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Bigger y axis means better swing over travel means you can turn much larger parts not just longer parts. Also it's got a much bigger motor than most 7x lathes so it will be less likely to bind up in the middle of turning metals. Bigger also typically means more rigidity for better precision.
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Dec 2, 2016 07:10
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Yeah the increased size and work envelope, 1,100 watt brushless motor, power cross feed, and hardened bed ways are probably the biggest differences that seperate the WBL250F from the other lathes you listed.
DethMarine21 fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Dec 2, 2016 |
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Dec 2, 2016 15:34
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DethMarine21 posted:Yeah the increased size and work envelope, 1,100 watt brushless motor, power cross feed, and hardened bed ways are probably the biggest differences that seperate the WBL250F from the other lathes you listed. Ohhh I see. Yeah no I don't have room for the 10x30. I'd be looking at the 8x16, which I don't really have room for either but I have a spot I can sort of wedge it into. I hadn't noticed that the LMS machine doesn't advertise hardened ways. I really thought it had that feature - I'll have to check.
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Dec 3, 2016 03:25
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I remember being surprised too that a lot of smaller hobby lathes often don't have hardened ways. I guess it's not that big of an issue in a non-production environment. Sieg is continually adding features to their models though so it's possible that even the 7x16 sizes have hardened ways by now. Chris at LMS is really helpful and responsive to questions so you can always check with him. The Weiss WBL210V is also an 8x16 size lathe by the way.
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Dec 3, 2016 04:00
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oh yeah another feature the 10x has - an internal gearbox for setting the feed rate. If you do any single point threading you're probably going to realize that you lost the one gear you needed to set the right travel rate for the TPI you wanted. An internal gearbox is a matter of turning knobs instead of opening the gearbox and swapping gears.
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Dec 3, 2016 08:28
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DethMarine21 posted:The Weiss WBL210V is also an 8x16 size lathe by the way. Yep, and thanks for pointing it out. So I'm currently looking at: the LMS 7x16 w/ DROs: http://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=5200&category=1271799306 the lil'est grizzly: http://www.grizzly.com/products/8-x-16-Variable-Speed-Lathe/G0768 and now the WBL210V. Any others in this size range? I'm not bumping up against my price limit here. CrazyLittle posted:oh yeah another feature the 10x has - an internal gearbox for setting the feed rate. It's real attractive but I just don't have the extra 18" of workbench. The 8x16 is already going to be a tight squeeze. The 10x30 is just not on the table, both figuratively and literally.
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Dec 4, 2016 04:31
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one day I will have room for something like this http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/for/5901117660.html
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Dec 4, 2016 08:07
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ok so I think this is the new frontrunner http://www.grizzly.com/products/9-x-19-Bench-Lathe/G4000 it's about 6" longer than the LMS machine but it should still fit. What say ye?
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Dec 5, 2016 16:30
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When's dinner? Can I come over? More seriously though, between the 9x19 and the 8x16 variable speed I'd actually go with the Grizzly 8x16 because it's also got a cam-lock tailstock while the 9x19 would require manually clamping down a bolt under the tailstock head. All three lathes (7x12, 8x16, 9x19) are using the same headstock taper, so you're not getting any additional through-head capacity. Really it all boils down to "what're you going to make with that lathe"? CrazyLittle fucked around with this message at 01:42 on Dec 7, 2016 |
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Dec 7, 2016 01:21
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CrazyLittle posted:Really it all boils down to "what're you going to make with that lathe"? hmm. I will meditate on this sage advice.
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Dec 7, 2016 05:34
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like out of curiousity where are the higher end benchtop lathes? like if I had a sudden fiscal windfall that was not enough to buy a new house with bigger shop space but enough to lay out some decent cash for a lathe, where would I look?
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Dec 7, 2016 05:47
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The higher end benchtop lathes come on their own benches. Enco, perhaps Jet... Amusingly, the smaller lathes all seem to be the same chinese Seig lathes renamed. I just saw the same lathe from Griz on Enco's page.
