoning the pump and saving the planet a bit. It's more complicated than just the price at the gas pump. Remember too that with higher prices that means there could be more production in North America.
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Dec 1, 2016 00:52
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Three-Phase posted:It's more complicated than just the price at the gas pump. Remember too that with higher prices that means there could be more production in North America. North Dakota and Alberta will be happy.
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Dec 1, 2016 01:25
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Edit: Nevermind 
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Dec 1, 2016 02:50
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Phuzun posted:Bolt on 110v would be fine for those distances and give you extra range if you suddenly went a few days without charging. Heat will destroy the battery though and I'm not sure what GM is doing for that. I know the Leaf had to get a new kind of battery to handle it and Tesla is water cooled. Being in Nevada, I'm sure you can find a way to get a Bolt from either of the states offering them, unless they strictly won't sell to nonresident. Ola posted:The Bolt has active cooling and should handle the heat fine while driving or quick charging. https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/deep-dive-2017-chevrolet-bolt-electric-powertrain/ Thanks. The way I live looks like range won't be a problem, and the heat... well, at least it's an apartment with a garage so the poor thing will be charging in probably 95 degree heat rather than 110? v  vStill got a few months to think about it. If I were going to buy I'd consider just flying to wherever in California and driving home (assuming there's a place I can charge on the route), but might get complicated on a lease? I dunno. Guess we'll see if it comes local before May.
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Dec 1, 2016 03:30
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Three-Phase posted:OPEC is cutting oil production. Prices are forecast to rise. Unless gas goes up to like $15 a gallon, the economic argument for electric cars still doesn't work. Get a 1.2L econobox that gets 45mpg on the highway and costs $12,000 brand new. The Bolt and Model 3 are bringing us closer to that point, though.
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Dec 1, 2016 03:35
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Sagebrush posted:Unless gas goes up to like $15 a gallon, the economic argument for electric cars still doesn't work. Get a 1.2L econobox that gets 45mpg on the highway and costs $12,000 brand new.
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Dec 1, 2016 03:48
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Don't care about the mileage or anything like that, I bought the volt because it's quiet, and doesn't rattle like my old Miata. Also the AC works.
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Dec 1, 2016 03:56
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The Sicilian posted:I don't think this is the be all end all metric. Even if GM manages put the keys in a customers hands first, we have to look at the quality and overall production of the vehicle. More likely they'll just not bother trying to produce enough EVs to meaningfully affect demand for gasoline powered cars (Wouldn't want to abandon billions of dollars worth of infrastructure over some silly little thing like protecting the environment, would we?). Bape Culture posted:My only problem with tesla is that everyone give credit to musk for innovation when it's some poor nerd in the engineering office who's actually come up with it. The innovation is in him actually working towards a goal of moving past fossil fuels when most major auto manufacturers have taken the attitude of "Here's your stupid hippie car, now quit whining". Not to mention recognizing that being a billionaire means you can afford to think long-term instead of agonizing over next quarter's profits.
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Dec 1, 2016 04:12
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ilkhan posted:Some of us want ∞ MPG AND acceleration faster than a foot bicycle. gently caress ecoboxes, drive hard. I do too, but not for $40k.
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Dec 1, 2016 06:17
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ilkhan posted:∞ MPG That's one thing I don't like about the volt so far. I drive to/from work on the same charge, so it always says 250+ mpg, which is great but disingenuous. Tell me how many kWh per mile I'm using. Second pet peeve, I switched the units to American, why does it tell me how many kilowatts of power my right foot is using instead of horsepower?
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Dec 1, 2016 13:53
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blugu64 posted:Second pet peeve, I switched the units to American, why does it tell me how many kilowatts of power my right foot is using instead of horsepower? Probably because the battery is measured and marketed in kWh.
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Dec 1, 2016 14:07
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blugu64 posted:That's one thing I don't like about the volt so far. I drive to/from work on the same charge, so it always says 250+ mpg, which is great but disingenuous. Tell me how many kWh per mile I'm using. Do you have a Gen II Volt? If you press the MPG button on the energy usage screen, it will toggle to a display that includes combined MPGe and electric miles and kWh usage.
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Dec 1, 2016 16:06
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Subjunctive posted:Probably because the battery is measured and marketed in kWh. Someone a ton smarter than me will correct me on this, but I'll give it a shot: Horsepower as car guys commonly know it is calculated as a derivative of torque. kW is the voltage and current the car is feeding the motor which is pretty trivial for the motor controller to calculate, but the motor's generated torque is something else. So it'd be weird to see the torque calculated HP while your motor is sucking down 750 amps at 300 volts as it would always look like you're not using a ton of power at low RPMs.
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Dec 1, 2016 17:01
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Ripoff posted:Someone a ton smarter than me will correct me on this, but I'll give it a shot: Horsepower as car guys commonly know it is calculated as a derivative of torque. kW is the voltage and current the car is feeding the motor which is pretty trivial for the motor controller to calculate, but the motor's generated torque is something else. So it'd be weird to see the torque calculated HP while your motor is sucking down 750 amps at 300 volts as it would always look like you're not using a ton of power at low RPMs. You can convert kW to HP by 1.34, which I thought is what they were asking for -- just mapping between unit systems.
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Dec 1, 2016 17:10
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Bought a Sonata plug in hybrid yesterday, here to report that after 1 day the car is still good.
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Dec 1, 2016 17:52
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Godholio posted:I do too, but not for $40k.
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Dec 1, 2016 18:06
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Subjunctive posted:You can convert kW to HP by 1.34, which I thought is what they were asking for -- just mapping between unit systems. Yep, that's what I'd like. Not asking to measure the battery in horsepower hours or anything.
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Dec 1, 2016 18:20
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What units does the US use for electricity in general, if not kW? I thought my bill was in kWh, but not I'm doubting myself.
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Dec 1, 2016 18:38
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