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KakerMix posted:All my jarls are tits
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Dec 10, 2016 05:43
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I honestly don't think there's a good option. The Empire let a bunch of elf fascists send inquisitors running around to suppress the local religion. You could say that they had no choice, but that doesn't really matter in terms of who's worth supporting when the outcome of them winning is the persecution and forced conversion of everyone in a particular, widespread religion. eta: Uh, I know it looks like I said I was done with this, but this is clearly about the religion of a fake fantasy kingdom, not its military!
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Dec 10, 2016 05:43
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gently caress it, let your 'sperg flag fly. I
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Dec 10, 2016 05:46
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My personal headcanon is that the Last Dragonborn sided with the Empire, more or less personally crushed the Stormcloak Rebellion, married High Queen Elisif, had an airtight alibi for when someone assassinated the Emperor, declared his own claim to the Imperial throne on basis of being Dragonborn and therefore Tiber Septim's rightful heir, swiftly crushed all organized opposition, and then personally led the Empire in leaving no trace of the Thalmor civilization but smoking craters.  I mean you consider what Tiber Septim accomplished, and he was a child playing with sticks compared to the Last Dragonborn, because he didn't have nearly the access to dragon souls (besides his Thu'um being probably not nearly as naturally strong.)
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Dec 10, 2016 06:01
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You asked for spergy so here goes... One of the things I didn't like about Skyrim is that twice the game promised to take you back in time only to chicken out. Once in Labyrinthia and once at the throat of the world. If I could make an add on it would be to take the player back to when the Snow elves fought the Nords. The difference from most Bethsesda games is that this time race makes a difference and the end is preordained. The player goes back in time, probably in Labyrinthia and is reset to a certain level and is not able to train up/level up for the duration. At the start of the game the player loses the things they need to go home and has to get them back in order to return to regular Skyrim. Race makes a difference. If you're an elf, your on the side of the snow elves. They like you and help you and the Nords attack on sight once the war begins. Same with being a human. It means your on the Nord side. The elves look down on you at the beginning and shoot at you on sight after hostilities begin. Orcs are respected by both sides, Kajits are ignored by both sides and Argonians are looked down on by both sides. Who you are is what side you're on. The pace of the war is pre-set. Events happen even if you're not there. It begins with Skyrim dominated by Snow elves. The cities we are used to seeing in in Skyrim aren't there yet. The Snow elf cities are in the barrows. They are an exterior market made up of massive tents held up by the frames we see left in "modern" skyrim and an interior throne room.(At one point one of the nord leaders yells at a stubborn rear end of an elf leader "I will turn your cities into graveyards" which is why the barrows become nord burial grounds.) The snow elf homes are tents which are scattered around the landscape. The Nords live condensed in one of the holds in small cities with stone walls (maybe the area where Windholm and Eastmarch is) BTW, the game would take place in summer, where most of skyrim is ice free. The game starts with a status quo where the elves are dicks to the nords and a small indecent leads to a larger retaliation and so on until outright war. The elves have the initial advantage although the point is made that both populations are close to the same in size. The elves hold a larger area but the nord areas are more intensely populated. Also, the elves, although being better fighters are over confident and don't press their advantage. They just want the nords to give up and go away. The battles initially go the elves way but the nords begin to hold their own. Then they introduce horses, which changes things. At least in this game elves can't ride horses as the horses don't like them and the nords use them to get a tactical advantage. The horse riders wear the armor we see in the tombs all around "modern" Skyrim. Along with the deathlords, a priest comes who ends up becoming the first dragon priest and the one who wore the wooden mask that takes you back in time. The horse riders turn the war and press the Snow elves backwards. The elves turn to the Dragons who also inhabit the land but because the two have never gotten along well the dragons betray the elves and begin to teach the Nords dragonspeak. This pushes the elves into the arms of the dwarves who betray them in an even worse way that leads to all of them becoming Gollum. The main idea that I wanted to explore is the way that culture affected warfare. The elves are more talented but the nords are more stubborn. "Skyrim is for the Nords" is a rallying cry, a response to the elves telling them they don't belong there. The elves have divided leadership, more concerned with their own standing. They don't look at it as a war until it is too late. The nords are blood mad from the way they've been treated and are resolute, even when they are pushed backwards. The elves mainly use bows and the nords use swords and spears/lances with the horse. Anyways, that's what I'd like to see. (I've done a bit of factory work, I've had time to think) /mod fan fict
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Dec 10, 2016 07:28
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From a pure political stand point of tamreil, the empire is the faction that needs to win. The great war ended heavily with almost defeat. The Thalmor are the worst scum in that world. The stormcloaks is the proper timing to weaken the empire by cutting off nord support for the empire. Which is what the thalmor fear due to talos being a nord and being first emperor and conqueror of all tamriel. Unfortunately, the weakened emperor bloodline had to agree to stop talos worship which is a direct challenge to strain born rule. Those loving elves are trying to gently caress up the other races into them being in charge
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Dec 10, 2016 08:18
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The Elves, especially the Thalmor (who are the nazis of the Altmer) have a tremendous bug up their collective asses about Talos being a god. They know he's a god and it pisses them the hell off, because they all believe they're supposed to be gods and got cheated out of it by Lorkhan (who men call Shor, or Shezzar) when he tricked the other gods into creating the world.