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Dec 7, 2016 06:25
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yeah like as far as I can tell I'm just trying to make the decision between different configurations of Sieg lathes. i think i found the highest end tho: http://www.smsa.ch/en/Products.html
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Dec 7, 2016 06:32
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you could always just build your own “air bearing CNC lathe and grinder having 1um (0.00004") accuracy”, dude makes it sound like it's easy, nbd https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFrVdoOhu1Q
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Dec 7, 2016 07:39
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well i mean of course i could I just don't want to seem like a big showoff is all
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Dec 7, 2016 16:37
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quote:...surplus semiconductors... super cheap... couple hundred bucks on ebay... nope. nope. nope.
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Dec 7, 2016 16:53
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fixturing thin sheet metal that's gonna have a couple hundred holes drilled in it- what's a good compromise between holding ability and removability? I figure double-sided tape or hot glue on a Masonite spoilboard is the way to go, but I'd have to track down good tape whereas I deffo have hot glue sticks knocking around. Just worried about mangling the sheet trying to get it off the glue, even with a heat gun to help it along. Any solvents work well on hot glue?
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Dec 7, 2016 20:23
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3M spray 77?
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Dec 7, 2016 20:29
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CrazyLittle posted:3M spray 77? This, and a bottle of Lift Off to get it off after.
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Dec 7, 2016 20:44
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rawrr posted:you could always just build your own “air bearing CNC lathe and grinder having 1um (0.00004") accuracy”, dude makes it sound like it's easy, nbd Precision granite bed  Ambrose Burnside posted:fixturing thin sheet metal that's gonna have a couple hundred holes drilled in it- what's a good compromise between holding ability and removability? I figure double-sided tape or hot glue on a Masonite spoilboard is the way to go, but I'd have to track down good tape whereas I deffo have hot glue sticks knocking around. Just worried about mangling the sheet trying to get it off the glue, even with a heat gun to help it along. Any solvents work well on hot glue? 3M 401M or 410M double-sided tape is strong enough to hold parts for finish milling as described in the datasheet and might work for you. 3M Super 77 spray adhesive would also probably work but can make a mess. I've seen it for sale at Home Depot. DethMarine21 fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Dec 7, 2016 |
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Dec 7, 2016 21:51
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DethMarine21 posted:Precision granite bed The best part is how nonchalant he is about it. "Oh I just walked down the street and there were granite slabs accurate down to 1mic just laying there"
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Dec 7, 2016 22:12
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So I wanna make male and female matched semicylindrical dies. the kind of thing you'd use to press a piece of sheet metal into a U shape. Small dies, maybe 2x2x1" in size per half. The female part is dead simple, just do a couple passes with a ballnose mill, but the male part is gonna be trickier. My approach to this, with my experience, would be to: 1. subtract the metal thickness from the female die cutter radius to get the male die radius 2. mill a slot with the smaller cutter down to the radius depth to get a half-round slot 3. buy some tool steel drill rod of that thickness 4. using a normal endmill narrower than the drill rod, cut a couple slots through the bottom of the round slot all the way through the steel, or just drill a bunch of holes with a good ol jobber drill 5. clamp the poo poo out of the round rod in the half-round slot to form the male die profile, weld in place with plug welds through the slots from the back but i don't have any experience welding alloy steel so I don't wanna bank on that, and I don't really wanna source the special electrodes I'd need for that and etc. Would it be easier to just rough out the die and then do a real fine waterline finishing pass with a ballnose mill? Also something I've never done but at least have the stuff on hand to attempt?
