|
Khisanth Magus posted:People like you want to completely alienate 1/4-1/3 of the democrat voters who are moderates and don't want FULL COMMUNISM NOW, but who also don't agree with the GOP. well i mean, at least its better than the republicans, right?
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:20
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 23:01 |
|
|
The Democratic Party are not "Republican-lite", and anyone claiming that at this point is either so insulated from Republican hate that they're functionally blind and deaf, making claims in bad faith, or completely uncaring about people (i.e. minorities) that get hurt by Republican policies. My state's Republican government just passed a hosed-up law that will have women forced to pay for burial and a funeral for an aborted fetus. Shame on you for making this actively harmful false equivalence, and may Trump's horrible policies harm you personally.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:21
|
|
|
I'd like to ask these so-called "moderates" to explain the Grand Bargain
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:22
|
|
|
Dr. Fishopolis posted:Democrats stayed home, Republicans didn't, counties flipped. That shouldn't be surprising and doesn't contradict my point at all. I realize this article doesn't have a overall breakdown of who voted what in those counties but that's what I get for fast linking WaPo. . My point was that it's also possible that the same Obama voters threw in with Trump instead. Whether or not they were D/R/I is to be found in the polling data for the stated counties.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:23
|
|
|
shrike82 posted:I'd like to ask these so-called "moderates" to explain the Grand Bargain something something have to raise the debt ceiling something something compromise something reaching across the aisle
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:26
|
|
|
Its the economy, stupid.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:26
|
|
|
shrike82 posted:I'm late to the party but the fact that we have to relitigate the fact that Obama is a lovely rear end neoliberal president with people like Angry Ed every 20 pages is a sign that the DNC wing hasn't learnt anything. Interesting that you ask because I never defended that and no, it was not a good move, even if it was to avoid the catastrophe of a government default. All it ended up doing was highlighting the point (that Obama sadly didn't learn in time or didn't want to learn) that the Republicans are beyond reasoning with to the point when even if you give them everything they want they'll still complain. But i'm glad you keep calling me neoliberal because it's only proving my point that you're all doomed to repeat your same purity test bullshit rather than convincing people to be more progressive. Hell you're all assuming I'm a neoliberal just because I'm not screaming "YEAH gently caress THE THIRD WAY FULL COMMUNISM NOW" and asking you smug hot-takers to actually present plans rather than let you exist in your bubble of thinking delivering sick burns and saying "neoliberal" a lot is actually doing anything. EDIT: Also the "lovely rear end neoliberal president" is leaving office with a nearly 60% approval rating. Guess you should have smugged harder A lovely Reporter posted:The Democratic Party are not "Republican-lite", and anyone claiming that at this point is either so insulated from Republican hate that they're functionally blind and deaf, making claims in bad faith, or completely uncaring about people (i.e. minorities) that get hurt by Republican policies. My state's Republican government just passed a hosed-up law that will have women forced to pay for burial and a funeral for an aborted fetus. Shame on you for making this actively harmful false equivalence, and may Trump's horrible policies harm you personally. Yeah but see neoliberals 
Angry_Ed fucked around with this message at 23:40 on Nov 30, 2016 |
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:28
|
|
|
Khisanth Magus posted:People like you want to completely alienate 1/4-1/3 of the democrat voters who are moderates and don't want FULL COMMUNISM NOW, but who also don't agree with the GOP. "Moderate voters" don't actually give a poo poo about where any given economic policy lies on the left/right spectrum. They just want more money and more comfort.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:28
|
|
|
Note to the multiple people claiming that turnout was way down versus 2012 and Trump got fewer total votes than Romney: this is not true. The numbers you're looking at were published before all the votes were counted. Heck, all the votes still haven't been counted. Here's the Cook Political Report's popular vote tracker, which is being continually updated. Romney 2012 votes: 60,933,504 Trump 2016 votes: 62,544,722 Obama 2012 votes: 65,915,795 Clinton 2016 votes: 64,917,448 And again, there are still outstanding votes, mostly in California, so both totals (and especially Clinton's) will be a bit higher. Sure, turnout was down in some places, but in others it was up. Clinton got 267,000 more votes in Florida than Obama did in 2012, and still lost. Also, it looks like a lot of the places where Democratic turnout fell the most were majority-black areas in major cities.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:35
|
|
|
