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Pretty intense episode this week. We all knew you couldn't actually do it, Yayaka.
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Dec 1, 2016 18:24
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 This show has to end with Papika coming to understand that she loves Cocona as a distinct person from Mimi. I'm not loving emotionally ready for the other possible outcome here.
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Dec 1, 2016 18:33
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I'm pretty confident it will. The first half was focused on Cocona developing, the second seems to be focused on Papika's development.
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Dec 1, 2016 18:52
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Mokinokaro posted:I'm pretty confident it will. The first half was focused on Cocona developing, the second seems to be focused on Papika's development. ...Yeah, thinking rationally now that I'm not 30 seconds out, that seems to be the easiest path forward for the show. But man, that is 3 episodes in a row where P&C have been super in love only for the stinger to make you wonder whether Papika even knows who Cocona is. I don't know if poor Cocona's heart can take another. 
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Dec 1, 2016 18:59
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at the very least i am glad yayaka is finally going to join the super p&c adventure club https://twitter.com/AkemiVermilion/status/802923284291579904
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Dec 1, 2016 19:16
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I'm starting to worry they spent too much of their creativity on the early episodes. This one was mostly shonen fighting in a literal blank expanse. They weren't even sampling a genre this time. I thought they were going to do space opera from that one scene but nope. Am I the only one who's seeing the plot as actually getting in the way of the good parts of the show? The actual collecting rocks and KKK bits don't really have any tension in them. Hell this is a 12 episode show right? We're 3/4ths through and we still don't know plot motivations for like half the show's cast.
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Dec 1, 2016 19:36
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Pavlov posted:Am I the only one who's seeing the plot as actually getting in the way of the good parts of the show? The actual collecting rocks and KKK bits don't really have any tension in them. Hell this is a 12 episode show right? We're 3/4ths through and we still don't know plot motivations for like half the show's cast. It's reminding of me KLK in that way. The first half was mostly fun, stylized goofy antics and then the plot moved in and derailed the show.
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Dec 1, 2016 19:45
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I'm adoring the character work, so I can't really relate. Cocona's my character of the year and it's not even close. I feel like the show's done a fantastic job of showing us her headspace without ever having her have to give long monologues about her feelings or anything like that - just through imagery and her interactions with people around. That hasn't let up at all since the plot started picking up.
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Dec 1, 2016 19:47
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i don't think they "spent their creativity" on anything, and i don't think they're turning the focus to collecting rocks as much as they're putting it on resolving yayaka and papika's relationships with cocona. the evil organization is really just serving as a vehicle for that stuffMokinokaro posted:It's reminding of me KLK in that way. The first half was mostly fun, stylized goofy antics and then the plot moved in and derailed the show. i see this comparison come up a lot and i can't disagree with it more considering kill la kill's second half was sort of garbage that didn't have much of what made the first half fun, while flip flappers has always had the relationship between papika, cocona and yayaka as a major part of it and it hasn't dropped any of the pure illusion stuff, just made it into more of a driving force for character interaction
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Dec 1, 2016 19:52
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Yeah, this episode was great. Sort of chilling showing the twins' manipulative side, though.
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Dec 1, 2016 19:56
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I'd also say that I don't think the artistry is letting up at all. The broader illusion this ep is a white void, yeah, but I found Cocona's prison as well as her battlefield with Yayaka - with Yayaka and Cocona's happy memories being smashed while Papika and Cocona's happy memories beamed tauntingly down at the spurned Yayaka- to be striking and tragic as gently caress. The void is important to this episodes themes - all fairy tale pretensions have fallen away today, and all we're left with is our heroines' complicated passions and conflicts. Fangz posted:Yeah, this episode was great. It was borderline comical to me. Effective, but comical. "Gee, Cocona, Papika sure doesn't seem to be talking about you much." *Cocona starts crying* *Cut to Papika like a minute of screentime later.* "I LITERALLY LOVE EVERY INCH OF MY PRECIOUS COCONA, I'M COMING TO SAVE YOU MY SWEET!" Spiritus Nox fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Dec 1, 2016 |
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Dec 1, 2016 19:57
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The Colonel posted:i see this comparison come up a lot and i can't disagree with it more considering kill la kill's second half was sort of garbage that didn't have much of what made the first half fun, while flip flappers has always had the relationship between papika, cocona and yayaka as a major part of it and it hasn't dropped any of the pure illusion stuff, just made it into more of a driving force for character interaction It's more that I worry it'll go the same route. Not that it's declined currently.
