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Lovechop posted:aaaand h2k pick up nuclear and chei..... nuclear had a lot of potential, he and sasin basically carried sbenu. but also i think that lane is a downgrade for a whole lot of reasons and i would be sorta surprised if it worked out
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Dec 14, 2016 23:09
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Transient People posted:Lane swaps were logistically entertaining but incredibly noninteractive, and tactically and strategically boring. It's not that they couldn't be entertaining, but the focus of League of Legends isn't in winning before the match has started due to a successful laneswap or tower rush. there isn't one "focus" for league. the focus of pro league play is to win. the focus of league from a spectator standpoint is to enjoy it. the focus of league for low elo players is to get as many kills as possible. the focus of league for riot is to make money. pros did lane swaps because they worked. part of pick/ban strategy is "winning before the match has started" as well. pros didn't do lane swaps because they were boring. but riot wanted to get rid of lane swaps. riot didn't want to get rid of lane swaps because they're noninteractive but because they're boring. (they are boring because they're noninteractive, but it's the boring part that is relevant.) boring means spectator league fails to entertain the fans, and since the purpose of spectator league from riot's POV is to advertise their product, they can't have boring stuff damaging their advertising strategy; so they have to eliminate lane swaps.
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Dec 14, 2016 23:22
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Vermain posted:I genuinely wouldn't expect them until next season at the earliest. It'd pretty dramatically change how P/B works in competitive, especially if they do staggered bans ala DotA 2, and I suspect they're wary of making such a significant change without a lot of in-house testing. Riot doesn't really test things, so that's out the window. 10 bans is the kind of thing where you just have to do it, because you think it has value (by creating more diversity, or whatever), and tweak it later. The Spring split is probably the best time to do it, as it gives you a whole year to figure it out before Worlds.
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Dec 14, 2016 23:26
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nomadologique posted:there isn't one "focus" for league. We disagree on that to a fundamental level. There absolutely is a focus for League, the same way there's a focus for any other game. The games are built with some kinda way to play them in mind. Gross deviations of that are corrected, as a rule. It's why the offside rule exists in Soccer, for instance - otherwise you got degenerate 'chuck the ball towards the opponent's side of the field and hope defense fucks up' for 90 minutes (this is not made up, it HAS happened). There's nothing wrong with enforcing a basic way to play on a game. It tends to make it more interesting, not less.
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Dec 14, 2016 23:37
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Keep in mind that one of the reasons that, say, DotA2 sees more heroes played competitively is because DotA2 doesn't have the same philosophy of "roles" that League does. DotA2 heroes weren't designed with the idea of them going top/middle/bot/whatever and fulfilling some specific function (like initiation), and they therefore don't have to compete as much with other, similar entries who might play slightly different. Think about, say, Leona vs. Alistar: their general pattern of play and ability to lock someone down is roughly equal, but Alistar sees vastly more play because his combo is straight-up easier and more reliable to execute. Midlane mages almost always need to be designed with the ability to waveclear in mind, because being bad at waveclearing automatically puts them at a huge disadvantage (unless they're some scaling monster like Ryze). It means that design tends to be constrained more than DotA2, who can just pop out a hero with X abilities and see where it lands (since there's no hard and fast rules about what you "need" to have in each lane).
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Dec 14, 2016 23:41
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Dota has a lot of hero variety, but the flip side of that is: gently caress half those heroes
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Dec 14, 2016 23:52
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Transient People posted:We disagree on that to a fundamental level. There absolutely is a focus for League, the same way there's a focus for any other game. The games are built with some kinda way to play them in mind. Gross deviations of that are corrected, as a rule. It's why the offside rule exists in Soccer, for instance - otherwise you got degenerate 'chuck the ball towards the opponent's side of the field and hope defense fucks up' for 90 minutes (this is not made up, it HAS happened). There's nothing wrong with enforcing a basic way to play on a game. It tends to make it more interesting, not less. i don't think we really disagree. they make a rule change like that in soccer because it makes it more fun to watch, not because it's "fundamental" to the game in some way. i can guarantee you if it wasn't illegal, every pro team would do it all the time, every day, because they don't care about "the spirit of the game," they care about winning. lionel messi, for instance, in a really really special player: not only is he one of the most athletically talented and intelligent players to ever play the game, but he also refuses to dive etc. but that's by far the exception, not the rule. i see what you mean, there's a kind of abstract "attractor" that generally defines what the game is, and the game stops being interesting to watch when it is broken by something that keeps the game from hovering around that attractor... but that attractor is defined by many interests, and changes with them. riot doesn't make changes exactly based on the game's attractor-state so much as profitability. normally, making sure the game isn't broken is the most profitable solution... but what does and doesn't break the game is dependent on POV. there are a lot of smart people here, for instance, who say "the game sure would be better if xyz," and the fact is that these smart, well-informed, analytical people don't represent the mass of riot's customers. riot does stuff based on whether it'll help them sell more skins and icons. i think it's inaccurate, as well, to compare lane swapping to cherry picking.