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Dec 10, 2016 10:59
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wiegieman posted:The Elves, especially the Thalmor (who are the nazis of the Altmer) have a tremendous bug up their collective asses about Talos being a god. They know he's a god and it pisses them the hell off, because they all believe they're supposed to be gods and got cheated out of it by Lorkhan (who men call Shor, or Shezzar) when he tricked the other gods into creating the world. That's the best part of the Thalmor, and what's makes them so hate-able both in and out of universe no matter who you are. They take that fundamental elven belief that they are imprisoned gods to its logical conclusion: Final Solution everyone, including themselves, so they can attain their rightful godhood, and at the same time destroy the very concept of "man" so it can never "infect" the restored Elven God-kin ever again. The men hate them because, well obviously, but the elves hate them too because they say out loud what they're all thinking, but go about it in the most monstrously cruel fashion possible (the forced oppression of non-Altmer while consolidating their power certainly doesn't help, either). And the beastmen who haven't submitted to their rule just hate them because gently caress Yo Authoritay, like they did with the Septim Empire prior.
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Dec 10, 2016 12:01
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Darth Brooks posted:You asked for spergy so here goes... This sounds dope, yo.
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Dec 10, 2016 12:57
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"We're gonna build a wall, and we'll have the Thalmor pay for it!" "We're gonna drain this swamp!" "You have people come in and I'm not just saying Argonians, I'm talking about people that are from all over, that are killers and rapists and they're coming to this country," "When Elsweyr sends it people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people..." Posted on Shoutr by @realUlfricStormcloak
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Dec 10, 2016 13:05
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"Jarl Balgruuf is doing a terrible job as leader of Whiterun. Jarl Balgruuf should be ashamed of himself." "When will Elisif stop blaming me for her husband's awful fighting ability? Sad!"
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Dec 10, 2016 13:11
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Playing through the Civil War questline after the election, flawed as it is, was sooooo satisfying just to deny Ulfric that last egotistical request.
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Dec 10, 2016 13:32
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e: quote is not edit 
Eric the Mauve fucked around with this message at 13:37 on Dec 10, 2016 |
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Dec 10, 2016 13:35
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Now I want a Kickstarter to hire Vladimir Kulich to voice the Make Skyrim Great Again mod. Kerning Chameleon posted:Playing through the Civil War questline after the election, flawed as it is, was sooooo satisfying just to deny Ulfric that last egotistical request. I wish there were an option to bring, say, Jenassa as a follower and have her execute him.
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Dec 10, 2016 13:36
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Yeah, Skyrim is my first TES besides like 15 hours in Oblivion so I was pretty pro-Stormcloak until this playthrough, when I realized that the only reason I'm siding with them is the whole Talos worship thing. I still completed their quest but it left a bad taste in my mouth.
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Dec 10, 2016 13:43
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KakerMix posted:All my jarls have tits I, too, installed the skyrim bird mod.
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Dec 10, 2016 14:42
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I'm the last Dragonborn and Idgrod Ravencrone is my favorite Jarl in Skyrim.
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Dec 10, 2016 15:07
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Are there any books in Skyrim that talk about the Things the Thalmor Actually Believe, i.e. the whole final solution their way into godhood stuff? I played casually the first time and only read a few of the books and never really got the vibe. I also haven't played the other ES games, mind.