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Dec 1, 2016 20:04
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Mokinokaro posted:It's more that I worry it'll go the same route. Not that it's declined currently. we have three episodes left, instead of twelve. the only thing to worry about is that they might not be able to spend enough time on plot, imo
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Dec 1, 2016 20:08
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The second half has not, so far, been largely comprised of our main characters getting repeatedly raped by their evil, all-powerful mother. So that's a pretty big advantage over KLK.
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Dec 1, 2016 20:15
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Spiritus Nox posted:The void is important to this episodes themes - all fairy tale pretensions have fallen away today, and all we're left with is our heroines' complicated passions and conflicts. There were also physical walls separating Papika and Cocona for most of the episode, which is I guess emphasizing the whole problem that the stingers have been hinting at and hopefully beginning to answer?
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Dec 1, 2016 20:16
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StandardVC10 posted:There were also physical walls separating Papika and Cocona for most of the episode, which is I guess emphasizing the whole problem that the stingers have been hinting at and hopefully beginning to answer? Don't forget the bars of the window Cocona was watching through. https://twitter.com/B0bduh/status/804395453001375744 https://twitter.com/B0bduh/status/804396163176734724 Darth Walrus posted:The second half has not, so far, been largely comprised of our main characters getting repeatedly raped by their evil, all-powerful mother. So that's a pretty big advantage over KLK. ...Boy, that show got weird after I fell of of it, huh
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Dec 1, 2016 20:16
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Spiritus Nox posted:...Boy, that show got weird after I fell of of it, huh You have no idea. The second half is basically a completely different (and worse) show with the same characters. EDIT: \/ I'm pretty sure that Yayaka is human, though it could be interesting if she is an amorphous and her will is her "flaw" Mokinokaro fucked around with this message at 20:47 on Dec 1, 2016 |
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Dec 1, 2016 20:29
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alright, admittedly i was not expecting yayaka to have been with the coneheads since that young. expecting a reveal that she was the original (imperfect) amorphous baby. aside from papika's description of cocona, this just felt like it was tying up things we'd already seen coming. which would be fine if it was as visually interesting as other episodes, but apart from the crystal prison it was a lot of nothing. hopefully we'll get more focus on awesome looking sequences now that we've got the cards on the table.
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Dec 1, 2016 20:43
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I'm pretty sure the amorphous children are literal robots, judging from toto's head injury. Also the prism reflection fight was so good. brb literally smashing fond childhood memories
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Dec 1, 2016 21:57
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It really feels like Papika's got a fractured memory or some sort of PTSD.
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Dec 1, 2016 23:20
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this show is really good and I find it shocking that anyone can think it's going downhill
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Dec 1, 2016 23:43
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Mokinokaro posted:It really feels like Papika's got a fractured memory or some sort of PTSD. Yeah. Especially since it seems like she has genuinely fallen for Cocona as separate from Mimi. She cites a bunch of reasons in episode 4 why she likes Cocona and is clearly devoted to her in this episode. It's primarily when the gems start resonating that she gets confused. I mentioned this before and I'm more confident about it now - I'm pretty sure there's a deliberate parallel being drawn between Papika's muddled memories and Iro's Aunt's dementia. I think Cocona will ultimately reach Papika by not running away and simply being there to remind Papika who they both are. I bet the reason Yayaka survived this episode at all is so there could be someone who Cocona could talk to and give her the courage to not give up on Papika.
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Dec 2, 2016 00:08
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for an episode ostensibly about strengthening the cocona/papika relationship, i care way more about yayaka/cocona now. guess i've got 3 eps to get over that.
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Dec 2, 2016 01:34
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dogsicle posted:for an episode ostensibly about strengthening the cocona/papika relationship, i care way more about yayaka/cocona now. guess i've got 3 eps to get over that. Hey, polyamory is always an option. They're even coded to each of the three primary colours.