yoctoontologist posted:Note to the multiple people claiming that turnout was way down versus 2012 and Trump got fewer total votes than Romney: this is not true. The numbers you're looking at were published before all the votes were counted. Heck, all the votes still haven't been counted. Here's the Cook Political Report's popular vote tracker, which is being continually updated. now factor in population growth and you get low turnout
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:36
|
|
|
Is there a reason why people should care about raw vote count over percentages considering population growth? The electorate grew by 10 million between 2012-2016.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:37
|
|
|
galenanorth posted:I think maybe a slogan like "Back to work" would work for "free college", because it would help lower unemployment in the long-term. It'll counter the "free" soundbite and do the Rove/Trump thing about turning weaknesses into strengths and getting out in front of what your opponent's argument. Wouldn't really work. The number of jobs available for college graduates isn't going to meaningfully change with a higher rate of educational achievement, so selling something this way is a great way to have an incredibly disillusioned voter base and a system that probably won't survive a few elections. Education pretty much has to be sold for its own sake, which is still a very important thing to do. Trying to push college-as-job-training even harder would be a disaster over the long term. Jobs and the economy would really be an altogether separate issue, except for the fact that we currently use degrees as a job applicant filtering method and minorities and other disadvantaged groups (ie, poor people) have lesser/more difficult access to higher education.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:37
|
|
|
yoctoontologist posted:Note to the multiple people claiming that turnout was way down versus 2012 and Trump got fewer total votes than Romney: this is not true. The numbers you're looking at were published before all the votes were counted. Heck, all the votes still haven't been counted. Here's the Cook Political Report's popular vote tracker, which is being continually updated. That's half a million more votes. There are 11 million more Americans now than in 2012.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:40
|
|
|
Just to test the waters here, what are the thoughts on John Hickenlooper running for 2020?
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:41
|
|
|
Condiv posted:now factor in population growth and you get low turnout Adult population grew about 3%, raw votes grew at least 4.4%, so no. Unless I'm doing the population math wrong.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:42
|
|
|
Doccers posted:Just to test the waters here, what are the thoughts on John Hickenlooper running for 2020? Jesus christ no. Hick was a decent mayor and has been an ok governor but he's definitely not someone I want on a national level
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:42
|
|
|
Doccers posted:Just to test the waters here, what are the thoughts on John Hickenlooper running for 2020? depends. can we skip straight to the part where i get to wear a "Don't Blame Me, I Voted For Hickenlooper" shirt?
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:44
|
|
|
A lovely Reporter posted:The Democratic Party are not "Republican-lite", and anyone claiming that at this point is either so insulated from Republican hate that they're functionally blind and deaf, making claims in bad faith, or completely uncaring about people (i.e. minorities) that get hurt by Republican policies. My state's Republican government just passed a hosed-up law that will have women forced to pay for burial and a funeral for an aborted fetus. Shame on you for making this actively harmful false equivalence, and may Trump's horrible policies harm you personally. A lesson that takes 8 years to learn and 7 years to forget
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:44
|
|
|
yoctoontologist posted:Adult population grew about 3%, raw votes grew at least 4.4%, so no. Unless I'm doing the population math wrong. no matter how many times i do the math, the number of dem/republican voters grew by ~0.4%, which is vastly outstripped by that adult population growth of 3%. can i ask how you came to that 4.4% figure?
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:48
|
|
|
Yup, let's blame the voters rather than blame HRC for being a terrible campaign - a sure-fire way of winning in '18/'20.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:49
|
|
|
shrike82 posted:Yup, let's blame the voters rather than blame HRC for being a terrible campaign - a sure-fire way of winning in '18/'20. Nothing anyone posts here will change the outcome of '18 or '20 either way.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:50
|
|
|
shrike82 posted:Yup, let's blame the voters rather than blame HRC for being a terrible campaign - a sure-fire way of winning in '18/'20. Lets run her again. And we'll KEEP running her until America learns. :|
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:51
|
|
|
remember when people were saying "hillary is terrible, i'm going to vote third party!" and all the hillfolk were like "well we don't need you anyway, we have moderate republicans to replace you!" 