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Dec 10, 2016 16:26
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I guess another reason I was pro-stormcloak my first game was that it was my first TES game. I got into the game completely blind, not know anything about the series. It's a pretty common theme elsewhere that Empires = bad, Rebels = good, so I had that stereotype before the cart ride even started. Looking bad now it's pretty obvious the Empire ultimately has the better chance of winning against the Thalmor, and that banning Talos worship is just a temporary measure to placate the Thalmor before round two starts.
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Dec 10, 2016 18:02
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Hollow Talk posted:"We're gonna build a wall, and we'll have the Thalmor pay for it!" lmao but also  Who wants to crack open the construction kit and make a half-assed Trump to replace Ulfric and replace his voice lines with poorly-recorced quips from Trump's rallies? Artmoor will make SURE it becomes a ~hot file~ A.o.D. posted:I, too, installed the skyrim bird mod. The best immersion mod there is, truly. idiot of the legal system posted:Are there any books in Skyrim that talk about the Things the Thalmor Actually Believe, i.e. the whole final solution their way into godhood stuff? I played casually the first time and only read a few of the books and never really got the vibe. I also haven't played the other ES games, mind. Probably, but the reason you didn't get that vibe is because Morrowind (which put all this stuff in everyone's minds because it was Bethesda's first huge smash hit popular TES game) is loving nuts in comparison to say, Oblivion, because Bethesda was different when Morrowind was being made. When Morrowind came out Cyrodiil was still this hosed up jungle swamp thing and then a writer left (???) and Oblivion came out with a 'Pocket Guide to The Empire' which told of that cool jungle Cyrodiil while you stared at a by-the-numbers design of Euro-fantasy. Cannon is ~chim~ which is also ???. When people bitch about Bethesda not being able to write this is a part of it, such rich and cool history about what the Thalmor are actually doing, what their culture is like, same with Argonians and Kahjit and even wood elves who are cannibalistic insane things and we just get quips. This is why Fallout New Vegas is lauded for being a real and true RPG with a rich story and intrigue and characters and Fallout 4 is the text version of this
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Dec 10, 2016 18:12
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Having played Morrowind and Oblivion before playing Skyrim and joined with the Empire. The Stormcloaks were only weakening the Empire (which is not the Thalmor, their real enemy), which in turn was strengthening their enemy. The sooner the Empire can end the war against the Stormcloaks the sooner it can set it's resources on preparing to fight the Thalmor. Ulfric was a pawn of the Thalmor, and his whole rebellion was playing into their hands. Sure, they'd get their free worship of Talos... for a little while. In the long run they'd end up crushed under the boot of the elves. Division is death. Unless you're Altmer then whatever.
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Dec 10, 2016 18:27
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One thing to note: According to Kirkbride, the Thalmor win.
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Dec 10, 2016 18:54
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the stormcloaks have legitimate grievances, but at the end of the day, ulfric is a twat and i don't want him to lead. the discussion in this thread over the last couple pages is exponentially more story detail than the entire civil war quest provides
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Dec 10, 2016 18:59
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Agents are GO! posted:One thing to note: According to Kirkbride, the Thalmor win. Honestly, if the next TES game focuses on the fight against the Thalmor I doubt Bethesda will bring in Kirkbride's stuff about the Thalmor wanting to unmake reality into the games' canon. Maybe it would be referenced here and there. But all that stuff about the Towers and the metaphysics about how reality came into existence and is maintained is already convoluted and confusing to hardcore TES/Kirkbride fans. How would you get new players up to speed on all that without breaking their brains? GunnerJ posted:Elenwen is the local, like, viceroy of the Thalmor so it's not like this is some rando talking poo poo, there's a paper trail leading to an important person who can confirm or deny it. It also never really comes out and personally takes credit for anything as big as starting the war. It's a reference document, not anyone's personal claim to fame. I guess the joke part wasn't obvious. Sorry.
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Dec 10, 2016 19:32
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Yeah I love me some Kirkbride but not past the point where everyone dies but his beloved dunmer, numidium comes back (again) to destroy the world, and vivec and friends return to be the heroes because why not. Smack of favouritism. It's just as well c0da is all wrapped up inn the message that there are infinite realities/dreams, and this one is his.
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Dec 10, 2016 20:15
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Does a Stormcloak-affiliated torturer ever show up in the game? I've played a bunch of it but I haven't bothered going through the civil war quests. I feel like the utilitarian argument that you ought to join w/ the Empire because it ultimately strengthens the opposition to the Thalmor falls a bit flat after you've casually murdered the dragon god that's gonna eat the world, you could probably start and end the next war against Thalmor right there once you're done with all the politicking around.