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Dec 2, 2016 01:39
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Darth Walrus posted:Hey, polyamory is always an option. They're even coded to each of the three primary colours. Eh, I doubt it. The way the show emphasized Cocona choosing Papika over Yayaka to escape from the trap, and then lingered on crystals showing C&Y's happy memories getting smashed but not those showing P&C's makes me think that Yayaka isn't coming back from this one as far as Cocona's concerned. Not romantically, anyway.
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Dec 2, 2016 01:42
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Spiritus Nox posted:Yeah. Especially since it seems like she has genuinely fallen for Cocona as separate from Mimi. She cites a bunch of reasons in episode 4 why she likes Cocona and is clearly devoted to her in this episode. It's primarily when the gems start resonating that she gets confused. I can't believe Papika is going to turn out to be the aunt through some contrived time travel gimmick and or pure illusion magic
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Dec 2, 2016 01:48
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Have u ever seen the aunt and Papika in the same scene? Makes u think...
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Dec 2, 2016 01:49
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dogsicle posted:for an episode ostensibly about strengthening the cocona/papika relationship, i care way more about yayaka/cocona now. guess they've got 3 eps to confirm that
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Dec 2, 2016 03:57
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What was up with grandma dragging young Cocona to the hospital for extensive probing? Up until now, I wasn't really getting the same creepy vibes from her as some other people in this thread, but this episode certainly put her in the "probably kinda evil" camp.
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Dec 2, 2016 14:34
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Reddit's thinking she's working for the klan or Salt and the whole meeting with Yayaka was a setup.
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Dec 2, 2016 15:00
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Well, I have found that the older you are, the more likely it is you hold Klan sympathies...
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Dec 2, 2016 15:03
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I'm wondering if Granny might have something to do with Mimi, actually. Although I'm also pretty convinced that the newest Amorphous Child is going to be some incarnation of Mimi. Would seem to fit with the naming scheme we've got going on - Toto, Yuyu, and Mimi vs Cocona, Papika, and Yayaka.
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Dec 2, 2016 15:28
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I was wondering about the hospital too. Though my thought was that Cocona had some sort of history of illness. (For no other reason than that being in the hospital can be a rather alienating experience and Cocona seems like a rather alienated person at the beginning of the show.)
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Dec 2, 2016 16:59
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I would be shocked if the tests they were running on Cocona weren't either A.) putting/growing the amorphous shard in her thigh or B.)the shard was always there and they were running tests to try and analyze it.
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Dec 2, 2016 17:00
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That would make some sense, given that this whole thing apparently goes back further in time than the early episodes made it look.
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Dec 2, 2016 17:03
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Also, they out sent at least half a dozen people to look for her when she was hiding with Yayaka, which doesn't seem like the sort of thing they'd do for a regular girl with a history of normal (non-amorphous-related) illness. And these weren't worried nurses either, these were grim-looking men in lab coats. I wonder if the hospital (and by extension, granny) are working with the clansmen, or against them (and with Salt, perhaps?). On the one hand, they seemed genuinely distraught when Yayaka whisked her away, and given that she's an agent for the clansmen, this would indicate that they weren't in cahoots. On the other hand, granny asking Cocona if she made a new friend kinda smells like her checking if Yayaka's mission as a success.
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Dec 3, 2016 00:41
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The only thing I didn't really like about this episode was how little context we had for exactly why Yayaka would go that far against someone she obviously cared about that much, other than her presumably getting kicked out of an organisation who's goals we don't even know. I guess the episode hinted at her growing up there and maybe not knowing anything else, but it just seemed like her motivations we weak from our perspective.
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Dec 3, 2016 14:27
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Sakurazuka posted:The only thing I didn't really like about this episode was how little context we had for exactly why Yayaka would go that far against someone she obviously cared about that much, other than her presumably getting kicked out of an organisation who's goals we don't even know. She didn't go against Cocona here. She went against Papika. What we saw here was an incredibly repressed person (see also, the Class S episode) letting it all pour out in a torrent of jealous rage and possessiveness.
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Dec 3, 2016 14:34
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It seems strongly suggested that Yayaka is an orphan who has internalized the sense that her value and her place in the world is innately connected to her role in the organisation.
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Dec 3, 2016 14:36
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The coneheads also gave her the mission of "monitoring" Cocona, which is likely to be the entire reason she's stuck with them so long to begin with.
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Dec 3, 2016 16:37
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