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:51
|
|
|
Calibanibal posted:enough of the counterfactuals, its literally and categorically impossible to learn by examining the past and wondering what COULD have been. We need to blindly grope towards the future without ever, ever turning around to look backwards This is pretty accepted within the Democratic Party. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CCh9sk-9l4
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:52
|
|
|
I wonder if Hillary will reach a 3 million vote lead in the popular vote. Jesus Christ that's nuts.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:52
|
|
|
Weirdly, despite how bad it was in the end my county went for a Democrat president for the first time since the mid 60s. Despite zero effort from HRC. Didn't matter though because Maryland.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:53
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:I wonder if Hillary will reach a 3 million vote lead in the popular vote. Jesus Christ that's nuts. Why, that's more than 5 Wyomings!
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:54
|
|
|
Condiv posted:remember when people were saying "hillary is terrible, i'm going to vote third party!" and all the hillfolk were like "well we don't need you anyway, we have moderate republicans to replace you!" Democrats complaining about Hillary after she had won the primary are garbage and helped Trump win.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:55
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:I wonder if Hillary will reach a 3 million vote lead in the popular vote. Jesus Christ that's nuts. Turns out literally every liberal in Wisconsin got the gently caress out
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:56
|
|
|
I complained about her but still voted for her. Trump won because Hillary was a garbage candidate under FBI investigation who ran a lovely campaign full of hubris and complacency.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:57
|
|
|
Sorus posted:Weirdly, despite how bad it was in the end my county went for a Democrat president for the first time since the mid 60s. I wonder if we're seeing the results of increasing exodus from Republican-run states. That's possibly another factor. Sure, more people in the big cities who have fled, but that's just making a blue state bluer, and a red state redder.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:58
|
|
|
Condiv posted:remember when people were saying "hillary is terrible, i'm going to vote third party!" and all the hillfolk were like "well we don't need you anyway, we have moderate republicans to replace you!"
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:57
|
|
|
Someone post the Schumer quote please.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:58
|
|
|
a shameful boehner posted:I complained about her but still voted for her. Trump won because Hillary was a garbage candidate under FBI investigation who ran a lovely campaign full of hubris and complacency. That was kneecapped at the very end by the FBI releasing a letter. Both campaign data teams have cited the last Comey letter as when their numbers started changing in favor of Trump. Sure if she wasn't under investigation that couldn't have happened, but it shouldn't be ignored.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
JeffersonClay posted:Democrats complaining about Hillary after she had won the primary are garbage and helped Trump win. Run a better candidate next time under a party that isn't a piece of poo poo. Hieronymous Alloy posted:Turns out literally every liberal in Wisconsin got the gently caress out It is weird how Red states become stronger the less people they have while fat Blue states get weaker as they gain more.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
JeffersonClay posted:Democrats complaining about Hillary after she had won the primary are garbage and helped Trump win. no i'm p sure hillary did that when she didn't bother to campaign in wisconsin
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
Condiv posted:no matter how many times i do the math, the number of dem/republican voters grew by ~0.4%, which is vastly outstripped by that adult population growth of 3%. can i ask how you came to that 4.4% figure? Because over 7 million people voted for third parties. How about you go look at the numbers instead of doing napkin math and proclaiming victory.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
JeffersonClay posted:Democrats complaining about Hillary after she had won the primary are garbage and helped Trump win. No, I guarantee you this level of entitlement is part of why Clinton lost. This is "complaining about dear leader emboldens our enemies" nonsense.
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
“For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin.” larf
|
|
#
?
Nov 30, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 23:01 |
|
|
Buckwheat Sings posted:It is weird how Red states become stronger the less people they have while fat Blue states get weaker as they gain more. Someone in a think tank is preparing an article about how blue states prove the dangers of
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2016 00:01
|
|