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Dec 10, 2016 20:26
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Vanadium posted:Does a Stormcloak-affiliated torturer ever show up in the game? I've played a bunch of it but I haven't bothered going through the civil war quests. Not to imply Bethesda is ever even somewhat competent at writing, but one of the main themes of the Dragonborn DLC is to knock down this this notion of the "invincible, all-powerful Dragonborn"... that Bethesda themselves propagated in the first place. The villain (well, the one you get a boss fight with anyway) is literally the most powerful Dragonborn to ever live, implied to have waaaaaaay more powers than your character could ever hope to figure out in their lifetime, but Miraak is still ultimately a pawn of much more powerful and dangerous forces in the world, and is discarded like so much rotten turkey the moment he stops being useful and a new model comes in. The Dragonborn, while an important agent of change, is still just one little piece on the big board game of Tamriel.
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Dec 10, 2016 22:25
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Strategic Tea posted:Yeah I love me some Kirkbride but not past the point where everyone dies but his beloved dunmer, numidium comes back (again) to destroy the world, and vivec and friends return to be the heroes because why not. Smack of favouritism. It's just as well c0da is all wrapped up inn the message that there are infinite realities/dreams, and this one is his. Kirkbride likes the Dunmer because they're elves who "get it" about what Nirn is for. It's not supposed to be a prison, and the elves' gods are just as stupid about it as they are, so much that the Daedra laugh at them about it and occasionally rip off their divine flesh and impersonate them. I just wish the cool stuff could come across when you go talking to people in the game rather than being buried in a book no one will see. I want more of the Altmer legion officer who hates the Thalmor because the loving nazis killed his entire extended family in a terror attack.
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Dec 10, 2016 22:53
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Kerning Chameleon posted:Not to imply Bethesda is ever even somewhat competent at writing, but one of the main themes of the Dragonborn DLC is to knock down this this notion of the "invincible, all-powerful Dragonborn"... that Bethesda themselves propagated in the first place. The villain (well, the one you get a boss fight with anyway) is literally the most powerful Dragonborn to ever live, implied to have waaaaaaay more powers than your character could ever hope to figure out in their lifetime, but Miraak is still ultimately a pawn of much more powerful and dangerous forces in the world, and is discarded like so much rotten turkey the moment he stops being useful and a new model comes in. The Dragonborn, while an important agent of change, is still just one little piece on the big board game of Tamriel. The story of Jurgen Windcaller also shows the lie of the notion that the thu'um is some kind of ultimate power. An army of shouting Nords got their asses kicked by a Chimer/Dwemer alliance so hard that their mightiest shouter had to go live on a mountain for a bunch of years to figure out how the hell that happened. So while TLD might be a very mighty individual, there's no way he could turn the tide of a major war all by himself. That trick only works when you're thumping reachmen over the head.
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Dec 10, 2016 23:18
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The real reason the Last Dragonborn is so powerful is because they have CHIM, not because they have Thu'um. 
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Dec 10, 2016 23:24
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A few of my more recent playthroughs I've done the main quest up to The Fallen and then go do the civil war quest line. It lets me skip the whole peace council shite at high hrothgar and Esberns dream\nightmare spiel is one of the cooler va moments in the game, to me. I went full Talos loving Nord this time because I planned on doing a Stormcloak run, for once, and it just makes me feel dirty. I also miss Balgruuf. Honestly, choosing a player character from one of the discriminated races should have made siding with the stormcloaks... not an option, or much more difficult somehow. It's lovely that you can basically be Ulfrics best bud when playing as an Argonian. You can have a house in the city while all your brethren are not even allowed inside the city walls. Terrible design. Imperials aren't much better either.
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Dec 10, 2016 23:34
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The Stormcloaks would definitely accept the help of someone as powerful as the player character regardless of race, you'd just be considered "one of the good ones." It'd be nice if the game did more to signal to a Dunmer/Khajiit/whatever Dragonborn who sides with the Stormcloaks that your people consider you a collaborationist bastard but hey.