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Dec 15, 2016 00:01
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rabidsquid posted:nuclear had a lot of potential, he and sasin basically carried sbenu. but also i think that lane is a downgrade for a whole lot of reasons and i would be sorta surprised if it worked out yeah i think nuclear is okay but from forgiven / vander to that lane ahhh. it's probably gonna be a nightmare yeah.
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Dec 15, 2016 00:02
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KONGDOO Monsters and Dark Passage is about to start. Probably. https://www.twitch.tv/esl_lol
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Dec 15, 2016 02:00
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When does Fenix and Piglet play?
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Dec 15, 2016 02:52
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Ghetto SuperCzar posted:When does Fenix and Piglet play?
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Dec 15, 2016 03:26
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I don't understand how it's possible for IEM production to be consistently so bad
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Dec 15, 2016 03:26
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Is there really no non-braindead mid they can take over GoldenGlue? I haven't seen anyone be such a non-factor in a game for a looong time
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Dec 15, 2016 03:54
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wait reignover left immortals for goldenglue and lolru?
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Dec 15, 2016 03:58
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Wuxi posted:Is there really no non-braindead mid they can take over GoldenGlue? I haven't seen anyone be such a non-factor in a game for a looong time Agreed. With that much farm and items on Ryze you should definitely do more. It barely seemed like he casted any spells. He was full hp/full mana after every fight except the last one where they all instantly died minus Piglet. Ryze is so busted but Goldenglutes made him seem underpowered. I don't want to hate too much on him but you could tell the difference between him and Night who is the among the best midlaners in EU which is a league stacked with good mids. Also for once I have to agree with Phreak, the Hexdrinker buy was really stupid and bad by Piglet. Hexdrinker is good vs LB or Syndra where you might get bursted but survive with shield(of course qss can be good here too). Vs Ryze/Cass you definitely want qss to cleanse the cc because thats whats gonna kill you. Also not to mention that there is a Ashe in the game. I know piglet trusts his mechanics but he can qss a cc from every single giants member except Reksai. QSS was infinitely better.
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Dec 15, 2016 04:02
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https://twitter.com/Korean_Mulan/status/809084153325096960
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Dec 15, 2016 04:18
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owns
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Dec 15, 2016 04:52
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nomadologique posted:i don't think we really disagree. they make a rule change like that in soccer because it makes it more fun to watch, not because it's "fundamental" to the game in some way. i can guarantee you if it wasn't illegal, every pro team would do it all the time, every day, because they don't care about "the spirit of the game," they care about winning. lionel messi, for instance, in a really really special player: not only is he one of the most athletically talented and intelligent players to ever play the game, but he also refuses to dive etc. but that's by far the exception, not the rule. That's fair. I do think that eliminating laneswaps wasn't necessarily a profit-driven decision (I design games too and go absolutely batty when poo poo goes completely off the rails - I don't think the investors have much of a say on how the balance team shakes things up so long as it continues to make money, though I'd be curious if viewcounts nosedived during the age of laneswaps), but it's true that the teams themselves will not give a poo poo about what makes the game boring to watch so long as it makes them more successful. What would you compare laneswaps to?
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Dec 15, 2016 05:30
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About this Giants roster. Night is decent but Ori/Ryze into Cassio are both losing matchups. Also Upset, this rookie German adc looks really good. Playing really REALLY aggro in teamfights doing lots of dps. These teamfights look good because how good Night and Upset are in teamfights but KDM have too large leads. Edge really playing the lane well both times.
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Dec 15, 2016 05:36
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Ulio posted:About this Giants roster. Night is decent but Ori/Ryze into Cassio are both losing matchups. Also Upset, this rookie German adc looks really good. Playing really REALLY aggro in teamfights doing lots of dps. These teamfights look good because how good Night and Upset are in teamfights but KDM have too large leads. Edge really playing the lane well both times. you can't gently caress with the one and only kongdoo monster himself, but this giants roster is actually pretty cool yeah
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Dec 15, 2016 08:10
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Ya this giants roster just go all in teamfights and are fun to watch. Don't like mightybear even Wisdom would be a better pickup than him. Flaxxish has decent mechanics from few challenger games I saw him in na. Also Piglet making GBS threads on DP so hard lol. Winning lane as Ez/Twitch vs Cait.
