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Xarn posted:Add me to the people who bought darkest dungeons because of this LP. The one time I forgot trinkets I was like "Well this is a short easy run, I won't have a problem." I got back to the hamlet and one of my guys had gambled away one of my trinkets I normally always equip 
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Nov 29, 2016 14:45
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dscruffy1 posted:They're fairly weak loot piņatas, assuming you're not low on sanity and will check. You get a unique item when they die and they leave the game instead of going back to the monster pile. They leave the game? Huh. AH is one of those games we break out maybe once every other year when we have an entire evening and feel like reminding ourselves why we don't play this game that often.
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Nov 29, 2016 15:48
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Samovar posted:Oh God, tell me about that. It would really help if the provisions button called up the trinkets screen first. I've noticed a few times that the game will notify me when I don't have any trinkets equipped at all and ask if I really want to continue. I think it only triggers on medium or higher missions though. And possibly only when I have no trinkets on anybody.
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Nov 29, 2016 16:12
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Xarn posted:Add me to the people who bought darkest dungeons because of this LP. I hate it when I forget to reequip skills and go in with either the wrong set or worse only two or three skills.
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Nov 29, 2016 16:20
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You can fix that as long as it's not mid-combat or mid camp though. (OTOH, planning to and forgeting to swap out for a boss leads to... this episode). I have before managed to buy a camping skill I want, usually prevent ambush, and fail to equip it as your fourth camping skill doesn't auto-equip. Which isn't the end of the world, but doesn't help.
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Nov 29, 2016 16:29
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CrazySalamander posted:I hate it when I forget to reequip skills and go in with either the wrong set or worse only two or three skills. Walking into a battle with a Leaper with no attack skills is always fun.
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Nov 29, 2016 16:33
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IMJack posted:IIRC in the Arkham Horror board game by Fantasy Flight (lol ameritrash) the Mi-Go were wimpy trash monsters that dropped useful stuff when you stomped them, so they were the monsters you wanted to pop out of portals. dscruffy1 posted:They're fairly weak loot piņatas, assuming you're not low on sanity and will check. You get a unique item when they die and they leave the game instead of going back to the monster pile. The implication that my group always went with was that they're less loot piņatas and more fellow adventurers that you end up jumping in some back alley somewhere. They're actually sentient scientists that have a bad habit of assuming that just because they don't have a problem with putting their brains in mason jars that other creatures don't mind it either. We haven't played Arkham Horror in forever since I think we accidentally stumbled in to a win condition. Dunwich Horror's interesting because it's one of the few stories where humanity actually ends up winning without the help of cats; but then Lovecraft's author inserts tended towards the nebbish and well-educated. Contrast that with Conan the Barbarian, where Howard (a contemporary of Lovecraft who was part of his writing circle) figured that any eldritch being could be defeated provided you punch it hard enough.
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Nov 29, 2016 16:59
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citybeatnik posted:The implication that my group always went with was that they're less loot piņatas and more fellow adventurers that you end up jumping in some back alley somewhere. They're actually sentient scientists that have a bad habit of assuming that just because they don't have a problem with putting their brains in mason jars that other creatures don't mind it either. Eldritch Horror is a better version of Arkham Horror. More streamlined with every old one needing a different set of conditions met in order to win. I actually modded the game files for this game mostly to cut the grinding down; i leveraged up the stack limits for almost everything. I never felt like the grinding was the hard part, and really do like the game more after changing that stuff, grinding for the sake of it just isnt terribly fun, especially given the quantity of relics needed to upgrade buildings.
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Nov 29, 2016 17:27
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Not sure if you were talking about me, but what I said before is that the line "how many rats will it take to chew through a ton of putrid flesh" is another reference to Rats in the Walls, where a guy rebuilding his ancestral manor digs too deep and finds an ancient city filled with half human, half swine corpses/skeletons, and rats chewing through whatever flesh remained.
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Nov 29, 2016 17:27
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double nine posted:my favorite is forgetting shovels. "Okay, I think I've got everything. Holy water and bandages for curios, food aplenty, two stacks obv, oh poo poo, almost forgot torches. Right, I think that's everything. Let's go!".
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Nov 29, 2016 21:00
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JT Jag posted:I'm pretty sure I'd just abandon the mission the moment I walked up to the first wall and realized I lacked a shovel, presuming it's still early what kind of quitter talk is that??! We'll make it to the end of the mission, drat you, even if it costs the lot of you your sanity! And half of you your lives. (they had unupgraded gear and skills so no money was lost)
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Nov 29, 2016 21:18
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Any views on how good Shadow of the Demon Lord would be for representing Darkest Dungeon.
