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Sassy Sasquatch
Feb 28, 2013

Nonsense posted:

Hollande announced he is not standing for a second term. Make France Great Again

I love how no one is treating this as news around me or even in the media.

Never thought I'd vote for Mélenchon someday but here we go !

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Baloogan
Dec 5, 2004
Fun Shoe
who does holland not getting in the election give the votes to?

Pinch Me Im Meming
Jun 26, 2005

Baloogan posted:

who does holland not getting in the election give the votes to?

Presumably to the winner of the Socialist Party primaries.

Baloogan
Dec 5, 2004
Fun Shoe

Pinch Me Im Meming posted:

Presumably to the winner of the Socialist Party primaries.

:argh: is this gonna help the thatcherite or the facist?????

Fiction
Apr 28, 2011
Having a credible left wing challenger to the coward rightist who refuses to go full fascist could change the first round result, but it's unlikely with Macron in there scooping up all the useless liberals.

Toplowtech
Aug 31, 2004

Baloogan posted:

:argh: is this gonna help the thatcherite or the facist?????
It depends on who wins. See you are learning how loving frustrating and not predictable French politics is. Next time someone tell "candidate X will win, the polls say so!" you will know it's your loving right to punch him in the face.

Kurtofan
Feb 16, 2011

hon hon hon
who's the favourite to win the primaries anyway

jBrereton
May 30, 2013
Grimey Drawer
The way this poo poo election has gone so far, probably not-really-a-socialist cryptofascist Valls.

Montebourg has a way with words and might be a seen as a solid centre-left alternative to the current candidates rather than Valls, though (who people will just ignore in favour of Fillon, you'd think).

deadgoon
Dec 4, 2014

by FactsAreUseless
if france & germany go to war again are they even gonna bother calling it ww3, does anyone still care about europe

A Buttery Pastry
Sep 4, 2011

Delicious and Informative!
:3:

deadgoon posted:

if france & germany go to war again are they even gonna bother calling it ww3, does anyone still care about europe
France would roll over Germany before anyone realized they were at war.

deadgoon
Dec 4, 2014

by FactsAreUseless
well cool let them conquer the EU and rename it the frankish empire who cares

Pinch Me Im Meming
Jun 26, 2005

deadgoon posted:

well cool let them conquer the EU and rename it the frankish empire who cares

Lots of people do, deadgoon. Jeez.

Entenzahn
Nov 15, 2012

erm... quack-ward
Alexander van der Bellen will be the next Austrian president, defeating right-wing populist Norbert Hofer.

He's projected to receive 53,6% of the vote right now, outside the margin of error. That's up more than 3% from the nullified election earlier this year, which he barely won as well. He's also gained across every single municipality that we've seen so far. That's only been a handful, but they include Hofer's place of birth (lol).

I for one am glad that this loving shitshow is over already, and also that we don't have a Nazi president, that's good too.

Entenzahn has issued a correction as of 17:33 on Dec 4, 2016

Baloogan
Dec 5, 2004
Fun Shoe
WWIII is gonna be reverse WWII lamo

deadgoon
Dec 4, 2014

by FactsAreUseless
i welcome the russo-franks as liberators imo

logikv9
Mar 5, 2009


Ham Wrangler

Baloogan posted:

WWIII is gonna be reverse WWII lamo

Are we the baddies? No, it is the Germans who are wrong.

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

Thank gott that Hofer didn't become Austria's new Fuhrer. There is hope in Europe after all.

Vox Nihili
May 28, 2008

Entenzahn posted:

Alexander van der Bellen will be the next Austrian president, defeating right-wing populist Norbert Hofer.

He's projected to receive 53,6% of the vote right now, outside the margin of error. That's up more than 3% from the nullified election earlier this year, which he barely won as well. He's also gained across every single municipality that we've seen so far. That's only been a handful, but they include Hofer's place of birth (lol).

I for one am glad that this loving shitshow is over already, and also that we don't have a Nazi president, that's good too.

Maybe we should just do a re-run of every election after giving folks a few months to think about their actions.

OhFunny
Jun 26, 2013

EXTREMELY PISSED AT THE DNC
The No vote has won the Italian referendum by a large margin according incoming exit polls.

AceRimmer
Mar 18, 2009
Real results screencap:

lollontee
Nov 4, 2014
Probation
Can't post for 10 years!

Nonsense posted:

Hollande announced he is not standing for a second term. Make France Great Again

I thought there was a big political horse trade just a while about his prime minister not challenging Hollande running. What the hell Hollande, how much of a traitor to your people can you even be you hostis publicus

AceRimmer
Mar 18, 2009
Renzi is resigning and "takes full responsibility" for the loss

Fiction
Apr 28, 2011
Good on Austria for prolonging their descent into the void like we failed to do.

Corek
May 11, 2013

by R. Guyovich
Speaking of resignations, the PM of New Zealand (which is basically europe) suddenly resigned during his weekly press conference.