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Dec 15, 2016 08:18
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instead of Easyhoon going BACK TO YOUR FAVORITE KOREAN TEAM! actually Bengi is the jungler for VG now lmao
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Dec 15, 2016 09:43
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TL's map movement is pretty impressive this game
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Dec 15, 2016 09:58
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Duke to iG is apparently a thing
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Dec 15, 2016 14:16
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oh and Ming is the new RNG support, he was pretty good in the Ning/Ming bot lane for Young Miracle. also rumors that PAIN EVIL is gonna try out for mid for RNG. Zzitai is the new Snake mid edit: there are rumors that Cry is gonna be the new EDG ADC lmao
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Dec 15, 2016 14:18
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rabidsquid posted:instead of Easyhoon going BACK TO YOUR FAVORITE KOREAN TEAM! actually Bengi is the jungler for VG now lmao I barely follow LPL how is VG as a team? Obvi Bengi is a solid upgrade over whoever was jungling before.
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Dec 15, 2016 14:20
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Goldenglue was also pretty good other than the first game vs Night where he did absolutely nothing. He solokilled him in the other games and played teamfights really well. He should learn a thing or two vs Crown. Finally some hot spicy rumors about LPL. I feel like people will see how weak Bengi is as a player individually in LPL. Also in LCK news, EVER's roster is same as kespacup/summer except no Loken/Key. Key didn't play much anyway and Loken is being replaced by CJ sub adc Ghost who was kinda hyped for a long time but was too young to play in summer or spring I forgot when.
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Dec 15, 2016 16:56
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Bengi and Easyhoon are going to form a bromance and storm to world's glory or they will finish 5th.
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Dec 15, 2016 17:04
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Kashuno posted:Obvi Bengi is a solid upgrade over whoever was jungling before. Dandy? I mean, I guess...
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Dec 15, 2016 17:09
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lol
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Dec 15, 2016 18:22
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Looks like Dignitas has used their basketball dollars to pick up Ssumday and Chaser for top/jungle. Decent acquisition? I know Ssumday used to be pretty drat good but I have no idea who Chaser is at all.
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Dec 15, 2016 19:39
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New rules for NALCS spring 2017 TLDR: Expedited arbitration for some infractions, minimum $50,000 additional guaranteed income for all teams from digital goods, increased prize pool, poaching protection for head coaches, team rosters expanded to include 3 inactive spots, relegation is now a double elemination tournament between the top two qualifying challenger series teams and the bottom two LCS teams and sister teams can play in the challenger series but are ineligible for promotion and can only take 3 of the 6 slots.
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Dec 15, 2016 19:59
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The difference between GoldenGlue and Night in their respective Ryze games was pretty telling.
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Dec 15, 2016 20:15
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Sexpansion posted:The difference between GoldenGlue and Night in their respective Ryze games was pretty telling. Yeah goldenglue mostly used ryze as a character in league of legends, while Night was a chilling true memoir of the holocaust.
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Dec 15, 2016 20:18
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Work Friend Keven posted:Yeah goldenglue mostly used ryze as a character in league of legends, while Night was a chilling true memoir of the holocaust. that's a good book nice reference.
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Dec 15, 2016 20:31
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I want to see an LCS sister team and CS sister team get into the promotion/relegation tournament and watch the LCS team get removed tbh. Those changes for spring are good tho
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Dec 15, 2016 20:39
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Kashuno posted:I want to see an LCS sister team and CS sister team get into the promotion/relegation tournament and watch the LCS team get removed tbh. Can't happen under the new rules - CS sister teams can't participate in the promotion tournament. The two highest ranked unaffiliated CS teams get invited.
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Dec 15, 2016 20:43
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"All NA LCS teams have been made aware of this change well in advance of the 2017 Season." oh, that's alright then. well, i'm sure the cs teams were made aware too, and didn't find out from the public post or anything.
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Dec 15, 2016 20:50
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Sexpansion posted:The difference between GoldenGlue and Night in their respective Ryze games was pretty telling. Goldenglue's ryze game was horrible but he outperformed in nearly every other game they played. I was really surprised Night made many mistakes imo because in EU lcs he plays a lot better. Giants just gonna be the teamfighting team in EU I guess. Upset really impressed he played so aggressive on even immobile carries like Jhin/Ashe it was refreshing to see.
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Dec 15, 2016 21:02
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Chris de Sperg posted:"All NA LCS teams have been made aware of this change well in advance of the 2017 Season." 
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Dec 15, 2016 22:10
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