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Dec 10, 2016 23:39
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Pakled posted:The Stormcloaks would definitely accept the help of someone as powerful as the player character regardless of race, you'd just be considered "one of the good ones." It'd be nice if the game did more to signal to a Dunmer/Khajiit/whatever Dragonborn who sides with the Stormcloaks that your people consider you a collaborationist bastard but hey. Yeah but if you are a Khajiit you shouldn't even be allowed inside any of the major cities because they are explicitly not allowed inside yet ol' player character can just waltz on in. I've never done it but what's that first interaction you see in Windhelm with those two Nords giving poo poo to that dark Dunmer woman like if you yourself are a dark elf? I bet absolutely zero difference. A neat playthrough would be as a Khajiit, open cities and a mod to make it so you commit a crime every time you are spotted inside the major cities.
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Dec 10, 2016 23:53
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the lack of acknowledgement of race in skyrim is a real bummer. i feel insanely weird being a high elf and having the jarl of windhelm go "oh you're the dragonborn? that makes total sense to me."
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Dec 11, 2016 00:01
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Kinda feel the same way with every faction quest ending with you becoming the leader in relatively short order. Funniest of these in my first game was the College of Winterhold which somehow saw fit to award Archmage status to a berserker whose best magic skill was enchanting his warhammer and plate mail. 
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Dec 11, 2016 00:05
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Pakled posted:The Stormcloaks would definitely accept the help of someone as powerful as the player character regardless of race, you'd just be considered "one of the good ones." It'd be nice if the game did more to signal to a Dunmer/Khajiit/whatever Dragonborn who sides with the Stormcloaks that your people consider you a collaborationist bastard but hey. I don't know, a Dunmer ultranationalist could probably justify siding with Stormcloaks as loving over the empire that defiled their homeland, and making sure it never happens again. They also may want all the dark elves in Windhelm to go back and help rebuild.
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Dec 11, 2016 00:06
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KakerMix posted:Yeah but if you are a Khajiit you shouldn't even be allowed inside any of the major cities because they are explicitly not allowed inside yet ol' player character can just waltz on in. I've never done it but what's that first interaction you see in Windhelm with those two Nords giving poo poo to that dark Dunmer woman like if you yourself are a dark elf? I bet absolutely zero difference. I know Inconsequential NPCs makes it so that the Windhelm guards will stop Khajiit PCs from entering the city unless you can convince them to let you in. Now you might think that seems to go a bit counter to the mod's name and stated intent, but eh
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Dec 11, 2016 00:24
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The Thalmor presence always felt really weak to me, mostly because they were basically one of the few groups on my "murder on sight" list with zero consequence. Accidentally steal an old lady's plants? She was hiring hitmen to take your life. Thalmor reaction to murdering every roaming band you see? Nothing. Murder entire forts of them? Nothing. I guess nobody ever lived to report anything, but still you'd think it would trigger a quest or event or something from them.
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Dec 11, 2016 00:26
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Kerning Chameleon posted:Not to imply Bethesda is ever even somewhat competent at writing, but one of the main themes of the Dragonborn DLC is to knock down this this notion of the "invincible, all-powerful Dragonborn"... that Bethesda themselves propagated in the first place. The villain (well, the one you get a boss fight with anyway) is literally the most powerful Dragonborn to ever live, implied to have waaaaaaay more powers than your character could ever hope to figure out in their lifetime, but Miraak is still ultimately a pawn of much more powerful and dangerous forces in the world, and is discarded like so much rotten turkey the moment he stops being useful and a new model comes in. The Dragonborn, while an important agent of change, is still just one little piece on the big board game of Tamriel. I don't feel like it's an argument against the indomitable might of the player character that, within like a day of his dumbass cultists having revealed his existence to me, I've thoroughly dunked on Miraak's whole centuries-spanning operation. A.o.D. posted:The story of Jurgen Windcaller also shows the lie of the notion that the thu'um is some kind of ultimate power. An army of shouting Nords got their asses kicked by a Chimer/Dwemer alliance so hard that their mightiest shouter had to go live on a mountain for a bunch of years to figure out how the hell that happened. So while TLD might be a very mighty individual, there's no way he could turn the tide of a major war all by himself. That trick only works when you're thumping reachmen over the head. The Aldmer probably don't have weird spider robots and poo poo, so it'll be just fine.
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Dec 11, 2016 00:29
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Decus posted:Accidentally steal an old lady's pants? She was hiring hitmen to take your life. *frantically hides sexlab from installation before posting load order asking for help*
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Dec 11, 2016 00:29
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