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Nov 30, 2016 01:48
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Sloober posted:Eldritch Horror is a better version of Arkham Horror. More streamlined with every old one needing a different set of conditions met in order to win. Seconding Eldritch Horror. It still takes forever to play, but its actually fun doing so.
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Nov 30, 2016 02:07
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Why are American style (specifically Ameritrash) board games so bad? Is it the hundreds of pieces? The convoluted rules? The fact that they take eight goddamned hours to play, assuming you have a group of people who are actually familiar with the game and stay on task? Who loving keeps designing them? Who keeps paying for them to be manufactured? As an example of extremes, consider two popular classic war games: Axis & Allies is a frustrating clusterfuck of hundreds of pieces and tech levels and production points and buckets of dice, while Diplomacy barely even has any pieces to move on the board and there are no dice. One of the two is much more exciting than the other to play. I'll let you guess which one that is. I bought Descent, played it twice, and now I just use the minis and tiles for D&D as it's far less complicated to actually run a proper RPG instead of that nightmare. I was hoping for a modern Warhammer Quest with some new ideas and leaner mechanics, but the game was somehow clunkier and less intuitive than an ancient Games Workshop game. I mention Descent and Warhammer Quest as they share quite a bit of DNA with Darkest Dungeon.
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Nov 30, 2016 02:26
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Pvt.Scott posted:Why are American style (specifically Ameritrash) board games so bad? Is it the hundreds of pieces? The convoluted rules? The fact that they take eight goddamned hours to play, assuming you have a group of people who are actually familiar with the game and stay on task? Who loving keeps designing them? Who keeps paying for them to be manufactured? The short answer is American Gaming Culture. The long answer is complicated, and could probably be answered by someone more qualified than I, but could best be described as a whole host of factors, starting with influences and philosophy. Basically, a lot of American gaming owes it's roots to D&D, arguanly the first American gaming invention. Developed by Gary Gygax and contemporaries, D&D started its life as an attempt to emulate historical wargames in a fantasy setting. So immediately, you have a reliance, or at least a fondness, for model pieces, or a significant amount of pieces. Notably, pitched battles in historical wargames use a lot of pieces to represent formations of troops that could never be utilised on the tabletop. Seriously the frontage for 35 men is around 70 inches by scale conversion, so they would use 1 model = 10 men or more, and they would still have a ton of models. As D&D changed, it instead became a method of emulating the fantasy or sci fi adventures of LOTR, or the Lensmen, or any other property. And this is where a lot of suspect rules conventions were created. You'd have to be fairly freeform to allow a character to do many of the things found in fiction, but these ideas were instead codified into the rules. So the idea that rules were built to emulate fiction, that 'the rules followed fluff', became a natural part of the design ideas. During this time, Gary Gygax and pals were pushing D&D as an adversarial game, a tournament where people would compete against other teams and the DM to complete or get as far into a dungeon as they could. So this adversarial style began to become a natural part of game design as well. Then the 1980's happened. And the Satanic Panic that D&D was devil worship caused a number of cultural shifts. One of which was Walmart and other general stores taking board games off the shelves and stocking them with knockoff, easy cashgrab games like mousetrap or monopoly. Snakes and ladders and other games had very little in the way of game mechanics, and with them being the only game in town, you either bought them or didn't play. So board games stagnanted for a time. The rise of kickstarter and other revenue streams has bought board games back into the light. But a lot of designers and creators are still learning from those pre-1980 games. So their rules are naturally written to fit the fluff, and thus ambiguous. There's a reliance on physical objects, and research about tactility that makes adding a bunch of cheap plastic pieces both viable and a 'sound' idea. A lot of these games rely on dice or other randomness to emulate 'chance' withour giving the players the ability to affect or control it very well. And the games are still adversarial. Which is why they take so long. Earlier games were process-based, requiring no input from the players, and as such would eventually reach the end. But a lot of these games would take forever to do so, like monopoly. And when you do give the players a choice, it become binary, since the game is adversarial. Either I'm winning, at which point I want to end the game as fast as possible, or make it harder to lose the lead, or I'm not winning, at which point I want to prolong the game to put myself in the lead. So the game gives you choices, but the objectively best is 'make the game take longer.', which only the leader disagrees with, and then only if they're comfortably winning. If Ameritrash games made finishing the game more attractive, a lot of the other problems would be minimized, or more tolerable. Losing a hand of poker after a minute hurts less than losing an hour+ game. Torchlighter fucked around with this message at 03:42 on Nov 30, 2016 |
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Nov 30, 2016 03:39
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Blame Monopoly for being the board game that defines all American preconceptions of board games? It has a laundry list of everything that's wrong with Amerigames. Dice rolling for randomness; cards with rules text printed on them; a one-player-at-a-time action cycle that usually leaves players unengaged while it's not their turn; victory by elimination with no defined game length. Figure out how to make Monopoly not poo poo by the standards of modern board game design, without messing up its core premise or inherent approachability (and potential for branding) and Hasbro will hand you their wallet. Veering back on topic, what would a Darkest Dungeon board game look like. I'm seeing cooperative dungeon crawling where players have secret agendas in the form of negative quirks.