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Dec 17, 2016 21:00
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unrelated: it turns out that just winging a slotting cut with a 1/16" cutter without calculating speeds is a bad idea, and doing it twice without stopping t othink about a single goddamn thing beyond "just slow it down by half this time, thatll definitely work out fine" is an even worse idea how the hell does any work get done with like 1/64" endmills
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Dec 17, 2016 21:03
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Why do you need to bother with the through slot and welding? Sounds to me like when you form whatever it is you're forming, the rod will be pressed into the supporting portion of the male die anyway - there aren't any forces pulling the two pieces apart. So you can just epoxy it in place, no? e: also welding might warp your dies in strange/undesirable ways rawrr fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Dec 17, 2016 |
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Dec 17, 2016 21:31
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It'd be a hot-forging die struck with a hammer, at least for now, so an epoxy wouldn't hold up to that or else I'd default to something like that, yeah. distortion's def a thing I didnt consider too hard though
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Dec 18, 2016 02:42
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3d contouring with a ball/bullnose endmill shouldn't be difficult. Don't try to get it right to finish dimensions, leave some stock and just finish on a belt sander or grinder. Or hell, if it doesn't need to be too accurate just draw the profile and grind it all, if you've got a belt grinder.
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Dec 18, 2016 04:11
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Maybe you could try mechanical fastening? Drill through the die, drill and tap the rod, then screw the two together.
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Dec 18, 2016 17:58
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Any mechanical fasteners are liable to get mashed or distorted over time so if anything loosened up i wouldn't be able to fix it easily. I'll just take a crack at machining it as one piece, see how it goes with an aluminium trial run. Different question- do folks make much use of MPG handwheels/pendants at the hobby level? Having one available seems smart if I've got simple tasks that aren't worth putting a model/gcode together for, but I'm seeing grievances online about wireless USB pendants being useless for actual machining (as opposed to just jogging or whatever) because there's too much latency. Would a hardwired pendant or handwheel/s be suitable as a substitute for manual machining-style control, and have people found it was worth setting up? Also, if it's a simpler MPG (just bare wire leads, no USB dongles or software nonsense), how does that interface with my mill? The documentation for the affordable Aliexpress picks are atrocious, naturally. Would it be bypassing Mach3 and all that and sending pulses directly to the steppers or would it need configuration n compatibility wrangling? Ambrose Burnside fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Dec 22, 2016 |
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Dec 22, 2016 21:43
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The bare wire MPGs need to be interfaced through a controller which then connects to the stepper drivers. I use mine with a standalone controller and there's no latency. You could try something like this: https://www.aliexpress.com/item/NVUM-CNC-Controller-MACH3-USB-Interface-Board-Card-200KHz-for-Stepper-Motor-3-Axis/32704512647.html which has inputs for an MPG and interfaces with mach3 through USB (though I have no idea if it works / works well in practice)
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Dec 23, 2016 17:49
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Ambrose Burnside posted:Any mechanical fasteners are liable to get mashed or distorted over time so if anything loosened up i wouldn't be able to fix it easily. I'll just take a crack at machining it as one piece, see how it goes with an aluminium trial run. MPG jog wheels are at best kinda so so for most milling work. I used them in school on a Fadal tool room mill and very quickly gave up in disgust. You don't get any feedback like you would on a manual mill, the start/stop jerking motion of the manual jog feeds can hammer the crap out of tools, and they're generally just not that great for most things. The joy of having a fancy pendant jog wheel type jobby is you get hardware feed override knobs, cycle start buttons, a big red e-stop button, and so on, which is really handy when the mill suddenly makes sad noises. The physical feed override knobs are the big one, you can adjust your speeds and feeds up and down 50% or more, making it a lot nicer to proof out a part where you can adjust things until it sounds happy. Once you have some decent cut recipies for the mill and material, it's super easy to turn on the spindle, then type in G1 F10 X5 in the MDI line and watch as the mill does the hard work. I do the same thing on my Tormach to square up parts all the time. P.S. Fusion 360 is free for small business owners, and is stupid powerful for all your milling and turning needs.