Baloogan
Dec 5, 2004
Fun Shoe
what-a were they-a voting about-a

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

why did the italians have a referendum on affluenza, I thought that was a pale-skin thing

Fiction
Apr 28, 2011

Baloogan posted:

what-a were they-a voting about-a

the democratic party government under renzi wanted to change the constitution to give more power to the national government, which the people soundly rejected. renzi in a stunning show of self-awareness which most recent european leaders have lacked saw the writing on the wall and resigned.

the five star movement, which is run by a crazy italian comedian who does all the party's platform polling on his closed-source website, went against it and won handily. in addition, they're currently really likely to have a majority in the lower house but will likely not be able to pass much legislation because of the failure of the very bill they're fighting against. it's still bad for the EU though so you should be happy.

also snap elections might not happen so who knows.

Baloogan
Dec 5, 2004
Fun Shoe
i still don't know what they were voting about, evolving more power to their national government okay but what powers does the national government want?

Fiction
Apr 28, 2011
They wanted to nuke the Senate's political power and institute effective unicameralism because of the guaranteed majority for the winner of the election. The prime minister and his government would be effectively wielding unopposed political power in the congress.

Baloogan
Dec 5, 2004
Fun Shoe
yeah okay thats not cool, how the hell is voting against that somehow anti EU? having bicameronism is cool for government imo

Fiction
Apr 28, 2011
It's not at all but it being soundly rejected means there's widespread distate for the PD and means it's very likely that the five star movement will win the next election and vote for a referendum on leaving the eurozone.

OhFunny
Jun 26, 2013

EXTREMELY PISSED AT THE DNC

Baloogan posted:

yeah okay thats not cool, how the hell is voting against that somehow anti EU? having bicameronism is cool for government imo

Gonna copy&paste Omobono's post in the D&D Euro thread about why Italy's Bicameral system is bad and leads to unstable government.

quote:

There are, not that most of the no side has enough political competence to understand that.

It's a conjunction between the constitutional reform and the electoral law. The executive in Italy lives and dies on the parliament's confidence. At any time either the Chamber or the Senate may have a vote of no confidence on the government. If it passes, current government goes down and a new one has to be nominated. This is mitigated by the fact that if the chambers can't find a government they're satisfied with, it's new elections time.

As you may know, Italian governments have a medium duration of around 1 year instead of the natural 5; this setup is why, even before getting into poo poo like when the 2001 Berlusconi government deliberately sabotaged the electoral law to make Prodi's victory in 2006 short-lived.

The new electoral law, the "Italicum", seeks to stabilize the executive by giving absolute majority (55% to be exact) of the chamber to the party that wins the election, party chosen by having the top 2 parties in the election go to a runoff voting round.

By stripping the senate of its power to have a vote of no confidence, this would make governments fairly stable.

However, the constitutional reform goes a lot further in diminishing the senate's power, basically turning it into an empty shell, without basically any kind of legislative power. The risk then is dictatorship of the majority where a party has strong control of both the legislative of the executive, except said majority is a 20-25% relative majority (the 3 top parties in Italy are around that number).


Now, those musings where pointing me to a no vote around 1 year ago, except a simple observation trumps those: "The perfect is the enemy of the good".

It's at least 20 loving years we talk here in Italy of the necessity of reforming our constitution, especially removing the perfectly symmetrical bicameralism; everyone, and I mean everyone, agrees that the senate shouldn't be able to make the executive die. And yet, mysteriously, every single time someone makes a serious proposal for constitutional reform there's always some excuse to shoot it down.

gently caress them.

It's quite clear that the 5 star movement and most of of the no side have actually no intention of doing something for the malaise that is affecting Italy.

Lord of Pie
Mar 2, 2007


Fiction posted:

It's not at all but it being soundly rejected means there's widespread distate for the PD and means it's very likely that the five star movement will win the next election and vote for a referendum on leaving the eurozone.

Gonna be a tough call between a bad economy and a bad economy with literal monopoly money

Corek
May 11, 2013

by R. Guyovich
The Five Star Movement is the most shapeless populism I've seen yet. It doesn't seem either left or right-wing, or anything like that.

Baloogan
Dec 5, 2004
Fun Shoe
lol the malaise of the post-modern era. they know something is wrong, but don't know how to fix it it gnaws at their minds

Doktor Avalanche
Dec 30, 2008

Baloogan posted:

lol the malaise of the post-modern era. they know something is wrong, but don't know how to fix it it gnaws at their minds

you've described me to a T

Fiction
Apr 28, 2011
They can fix it by imprisoning the bankers and nationalizing the steel and automobile industries. They just don't know it yet.

Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3
Nov 15, 2003
Probation
Can't post for 6 hours!
Capitalism is not a place to live in. The rents are high, the food is bad, the dust is disgusting and the morals are deplorable. Go Left, young man, go Left and grow up with the country.

AceRimmer
Mar 18, 2009

Man even the Italians hate Ted Cruz

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jBrereton
May 30, 2013
Grimey Drawer

OhFunny posted:

Gonna copy&paste Omobono's post in the D&D Euro thread about why Italy's Bicameral system is bad and leads to unstable government.
Oh god not unstable governments. think of the economy!!!!

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