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Nov 30, 2016 04:19
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IMJack posted:Veering back on topic, what would a Darkest Dungeon board game look like. I'm seeing cooperative dungeon crawling where players have secret agendas in the form of negative quirks. On an aside, I streamed Pathologic recently and apparently for their remake they are making a board game that's competitive co-op. That looks interesting, though it looks to only be in russian right now.
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Nov 30, 2016 04:40
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Pvt.Scott posted:Why are American style (specifically Ameritrash) board games so bad? Is it the hundreds of pieces? The convoluted rules? The fact that they take eight goddamned hours to play, assuming you have a group of people who are actually familiar with the game and stay on task? Who loving keeps designing them? Who keeps paying for them to be manufactured?
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Nov 30, 2016 05:36
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IMJack posted:Blame Monopoly for being the board game that defines all American preconceptions of board games? It has a laundry list of everything that's wrong with Amerigames. Dice rolling for randomness; cards with rules text printed on them; a one-player-at-a-time action cycle that usually leaves players unengaged while it's not their turn; victory by elimination with no defined game length. Which is ironic considering how much of the original point of Monopoly was to make it unpleasant to play.
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Nov 30, 2016 06:02
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Highwang posted:HeroQuest You can't say this without posting this video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cx8sl2uC46A
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Nov 30, 2016 08:52
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IMJack posted:Veering back on topic, what would a Darkest Dungeon board game look like. I'm seeing cooperative dungeon crawling where players have secret agendas in the form of negative quirks. This idea intrigues me. I think you'd have to eliminate the hamlet/campaign aspect and focus on a single dungeon run for brevity's sake, but otherwise it could be fun. Highwang posted:I can see it being like a variant of HeroQuest, though I doubt that'd solve the issues of board games in general. I'm not much of a board game player. What problems would those be? citybeatnik posted:Which is ironic considering how much of the original point of Monopoly was to make it unpleasant to play. Wait... Monopoly is that bad on purpose? That would explain a lot, but... Do you have a source for this? Spudd posted:You can't say this without posting this video The best thing about HeroQuest is probably that video. And I'm not even joking.
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Nov 30, 2016 10:50
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Well, talking about forgetting things before setting off, guess who managed to go after the second form of the Swine Prince and neglected to buy torches? Oh, and who actually tried to NOT do what Highwang did with the Arbelist, but added trinkets which made her as slow as the big guy, meaning that flare couldn't always be used on time? Interestingly, and I don't know if it was a bug, the Prince doesn't always go after marked targets. It appears that sometimes he can obliterate bodies on others when some members are marked.
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Nov 30, 2016 18:37
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Hunt11 posted:Any views on how good Shadow of the Demon Lord would be for representing Darkest Dungeon. Haven't played SotDL, but there's a new RPG called The Nightmares Underneath that looks like it might emulate the Darkest Dungeon experience pretty well.
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Nov 30, 2016 19:19
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Pvt.Scott posted:Why are American style (specifically Ameritrash) board games so bad? Is it the hundreds of pieces? The convoluted rules? The fact that they take eight goddamned hours to play, assuming you have a group of people who are actually familiar with the game and stay on task? Who loving keeps designing them? Who keeps paying for them to be manufactured? Diplomacy and A&A are two different types of games. A&A is more traditionally wargamey, Diplomacy is more of a negotiation game (...diplomacy?). You can enjoy one and completely dislike the other (i dislike both). A&A fits in with miniatures games closer to warhammer. Buckets of dice being pitched. Nowadays euro games are blending theme a great deal more, and ameritrash are incorporating more solid mechanics. As far as Descent goes, Fantasy Flight has released an APP that handles the overseer role for 2e, and its actually pretty good. I assume you're talking 1e, which i have no experience with. 2e itself doesn't really have any extraordinary amount of parts tbh. I've seen far worse, and own far worse. DGM_2 posted:Wait... Monopoly is that bad on purpose? That would explain a lot, but... Do you have a source for this? Read up on The Landlord's Game on wikipedia; it covers the original intent. Much of the problem with modern day Monopoly is from the house rules that people use as real rules (Money from taxes to the pot in the middle of the board, free parking gets it, landing on GO gives 400 or whatever, all are house rules. You are also supposed to auction properties you land on but do not buy, so the board gets eaten up quicker and ends it sooner) DGM_2 posted:The best thing about HeroQuest is probably that video. And I'm not even joking. I actually have a copy of Heroquest and 2 expansions on my board game shelf in the basement; i will probably never play it again (I received it as a child a very long time ago) as really it has poor mechanics and the system is biased towards the heros winning, so the DM (Zargon?) is just there to give them an experience. Also I may be alone here but my heroes in DD don't deserve torches until they've hit at least resolve 3.