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Dec 23, 2016 20:24
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Yeah, I suspected the lack of feedback might kind of hobble it, the difference between a clicky wheel and an arrow key isn't going to be that groundbreaking. I've already got a big ol physical E-stop built into my controller so the main appeal would be the feed override. Might still be worth it if I've already got the controller and I can get the pendant for $50-75 shipped. e: definitely no feedrate override in anything on aliexpress, though. welp Ambrose Burnside fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Dec 24, 2016 |
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Dec 23, 2016 22:09
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There are folks who have hooked up xbox game pads to their shapeokos for control, no idea if they suffer from major lag or what but might be worth a look.
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Dec 23, 2016 23:32
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Parts Kit posted:There are folks who have hooked up xbox game pads to their shapeokos for control, no idea if they suffer from major lag or what but might be worth a look. I used a generic gamepad as a pendant for my mill, worked fine. You can use the analog sticks to control velocity and direction. http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?Simple_Remote_Pendant
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Dec 25, 2016 23:41
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the config language they use for the halui stuff is pretty weird imo but after a while it starts to make sense
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Dec 25, 2016 23:43
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I guess there's a mach3 thing for it too? I dunno but this page exists anyway: https://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php?topic=16140.0
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Dec 26, 2016 06:45
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Yeah I looked into building a pendant style control for my Taig a while back. I figured it would be pretty easy to just cram an Arduino in a small enclosure and get the thing talking to Mach3. It probably would be, but once I started pricing out jog wheels and rad as gently caress pucker buttons I realized it would just be a huge pile of money for something I don't really need-need. One day I want to get a real full sized lathe. One of the most depressing things was almost getting a perfectly functional LeBlond with the rad SPEED DIAL for $200 or so. The community college I was going to still had 2 of them, but were replacing them with newer machines. The department head said they were just having them hauled off for scrap, I begged to pay the scrap value for one of them and they were going to let me do it. Then promptly forgot and had them hauled off anyway. Fuckers.
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Dec 27, 2016 11:00
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mach3 reset my step count per inch in the z-axis without me noticing (pretty dang sure I didn't do it) and hosed up my program. no big, fix the step count and run it again from the halfway point, but what the
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Dec 28, 2016 00:46
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At least you can get your step count to run the machine the way it should....
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Dec 28, 2016 01:54
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Enos Shenk posted:Yeah I looked into building a pendant style control for my Taig a while back. I figured it would be pretty easy to just cram an Arduino in a small enclosure and get the thing talking to Mach3. It probably would be, but once I started pricing out jog wheels and rad as gently caress pucker buttons I realized it would just be a huge pile of money for something I don't really need-need. for reals tho the game controller works great, and is basically free. quote:One day I want to get a real full sized lathe. One of the most depressing things was almost getting a perfectly functional LeBlond with the rad SPEED DIAL for $200 or so. The community college I was going to still had 2 of them, but were replacing them with newer machines. The department head said they were just having them hauled off for scrap, I begged to pay the scrap value for one of them and they were going to let me do it. Then promptly forgot and had them hauled off anyway. ffffffffffffff I like the taig mill, i have no real yearnings for a bigger mill. The taig lathe however? It's a watchmakers lathe and I'm not making any watches.
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Dec 28, 2016 04:12
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Brekelefuw posted:At least you can get your step count to run the machine the way it should.... things are "good enough", if i tell it to move an inch it moves an inch, within a few thou anyways (the balance being unknowable due to my sloppy fixturing and the headstock not being proper perpendicular im p sure). if my vendor didn't provide a copy of mach3 with a profile already set up for his taig build specifically i'd be totally boned. what's up with yours? e: the taig lathe just seems like a huge exercise in frustration if youve ever used a real lathe but i gotta give it props for basically being the smallest and most portable "real" machine tool conceivable (pre-emptive "dont post a picture of a hand file at me ok") Ambrose Burnside fucked around with this message at 21:49 on Dec 28, 2016 |
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Dec 28, 2016 21:35
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