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Nov 30, 2016 19:48
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Scribbleykins posted:Haven't played SotDL, but there's a new RPG called The Nightmares Underneath that looks like it might emulate the Darkest Dungeon experience pretty well. Seconding this. Not only is it a mechanically good game, The Nightmares Underneath just feels like it was written as a book made of Ancestor quotes.
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Nov 30, 2016 22:06
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DGM_2 posted:This idea intrigues me. I think you'd have to eliminate the hamlet/campaign aspect and focus on a single dungeon run for brevity's sake, but otherwise it could be fun. Agreed, the meat of a game would be a single run through the dungeon. But once you have a good core game, there might be room for "legacy" style campaigns. My group just finished Pandemic Legacy Season 1, and we had a blast. Similarly with Risk Legacy, though we made some mistakes that kind of marred that experience.
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Nov 30, 2016 22:15
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IMJack posted:Veering back on topic, what would a Darkest Dungeon board game look like. I'm seeing cooperative dungeon crawling where players have secret agendas in the form of negative quirks. The real problem is making sure we retain the experience of carrying all those stacks of food. (And the woes of limited inventory space.) I used to play Warhammer Fantasy RPG so I am numb to most excessive rules.
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Dec 1, 2016 08:06
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Jenner posted:The real problem is making sure we retain the experience of carrying all those stacks of food. (And the woes of limited inventory space.) One player just needs to buy a bunch of $5 pizzas from Little Caesars.
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Dec 1, 2016 08:14
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And not eat them?
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Dec 1, 2016 08:14
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Not a one! They might come in handy later.
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Dec 1, 2016 08:21
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No, no, occasionally you have to roll to see if everyone needs to eat an entire pizza.
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Dec 1, 2016 08:29
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But the target number, die size, and number of dice change each roll.
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Dec 1, 2016 20:16
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I'm gonna make a system where you use the d12 for everything. It's gonna be great.Highwang posted:One player just needs to buy a bunch of $5 pizzas from Little Caesars. Ugh, Little Caesars is just awful. Considering the state of the hamlet when the crew rolls in on the carriage though they're probably lucky if they can get food of that quality.
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Dec 1, 2016 20:35
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Highwang posted:One player just needs to buy a bunch of $5 pizzas from Little Caesars. Too good. To simulate darkest dungeon food you need the pizza that Sbarro throws out for being not fresh enough to sit under a heatlamp for 18 hours a day
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Dec 1, 2016 21:09
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Zikan posted:Too good. Said pizza is then left piled in a cart full of plague infected corpses. Hope you like medicinal herbs as a pizza topping!
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Dec 1, 2016 23:46
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Jenner posted:I'm gonna make a system where you use the d12 for everything. It's gonna be great. Advanced Heroquest has you beat.
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Dec 2, 2016 00:20
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My screenshots didn't take. but I had a run where I had 2 and a ha;f stacks of food. On a short dungeon. So basically a Highwang Run.
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Dec 2, 2016 00:43
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Veloxyll posted:My screenshots didn't take. but I had a run where I had 2 and a ha;f stacks of food. What difficulty level?
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Dec 2, 2016 00:59
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Hunt11 posted:What difficulty level? Entry level stuff. Where the game refuses to give me Lepers or Men At Arms. Or Antiquitarians.
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Dec 2, 2016 02:21
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IMJack posted:Agreed, the meat of a game would be a single run through the dungeon. But once you have a good core game, there might be room for "legacy" style campaigns. I love Pandemic and Risk Legacy, they've really solidified in my mind the potential of legacy based systems for board games. Considering you usually play board games with a small group of friends and slowly develop your own rules and styles for games it feels like an organic evolution to have such games become more common place. Plus its fun to look at a board covered in stickers and fondly think to how you got here. I've seen some people here mention Fantasy Flight. They are one of the kings of convoluted rules for massive games, but they have been getting better at tightening up rules and making their games better. Arkham Horror was nearly unplayable, but they turned it around with Eldritch Horror and made an awesome game. I hope one day they'll release a Twilight Imperium 4, making a stellar space strategy game that doesn't require three weeks, 4 tables and a spread sheet to finish.....and no one gets The Yssaril Tribes 
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Dec 2, 2016 03:37
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